Current Events > Sweden: false rape allegations can now land you jail time

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/03/15/opinion/cissi-wallin-fredrik-virtanen-metoo-sweden.html?referringSource=articleShare

Good

Justice.

Based

I read this is you being falsely accused of it could get you jailed.

Can't get passed the paywall, how do they specifically prove it's false vs just not having enough evidence to prosecute

Lairen posted...

I read this is you being falsely accused of it could get you jailed.

that happens already

Bio1590 posted...

Can't get passed the paywall, how do they specifically prove it's false vs just not having enough evidence to prosecute

If you hit the stop loading button right after going to the page you can bypass the paywall.

Now for murica to follow suit pls

Not a bad idea in theory, but it depends on how they implement this. While I feel many guys take things too far when it comes to this particular subject, I also don't like how many downplay being falsely accused of rape and think it shouldn't be punishable to do so.

I get it but my concern is

1. Will people with valid claims they can't prove be considered false. (8% of Rape cases are considered "unfounded" by the FBI. Not fake, just impossible to prove.
2. Would the fear of above make people not want to come forward

Pretty much every bit of research we do states that most rape victims (male and female do not come forward.

The threat of "If you come forward not only will we all judge and humiliate you, but then once you can't prove it you'll go to jail and be branded as a liar" must be overwhelmingly terrifying for a young girl.

I think the users just going "Good!" are underthinking the serious concerns of this.

Never forget the stories you read on facebook of girls randomly lying about rape to get people they dislike arrested are monumentally rare and there's a serious agenda why certain people are megaphoning them to make you think they are not.

It's estimated that only 35% of rapes in the west are reported to the police.

We all want to see fakers face justice, just be careful that you're not turning a gray reality into a black and white situation.

Try to think about how it will effect rape victims and how unjust the courts can be.

Especially when we live in a world where literally hundreds of millions of people openly claim that it's impossible for a husband to rape their wife.

Now mix that belief in with "If you try to claim I did, you will go to prison" coming from an emotional abuser

I am glad false accusations are being punished but we also need to make sure real victims are not punished or afraid to come forward.

Rape is no joke and real victims NEED justice, just as false claims NEED to be punished.

As long as it's only with concrete evidence it's a false allegation.

Women already are scared to come forward. I wanna work towards a world where women will come forward asap while the DNA evidence is still fresh. That way justice is served and also we may do away with allegations from like 20 years ago.

Worth noting that, statistically speaking, even as a man you are more likely to be a victim of rape than you are to be falsely accused of it.

MrToothHasYou posted...

Worth noting that, statistically speaking, even as a man you are more likely to be a victim of rape than you are to be falsely accused of it.

It happens though. Had a ex friend get accused of rape. Only thing that kept him from spending the night in jail (idk how thr trial woukda played out) was the girls own best friend threw her under the bus for lying.

Apparently both girls drunkenly (dudes where drunk too) had sex in the same room with the dudes. Long story short she woke up and realized he's ugly af.

mooreandrew58 posted...

It happens though. Had a ex friend get accused of rape. Only thing that kept him from spending the night in jail (idk how thr trial woukda played out) was the girls own best friend threw her under the bus for lying.

Apparently both girls drunkenly (dudes where drunk too) had sex in the same room with the dudes. Long story short she woke up and realized he's ugly af.

Thing is while neither the drunk dude or girl could consent the law has stated the man is still at fault and it can be seen as rape. While this is actually only the girl regretting sex with a guy she sees as ugly it is allowed by courts to be classed as rape. Bullshit as it may be the man is still held responsible even when he could not consent or be aware of what he was doing.

Many of these regret sex ONS are legally allowed to be called rape which is why men need to stop hooking up when drunk and never touch a drunk woman as you can be thrown in jail.

RiKuToTheMiGhtY posted...

Thing is while neither the drunk dude or girl could consent the law has stated the man is still at fault and it can be seen as rape. While this is actually only the girl regretting sex with a guy she sees as ugly it is allowed by courts to be classed as rape. Bullshit as it may be the man is still held responsible even when he could not consent or be aware of what he was doing.

He got off cause the friends statement.

I feel when both parties are drunk it should be nullified. Unless it's an adult and a minor.

But other than that I've had inmates shoe me pretty hard to ignore evidence they where innocent of it. One guy showed me all his legal paperwork regarding his case. Hes I'm for raping a child. Papers state no physical or mental trauma was found in the child. No DNA evidence was found on her or at the alleged scene. Then he showed me where they used his past record of crime to slander his name in court but the social security numbers didn't match up. They justbfound someone with the same name.

Long story short He dumped a girl cause she was crazy. She accused him of raping her daughter. He found out just how crazy. It was q small town he said where everyone knew everyone and he was a outsider. Now he's on year 20 with 11 more to go. It's sad he's fought it but he's given up and taken to drugs and I've witnessed him slowly lose his mind

mooreandrew58 posted...

It happens though. Had a ex friend get accused of rape. Only thing that kept him from spending the night in jail (idk how thr trial woukda played out) was the girls own best friend threw her under the bus for lying.

Apparently both girls drunkenly (dudes where drunk too) had sex in the same room with the dudes. Long story short she woke up and realized he's ugly af.

If you are drunk you are impaired and cant consent.

Can I predict the meninist suppurating dicknozzles being all good?

The friend is the only reason that guy is not in jail. Its fucked up but yes the man Is held accountable. What is really a how the hell does that add up is when a dude is drunk and the woman sober yet once again the man is held responsible if they have sex and she does not like it (regret sex).

The man in prison serving 20 years should have had an attorney fight that shit for the blatant bullshit it was. No evidence of the crime on the child, no DNA, and social security numbers not adding up is way to much evidence to prove he did NOTHING.

IIRC, it would have been considered slander (or libel, I forget which is which), even if the allegations were true. Which, considering what a sleazeball Virtanen is, they probably are. Swedish libel laws are a bit weird. One of our parliamentary party leaders was guilty of slander even though what she said was true. BL made topics about it at the time. Fredrik Virtanen is a disgusting man and there are receipts of him trying to chat up underage girls on Facebook.

That said, Cissi Wallin is a bit of a circus act herself, so I wouldn't want to touch either side of this case with a ten foot pole.

Dathrowed1 posted...

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/03/15/opinion/cissi-wallin-fredrik-virtanen-metoo-sweden.html?referringSource=articleShare

What you dont understand is that rape in Sweden is any sex without consent.

Cuticrusader09 posted...

If you are drunk you are impaired and cant consent.

If everyone is drunk and both have sex, is that a 2 way rape?

Cuticrusader09 posted...

What you dont understand is that rape in Sweden is any sex without consent.

The consent law is fairly new, and passed long after the events of this case.

Bio1590 posted...

Can't get passed the paywall, how do they specifically prove it's false vs just not having enough evidence to prosecute

They didn't. It went to court and he was found not guilty, IIRC. That's it.

Slayer_22 posted...

If everyone is drunk and both have sex, is that a 2 way rape?

By actual logic it should be but the law claims the man is to be punished and held accountable. He could be black out drunk and her only tipsy but he is responsible.

mooreandrew58 posted...

It happens though. Had a ex friend get accused of rape. Only thing that kept him from spending the night in jail (idk how thr trial woukda played out) was the girls own best friend threw her under the bus for lying.

Apparently both girls drunkenly (dudes where drunk too) had sex in the same room with the dudes. Long story short she woke up and realized he's ugly af.

I dont see how this is relevant to my point.

Also, there was no jail time in her sentence. There was a fine and probation.

RiKuToTheMiGhtY posted...

By actual logic it should be but the law claims the man is to be punished and held accountable. He could be black out drunk and her only tipsy but he is responsible.

what

Slayer_22 posted...

what

The law will punish the man for rape is what I was saying.

RiKuToTheMiGhtY posted...

The law will punish the man for rape is what I was saying.

Except we know it very often doesn't

MrToothHasYou posted...

Worth noting that, statistically speaking, even as a man you are more likely to be a victim of rape than you are to be falsely accused of it.

What's your point?

I get the feeling this is one of those 1 step forward 2 steps back things. Now girls will not confess they are lying.

SauI_Goodman posted...

I get the feeling this is one of those 1 step forward 2 steps back things. Now girls will not confess they are lying.

It should be noted that Cissi Wallin did not get punished for false rape allegations. There was a trial, Virtanen was found not guilty (or charges were dropped, I can't remember), and that was that. Then, several years later, she went on social media and publically named him as rapist, knowing full well that it could constitute libel even if he had been found guilty. I didn't read the NYT story but the point here is that she didn't get fined for false rape allegations, she got fined for libel long after the rape case was legally settled, and libel laws in Sweden are weird.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/3/7/4/AAR21wAADCq-.jpg

Relevant part of the article. Or a relevant part

scar the 1 posted...

Except we know it very often doesn't

Maybe if youre an affluent white man.

Cuticrusader09 posted...

If you are drunk you are impaired and cant consent.

Everybody involved was drunk. Do men magically have better decision making skills than women when drunk?

Dathrowed1 posted...

Relevant part of the article. Or a relevant part

Right, she filed charges but they were dropped then. The book was cleared like a day ago.

dave_is_slick posted...

What's your point?

That the perceived likelihood of being falsely accused of rape is incorrectly inflated in popular opinion, and that focusing legislative or policy efforts on rectifying this perceived problem results in systems that ultimately protect actual rapists and further victimize those that they prey upon.

MrToothHasYou posted...

That the perceived likelihood of being falsely accused of rape is incorrectly inflated in popular opinion, and that focusing legislative or policy efforts on rectifying this perceived problem results in systems that ultimately protect actual rapists and further victimize those that they prey upon.

So ignore it and pretend it never happens. I thought that was what you were going for, just wanted you to confirm your BS.

Based Sverige

dave_is_slick posted...

So ignore it and pretend it never happens. I thought that was what you were going for, just wanted you to confirm your BS.

Where did I say it should be ignored? It should be given attention, just not undue attention, particularly when we are still grappling with the problem of actual rape.

This is good. Until someone powerful and connected wins a case even though they're guilty. As long as that can happen, everything is broken

UnfairRepresent posted...

We all want to see fakers face justice, just be careful that you're not turning a gray reality into a black and white situation.

No one's saying it's not gray stop with the strawmen

Lost_All_Senses posted...

This is good. Until someone powerful and connected wins a case even though they're guilty. As long as that can happen, everything is broken

That's pretty much what happened here. Virtanen seems pretty guilty, and there were several corroborating testimonies from other alleged victims. Issue is that Wallin is also powerful, and a narcissistic TERF, so regardless of how plausible the allegations are, her character makes things more muddled.

mooreandrew58 posted...

As long as it's only with concrete evidence it's a false allegation.

This

Also I cant read the article

There was a guy - Brian Banks, and there's a wikipedia on his case - who as a high school student was falsely accused of rape and did 6 years prison and 5 years probation before his accuser admitted she made it all up.

He was a sure starter in college football at USC and was projected to be an NFL player.

After he was exonerated, he tried to catch on with an NFL team but he was nearly 30 by that time and his football skill had faded by that point. He only played in 4 preseason games for the Atlanta Falcons after a tryout.

dave_is_slick posted...

So ignore it and pretend it never happens. I thought that was what you were going for, just wanted you to confirm your BS.

what a lazy retort

Good