Current Events > Webcast: The Intersection Between Autism Spectrum Disorder & LGBTQIA+

(+) Yeah! (+)

Eventbrite event: https://bit.ly/3coeipF

This could be okay, but the title of it makes me think it could be trying to say being LGBT means you're developmentally disabled. I'm tempted to sign up just to see if it's atrocious or not.

Thoughts?

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The_Hat posted...

the title of it makes me think it could be trying to say being LGBT means you're developmentally disabled

Now that's what I call shitposting.

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DeadBankerDream posted...

Now that's what I call shitposting.

That's not my intention. I've seen people argue before that people who are LGBT must have a mental illness and it's always pissed me off.

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I suppose if you had a narrative you wanted to do confirmation bias on, and you tried really hard, and didnt read the study you might be able to think that

There's a high degree of overlap in developmental theories of these groups.

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The_Hat posted...

LGBT must have a mental illness

anyone who say LGBT is a mental illness is completely wrong. i call it a lifestyle choice.
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The_Hat posted...

Eventbrite event: https://bit.ly/3coeipF

This could be okay, but the title of it makes me think it could be trying to say being LGBT means you're developmentally disabled. I'm tempted to sign up just to see if it's atrocious or not.

Thoughts?

So your implication here is that being disabled is a bad thing.

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UndefeatedGOAT posted...

I suppose if you had a narrative you wanted to do confirmation bias on, and you tried really hard, and didnt read the study you might be able to think that

This isn't a study, it's an event lead by 3 doctors.
I really hope it's a positive event, I'm probably being overly cynical based on pervious experience with The Help Group.

WeeWeiWiiWie posted...

There's a high degree of overlap in development theories of these groups.

I haven't personally seen that research, but if that's all this event is then great!

kingdrake2 posted...

anyone who say LGBT is a mental illness is completely wrong. i call it a lifestyle choice.

I agree with the statement that it's not a mental illness, but I wouldn't call it a choice. Being gay/bi is not a choice.

MrToothHasYou posted...

So your implication here is that being disabled is a bad thing.

No, my implication is that new outlets/trolls/terrible people like to cherry-pick and will say being LGBT = being autistic.
I worked with adults with developmental disabilities for 5 years and my wife's younger and older brothers both are on the spectrum so I'm really protective of the group as a whole.


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Taking a quick look at the website and group, I'm slightly hopeful that it's good and not a flaming pile of garbage. But it's to soon to say, I didn't look into any of the organizers.

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gunplagirl posted...

Taking a quick look at the website and group, I'm slightly hopeful that it's good and not a flaming pile of garbage. But it's to soon to say, I didn't look into any of the organizers.

I was actually hoping this would catch your attention since I know you really care about LGBT rights. I probably should have opened with the fact that I've personally had bad experiences with The Help Group when doing business with them in the past, but I'm hopeful this is a positive event.

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Anyone know who's shitposting alt TC is?

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The_Hat posted...

This isn't a study, it's an event lead by 3 doctors.
I really hope it's a positive event, I'm probably being overly cynical based on pervious experience with The Help Group.

I haven't personally seen that research, but if that's all this event is then great!

I agree with the statement that it's not a mental illness, but I wouldn't call it a choice. Being gay/bi is not a choice.

No, my implication is that new outlets/trolls/terrible people like to cherry-pick and will say being LGBT = being autistic.
I worked with adults with developmental disabilities for 5 years and my wife's younger and older brothers both are on the spectrum so I'm really protective of the group as a whole.

What even is an Illness though, there are traits, then there are traits we cant control, then some percentage of those are illnesses

what about the intersection between ASD and gfaqs users?

(i'll get me coat..)

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DeadBankerDream posted...

Anyone know who's shitposting alt TC is?

Not an alt, this is my main account. Sorry to make you think this is a shitpost, it really wasn't meant to be.

UndefeatedGOAT posted...

What even is an Illness though, there are traits, then there are traits we cant control, then some percentage of those are illnesses

An illness is defined as: a condition of being unhealthy in your body or mind. Being LGBT is not unhealthy.

Biscotti posted...

what about the intersection between ASD and gfaqs users?

(i'll get me coat..)

While this is a troll post, that'd actually be interesting to find out. While there are a bunch of traits of those with ASD one that many are high functioning/level 1 are prone to obsessions and repetitive behavior, and routine. If a routine was built around coming to a forum when the person was younger, that could easily continue into adulthood. I won't post it here, but there's a great subreddit for parents/SO's of adults with autism where they talk about what their recent obsession is and give advice on those situations.

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kingdrake2 posted...

anyone who say LGBT is a mental illness is completely wrong. i call it a lifestyle choice.

It's not a choice lol no more than being straight is a choice

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The_Hat posted...

Not an alt, this is my main account. Sorry to make you think this is a shitpost, it really wasn't meant to be.

An illness is defined as: a condition of being unhealthy in your body or mind. Being LGBT is not unhealthy.

While this is a troll post, that'd actually be interesting to find out. While there are a bunch of traits of those with ASD one that many are high functioning/level 1 are prone to obsessions and repetitive behavior, and routine. If a routine was built around coming to a forum when the person was younger, that could easily continue into adulthood. I won't post it here, but there's a great subreddit for parents/SO's of adults with autism where they talk about what their recent obsession is and give advice on those situations.

To what degree is an autism spectrum condition an illness though

And is spectrum different than autism? (Genuinely dont know, ELI5)

kingdrake2 posted...

anyone who say LGBT is a mental illness is completely wrong. i call it a lifestyle choice.

That's also completely wrong

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UndefeatedGOAT posted...

To what degree is an autism spectrum condition an illness though

And is spectrum different than autism? (Genuinely dont know, ELI5)

So as I've mentioned, I used to work with adults with developmental disabilities. Specifically, as a specialty teacher focusing on basic computer science skills. So I know more than most, but I'm certainly not an expert.

The current PC term is "developmental disability" when talking about someone who is on the spectrum and may have autism, aspersers, cerebral palsy, or in some cases even severe ADHD or dyslexia.
It's generally something you're born with or appears very early on in life and is essentially caused by how the brain is wired up as you grow during those early years. In fact, it's not actually an illness as there is no cure! (just like being LGBT isn't an illness!)
You can think of it more like someone being born without an arm vs someone who is born with both arms. They aren't sick, they're just built differently.

As for "how is spectrum different than autism" it isn't!
There is a general scale ranging from 1-3 (though personally I use a 5 point scale) in which

1. Requires little support, high functioning individuals are in this range. Difficult to diagnose. If you look into this level a lot you'll probably notice you've known someone in this range who was never diagnosed! They're very capable and who I worked with.
2. Requires a good deal of support. This is the kind of person who at a glance you can tell is autistic. Generally speaking their mind significantly slows development at a young age and they require daily supports. If they get enough supports they can still live mostly normal lives. One of my wife's brothers is level 2 and he was able to graduate high school and is a productive member of the family helping with chores and such.
3. Requires significant daily support. These are the kind that get the worst of the worst stereotypes and struggle with daily life. I have never personally worked with someone who was level 3, and I admire those who make it their life decision to help them as I'm sure it's a very rewarding but difficult endeavor.

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The_Hat posted...

So as I've mentioned, I used to work with adults with developmental disabilities. Specifically, as a specialty teacher focusing on basic computer science skills. So I know more than most, but I'm certainly not an expert.

The current PC term is "developmental disability" when talking about someone who is on the spectrum and may have autism, aspersers, cerebral palsy, or in some cases even severe ADHD or dyslexia.
It's generally something you're born with or appears very early on in life and is essentially caused by how the brain is wired up as you grow during those early years. In fact, it's not actually an illness as there is no cure! (just like being LGBT isn't an illness!)
You can think of it more like someone being born without an arm vs someone who is born with both arms. They aren't sick, they're just built differently.

As for "how is spectrum different than autism" it isn't!
There is a general scale ranging from 1-3 (though personally I use a 5 point scale) in which
1. Requires little support, high functioning individuals are in this range. Difficult to diagnose. If you look into this level a lot you'll probably notice you've known someone in this range who was never diagnosed! They're very capable and who I worked with.
2. Requires a good deal of support. This is the kind of person who at a glance you can tell is autistic. Generally speaking their mind significantly slows development at a young age and they require daily supports. If they get enough supports they can still live mostly normal lives. One of my wife's brothers is level 2 and he was able to graduate high school and is a productive member of the family helping with chores and such.
3. Requires significant daily support. These are the kind that get the worst of the worst stereotypes and struggle with daily life. I have never personally worked with someone who was level 3, and I admire those who make it their life decision to help them as I'm sure it's a very rewarding but difficult endeavor.

Thanks for the clarification, because the savant genius, the awkward genius coder come to mind, but on the other end you have people that are seriously debilitated

I guess you wouldnt consider the high functioning people ill , or as ill?

@The_Hat did you watch the Netflix documentary on the rubiks cubers?

UndefeatedGOAT posted...

Thanks for the clarification, because the savant genius, the awkward genius coder come to mind, but on the other end you have people that are seriously debilitated

I guess you wouldnt consider the high functioning people ill , or as ill?

Again, it's not an illness as there isn't a cure. It's just a different formation of the brain during development. I'd just consider them as needing less support or only needing slightly more support than others.
But more to your point, yeah the savant coder would probably be a level 1 and have an obsession with computers, puzzles, structures, and other things of that nature.

UndefeatedGOAT posted...

@The_Hat did you watch the Netflix documentary on the rubiks cubers?

Yeah it was a fun watch! Max would be level 1 on the official scale, and level 4 on my personal scale.

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The_Hat posted...

Yeah it was a fun watch! Max would be level 1 on the official scale, and level 4 on my personal scale.

Max was the american right? Thats the thing I felt so bad for him, i feel like he'll never have a normal life.

And even being the literal best in the world at what he does, he completely beats himself up for next clean sweeping a championship in every category. Obviously, having something like that he can care about though has been much better for him overall

The_Hat posted...

Again, it's not an illness as there isn't a cure.

Uhhh. ???

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UndefeatedGOAT posted...

Max was the american right? Thats the thing I felt so bad for him, i feel like he'll never have a normal life.

And even being the literal best in the world at what he does, he completely beats himself up for next clean sweeping a championship in every category. Obviously, having something like that he can care about though has been much better for him overall

Yeah unfortunately that's a pretty common stereotype and, even more unfortunately, often true.
It's one of the reasons I don't like the current level 1-3 system and believe a 5 or even 10 tier scale would be better. Currently both he and Dan Aykroyd would both be at level 1.

WeeWeiWiiWie posted...

Uhhh. ???

What are you confused about?

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just because being successful/financial good puts you at a 1 because you got youre shit sorted financially i guess?

definitely, theres successful people who have rough lives, and unsuccessful people who are completely happy

@The_Hat

youre description wasn't great, cancer and covid dont have cures but theyre illnesses

hes probably picking your point apart idk

UndefeatedGOAT posted...

just because being successful/financial good puts you at a 1 because you got youre shit sorted financially i guess?

definitely, theres successful people who have rough lives, and unsuccessful people who are completely happy

It's more like, and this is a terrible way to put it, "how close to being normal are you" in large groupings. Again, I really dislike the current scale, but you're welcome to read a better source on it here:
https://www.verywellhealth.com/what-are-the-three-levels-of-autism-260233

By the way, the technical terms are neurotypical and neurodivergent/nerodiverse with the former being "normal" and the latter being on the spectrum.

UndefeatedGOAT posted...

@The_Hat

youre description wasn't great, cancer and covid dont have cures but theyre illnesses

hes probably picking your point apart idk

Cancer we're trying to cure and covid we are trying to prevent and people can recover from both with medical aid.
Since ASD is a development thing there is no way (that I know of) that we could stop it/reverse it once it's happened.

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i didnt have an issue with what you said lol, I'm just trying to imagine what the shitposter meant, lazy "?" posts actually piss me off a lot tbh

I'm autistic and LGBTQIA+, so there's my anecdotal evidence towards a connection.

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UndefeatedGOAT posted...

i didnt have an issue with what you said lol, I'm just trying to imagine what the shitposter meant, lazy "?" posts actually piss me off a lot tbh

Fair, but I still wanted to point out the discrepancy I suppose. Honestly people calling me a shitposter earlier got me kinda upset.

hockeybub89 posted...

I'm autistic and LGBTQIA+, so there's my anecdotal evidence towards a connection.

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I've known several who are both on the spectrum and LGBT+. I just really, really, really, don't want Fox News style headlines about a correlation between the two. Ya know? Both groups get attacked far to much already.

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The_Hat posted...

Fair, but I still wanted to point out the discrepancy I suppose. Honestly people calling me a shitposter earlier got me kinda upset.

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I've known several who are both on the spectrum and LGBT+. I just really, really, really, don't want Fox News style headlines about a correlation between the two. Ya know? Both groups get attacked far to much already.

People dont know what shotposting is anymore

The conformist who can only ever post

Imagine saying ______ are shitposting

Whether something is curable theoretically or otherwise, has no bearing on whether it is an "illness".

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WeeWeiWiiWie posted...

Whether something is curable theoretically or otherwise, has no bearing on whether it is an "illness".

Its a minor slip up I thought it was clear they didnt mean that

UndefeatedGOAT posted...

Its a minor slip up I thought it was clear they didnt mean that

I mean, in his reply he continues to say that it's not an illness because it cannot be reversed (which is probably not necessarily true anyway).

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Looking solely at the overview, it doesnt sound nefarious at all, theyre just studying the overlap.

DeadBankerDream posted...

Anyone know who's shitposting alt TC is?

TC isnt shitposting, theyre cool.

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You all seem to be misinterpreting the definition of "intersectionality."

In this case, it refers to how there are multiple aspects of life, specifically in terms of minority identity.

So when you have a half Japanese half Navajo lesbian woman you have the intersection of several identities (Asian, Native American, multiracial, sexual orientation, gender) which have complex interactions both for the person and for how society treats said person.

So this event is more or less about how society treats minorities of both orientation and neurotypicality in similar ways.

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WeeWeiWiiWie posted...

I mean, in his reply he continues to say that it's not an illness because it cannot be reversed (which is probably not necessarily true anyway).

I looked it up and apparently the difference between disease and illness is that a disease can be cured and an illness can only be managed. Neat, I was wrong!
So technically I suppose it is a mental illness, but the PC term is still Developmental Disability.

Shablagoo posted...

Looking solely at the overview, it doesnt sound nefarious at all, theyre just studying the overlap.

TC isnt shitposting, theyre cool.

Thanks Shab <3

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