Board 8 > Coronavirus topic 7: Biohazard

(+) Yeah! (+)

Other viral infections can affect sense of smell/taste but I don't think those are to the same degree as gets reported with COVID-19.

There's also stuff like focal seizures which would be fleeting and highly unlikely to hit multiple people at once. There's also stroke which is similarly unlikely.

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guffguy89 posted...

This is one of the arguments people who have been violating the stay at home order since day 1 have been making. I initially looked at those people with shock. Like, how could they be so irresponsible, selfish, and careless? But a month has gone by and despite them seeing everyone and going everywhere, they never got the virus nor have anyone they've known. Obviously, this is just a short sample size of the people I know personally that have been breaking the stay at home order, but the longer this goes on, it's creating a false sense of security in people who are following the orders. If my friend isnt getting the virus by going to see his family and friends every other day, what are the chances I'd get the virus if I go see someone once?

The other new argument that's coming up is how long are we suppose to avoid our older relatives? Until a vaccine? Am i not supposed to physically see my mom for a year or two? Is that really the only responsible approach? If you say, "after the stay at home order is lifted, you can see her" or "wait a few more months and you can see her." Well, the coronavirus will still be around at that point, so I have as much chance of giving it to her now as I would giving it to her later. Until we both get vaccinated.

I just feel like I'm slowly turning to the other side on this. Every day they seem to be the more reasonable and my own the less reasonable.

on the first: there's no way of knowing if those people caught it and are asymptomatic too. it is definitely frustrating to see that and honestly, if you're not in a major city the risk is smaller, so i understand that. with that said, there are cases where people do that and end up infecting literally 100+ people. the biggest record i think is to a guy over in India who has a rumored count of 40,000.

the second and third basically just are a case of the more emotional and social side of things coming out. hell, that's part of the first one too really, it's jealousy or even outright envy of the ability to do that. which... is pretty human so it's nothing bad to feel or think that way. i don't know how severe the lockdown is where you are but a lot of places are overreaching and it shows. humans are social creatures that demand sunlight - these are natural needs we have as humans, it's literally our biology and make up. it's perfectly reasonable to want a clear idea of when things are opening up so you can prep for that. similarly, it's perfectly reasonable to be fearful of opening up too soon. you're just looking for a middle line so i wouldn't feel bad or guilty, it's a good thing to be able to see and understand the varying perspectives.

personally i take the position that if 1) our numbers are down, 2) our medical facilities are fully capable to handling an uptick of cases again (including concerns on PPE), and 3) we continue certain measures to minimize infection, we should start opening things up. medical has always been the line to work towards and what any plan should target. the good news of my outlook is that we've basically hit 1, are mostly there on 2, and 3 is happening. though "certain measures" should probably be better defined because i do fear businesses and governments overreaching themselves on it (e.g., mandatory/"recommended" contact tracing, certain business restrictions).

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redrocket posted...

Are there people here who seriously thought the current guidelines would be sustainable for what, the rest of the year or something? Help me out here.

This is my issue with how everyone is acting too. We went from 2 weeks lockdown to flatten the curve to people wanting lockdown until nobody at all has the virus which isn't realistic. The whole point of the lockdown was to make sure the health system wasn't overwhelmed rather than complete prevention of the virus. It wasn't like we were going to magically open after 2 or 4 or 12 weeks and the virus was no longer an issue. Until a vaccine is developed or herd immunity is developed, the virus is going to be a part of our life. A vaccine is likely years away and herd immunity requires the majority of people to actually get the virus and again would be a long time away from developing and involving a lot of death.

Now I'm not saying we should reopen and go back to normal but it also isn't remotely feasible to be on lockdown for the indefinite future either. Social distancing needs to remain (as much as it can) and reopening needs to happen at some point. Maybe not necessarily right now but also not months down the line either.

The fact that so many people have gotten it and were asymptomatic is both a good and bad thing. The virus is less deadly than we thought and seems to be getting less deadly the more data we get. However, it's also spread a lot more than we have recorded too which obviously isn't great for the ones who are at risk.

Sweden is probably someone we should be looking at since they effectively just said fuck it and went about business as normal. Not as densely populated as the US but should give an idea of what happens when we reopen somewhat.

We had something like 8 people out at one point and one of my supervisors was out for two weeks with severe bronchitis she was hospitalized for. I vividly remember one of my coworkers from the overnight shift happily telling me her fever broke when I showed up to relieve her and being like uhhhhhhh why are you here. We work in a hospital so we all could have been exposed, who knows

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Where you from Ryokles?

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Boston

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Kinglicious posted...

humans are social creatures that demand sunlight - these are natural needs we have as humans, it's literally our biology and make up.

i generally prefer being alone, actually, so the lockdown hasn't negatively affected my mental state at all >_>

can't imagine how shit this whole situation has been for people who always need to be around other people, though.

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Kinglicious posted...

They'll still oppose opening everything up.
But they'll break the rules too. Which, if you just look at the mask practices, was a given.

I saw a fair amount of folks on social media who were partying it up on spring break/St. Patty's, only to take a hard turn to cries of "STAY THE FUCK HOOOOOME" and shaming people once they realized they themselves could be shamed for going out.

As soon as the court of public opinion eases up even slightly on people going out, you'll see hordes of those militant types crack like eggs in short order.

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There are going to be people like red regardless, who want a full lockdown until a vaccine because they are scared. Which is understandable. I, however, don't see any way with the way data is currently trending and with the furor that is rising in the populace that it continues that way.

I expect at some point we will pivot to a slowly let everyone get it until herd immunity standpoint (slowly) that way just in case a vaccine doesn't happen we still have a path forward.

Just keep the infections below overwhelming states and using masks in most in door communal areas.

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I have never advocated for full lockdown until vaccine. I want a shrinking of the curve and then smart intelligent phased reopenings.

Hell I have literally been stating in these topics that I am of the opinion us ever creating a safe and effective vaccine is less likely than not.

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Hell I literally go outside every day. I want people to go outside but not pack the fucking beaches and put everyone at risk.

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red13n posted...

I have never advocated for full lockdown until vaccine. I want a shrinking of the curve and then smart intelligent phased reopenings.

Hell I have literally been stating in these topics that I am of the opinion us ever creating a safe and effective vaccine is less likely than not.

I must misremember then.

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https://twitter.com/jjenna/status/1256709008427225089

Woman tries to enter Family Dollar without mask. Is told she can't without the mask. She spits in his face. Guard pushes her out. She returns with family who shoot security guard in the head.

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lock her(and him) up?

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https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/04/us/coronavirus-live-updates.html

This obviously sounds impossible but...

"The projections, based on government modeling pulled together in chart form by the Federal Emergency Management Agency, forecast about 200,000 new cases each day by the end of the month, up from about 25,000 cases a day currently."

If 200,000 new cases a day, herd immunity would be reached rather quickly.

I doubt this though. This doesn't account for the massive amounts of asymptomatic numbers we have been finding lately.

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I think we end up beating projections, but primarily on the ground that our physical distancing numbers are actually already significantly better than what initial government projections estimated. So I imagine the models are also continuing to overestimate how much people will interact with each other.

The uncertainty for a month from now is probably huge.

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Corrik7 posted...

?

It's quite likely someone is lying. If the symptomatic/asymptomatic ratio is around 1:400 then the outbreak in the United States is almost over due to almost reaching herd immunity.

The only other explanation is the virus in that cluster has mutated to be less virulent, which would be great assuming no latent effects in the future

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%s don't equally show everywhere. Could be a lucky small sample size. Something regional. Maybe they will get symptoms later on or so on.

I don't see why people would lie though.

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There is a lot of sampling selection fallacies in these studies. Their hypothesis might not be entirely wrong but likely not correct to the numbers they are trying to showcase.

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Out of curiosity. How good or shitty are your areas for dishing out unemployment in the pandemic?

I was furloughed on April 10th (hopefully returning June 1st) and applied for assistance on April 11th. My application is still 'Pending - Submitted', hasn't even synced up with the main unemployment site yet and I have yet to hear anything at all back from them. Essentially, they haven't even touched / looked at my application yet.

Fortunately I am not in a position where the money will make or break me and I have plenty to fall back on. But good grief, anyone who actually does need the money is royally fucked. How could people go a month without money they need? And it's not like there's an end in sigiht. They haven't even started the process on my app yet, nevermind being anywhere close to sending the money.

Depends on your state. Lots of people backlogged in PA. If you can get on the phone with them, you can get it sorted right away, but it's hit or miss elsewise. My father got his UE within 72 hours. His wife is now 5 weeks still waiting.

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I actually got on the phone with them last week fairly easily and they said 'Yeah, it takes 3-4 weeks from application right now'. They also told me my application wasn't even in the system yet as they tried searching for it. So basically did nothing for me over the phone.

Florida has a stupid system where you apply through one site even though everything is done through a different site.

Massachusetts has been pretty good with it so far. My husband signed up the end of March I think or maybe the beginning of April and his went through right away

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CERB came in 2 days here

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Filing in Illinois was relatively easy. The Illinois employment website sectioned off time periods based on last names and I was able to certify and get my unemployment check last week.

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Missouri is doing surprisingly well for me. I submitted in late March, ten days later I was accepted and Ive been getting it weekly ever since plus a 600 dollars bonus per week as some sort of coronavirus relief thing. Its been a lifesaver and I honestly wasnt expecting it from a red state.

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charmander6000 posted...

It's quite likely someone is lying. If the symptomatic/asymptomatic ratio is around 1:400 then the outbreak in the United States is almost over due to almost reaching herd immunity.

The only other explanation is the virus in that cluster has mutated to be less virulent, which would be great assuming no latent effects in the future

Haven't a lot of people in those other supposedly all-asymptomatic clusters later come down with symptoms?

Seems like there are at least two easy explanations that I'd buy way before "almost everybody has had it and is asymptomatic":

1. There was a superspreader event a day or two before testing, and everyone was in the latency period
2. Batch of bad tests

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https://twitter.com/Freeyourmindkid/status/1257298294302289920

This shit is totally dumb as fuck lol... but it was cracking me the hell up. haha.

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"you believe in science dont you" i lost it.

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Went for a walk today, saw a man who seems to be delivering food, he appears to put the drink near his crotch area before handing it to the person who bought it, that's not sanitary WTF?? This is why I am definitely not ordering any takeout from now on even though I can get any food I want for free with promotion offers, food from resturants can be a source of contamination. I have not eaten anything for the past two days straight, fasting = good for your health.

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AltairXXX posted...

Went for a walk today, saw a man who seems to be delivering food, he appears to put the drink near his crotch area before handing it to the person who bought it, that's not sanitary WTF?? This is why I am definitely not ordering any takeout from now on even though I can get any food I want for free with promotion offers, food from resturants can be a source of contamination. I have not eaten anything for the past two days straight, fasting = good for your health.

Yeah, that isn't healthy.

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Positive case at work. The guy who had it kept coming into work even despite being very sick. Finally they stopped him and told him to get tested. Positive. Temp checks now and tracing his contacts here.

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We also had a positive case at work over the weekend although they didn't tell us who or what department so no idea if it was the lab or not.

They restricted our social distancing rules even further especially for break rooms.

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Corrik7 posted...

Positive case at work. The guy who had it kept coming into work even despite being very sick. Finally they stopped him and told him to get tested. Positive. Temp checks now and tracing his contacts here.

Was it someone you had close contact with?

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Corrik7 posted...

Positive case at work. The guy who had it kept coming into work even despite being very sick. Finally they stopped him and told him to get tested. Positive. Temp checks now and tracing his contacts here.

Not recently no, but if he was that bad the entire locker room is possibly suspect.

Our plant supposedly got a 60 day WARN act for shut down today.

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ninkendo posted...

We also had a positive case at work over the weekend although they didn't tell us who or what department so no idea if it was the lab or not.

They restricted our social distancing rules even further especially for break rooms.

we have two here now and they havent changed a thing in the break room for us. one of them actually had their 40something year old sister die from the virus

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LordoftheMorons posted...

Haven't a lot of people in those other supposedly all-asymptomatic clusters later come down with symptoms?

Seems like there are at least two easy explanations that I'd buy way before "almost everybody has had it and is asymptomatic":

There was a superspreader event a day or two before testing, and everyone was in the latency period
Batch of bad tests

I can't speak to the case of the pork processing plant specifically, but there's been a dearth of followup investigation and reporting on outbreaks with large contingents of asymptomatic people. Most of these wind up being snapshots of the situation.

No clue what's come of the NY maternity ward, the Boston homeless, the Marion, Ohio prison (or any of the several prison outbreaks), for examples. Even a breakdown of a pretty well contained incident with testing done on all people like with the USS Theodore Roosevelt or the French carrier, Charles de Gaullle is difficult to find. One of the rare followups I've actually seen was from early April with the nursing home in Wilmington, Massachusetts where like 80% of the residents were asymptomatic. Then 5 days later 7 residents were dead but they were still reporting 60% asymptomatic.

I also learned just yesterday that there was no second survey of passengers who were aboard the Diamond Princess. They just projected Wuhan statistics onto the case figures and didn't follow up, so that's why the claim of asymptomatic population dwindling to 18% happened.

I'm not inclined to believe bad tests are responsible for it either since that's been such a rare thing since March. Maybe more believable than "no one is showing symptoms" but bad testing like that has barely been a thing for like six weeks. But a superspreader event, especially that's increasingly looking like the modus operandi of this disease, is most likely.

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Yep. WARN act is filed. 60 days til our plant is idled. Sigh.

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Restaurants are open for outside dining here. Theyre opening everything back up come the 18th, which is still too soon. But Im worried my boss will buy some picnic tables and open up anyway since apparently thats allowed.

Currently playing is this allergies or corona with the little cough and scratchy throat I have. Getting flashbacks to when timjab said the same thing

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RIP Ryoko.

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Someone in my lab and someone in the lab that shares the floor with us tested positive within the past couple of days. So RIP me too, I guess.

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Ryokles posted...

Currently playing is this allergies or corona with the little cough and scratchy throat I have. Getting flashbacks to when timjab said the same thing

If it helps, I had a little cough with a scratchy throat about a month ago, and it went away after 3 days and hasn't come back. Hopefully it's just that

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Ryokles posted...

Currently playing is this allergies or corona with the little cough and scratchy throat I have. Getting flashbacks to when timjab said the same thing

How much risk have you taken?

If significant I would get tested.

Otherwise, we are mostly still in allergy season.

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Well I work in a hospital lab in Boston at the states largest hospital. Three people in my lab have tested positive and I came into contact with one. We were both in the break room the same time without our masks on for about five mins. Im honestly not that worried! Its almost positively allergies since this is how they typically manifest for me

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That's enough risk that I'd get tested.
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Also the whole micro lab pretty much has tested positive in the last month and they share a lot of spaces with us and nobodys caught it from them at all. It helps that we all wear masks unless were eating but everyone is six+ feet apart at that point

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You need to get tested.

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Play Virtue's Last Reward
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