Current Events > Software Developer/Engineer Thread

(+) Yeah! (+)

The_shibe posted...

You can't call yourself an engineer without an engineering degree haha kidding, I love to see those flame wars though

i read that that's legally true in at least parts of canada (or at least with some other kind of certification), didn't fact check it tho

Im doing automation testing for an energy dispatch engine software

I studied electrical eng and when I started this job I had no idea how to code I still dont

TheMikh posted...

i love how they spent years teaching us java through high school and most of undergrad cs, only to never use it again in postgrad cs or the industry

I used mostly java up until now

over the past year I was shifting towards kotlin more but there was definitely still java (android development)

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

ah, i might have just been in subsectors where its active use for development was less popular. the subsidiary at my last job was using it before management phased it out, and the job before was securing data from java-based application stacks among other things.

TheGoldenEel posted...

I used mostly java up until now

over the past year I was shifting towards kotlin more but there was definitely still java (android development)

what's the android development sector like these days? hadn't heard of kotlin, will have to look into it.

TheMikh posted...

what's the android development sector like these days? hadn't heard of kotlin, will have to look into it.

Kotlin is legitimately the "Java killer" people have been searching for. (Only for Android development though. Java is very much alive everywhere else)

Here's a cute guest book I made thanks to the book I'm reading. I'll probably make it again tomorrow. This book uses ejs which I much prefer to pug.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/8/8/9/AATc28AAEU1B.png

How easy to code something if you have all the functional requirements? How good is ChatGPT at coding something?

EDIT: I'm just wondering because a part of my soul really does want to learn this stuff, I just don't have the consistency. I also want to code a game.

TheMikh posted...

what's the android development sector like these days? hadn't heard of kotlin, will have to look into it.

Kotlin is great, like was said its basically a Java killer for android development. Its null safe and uses inference so it removes a lot of boilerplate code. Really simplifies a lot and makes things much more readable imo. Plus compiles to Java so its completely interoperable

also no semi colons

TheGoldenEel posted...

Kotlin is great, like was said its basically a Java killer for android development. Its null safe and uses inference so it removes a lot of boilerplate code. Really simplifies a lot and makes things much more readable imo. Plus compiles to Java so its completely interoperable

also no semi colons

Native Kotlin is also starting to gain traction. The plan seems to be to eventually release a version of Android OS that runs on Kotlin and is compatible with apps that need the JVM instead of the other way around.

SomeLikeItHoth posted...

Here's a cute guest book I made thanks to the book I'm reading. I'll probably make it again tomorrow. This book uses ejs which I much prefer to pug.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/8/8/9/AATc28AAEU1B.png

what techniques did u use?

html? css? js? react?

DaveTheUseless posted...

i read that that's legally true in at least parts of canada (or at least with some other kind of certification), didn't fact check it tho

I wonder how they regulate that.
Imagine u get a 4 yr CS degree, then a 2 yr master's in AI and a PHD in neural system and then you still can't get a "AI engineer" position at a B-list company

MedeaLysistrata posted...

How good is ChatGPT at coding something?

Chat GPT is going to replace most programmers, it's fucking gross.

It may or may not be there yet, but the fucking evil, shit eating grin CEO and his minions keep holding press releases saying shit like "we are still not at the place where we can replace programming jobs, but chart GPT-4 is a bit closer, and we're dumping millions of dollars into eventually being able to :) " (and therefore, destroy millions of jobs)

And somehow the general public reaction is "yay! slay!!! :D tehehehehe instead of questioning why spend so much money into that and how it benefits society

The_shibe posted...

Chat GPT is going to replace most programmers,

That's what the guy who invented the cotton gin thought about slaves and it was invented explicitly for that purpose of reducing slavery in the USA.

Turns out when you have a money printing machine you want more of it, not just enough to be able to output what you're outputting now for cheaper.

More like Chat TP

my take... you don't need to worry about chatgpt taking your job. you need to worry about the people who are actually learning how to effectively integrate chatgpt into their workflows

We use a standard .NET framework with Vue.js and a C# backing. Think our site is all in MVC but we are slowly moving to components and Vue.js to get a more consistent feel across the site.

I al so deal with desktop apps which are a nightmare. Had a major release that was supposed to happen last week that fell through cause of last minute issues. Always fun.

Kaldrenthebold posted...

We use a standard .NET framework with Vue.js and a C# backing. Think our site is all in MVC but we are slowly moving to components and Vue.js to get a more consistent feel across the site.

I al so deal with desktop apps which are a nightmare. Had a major release that was supposed to happen last week that fell through cause of last minute issues. Always fun.

how much do u make?

The_shibe posted...

how much do u make?

Not enough, that's for sure. This company loves to underpay people but it is very lax in terms of stress and good WFH / life balance so I don't complain too much. I'm working on getting promoted to Manager which should bump me up nicely. I make high 5 figures, manager will push me over 6.

I've wondered what the magic # is for me salary-wise, and I honestly have no idea. If I was primarily driven by how much money I made I'd be living a lot differently, that's for sure.

I know a guy who claims he makes around $200k a year as an uber driver. He was considering going into software development and I explained to him that he should have some capacity of love for doing it and that the learning curve can be deep (especially initially), and he went 'Nah, I'll just google what I need and plug it in'.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


I'm sure I could, but those jobs usually are much more stressful / high risk. As I said, I've never been a strong coder so it would be rough for me to get anywhere else going. But this place has undergone quite a change of leadership in the past 2 years and now my friend is the senior director and my other friend is the manager so I have people in the right places. I already know they want to make me manager and that kind of experience is what I want (with little risk) and if I like it, then I can translate those skills elsewhere and get much more money.

Kaldrenthebold posted...

Not enough, that's for sure. This company loves to underpay people but it is very lax in terms of stress and good WFH / life balance so I don't complain too much. I'm working on getting promoted to Manager which should bump me up nicely. I make high 5 figures, manager will push me over 6.

Man wtf whats with people ITT not advocating for themselves

you should be well into 6 figures with that kind of experience. I get being comfortable but you could be making so much more money, building up a nest egg for retirement or whatever it is you would be doing with 50% more money each year

Kaldrenthebold posted...

Not enough, that's for sure. This company loves to underpay people but it is very lax in terms of stress and good WFH / life balance so I don't complain too much. I'm working on getting promoted to Manager which should bump me up nicely. I make high 5 figures, manager will push me over 6.

not bad. congrats man :)

TheGoldenEel posted...

Man wtf whats with people ITT not advocating for themselves

It's not always about the money.

Good work/life balance is a powerful motivator to stay with a position for many (including myself). I've been working my first tech job for 2+ years and I can see myself staying for longer. The company generally isn't recommended for long-term careers pay-wise but the work is easy and is WFH. The pay isn't much of an issue because my lifestyle isn't expensive and I'd rather have some freedom and enjoyment in my life now instead of grinding until I'm old.

The_shibe posted...

Chat GPT is going to replace most programmers, it's fucking gross.

It may or may not be there yet, but the fucking evil, shit eating grin CEO and his minions keep holding press releases saying shit like "we are still not at the place where we can replace programming jobs, but chart GPT-4 is a bit closer, and we're dumping millions of dollars into eventually being able to :) " (and therefore, destroy millions of jobs)

And somehow the general public reaction is "yay! slay!!! :D tehehehehe instead of questioning why spend so much money into that and how it benefits society

Oh. Well I don't know, I just want to make my game into a gamefaqs add on

My boss goes apeshit if I ask to do anything virtually/over Zoom/etc. I had my ear talked off about how my expectations must be off because I was brought on board during COVID.

Blue_Thunder posted...

It's not always about the money.

Good work/life balance is a powerful motivator to stay with a position for many (including myself). I've been working my first tech job for 2+ years and I can see myself staying for longer. The company generally isn't recommended for long-term careers pay-wise but the work is easy and is WFH. The pay isn't much of an issue because my lifestyle isn't expensive and I'd rather have some freedom and enjoyment in my life now instead of grinding until I'm old.

Man there are so many jobs out there with good work life balance, and there are a ton of fully remote jobs out there

Ive never worked an hour over 40 in my career

just look at whats out there, maybe at the very least itll get you talking to your boss about a raise to a salary you deserve

my shitty work experiences over the years have probably biased me into thinking that a good fully remote job that pays me over 100k and is in line with my interests is a purple squirrel

TheGoldenEel posted...

Man there are so many jobs out there with good work life balance, and there are a ton of fully remote jobs out there

Ive never worked an hour over 40 in my career

just look at whats out there, maybe at the very least itll get you talking to your boss about a raise to a salary you deserve

What do you do? How'd you find a remote, less than 41 hr job? Those are like unicorns....

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


how did you guys save your industry from the outsourcing onslaught or the importing of "engineers" from ultra low wage countries?

The_shibe posted...

What do you do? How'd you find a remote, less than 41 hr job? Those are like unicorns....

Im not fully remote, but I wasnt really looking for a fully remote job, although I had interviewed for some

all my roles have been 2/3 day WFH hybrids with lots of flexibility day to day. I live in a medium-sized Midwest city so the commute when I go into the office has averaged like 20 minutes

i got into software engineering summer 2019, moved to a new job for a 22% raise in 2022, then got a 25% raise with the job I just started and now Im making 6 figures with under 4 years experience

all Im saying is it doesnt hurt to look. For most of yall maybe you think your jobs are unicorns but there is so much available (even with layoffs in certain sectors) and moving to a new job is the best way to get a pay bump

TheGoldenEel posted...

Im not fully remote, but I wasnt really looking for a fully remote job, although I had interviewed for some

all my roles have been 2/3 day WFH hybrids with lots of flexibility day to day. I live in a medium-sized Midwest city so the commute when I go into the office has averaged like 20 minutes

i got into software engineering summer 2019, moved to a new job for a 22% raise in 2022, then got a 25% raise with the job I just started and now Im making 6 figures with under 4 years experience

all Im saying is it doesnt hurt to look. For most of yall maybe you think your jobs are unicorns but there is so much available (even with layoffs in certain sectors) and moving to a new job is the best way to get a pay bump

Fascinating.

How did your journey start? CS degree?

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


That's interesting when compared to here.

Here there are are 2 tiers of jobs.

Sillicon valley and the FAANGS only hire like, the best of the best. But outside of them there's a weird thing: US grads go through a very hard measuring stick, it's like, "you're NOT from an Ivy? Why" ... "ok, you're from an Ivy, but your GPA is A - ? A MINUS?!... "Ok, you got an A from an Ivy, in computer science, but, why no elite intership? You might as well flip burgers, bro"

But then if the person applying for the same position comes from an ultra low wage country, through the "right" channels (body farms), the conversation changes to "ok, this guy says he graduated from the Krakozia Technical Institute... I guess that's a good school in Krakozia, right?".... "oh, look, he graduated with a GPA of "Gilded Mongoose". We don't know their grading system at all, but gilded means gold, I guess it's a good grade, plus the mongoose is a very smart animal, I am sure this is a good grade"... BOOM, bring this guy from Krakozia!

The_shibe posted...

That's interesting when compared to here.

Here there are are 2 tiers of jobs.

Sillicon valley and the FAANGS only hire like, the best of the best. But outside of them there's a weird thing: US grads go through a very hard measuring stick, it's like, "you're NOT from an Ivy? Why" ... "ok, you're from an Ivy, but your GPA is A - ? A MINUS?!... "Ok, you got an A from an Ivy, in computer science, but, why no elite intership? You might as well flip burgers, bro"

But then if the person applying for the same position comes from an ultra low wage country, through the "right" channels (body farms), the conversation changes to "ok, this guy says he graduated from the Krakozia Technical Institute... I guess that's a good school in Krakozia, right?".... "oh, look, he graduated with a GPA of "Gilded Mongoose". We don't know their grading system at all, but gilded means gold, I guess it's a good grade, plus the mongoose is a very smart animal, I am sure this is a good grade"... BOOM, bring this guy from Krakozia!

In here it's very different too: you know what coding is? Hired! Salary sucks, and you will be a one person solve it all on the company. Btw my printer is not working...

I went on interviews years ago in which I was woefully unqualified. I remember the interviewers straight up mocking me throughout the process in one interview, and during another the tech interviewer was (rightfully) caught off guard by my ignorance and actually took time to generally explain the purposes of the technologies/techniques that were not previously taught to me and how they interfaced/integrated. I was desperate to start paying back my student loans, and had no idea what the fuck I was doing.

RlP posted...

In here it's very different too: you know what coding is? Hired! Salary sucks, and you will be a one person solve it all on the company. Btw my printer is not working...

LMAO

DaveTheUseless posted...

I went on interviews years ago in which I was woefully unqualified. I remember the interviewers straight up mocking me throughout the process in one interview, and during another the tech interviewer was (rightfully) caught off guard by my ignorance and actually took time to generally explain the purposes of the technologies/techniques that were not previously taught to me and how they interfaced/integrated. I was desperate to start paying back my student loans, and had no idea what the fuck I was doing.

Do u remember any of those questions?

The_shibe posted...

Do u remember any of those questions?

The first interview, they bashed me in the head because they acted like I lied on my resume. Essentially, they wanted someone who had experience working in a university lab who also programmed experiments. I worked in a university lab and had programming experience, but never actually programmed experiments. My resume did not suggest that I did. That's on them.

The other one was for a low-paying Java gig in which they wanted someone who could work with Spring and Hibernate and do command wizardry (things I can do now no problem, but they didn't teach me it at university). The guy's mind was blown when I told him that JAR files were never mentioned in any of my Java courses.

DaveTheUseless posted...

The first interview, they bashed me in the head because they acted like I lied on my resume. Essentially, they wanted someone who had experience working in a university lab who also programmed experiments. I worked in a university lab and had programming experience, but never actually programmed experiments. My resume did not suggest that I did. That's on them.

The other one was for a low-paying Java gig in which they wanted someone who could work with Spring and Hibernate and do command wizardry (things I can do now no problem, but they didn't teach me it at university). The guy's mind was blown when I told him that JAR files were never mentioned in any of my Java courses.

Both sound like the issue I was describing, tbqh. I bet the guy they interviewed after you was like "JAR files! In krakozia we put tears of pet monkey in jar, then we ferment peel of banana in jar with tears. Is good remedy for unwilligness of the man when meeting lady at night" and they kind of shrugged and hired him.

The_shibe posted...

Both sound like the issue I was describing, tbqh. I bet the guy they interviewed after you was like "JAR files! In krakozia we put tears of pet monkey in jar, then we ferment peel of banana in jar with tears. Is good remedy for unwilligness of the man when meeting lady at night" and they kind of shrugged and hired him.

I'm close to 100% that you're right.

The 'soft skills' guy (there were 2 interviewers) looked like he was on shrooms, and was only there because he was obligated to. The only nice person there was the receptionist, who wanted to make sure I was truly cool with not having a free coffee. This was 12ish years ago, yet I somehow remember this.

There was a sign-in sheet out in the open, with the names of people who had interviewed. I know the hourly rate was really low or a programming job (around $15? Even accounting for that long ago, that's ridiculous). Got the vibe that if you gave them one or two answers they wanted, they'd take you. I had none. I clearly didn't belong, for a variety of reasons.

The_shibe posted...

Fascinating.

How did your journey start? CS degree?

I graduated in 2011 from a good school with a double major in electrical engineering and CS, but with a bad GPA, so I got a stable, easy, decent paying job in an unrelated field (field service) out of college and spent most of my 20s comfortable and coasting

in 2017 I started getting sick of coasting and wanted to get back into software engineering so I started applying, got a few interviews and got rejected so I got discouraged and stopped

finally in 2019 I started applying again, brushed up on some concepts from my previous interview experience and found some places where I could leverage my customer service experience as a positive. Got two job offers but I ended up taking one that was a sustaining software engineer; essentially I would take escalated customer software issues and implement the code fixed myself. This was for a major exercise equipment manufacturer and the code was largely android based (for the touch screen apps on treadmills etc)

in 2022 I had a new boss who was starting to shift my job away from coding and more towards like, data analysis type stuff so I started looking again, found a job as an android app developer for a smallcontract engineering firm. The offered me a 22% raise which was less than I was looking for, with a promise of a $5k raise at the end of the year if I met metrics

well I did, but they didnt give me the raise due to financial issues at the company, so I started looking for new roles again. Shortly after I expressed dissatisfaction with the lack of raise they laid me off, but I had already started the process of interviewing at the place I work now, which is the connected apps department of another major product manufacturer.

tl;dr dont settle for less than you deserve because theres always another opportunity out there

The_shibe posted...

Both sound like the issue I was describing, tbqh. I bet the guy they interviewed after you was like "JAR files! In krakozia we put tears of pet monkey in jar, then we ferment peel of banana in jar with tears. Is good remedy for unwilligness of the man when meeting lady at night" and they kind of shrugged and hired him.

No need to keep being racist dude, holy shit

DaveTheUseless posted...

There was a sign-in sheet out in the open, with the names of people who had interviewed. I know the hourly rate was really low or a programming job (around $15? Even accounting for that long ago, that's ridiculous). Got the vibe that if you gave them one or two answers they wanted, they'd take you. I had none. I clearly didn't belong, for a variety of reasons.

My very first dev job was for $37.5k as a junior full-stack engineer. It was actually pretty cool.

We used the MEAN stack and I've really come to like JS.

A good way of getting a job is having a github and a working full-stack web application that proves you know how to write something that works and is packageable/consumable by others.

If you really want the job, also show you know how to write tests. If a junior came to me with a GH repo and it actually worked and it actually had tests, it'd be an insta-hire.

The_shibe posted...

what techniques did u use?

html? css? js? react?

html for the form
bootstrap for the overall look (tbh I don't like using bootstrap too much)
js to loop through the entries array
all hosted on an Express server.

I'm learning about Express/MongoDB and ejs for the view engine. I've used React before but not with Express.

I have a GitHub and have done all sorts of crap since. Really, really old interview.