Current Events > Arkham Knight needed good boss fights. And less Batmobile.

(+) Yeah! (+)

It got neither, and suffered for it.

Batmobile wasn't an issue. Lack of bosses, yes

Batmobile sucked.

Meh. Batmobile wasnt nearly as bad as everyone said and the bosses have sucked in all the games except Origins and the Mr Freeze AC fight, yet origins gets absolutely no love.

batmobile should've been more optional and less focused on

the fact that everyone refers to the batmobile part when talking about this game is entirely the problem. it shouldn't have been that big of a feature.

The only problem with the Batmobile is the Riddler race tracks and some of the Riddler trophies.

LiqiudusSnake posted...

Meh. Batmobile wasnt nearly as bad as everyone said and the bosses have sucked in all the games except Origins and the Mr Freeze AC fight, yet origins gets absolutely no love.

Disagree. Batmobile stealth tank fights littered the game. The final big fight of the game is a marathon against a bunch of tanks.

The game isn't a car combat game like Twisted Metal, but over half the game consists of playing it like one. Like was already said:

Guerrilla Soldier posted...

the fact that everyone refers to the batmobile part when talking about this game is entirely the problem. it shouldn't have been that big of a feature.

It took away from the best parts of the game. All the bosses were batmobile fights. They demoted Deathstroke from one of the best fights in the series(with Origins) to a tank fight. A stealth tank fight.

Wtf?

LiqiudusSnake posted...

Meh. Batmobile wasnt nearly as bad as everyone said and the bosses have sucked in all the games except Origins and the Mr Freeze AC fight, yet origins gets absolutely no love.

I LOOOOOOVE Origins. It's the best game in the series, talking boss fights specifically.

Deathstroke, Copperhead, Croc, Firefly, Bane, oh my God that game was jam packed with good, fun bosses.

Awesker002 posted...

The only problem with the Batmobile is the Riddler race tracks and some of the Riddler trophies.

I hated how focused around the batmobile the riddler puzzles were. I 100% every puzzle in Asylum, Origins, and City, but couldn't stand them in Knight.

Batmobile was overused and boss fights were lacking but the story was a massive let-down too.

Glob posted...

Batmobile was overused and boss fights were lacking but the story was a massive let-down too.

I agree.

No idea why the fuck they dropped Paul Dini. He had an idea, clearly, and then they dropped him for the last part in the trilogy? Wtf?

The things Im most butthurt about with that game are things I never see anyone complain about.

The first is the fact that they changed how you access gadgets. Idk, needlessly changing something thats pretty much been the same for three games prior just bugs me.

The other is that you only get experience points during missions. They really should have left it where you can get exp from fighting random thugs between missions. I cant think of any good reason for taking that away.

Remember when they wanted a huge mystery about the Knight's identity and everyone was just "Yeah that's clearly Jason Todd" and they got really mad?

Batmobile hate is definitely overblown. The story itself doesnt force you to use it that much by comparison to how much it puts you other types of combat scenarios and outside of the story you almost never have to use it to travel at all, since gliding is much faster.

That being said, the Riddlers batmobile puzzles and races can go fuck themselves. Ive thought since Arkham City that they needlessly bloated the riddle trophies and had no interest in collecting them all, but not only seeing how many more there were in Knight, on top of the new Batmobile focused ones, made me just laugh and not even pretend to want to finish his sidequest.

Also Deathstrokes boss battle being a tank battle is definitely an issue though.

rexcrk posted...

The things Im most butthurt about with that game are things I never see anyone complain about.

The first is the fact that they changed how you access gadgets. Idk, needlessly changing something thats pretty much been the same for three games prior just bugs me.

The other is that you only get experience points during missions. They really should have left it where you can get exp from fighting random thugs between missions. I cant think of any good reason for taking that away.

I actually prefer the system from Knight over the previous games. For example, I might need one more skill point to unlock an ability that I really want. Instead of trying to hunt down a group of enemies over and over or continuing the story, I could do one singular objective from a Gothams Most Wanted sidequest and instantly get the skill point. The game gives them out like candy.

DisgracefulSins posted...

Batmobile wasn't an issue. Lack of bosses, yes

This. The Batmobile was amazing

2SweetforTurtle posted...

Batmobile hate is definitely overblown. The story itself doesnt force you to use it that much by comparison to how much it puts you other types of combat scenarios and outside of the story you almost never have to use it to travel at all, since gliding is much faster.

Yeah, it might just be that I went in expecting it to be chock full of Batmobile stuff, but I didn't think it really overdid it in the story. It does front-load the fuck out of the game with it though.

DrizztLink posted...

Remember when they wanted a huge mystery about the Knight's identity and everyone was just "Yeah that's clearly Jason Todd" and they got really mad?

It's so weird too because the Arkham Knight is like the least important major thing in the game. I guess they didn't want to talk about the Joker stuff, so the "mystery" of who he was supposed to be was all they had to advertise.

2SweetforTurtle posted...

Batmobile hate is definitely overblown. The story itself doesnt force you to use it that much by comparison to how much it puts you other types of combat scenarios and outside of the story you almost never have to use it to travel at all, since gliding is much faster.

That being said, the Riddlers batmobile puzzles and races can go fuck themselves. Ive thought since Arkham City that they needlessly bloated the riddle trophies and had no interest in collecting them all, but not only seeing how many more there were in Knight, on top of the new Batmobile focused ones, made me just laugh and not even pretend to want to finish his sidequest.

Also Deathstrokes boss battle being a tank battle is definitely an issue though.

I actually prefer the system from Knight over the previous games. For example, I might need one more skill point to unlock an ability that I really want. Instead of trying to hunt down a group of enemies over and over or continuing the story, I could do one singular objective from a Gothams Most Wanted sidequest and instantly get the skill point. The game gives them out like candy.

Until you get to a point where youve done all the missions and completed the story and havent unlocked everything

Theres literally no reason for that.

The bat mobile combat is a really fun mini game. It just sucks all the immersion out of the game because driving a tank around and blowing up a bunch of enemy cars is so NOT Batman. And I didnt find it repetitive at all in the main story.

Yeah Arkham Knight is pretty damn disappointing, I didn't like any of the story besides that excellent scarecrow voice actor. Batmobile hate is underblown.

What's weird is there was all this hate for Arkham Origins but when I eventually played it, I was like "this... this is actually pretty great, very fun game what's with the hate?"

Meanwhile, Arkham Knight was the Rocksteady developed one, so it had all this hype after Arkham city, and yet it failed to deliver. Came up so short. Especially the plot lines that carried over from Arkham City, they built up Azrael as actually being something, not just same lame ass sidequest. Same for Hush puppy. At least they had manbat, that was a prediction I got right after lamenting the missed opportunity of having him in City.

rexcrk posted...

The first is the fact that they changed how you access gadgets. Idk, needlessly changing something thats pretty much been the same for three games prior just bugs me.

Remind me what that is

I had a friend that told me this was his goty in 2015 over the Witcher 3 and I had to stop talking to him

MaxEffingBemis posted...

I had a friend that told me this was his goty in 2015 over the Witcher 3 and I had to stop talking to him

Not a good decision, ngl. Witcher 3 is awful. Knight is just disappointing.

Also, one thing Knight has over the other games: the sheer amount of DLC content. Small little story bits, a ton of playable characters(even if Azrael is literally Batman). It's just perfect. Having so many playable characters is fun. Just wish they were in freeroam too.

Arkham Knight was so much fun to me, but yes the boss fights were pretty disappointing. The end of the Deathstroke sidequest felt like a slap in the face, like "oh good, after the tank fight we can go hand-to-hand" and then Batman just takes him out in one hit during the cutscene.

BakonBitz posted...

Arkham Knight was so much fun to me, but yes the boss fights were pretty disappointing. The end of the Deathstroke sidequest felt like a slap in the face, like "oh good, after the tank fight we can go hand-to-hand" and then Batman just takes him out in one hit during the cutscene.

If Arkham Origins didn't come out before, I'd have been less disappointed with the lack of boss fights in Knight, tbh. That game really set the bar for them.

It's one of the many reasons I'm looking forward to Gotham Knights. WB Montreal is making it, and I think Origins was a great Batman game overall.

Honestly? My biggest gripe with Knight and basically the entire Arkham franchise is the Joker.
Yes, like many I grew up with Batman TAS. I love Hamill's Joker. It was awesome getting both Conroy and Hamill for a game that's the Batman TAS of games.
However I did not need him to be shoehorned into every single game so the entirety of Batman's interesting rogues gallery could play second fiddle or just be cameos.
If Knight 's plot didn't spend so much time on Joker maybe we could've gotten an actually satisfying conclusion to sideplots from City. The tense buildup to Hush in City became a laughably short conclusion in Knight. Because why properly feature a diverse cast of villains when we can all fap to Joker some more.

Another super and petty dumb issue I have with Knight is that some of the characters(especially the women) just look.. different. Not different like well the graphics are better different, but we need to make the women less attractive to avoid controversy different.

I would have like the Batmobile sections more if the DLC ones for the racing sections were fully combat capable.

Arkham Knight was super disappointing. Rocksteady went too far by adding in tank combat when people only wanted to have car chases in the Batmobile. Nobody wanted to fight tanks or do puzzles with the Batmobile.

The writing also took a major hit. Paul Dini wasnt perfect but he definitely understood Batman and the characters surrounding him. Rocksteadys in house writers did not and Im surprised that they didnt let Dini just finish the trilogy. I was very excited to see Scarecrow as the main villain but they essentially turned him into Hugo Strange 2.0 from Arkham City. We didnt even get any of the fear sequences from Arkham Asylum.

And then you have other issues like predator rooms being overall worse, the ending, lack of memorable boss fights, obvious reveal of a villains identity, and so on. Just a disappointing game. Ive replayed the other Arkham games a countless number of times but Ive only played Arkham Knight once.

008Zulu posted...

I would have like the Batmobile sections more if the DLC ones for the racing sections were fully combat capable.

That pissed me off as well.

"You guys like Batman 89, right? Well here's the 89 Batmobile! What's that? You want it to be playable for more than 20% of the Batmobile content?"

That's another thing that's plagued the series. Providing DLC characters and locking them to a portion of content. At least Catwoman was fully playable in City.

Funny how this topic was started this week, as I just decided to revisit these games after not playing them for a while.

Asylum will still be my favorite of the run. While relatively short, compared to the others, it was so simple and straight forward in both gameplay and story.

City and Knight just felt so all over the place and overly complicated just to make the game longer.

rexcrk posted...

Another super and petty dumb issue I have with Knight is that some of the characters(especially the women) just look.. different. Not different like well the graphics are better different, but we need to make the women less attractive to avoid controversy different.

But, besides Ivy(she'd look far better if she let her hair down) I felt like the girls looked far more attractive. Selina had fuller lips, Harley looked much better(I didn't like her City look, but loved Asylum), Batgirl obviously looks great.

Who specifically are you referring to?

It was still a great game imo. The batmobile didn't bother me much except for all the riddler trophies and other activities outside of the main story.

Was still super fun driving around the city with it though.

I only put a handful of hours into it tbh, but as someone who platinum'd the previous three games I feel like my opinion is still valid.

The batmobile sucked. Driving it was clunky, it was forced quite frequently, and the puzzle segments were frustrating. If you like the batmobile that's fine, but you can't deny it was overused. The city traversal is one of the main selling points of the franchise, so putting so much emphasis on the driving was a poor choice.

Also, way too much Joker. I was getting bored of his monologues after an hour or two, I can only imagine how much nagging you have to put up with through the rest of the game.

And the Riddler. By the fourth game it's just not fun anymore, and feels way too much like a chore. Coupled with more forced driving and it's just flat out intolerable. Apparently it's required to get them all for the true ending or something, which is just stupid imo.

LiqiudusSnake posted...

Meh. Batmobile wasnt nearly as bad as everyone said and the bosses have sucked in all the games except Origins and the Mr Freeze AC fight, yet origins gets absolutely no love.

Origins should have just been DLC to Arkham City.

Scarecrow17 posted...

Arkham Knight was super disappointing. Rocksteady went too far by adding in tank combat when people only wanted to have car chases in the Batmobile. Nobody wanted to fight tanks or do puzzles with the Batmobile.

The writing also took a major hit. Paul Dini wasnt perfect but he definitely understood Batman and the characters surrounding him. Rocksteadys in house writers did not and Im surprised that they didnt let Dini just finish the trilogy. I was very excited to see Scarecrow as the main villain but they essentially turned him into Hugo Strange 2.0 from Arkham City. We didnt even get any of the fear sequences from Arkham Asylum.

And then you have other issues like predator rooms being overall worse, the ending, lack of memorable boss fights, obvious reveal of a villains identity, and so on. Just a disappointing game. Ive replayed the other Arkham games a countless number of times but Ive only played Arkham Knight once.

Agree on every single point. And my god I HATED that ending.

It's like the writers went 'so uh.....how do we end this?'

'I dunno'

'I dunno'

'Wait, i got it. Let's create a up-to-your-interpretation-type ending to cover up us not having a concrete idea. Then we can pretend it's artistic and a conversation starter so people don't realize we don't have a good idea!'

saspa posted...

Batmobile hate is underblown.

Lol wut

This is the #1 complaint.

I never even finished it. I just got bored. Batman isn't about tank combat. I remember there was one little mission (it may have been the one that introduces the Batmobile) where Batman goes "I need the batmobile for this" when it was something that he probably could have done using some gadget he had on him or he could have just found another solution entirely.

The batmobile seemed forced on you. Since when was the Riddler all about making race tracks? How did he even build those? I know that's sort of silly to ask in a world with Ra's al Ghul and a lot of crazy futuristic technology, but suspension of disbelief can only go so far.

The story was lacking to me. Scarecrow was wasted. The Arkham Knight (remember when they said he was going to be a totally original character and not a certain someone?) and his squad of bad guys were very generic and I don't even remember what the main plot was. AA and AC weren't masterpieces in storytelling or anything, but they kept you engaged with the story.

ppl legit defending batmobile stuff itt

wow

SSJGrimReaper posted...

ppl legit defending batmobile stuff itt

wow

I had fun with it but yeah, maybe the main game and DLC could've focused less on it.

The Arkham Knight reveal was way too obvious.

I predicted Jason Todd the second he started talking for the first time about how he knows the tricks to the bat suit and shit.

Then they had those flashbacks that just made it waaaayyy too obvious. Batman seemed like a fucking idiot for not putting it together on his own.

ViewtifulGrave posted...

Origins should have just been DLC to Arkham City.

What a garbage opinion.

BlueBoy675 posted...

The Arkham Knight reveal was way too obvious.

I predicted Jason Todd the second he started talking for the first time about how he knows the tricks to the bat suit and shit.

Then they had those flashbacks that just made it waaaayyy too obvious. Batman seemed like a fucking idiot for not putting it together on his own.

Commissioner Gordon got him a "World's Greatest Detective" mug as a joke Christmas present, and Batman thought he meant it sincerely.

008Zulu posted...

Commissioner Gordon got him a "World's Greatest Detective" mug as a joke Christmas present, and Batman thought he meant it sincerely.

Lol

008Zulu posted...

Commissioner Gordon got him a "World's Greatest Detective" mug as a joke Christmas present, and Batman thought he meant it sincerely.

Barbara actually got it for Gordon but Batsy got upset and sulked all evening until Jim gave it to him.

DrizztLink posted...

Barbara actually got it for Gordon but Batsy got upset and sulked all evening until Jim gave it to him.

Barbra and Gordon see Batman sitting on a gargoyle statue, brooding
Barbra: Is he upset because his parents are dead, or because I gave you that mug?

Still cant believe there is a large number of people that actually think Asylum is better than City lol. Theyre probably the same pretentious idiots who think Batman Begins is better than The Dark Knight.

Stereotypical the first movie/game/album etc is always the best hipster opinion

DavidZ2844 posted...

Still cant believe there is a large number of people that actually think Asylum is better than City lol. Theyre probably the same pretentious idiots who think Batman Begins is better than The Dark Knight.

Stereotypical the first movie/game/album etc is always the best hipster opinion

People really think that? Asylum is nice and fun but City improved upon it in every single way.

Slayer_22 posted...

People really think that? Asylum is nice and fun but City improved upon it in every single way.

Well, they're different genres. Asylum is basically a Metroidvania and City is open world. Some people prefer the tighter focus of Asylum.

When Arkham Asylum lifted dialogue straight up from BTAS and the DCAU, I thought that meant the Arkham games were sort of connected, so in Knight I was confused why they even did red hood instead of literally anything else. It wasn't thematically tied to anything that happened in the previous games before, I mean was he even mentioned or had literally any kind of easter egg or reference in any of the 3 games? Even in Asylum there was a straight up sequel easter eggs with Clayface and such. And I thought there was a dangling plot line with "the spirit of Arkham" and like maybe they were gonna do that Owl City plot?

Also remember after Arkham City, Hamill said he was tired of the joker and was gonna retire him? I remember hearing that was the reason he didn't return for Origins. So I was surprised (and not in a good way) when there was Joker presence in Arkham Knight because I thought it would be interesting to see what they would do with another storyline.

DavidZ2844 posted...

Still cant believe there is a large number of people that actually think Asylum is better than City lol. Theyre probably the same pretentious idiots who think Batman Begins is better than The Dark Knight.

Stereotypical the first movie/game/album etc is always the best hipster opinion

Asylum wins because it has a tighter, more focused story.

Then again, maybe it makes sense to have joker again, they basically made them lovers in the Arkham games. I remember wtfing at the ending of City when Batman was walking out of the building, lovingly cradling joker's body while leaving the recently stabbed Talia to rot.

saspa posted...

Also remember after Arkham City, Hamill said he was tired of the joker and was gonna retire him? I remember hearing that was the reason he didn't return for Origins. So I was surprised (and not in a good way) when there was Joker presence in Arkham Knight because I thought it would be interesting to see what they would do with another storyline.

He basically said he wasn't gonna do Joker again unless they did a version of The Killing Joke. Can't remember if he said that before or after Arkham Knight came out.