Current Events > The "wide as an ocean, deep as a puddle" open world shit has to stop.

(+) Yeah! (+)

It's getting a bit ridiculous when it's a pretty big chunk of the games coming out now. It's just so tedious and boring.

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Are you still buying them?

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HaVeNII7 posted...

Are you still buying them?

Not really. I've purchased exactly one game since 2019 lol. Just following the news.

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Problem is they are easy to develop/program and sell.

So they're not going away

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if you're complaining about BotW you're about 4 years too late

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HylianFox posted...

if you're complaining about BotW you're about 4 years too late

BotW really isn't the only open-world game that's potentially guilty of this.

But I guess since that was mentioned I really hope the sequel fixes it. It's apparently going to re-use the world in various ways, so why not just stuff it full of new stuff?

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indeed.
On the other hand Biomutant can't download fast enough

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HylianFox posted...

if you're complaining about BotW you're about 4 years too late

Ubisoft are the worst offenders, but not the only ones for sure.

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What games are you referring to?

I mean, I agree TC, but people have varying perspectives of this. Like, there are really good open world games, but I see posters crap on those here too. It blows my mind that some people say RDR2 sucks.

But yeah TC, I would prefer a guided/linear experience if it provided a really fun gameplay experience over wandering around some generic city, going from point A to point B and ultimately just delivering something or talking to someone with no level diversity since the entire game is just one map.

I think BoTW is absolutely not guilty of this. The world is constructed to literally be one giant navigational puzzle. Like the world design is ridiculously well thought out.

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See, I posted before reading the topic content but BotW is another one I feel you guys are a little harsh on.

On the other hand, there are also people that claim it's the best Zelda ever made which is def swinging too far in the other direction, so I kind of understand it. But pretending it's garbage isn't fair. I didn't even want to like it but I did.

I've never really understood what peoples' expectations are when they make this criticism tbqh

All open world games are just a handful of activities that you repeat at different points on the map. That's what they've always been

DipDipDiver posted...

I've never really understood what peoples' expectations are when they make this criticism tbqh

All open world games are just a handful of activities that you repeat at different points on the map. That's what they've always been

That's a reduction that can apply to the majority of genres. The sequences, variety of content, and amount of content can obviously have varying quality.

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COVxy posted...

I think BoTW is absolutely not guilty of this. The world is constructed to literally be one giant navigational puzzle. Like the world design is ridiculously well thought out.

Yeah, this is a good way of explaining it. I went into the game EXPECTING it to be what TC described and was proven wrong. Plus it does a damn good job of transforming Hyrule into a legit open map, w/all the notable areas of previous games given life. It ALMOST makes up for the lack of dungeons.

On the other hand....I still like Twilight Princess more.

Fallout 4 sux

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DipDipDiver posted...

I've never really understood what peoples' expectations are when they make this criticism tbqh

All open world games are just a handful of activities that you repeat at different points on the map. That's what they've always been

Ehhh, Ubisoft can be particularly bad about it though.

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I dunno, I think there's a place for that kind of intentionally minimal open world. It can serve an important aesthetic and narrative role, to invoke a sense of adventure or desolation or vastness.

But I do think that too many developers feel pressured to have an open world in their games because it's the norm, even in games that don't call for it, and they just end up being empty because they don't have any idea how, or enough resources, to fill it.

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Lol I dunno how this became about BotW. I mostly made it because of biomutant and it's comparisons to Ubisoft games.

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Guide posted...

That's a reduction that can apply to the majority of genres. The sequences, variety of content, and amount of content can obviously have varying quality.

TC isn't talking about quality though, he's talking about depth. Like I would consider the AC games to be high quality games but TC is holding them up as a prime example of lacking depth. I don't disagree with that, but what does depth actually mean in an open world game? That's what I mean when I say i don't know what people expect.

This is the result of people saying they need a game to be x number of hours long to justify the purchase. Quantity over quality.

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3PiesAndAFork posted...

This is the result of people saying they need a game to be x number of hours long to justify the purchase. Quantity over quality.

There was also a push for many years to have progressively larger maps. I think we're more or less at the point now where they're realizing there's such a thing as too big

I agree
Skyrim sucks

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you should play Shenmue TC

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Journalists for a long time just saw "Big, Open world11" in marketing and felt that was all that was needed for GOTY.

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DipDipDiver posted...

TC isn't talking about quality though, he's talking about depth. Like I would consider the AC games to be high quality games but TC is holding them up as a prime example of lacking depth. I don't disagree with that, but what does depth actually mean in an open world game? That's what I mean when I say i don't know what people expect.

Ahh, excuse me. That's a fair point, and something I've often wondered myself.

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how I feel playing Ghost of Tsushima.

I think it's a good game, from what I've played, but when I'm doing something that should be A -> B, I'm not trying to go to another location to pad out the time.

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COVxy posted...

I think BoTW is absolutely not guilty of this. The world is constructed to literally be one giant navigational puzzle. Like the world design is ridiculously well thought out.

Despite what I said, I could agree with this. It didn't feel super empty to me because traversing it was a navigational puzzle at times.

I do think it could've used something more substantial than 900 Korok Seeds and randomly collecting materials though, lol. Shrines were a cool concept though, they could bring back the concept by integrating mini-dungeons organically into the world, like finding caves or ruins with treasures inside after solving some environmental puzzles.

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BotW is like the only open world I've even been able to get through to the finish and then some.

The rest are way too boring and distracting. I feel like open world games would have been amazing when I was young. Now I just want to get through the experience of a game and move on. Don't care if it's guided or even has cheats to use.

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Goatsensation posted...

indeed.
On the other hand Biomutant can't download fast enough

what is bio mutant?

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Agnostic420 posted...

what is bio mutant?

According to most reviews, a "wide as an ocean, deep as a puddle" open world game.

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Agnostic420 posted...

what is bio mutant?

it's beautiful

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What open world games can be held up as good examples of intricate and immersive games?

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Criminalt posted...

What open world games can be held up as good examples of intricate and immersive games?

IMO - Breath of the Wild, GTAV, & RDR2.

the former because of how the world is Link's playground, and if you can imagine doing something, there's a good chance that you can do it.

for the other two, they each have living, sprawling worlds, that you can immerse yourself in and lose yourself. and it feels like things go on independently of you, like you're just a part of the world rather than the center of it.

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Damn_Underscore posted...

you should play Shenmue TC

I did on dream cast way back when. I prefer yakuza. It was a better shenmue.

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g0ldie posted...

how I feel playing Ghost of Tsushima.

I think it's a good game, from what I've played, but when I'm doing something that should be A -> B, I'm not trying to go to another location to pad out the time.

Ghost of tsushima was basically an Assassins Creed game, and if you've played any of the recent ones, that makes sense.

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That's why I like "open world" games like resident evil 8, it's a very curated experience but open enough to give you enough freedom to not be completely on rails 100% of the time.

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To be honest I prefer more measured open world design. BOTW being an example already listed in this topic. I'm playing Death Stranding at the moment and I'm enjoying having a destination and figuring out the ideal way to get there and what gear I should bring. That's taking advantage of an open world setting in a rather unique way.

My issue is when they try to cram too much stuff in because they're worried the player will get bored. Enemy outposts here. Constant map markers with quest givers here. A bunch of lists with 0/20 outposts completed. All with no real rhyme or reason. It doesn't really feel like I'm exploring or navigating a world anymore. It feels like I'm working on a checklist. But even then I sort of get why people enjoy that design if it feels like you're clearing up the map. I enjoy it that style too if it doesn't go too overboard.

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Darmik posted...

To be honest I prefer more measured open world design. BOTW being an example already listed in this topic. I'm playing Death Stranding at the moment and I'm enjoying having a destination and figuring out the ideal way to get there and what gear I should bring. That's taking advantage of an open world setting in a rather unique way.

My issue is when they try to cram too much stuff in because they're worried the player will get bored. Enemy outposts here. Constant map markers with quest givers here. A bunch of lists with 0/20 outposts completed. All with no real rhyme or reason. It doesn't really feel like I'm exploring or navigating a world anymore. It feels like I'm working on a checklist. But even then I sort of get why people enjoy that design if it feels like you're clearing up the map. I enjoy it that style too if it doesn't go too overboard.

As stated, Ubisoft is definitely the worst about this.

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Yup and I'm playing through horizon zero dawn and it's as generic as it comes, at least the story and graphics are good.

I prefer large hub zones like jedi fallen order with secret areas you can discover. I really cant think of a good modern open world game

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apocalyptic_4 posted...

Yup and I'm playing through horizon zero dawn and it's as generic as it comes, at least the story and graphics are good.

I prefer large hub zones like jedi fallen order with secret areas you can discover. I really cant think of a good modern open world game

Witcher 3 at least made the side quests actually meaningful with their own interesting stories.

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steveoSEK posted...

Witcher 3 at least made the side quests actually meaningful with their own interesting stories.

Forgot about the witcher 3 that's a rare exception. Other than mixing up high level enemies at random parts of the map with high level quests you shouldn't get access to so early it's a great example.

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COVxy posted...

I think BoTW is absolutely not guilty of this. The world is constructed to literally be one giant navigational puzzle. Like the world design is ridiculously well thought out.

I agree with this. There's so much variety in most of BotW open world that this does not apply imo

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apocalyptic_4 posted...

I prefer large hub zones like jedi fallen order with secret areas you can discover.

Exactly the game I was about to mention. Huge world but it stays linear and keeps you moving, exploring, and coming back.

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I play open world games mainly for the sense of adventure. Like I enjoy just riding around on a horse in RDR1&2 seeing what locations I can find or just to take in the sights.

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Flockaveli posted...

Exactly the game I was about to mention. Huge world but it stays linear and keeps you moving, exploring, and coming back.

Jedi fallen order was basically a 3d 3rd person metroidvania, and it's structure was perfect. I loved it.

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Strider102 posted...

I play open world games mainly for the sense of adventure. Like I enjoy just riding around on a horse in RDR1&2 seeing what locations I can find or just to take in the sights.

Rdr 1 and 2, and GTA5, had random events that would happen while in the world, which was great.

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steveoSEK posted...

Rdr 1 and 2, and GTA5, had random events that would happen while in the world, which was great.

That too.

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Criminalt posted...

What open world games can be held up as good examples of intricate and immersive games?

Yakuza 0
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