Current Events > ITT: Things that aren't inherently plot holes and/or bad writing

(+) Yeah! (+)

- Characters not doing the thing you want them to or not immediately coming up with the best possible solution to a problem (especially if the 'solution' being suggested is convoluted and overly detailed)

- The plot not accounting for every scenario you can conjure up (no, the Holdo manuever isn't bad writing just because it didn't account for the lack of onscreen hyperspace kamikaze ship attacks in other movies)

- Things that aren't explicitly explained by the plot, but have plausible explanations that fit within the rules of the universe

Thank you and this has been my TED talk

Kinda ties into #1, but a character not acting the same and having the same beliefs over time and years

Nerevar791 posted...

Kinda ties into #1, but a character not acting the same and having the same beliefs over time and years

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Digimon has better writing than Pokmon. If you disagree you clearly didn't go to uni.

RchHomieQuanChi posted...

- Things that aren't explicitly explained by the plot, but have plausible explanations that fit within the rules of the universe

I remember a topic where someone was complaining that the Avengers didn't get involved with the plotline of the Eternals when this is the case.

I'm not sure what category this goes in but I don't like the Dr. Strange spell in No Way Home.

If they were going to cast it, you would expect Strange to calmly go over the rules of the spell and have Peter tell him beforehand about friends/family to exclude. Or just make the magic apply to anybody who found out through JJJ.

Simps will say "It's Strange's character to have no caution and not explain any of this shit." Which is a translation for saying there wouldn't be a movie if they had common sense.

Nerevar791 posted...

Kinda ties into #1, but a character not acting the same and having the same beliefs over time and years

YES! And given that it's you, I almost feel like you're referring to Luke in TLJ lol

MedeaLysistrata posted...

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Digimon has better writing than Pokmon. If you disagree you clearly didn't go to uni.

u okay?

RchHomieQuanChi posted...

YES! And given that it's you, I almost feel like you're referring to Luke in TLJ lol

lol, yes was first that came to mind

Turtlemayor333 posted...

I'm not sure what category this goes in but I don't like the Dr. Strange spell in No Way Home.

If they were going to cast it, you would expect Strange to calmly go over the rules of the spell and have Peter tell him beforehand about friends/family to exclude. Or just make the magic apply to anybody who found out through JJJ.

Simps will say "It's Strange's character to have no caution and not explain any of this shit." Which is a translation for saying there wouldn't be a movie if they had common sense.

-The reason for using the spell was weak af.

-It seems like theres ways to phrase the spell that would fix everything. (Forget spider man vs peter parker or forget mysterio instead)

Turtlemayor333 posted...

I'm not sure what category this goes in but I don't like the Dr. Strange spell in No Way Home.

If they were going to cast it, you would expect Strange to calmly go over the rules of the spell and have Peter tell him beforehand about friends/family to exclude. Or just make the magic apply to anybody who found out through JJJ.

Simps will say "It's Strange's character to have no caution and not explain any of this shit." Which is a translation for saying there wouldn't be a movie if they had common sense.

LordMarshal posted...

-The reason for using the spell was weak af.

-It seems like theres ways to phrase the spell that would fix everything. (Forget spider man vs peter parker or forget mysterio instead)

But this is the kind of stuff I'm talking about. It's not flaw in the writing that they chose to do it this way. Yeah, you can say that it was done this way because the movie wouldn't have happened otherwise. But it's also consistent with what we know about the characters. Strange is a smartass who rarely ever explains what's happening because he thinks you're either smart enough to know the implications or too stupid to understand them in the first place. Peter is a smart but short-sighted kid who overthinks and overcomplicates his problems because he can't get out of his own head.

Even if it's a bit contrived, it makes sense for the story.

RchHomieQuanChi posted...

But this is the kind of stuff I'm talking about. It's not flaw in the writing that they chose to do it this way. Yeah, you can say that it was done this way because the movie wouldn't have happened otherwise. But it's also consistent with what we know about the characters. Strange is a smartass who rarely ever explains what's happening because he thinks you're either smart enough to know the implications or too stupid to understand them in the first place. Peter is a smart but short-sighted kid who overthinks and overcomplicates his problems because he can't get out of his own head.

Even if it's a bit contrived, it makes sense for the story.

Not really. Its a stretch to use such a drastic spell so quickly and so flawed. And he had a second chance at the end of the movie.

Its not a plot hole but just bad writing to make a movie.

Nanomachines, son

Vocal cord parasites are garbage but nanomachines actually fit in pretty damn well with the MGS world

LordMarshal posted...

Its a stretch to use such a drastic spell so quickly and so flawed.

It's two flawed characters known for hasty decision making making a hasty decision. Not really a stretch at all. They even address it.

LMAO what is with you people who will twist yourself in the craziest knots to justify your love for TLJ? It's a shitty movie, just get over it.

EmbraceOfDeath posted...

LMAO what is with you people who will twist yourself in the craziest knots to justify your love for TLJ? It's a shitty movie, just get over it.

I don't really care how people feel about TLJ and I know it has its flaws.

But armchair film critics that watch movies just to obsessively look for problems are the worst. That's not really what film criticism is about. That's a relatively new thing that happened when nerd culture (and I don't mean that derogatively) used the internet as an outlet to pick apart movies they didn't like.

Chuck Cunningham

A sad ending

Nerevar791 posted...

u okay?

Actually, yes. I read in an undergraduate journal years ago that when digimon evolve it's temporary- then they go back to in training.

Two narratives at the same time

RchHomieQuanChi posted...

It's two flawed characters known for hasty decision making making a hasty decision. Not really a stretch at all. They even address it.

Oh ok. So whyd he do it at the end of the movie?

By this logic Martha was a perfectly fine plot point.

Sometimes telling makes more sense than showing, if the context requires a character to tell.

LordMarshal posted...

Oh ok. So whyd he do it at the end of the movie?

To stop reality from collapsing in on itself?

BlackBlueButts posted...

By this logic Martha was a perfectly fine plot point.

There's a difference between something being a plot hole and something just being really, really dumb.

MedeaLysistrata posted...

Actually, yes. I read in an undergraduate journal years ago that when digimon evolve it's temporary- then they go back to in training.

That couldn't possibly be true. They have evolved form digimon just living their lives out in the wild.

I mean arguably nothing is inherently bad writing. Deus Ex Machina and Mary Sues can even be used well in some instances.

A_Good_Boy posted...

That couldn't possibly be true. They have evolved form digimon just living their lives out in the wild.

Jesus

I guess I forgot the part where Digimon with tamers are sPeCiAl

A lot of plot holes in MCU films really can be summed up as the movie would be over too quickly and they wanted to make a sequel.

MedeaLysistrata posted...

Jesus

I guess I forgot the part where Digimon with tamers are sPeCiAl

Yes? The vast majority of digimon live without humans.

ChocoboMog123 posted...

Yes? The vast majority of digimon live without humans.

Why does having a human partner make the digimon dedigivolve?

MedeaLysistrata posted...

Why does having a human partner make the digimon dedigivolve?

I don't think it does. Usually higher tier evolutions stay that way.
If you mean why do digimon with partners digivolve then turn back? Because the digivolution is usually only a temporary status caused by the power of feelings or whatever.
I think digimon "in the wild" also de-digivolve when they run out of power/get beat up, don't they?

Regardless, there's sufficient justification within the universe. If you want an answer, why don't you rewatch the whole series or something?

ChocoboMog123 posted...

I don't think it does. Usually higher tier evolutions stay that way.
If you mean why do digimon with partners digivolve then turn back? Because the digivolution is usually only a temporary status caused by the power of feelings or whatever.
I think digimon "in the wild" also de-digivolve when they run out of power/get beat up, don't they?

Regardless, there's sufficient justification within the universe. If you want an answer, why don't you rewatch the whole series or something?

I mean in the games they evolve permanently then die. Pick your priority.

Lore-wise evolution takes a considerable amount of energy/data, and tamers are usually in possession of some macguffin that can cheat the system. Those devices arent capable of generating the power needed to maintain higher evolutions for very long which is why they usually devolve after taking too much damage or expending too much energy.

BlackBlueButts posted...

By this logic Martha was a perfectly fine plot point.

tbh it kinda is, it's just that the execution and delivery was just really, really bad

mehmeh1 posted...

tbh it kinda is, it's just that the execution and delivery was just really, really bad

The problem with the scene is entirely the fact that "Save Martha" is one of the goofiest, clumsiest lines ever written.

Batman suddenly having empathy because he remembered losing his parents, which makes him realize that Superman is just as human as he is, sure, that's fine. It was just how they got there that sucked.

What mfer in Clark's position would call their mom by their given name lol.

BlackBlueButts posted...

By this logic Martha was a perfectly fine plot point.

It...was, at least in theory. The execution is the part that sucks.