Current Events > I love the dichotomy between Batman and Joker

(+) Yeah! (+)

They're both really similar. Take the world into their own hands, are crazy, are good at what they wanna do, are good at battle strategy/tactics/etc, have a morality that keeps them going moreso than a surface motivation, etc. They're like the same person but had a few key moments that really shaped who they want to be. They're envious of each other. Batman envies the freedom of the Joker and the Joker envies the morality of Batman.

Just revisiting The Dark Knight and getting nostalgic.

Joker's morality being that he only kills if it's funny?

That's quite a hot take.

Uh... No

FortuneCookie posted...

Joker's morality being that he only kills if it's funny?

Nah, Joker's morality is that he wants to ruin Batman's morality by forcing Batman to give empathy to him. Joker does the worst shit imaginable, which he would've otherwise without a Batman, but since Batman is in the picture, he does it specifically to keep trying to break Batman's morality.

Master Kazuya posted...

Nah, Joker's morality is that he wants to ruin Batman's morality by forcing Batman to give empathy to him. Joker does the worst shit imaginable, which he would've otherwise without a Batman, but since Batman is in the picture, he does it specifically to keep trying to break Batman's morality.

I think the bolded piece makes the end of your sentence redundant.

Master Kazuya posted...

Joker does the worst shit imaginable, which he would've otherwise without a Batman

There have actually been a few instances where Batman retires or disappears and the Joker just stops doing awful shit.

Sega_System posted...

I think the bolded piece makes the end of your sentence redundant.

Okay, I see that. Though, are you an English professor off duty or something? I feel like you could've conveyed the info better than pointing out something I did and making me reflect on it in vagueness.

pegusus123456 posted...

There have actually been a few instances where Batman retires or disappears and the Joker just stops doing awful shit.

I think the Joker would still have done Joker-ish things without a Batman present, but Batman being there just solidifies the deal and makes Joker realize he's motivated by Batman's morality primarily, instead of morality in general.

Batman cant kill a literal killer because hell get kill boner and kill is pretty dumb.

This is why The Killing Joke is the definitive Batman/Joker story. The original Alan Moore comic.

What I like is the dynamic is batman is the "world's greatest detective" and master martial artist. This clown has managed to keep his identity secret from this man and has gotten some pretty good licks in during fights. Also this man knows batman identity

mooreandrew58 posted...

What I like is the dynamic is batman is the "world's greatest detective" and master martial artist. This clown has managed to keep his identity secret from this man and has gotten some pretty good licks in during fights. Also this man knows batman identity

Depending on timeline he knows but 99% of the time Joker doesnt know and doesnt give the slightest hint of a fuck who Batman is.

they're both crazy, just in different sides of the spectrum

speaking of the dark knight, when Batman caught Dent threatening a guy to give information, he said that everything they've done would be undone and gordon would've died for nothing, but the next day, it's okay for Dent to admit that he's the rampant vigilante of Gotham?

spikethedevil posted...

Depending on timeline he knows but 99% of the time Joker doesnt know and doesnt give the slightest hint of a fuck who Batman is.

I like the Harley Quinn cartoon. Scarecrow tells joker its Bruce Wayne and he gets pissed and kills him because he doesnt care.

dummy420 posted...

I like the Harley Quinn cartoon. Scarecrow tells joker its Bruce Wayne and he gets pissed and kills him because he doesnt care.

Such a great show.

"Where's my goddamn electric car, Bruce?!"

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It's pretty accurate for Injustice. Look at the massive shit show that comes from Supes killing Joker.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


I haven't played or read Injustice but that's a really good line - I think I've seen it other fiction too

Y'all need to stop sleeping on Lego Batman Movie.

spikethedevil posted...

Depending on timeline he knows but 99% of the time Joker doesnt know and doesnt give the slightest hint of a fuck who Batman is.

The bigger part was batman never knowing who he was being the greatest detective and all.

To my knowledge joker knows who batman is he just doesn't care. Think there was a line "it's not fun without the mask on"

Didn't read that one but I did read thr one where managed to infiltrate the bat cave and attacked alfred

Questionmarktarius posted...

Y'all need to stop sleeping on Lego Batman Movie.

That's one of the best Batman movies

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Thats shitty. It's one of the best parts of the joker. That his orgin is a mystery.

Plus I personally preferred that a real tragedy caused it and not that he was just always a shitty human. Kills his one MO. Wanting to prove one shitty day can make someone like him

mooreandrew58 posted...

Thats shitty. It's one of the best parts of the joker. That his orgin is a mystery.

Plus I personally preferred that a real tragedy caused it and not that he was just always a shitty human. Kills his one MO. Wanting to prove one shitty day can make someone like him

I agree with this - why I love the BTAS episode with the Joker coercing the random guy who had "one shitty day" .. and the guy ends up showing it didn't define him

I'm kinda over them being lovers, it's kinda tiresome, the only shipment I've ever agreed with is batman and superman

mooreandrew58 posted...

Thats shitty. It's one of the best parts of the joker. That his orgin is a mystery.

There's apparently three of them now, so that's mysterious.

mooreandrew58 posted...

Thats shitty. It's one of the best parts of the joker. That his orgin is a mystery.

Plus I personally preferred that a real tragedy caused it and not that he was just always a shitty human. Kills his one MO. Wanting to prove one shitty day can make someone like him

Yeah I prefer that too. The take in the panels is kinda interesting but loses ground if you think about it for even just a minute. I also think the vat of chemicals things is super dumb

Master Kazuya posted...

I also think the vat of chemicals things is super dumb

That's been the one concrete thing about his origin forever though.

pegusus123456 posted...

That's been the one concrete thing about his origin forever though.

Yeah

Questionmarktarius posted...

There's apparently three of them now, so that's mysterious.

IIRC that got retconned.

They did a long ride.

Bryfang posted...

No, it actually makes sense. Theres a like that he says in Injustice and Under the Red Hood that is pretty great. He says if you kill once, you no longer have a reason to stop. You take one life, then you can justify another, and another.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/0/3/5/AAcstcAADBXj.jpg
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/0/3/6/AAcstcAADBXk.jpg
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/5/1/6/AAcstcAADB-U.jpg

What's with the whaling commentary?

spikethedevil posted...

IIRC that got retconned.

I fucking hope so. That shit was dumb

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I loved that Justice League the cartoon didn't touch on Aquaman's fish calling abilities... until the end of the first episode with him where it came of nowhere (in a good way)

They're both shades of the devil. Batman is a horned devil of order. Joker is a trickster devil of chaos.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Y'all need to stop sleeping on Lego Batman Movie.

Truth.

I actually like Zach Galifianakis' take on the joker it seemed more classic in the campy comicbook sense.

It seems like we either get Mark Hammil's version or Heath Ledger's brooding Joker anymore these days.