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Current Events > Florida is making it a felony to associate with undocumented people

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legendary_zell
03/17/23 10:53:32 AM
#1:


https://www.cbsnews.com/miami/news/florida-senate-panel-backs-immigration-crackdown-plan/

SB 1718 is going to pass. This bill will make it a felony to transport (including personal rides, buses, ridesharing/taxis), shelter (including renting or just providing a place to stay), or employing undocumented people.

It'll require hospitals to collect data on the immigration status of undocumented patients, and in another provision, forbids any entity from refusing to send collected data to federal law enforcement.

It'll require the collection of DNA samples for people put in jail (including children, and including innocent people who were simply arrested, not convicted).

It bars undocumented people from practicing law and invalidates their driver's licenses from other states.

It does lots of other terrible stuff besides this, it's hard to even track.

Make no mistake, this is a Nazi bill. This is a Gestapo bill. This will create a permanent underclass of undocumented people and turn hundreds of thousands of ordinary, compassionate people into felons. It will send a huge number of people into hiding or out of Florida. Florida is now an incubator for home grown fascism.

We're heading towards a very unstable situation because states are moving towards completely incompatible societies.

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#2
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Squall28
03/17/23 10:55:12 AM
#3:


When did Florida become the dumbest state?

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KarsaToblakai
03/17/23 10:55:28 AM
#4:


Man several parts of this are unconstitutional as fuck but it won't matter if we don't fix the SC

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A_Good_Boy
03/17/23 10:56:14 AM
#5:


legendary_zell posted...
It bars undocumented people from practicing law and invalidates their driver's licenses from other states.
Pretty sure that part specifically is unconstitutional.

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ScazarMeltex
03/17/23 10:56:36 AM
#6:


This is absolutely fascism, there is a reason there are swastikas at every GOP event in Florida.
This might be a bridge too far though since the state does not have ability to invalidate a license issued by another state.

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ellis123
03/17/23 10:57:38 AM
#7:


Squall28 posted...
When did Florida become the dumbest state?
60's/70's.

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WhisperWolf2005
03/17/23 10:58:32 AM
#8:


What if you didnt know that something you were associating with was undocumented??
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UnholyMudcrab
03/17/23 10:58:49 AM
#9:


Squall28 posted...
When did Florida become the dumbest state?
1845

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Solar_Crimson
03/17/23 10:59:26 AM
#10:


legendary_zell posted...
employing undocumented people.
Rich corps will still do it and get away with it.

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Were_Wyrm
03/17/23 10:59:42 AM
#11:


WhisperWolf2005 posted...
What if you didnt know that something you were associating with was undocumented??
Right to jail

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ellis123
03/17/23 10:59:44 AM
#12:


WhisperWolf2005 posted...
What if you didnt know that something you were associating with was undocumented??
Largely irrelevant. The law is just for profiling, it isn't actually something that matters in an actual legal sense.

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Nemu
03/17/23 10:59:45 AM
#13:


I'm still confused how people can be here illegally and get any kind of documentation. If we're going to do this vague bullshit, either fast track them to citizenship or deport them. Why is anyone sitting in this half-in, half-out state?
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Baha05
03/17/23 11:02:12 AM
#14:


WhisperWolf2005 posted...
What if you didnt know that something you were associating with was undocumented??
To ze camps!

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bluezero
03/17/23 11:03:35 AM
#15:


Squall28 posted...
When did Florida become the dumbest state?
Ron DeSantis

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Questionmarktarius
03/17/23 11:04:40 AM
#16:


papers, please
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ZevLoveDOOM
03/17/23 11:06:19 AM
#17:


Florida on meth and crack again...
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legendary_zell
03/17/23 11:06:38 AM
#18:


WhisperWolf2005 posted...
What if you didnt know that something you were associating with was undocumented??

The standard mirrors federal law because it's "knowing or had reason to know" essentially. Good luck proving that you didn't know or at least had reason to know once some prosecutor wants to boost their career by making an example out of you. You'll already be arrested, in jail, and have a felony arrest on your record by then, even if you're completely innocent of the crime of associating.


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legendary_zell
03/17/23 11:07:46 AM
#19:


Nemu posted...
I'm still confused how people can be here illegally and get any kind of documentation. If we're going to do this vague bullshit, either fast track them to citizenship or deport them. Why is anyone sitting in this half-in, half-out state?


That's because being here illegally is a civil offense, not a criminal one. And we recognize that they are here and will always be here and that society doesn't work if we act like they're not here.

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thronedfire2
03/17/23 11:10:44 AM
#20:


So does this mean they wont be shipping any more immigrants off to Marthas Vineyard?

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Questionmarktarius
03/17/23 11:15:19 AM
#21:


thronedfire2 posted...
So does this mean they wont be shipping any more immigrants off to Marthas Vineyard?
You should already know by now that nothing is illegal when government does it.
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KarsaToblakai
03/17/23 11:17:39 AM
#22:


legendary_zell posted...
That's because being here illegally is a civil offense, not a criminal one. And we recognize that they are here and will always be here and that society doesn't work if we act like they're not here.
Also immigration, legal or not, tends to be a boon for society

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MaxEffingBemis
03/17/23 11:20:03 AM
#23:


bluezero posted...
Ron DeSantis
Nah it was probably GWB before that. Florida at least used to be a blue state. Maybe since 2008ish

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MaxEffingBemis
03/17/23 11:21:01 AM
#24:


Also youd think this would piss off the Cuban and PR communities but I highly doubt it bc muh communism

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Questionmarktarius
03/17/23 11:22:19 AM
#25:


MaxEffingBemis posted...
PR
really?

really?
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NoxObscuras
03/17/23 11:22:53 AM
#26:


JFC. It's just one insane bill after another with Florida. I really hope none of these actually make it into law, but with the way things are going...

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CADE_FOSTER
03/17/23 11:23:05 AM
#27:


ScazarMeltex posted...
This is absolutely fascism, there is a reason there are swastikas at every GOP event in Florida.
This might be a bridge too far though since the state does not have ability to invalidate a license issued by another state.

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The_shibe
03/17/23 11:27:51 AM
#28:


legendary_zell posted...
SB 1718 is going to pass. This bill will make it a felony to transport (including personal rides, buses, ridesharing/taxis), shelter (including renting or just providing a place to stay), or employing undocumented people.


Imagine deputizing uber drivers and cab drivers to check people's visas (a simple passport won't do). What's gonna happen is that it becomes a "papers, please" state (literally). not to mention drivers simply won't take brown people because that'd imply the risk of committing a felony as per this law.

It'll require hospitals to collect data on the immigration status of undocumented patients, and in another provision, forbids any entity from refusing to send collected data to federal law enforcement.

so imagine you're a legal immigrant or a legal citizen that happens to have the "wrong" skin color and you are not walking around with your visa or US passport (for example, you were playing basketball and your friend's house and you fell and hit your head and need to go to the ER), now the hospital will say "papers, please" and let you bleed to death because of this law.

Desantis is far worse than trump

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The_shibe
03/17/23 11:28:27 AM
#29:


ScazarMeltex posted...
This is absolutely fascism, there is a reason there are swastikas at every GOP event in Florida.
This might be a bridge too far though since the state does not have ability to invalidate a license issued by another state.

it's not like the alt right scotus will care

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A_Good_Boy
03/17/23 11:30:15 AM
#30:


Florida is out here really trying to see how close they can get to being just like Nazi Germany without making it too obvious.

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Squall28
03/17/23 11:37:27 AM
#31:


ellis123 posted...
60's/70's.

I feel like people always acted like it was Alabama or some other red neck state when I was growing up. Florida was even a swing state. Somewhere along the way, Florida just went full stupid.

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Questionmarktarius
03/17/23 11:42:11 AM
#32:


Florida is dominated by retirees who moved there to avoid taxes, and Cuban immigrants who really fuckin' hate Castro.
That's what happened.
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ellis123
03/17/23 11:42:33 AM
#33:


Squall28 posted...
I feel like people always acted like it was Alabama or some other red neck state when I was growing up. Florida was even a swing state. Somewhere along the way, Florida just went full stupid.
It was until the late 90's, when they started to gerrymander the crap out of a lot of states, with Florida included (I still remember my mother getting pissed when they bragged about doing it on air in the mid 90's). However, despite being a swing state Florida had this reputation for being a bit special in the head well before that point. It was less about being out and out fascists like it is now, and more about just generally having some of the dumbest takes from their governors. A lot of which coming from the fact that they just wanted to be Cali, but lacked the money to really pull that off.

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LightHawKnight
03/17/23 11:46:21 AM
#34:


So businesses cant hire undocumented workers?

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Questionmarktarius
03/17/23 11:46:58 AM
#35:


LightHawKnight posted...
So businesses cant hire undocumented workers?
That's already a thing
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ScazarMeltex
03/17/23 11:49:10 AM
#36:


Questionmarktarius posted...
That's already a thing
And yet millions of them are employed.

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uwnim
03/17/23 11:51:04 AM
#37:


Hmm, reading it, if you give rides for a living, having procedures to minimize what you know about your customers would probably be a good idea. By having business practices that establish it would not be reasonable for you to know the immigration status, you would be safe from prosecution.

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#38
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Suolevram
03/17/23 11:55:14 AM
#39:


agoat posted...
Florida just fuck off already jfc


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LightHawKnight
03/17/23 11:55:22 AM
#40:


Questionmarktarius posted...
That's already a thing

Pffftt. Sure it is.

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Questionmarktarius
03/17/23 11:55:37 AM
#41:


uwnim posted...
Hmm, reading it, if you give rides for a living, having procedures to minimize what you know about your customers would probably be a good idea.

LightHawKnight posted...
Pffftt. Sure it is.

never underestimate the power of plausible deniability.
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awsomemanspiff
03/17/23 11:56:58 AM
#42:


Can illegal immigrants have US IDs? Legit question not trolling!

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ellis123
03/17/23 11:57:26 AM
#43:


Questionmarktarius posted...
never underestimate the power of plausible deniability.
That only helps get you out of legal trouble. It doesn't help you get out of being heckled/jailed.

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ellis123
03/17/23 11:58:23 AM
#44:


awsomemanspiff posted...
Can illegal immigrants have US IDs? Legit question not trolling!
Yes. Most illegal immigrants are people whose work visa expired and prior to that expiration they would have gotten a US ID.

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Error1355
03/17/23 12:02:31 PM
#45:


[LFAQs-redacted-quote]



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legendary_zell
03/17/23 12:03:55 PM
#46:


uwnim posted...
Hmm, reading it, if you give rides for a living, having procedures to minimize what you know about your customers would probably be a good idea. By having business practices that establish it would not be reasonable for you to know the immigration status, you would be safe from prosecution.


You would think so, but I've worked on a case within the last year where a federal judge held the opposite with respect to housing. The judge ruled that even though landlords don't check for immigration status, are not required to check, and even though the government knowingly rents to undocumented immigrants, it's potentially illegal to rent without checking immigration status.

There's no doubt that Florida will ask for the same analysis and that there are judges in Florida and the 11th Circuit willing to reach that conclusion. And whatever they decide will apply to housing, sheltering, transportation, and employment.

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TMOG
03/17/23 12:05:27 PM
#47:


Questionmarktarius posted...
really?

really?
You think the people supporting this bill are going to know or care that Puerto Ricans are American citizens?

The last guy Republicans voted for didn't even know he was their president.
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#48
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TheMikh
03/17/23 12:08:53 PM
#49:


criminalizing free rides and shelter is not just infringing on the divine right to voluntary association, but doing so beyond the scope of commerce - one would wonder if that's even constitutional

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hockeybub89
03/17/23 12:11:11 PM
#50:


legendary_zell posted...
We're heading towards a very unstable situation because states are moving towards completely incompatible societies.
This is the real scary part. How are people supposed to travel across the country when they could be pedophiliac murderers guilty of 10 felonies in one state and completely upstanding citizens in the next? Republicans can pretend to be appalled for a minute when MTG suggests secession, but they clearly want to fracture the country. If it's not to leave the union, it's certainly so they can go "Look at the godless heathens in the liberal states and their moral decay! We have a duty to bring all of them back to God as we have in red states!" and then force this shit on everyone nationwide the minute they get the Presidency and Congress.

There is no way America isn't collapsing soon and hundreds of millions of people will suffer.

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