Current Events > lady reporter: can we give Ukraine all capabilities to defend themselves?

(+) Yeah! (+)

UnfairRepresent posted...

Planes

Exactly what Ukraine has been asking for since day 1 and exactly the US has been refusing to give or allow Poland to give since day 1

The thing that stopped Russia from taking over in 2 weeks

The thing the US is openly saying they're scared of Russian escalation if they hand over

The thing we've been talking about the whole topic....

Even the US' own refusal is not "These planes won't actually help!" it's literally that they would help too much.

Ukraine cannot push Russia out of the annexed land without air superority. They can't get air superiority without more planes

Russia can't conquer Ukraine without air superiority. Ukraine can't prevent Russian air superiority if they run out of planes.

Even your own admission that handing over these planes as opposed to billions in bombs and anti-aircraft weaponry and missile systems and gear would be an "escalation" is a confirmination that you know how important they are even as you actively lie to pretend you don't.

And your entire "They could use them to attack Russia!.... Which they currently already could do anyway" is complete bullshit as an argument.

And somehow saying planes would boot Russia out is any less nonsensical?

It's a white elephant that Ukraine doesn't have the pilot or technical manpower to operate or maintain in the numbers needed, and their use would merely get depleted before it could really expel the Russians if used purely in their airspace.

So it's a dead-end if used domestically and an escalation if used to attack Russia. Lose-lose.

K181 posted...

And somehow saying planes would boot Russia out is any less nonsensical?

?

Yes

Why do you think Russia's invasion plans fell apart?

Because they entirely hinged on having air superiority. The moment they didn't, their plans failed and taking over Ukraine was impossible.

And why do you think Ukraine's counter attack on the annexed land has been so slow and stagnant despite Russia's constant setbacks and losses?

Because Russia has air superority in the annexed parts of Ukraine.

Why do you think Ukraine has been asking for planes since the outbreak of the war and is still asking now ? Why do you think Russia is so shit scared of Ukraine getting planes?

Ukraine having a fresh supply of planes would have more impact than any other resource and if they were given the planes in March, the war would not be still going on today.

It's a white elephant that Ukraine doesn't have the pilot or technical manpower to operate or maintain in the numbers needed, and their use would merely get depleted before it could really expel the Russians if used purely in their airspace.

So it's a dead-end if used domestically and an escalation if used to attack Russia. Lose-lose.

That's not what the US, Russian or Ukranian military, air force and intelligence believe.

And look how quickly you swivel excuses. You can't claim it's a useless dead end and waste of resources and an escalation that would piss off Russia due to how severe of an upgrade in resources it would be compared to billions in bombs and gear and vehicles and missile/targeting system

Also you're quite right. An attack on Russia would be insane and fail miserably. It's almost like your suggestion that we can't give Ukraine resources because they would use them to attack Russia is complete bullshit

It's also almost like they could attack Russia right now as we speak and are very intentionally not doing so.

I repeat the US' own refusal to give the planes and prevention of Poland giving planes was not "they would be useless" it was literally "They would be so useful we're shit scared of what Russia would do"

WingsOfGood posted...

You scared of Putin?

You are not afraid of a madman with nukes?