Current Events > If you think abortion shouldn't be a right, you're wrong. Full stop.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Neither you nor society has any right to determine what someone does with their own body.

Thinking it's wrong is fine. Trying to force that opinion on others is not.

Idk, I'm 100% pro-choice but I can see why someone who thinks it's murder doesn't give a fuck about bodily autonomy

---

You don't have the pontificate authority to decide an unborn child is part of its mother's body.

---

DevsBro posted...

You don't have the pontificate authority to decide an unborn child is part of its mother's body.

It's already been decided.

Hinakuluiau posted...

Idk, I'm 100% pro-choice but I can see why someone who thinks it's murder doesn't give a fuck about bodily autonomy

If we somehow could hook up grown adults to other adults to feed them nutrients and nurse them to health, it would not be murder to volunteer and then change your mind.

No one ever has a right to your body without ongoing consent. Their age, their innocence, their need, none of it matters.

---

DevsBro posted...

You don't have the pontificate authority to decide an unborn child is part of its mother's body.

It's not part of the mother's body, but no body has a right to another body. If it can't survive as its own body, that's just unfortunate. I view a fetus as a unique human body and fully support legal abortion.

If you can get a viable fetus out of a woman that doesn't want it, then by all means try to save it with medicine.

---

C

---

Isnt this from a nofx song

---

OctilIery posted...

Neither you nor society has any right to determine what someone does with their own body.

Then why is it illegal for me to sell or buy kidneys?

---

My thoughts on the issue are summed up quite well by the chorus from a Behind Enemy Lines song.

It's her body, it's her decision
Not that of state, man or religion
The pro-life movement is a moral fraud
So fuck their lies and fuck their god
---

KillerSlaw posted...

Then why is it illegal for me to sell or buy kidneys?

You've managed the dumbest possible take.

Congratulations.

---

KillerSlaw posted...

Congratulate yourself on your non answer and getting triggered over obvious shitposting

Fair.

In my defense it's getting to be impossible to discern between shitposts and reality here.

---

DrizztLink posted...

You've managed the dumbest possible take.

Congratulations.

While it was a shitpost

I need a kidney so why shouldn't this line of thinking work to my benefit? I could care less who gets an abortion tbh

---

KillerSlaw posted...

While it was a shitpost

I need a kidney so why shouldn't this line of thinking work to my benefit? I could care less who gets an abortion tbh

Dumbest question Ive ever seen

---

shockthemonkey posted...

And theyre wrong for thinking its murder

But if you kill a expecting mother, you get a harsher sentence for the death of the fetus.

I'm only against late term abortions. First few months is okay, but there are some psychos out there that think 7-9 months is right, which I disagree with

---

shockthemonkey posted...

Please tell me youre not actually confused by this and youre capable of telling the difference between choosing to have a fetus removed from your body and someone else ending its life without anyones consent.

No, I understand the difference. But you can't count it as a living thing for one person and not the other. The argument is that they're not really alive, so it's not murder. Then it can't be murder by anyone unless it's alive. And if it's alive, then the mother is guilty of murder

It can't be both ways

---

EndOfDiscOne posted...

Dumbest question Ive ever seen

Really? You must be pretty sheltered...

Why is my body, my choice only legit or should be allowed for certain things?

---

Doesn't that also imply that thinking this is also wrong?

Not saying I disagree with your other parts of the post.

---

-l___________l- posted...

I don't care about abortion (I'm not a woman) but what do people think about abortions that happen in the ninth month or where the fetus could survive as a baby? I know it's illegal in some places, do people think they should be legal?

Do you know what an abortion at 9 months is called?

A delivery

---

@shockthemonkey

^ Because the pro-choice crowd's main argument is that the baby isn't alive. You can't kill someone if they're not alive

---

shockthemonkey posted...

Why are you tagging me? Cmon buddy Im already in this topic.

You cant terminate a pregnancy without consent. Stop acting confused.

Because someone posted after you so the ^ was to the wrong person

We're talking about murder here. If the baby isn't alive, then you shouldn't have 2 murder cases. It should be just 1. You're the one acting confused here.

---

BTW, what do you all think about mothers that do drugs, smoke and drink during pregnancy?

---

shockthemonkey posted...

Im confused why youre acting so dumb

If it's just about the consent of the mother, then you have to concede that there is nothing wrong with her drinking, smoking, doing drugs, etc while pregnant.

If it's okay for her to kill her offspring before birth, then there is no reason she can't do whatever else she wants while pregnant. Because the only thing that matters is what she consents to do with her own body and no one has any right to tell her what she can and can't do with her body, regardless of the consequences on the baby.

If that baby dies in the womb or comes out all kinds of fucked up because she was binge drinking and smoking crack while pregnant, then oh well. Sucks to suck.

Except that has an effect on the life of the baby.

Baby gets aborted, no net change.

Baby is born with FAS, net negative change.

---

DrizztLink posted...

Except that has an effect on the life of the baby.

Baby gets aborted, no net change.

Baby is born with FAS, net negative change.

The net change of the baby being aborted is it's fucking dead, dude. That has a pretty big effect on its life.

Also...

OctilIery posted...

Neither you nor society has any right to determine what someone does with their own body.

Thinking it's wrong is fine. Trying to force that opinion on others is not.

You have no right to determine what the mother does with her body. The fetus inside of her doesnt have any right to a clean host. It has no right to expect the mother to refrain from her alcoholism.

You can't say she can't shoot up heroin just because she's 8 months pregnant, you nor society have any right to tell her what she can do with her own body.

Esrac posted...

The net change of the baby being aborted is it's fucking dead, dude. That has a pretty big effect on its life.

Never existed versus existing with FAS.

No net change versus net negative change.

---

DrizztLink posted...

Never existed versus existing with FAS.

No net change versus net negative change.

You're deluded, dude. It clearly exists, otherwise there would be no reason for the woman to have an abortion. The only way for it to never have existed is if the mother had never gone pregnant.

Those are some pretty extreme mental gymnastics. I don't think I've ever heard someone actually say the offspring never existed, so it's okay to kill it. Do you just not understand the concept of continuity?

The fetus exists, I'm talking about consciousness.

---

I think life is being confused with personhood as the actual important thing. An advanced tumor has more going on than a first trimester human. A hundred lives are extinguished if we scratch our own skin too roughly.

---

DrizztLink posted...

The fetus exists, I'm talking about consciousness.

Not particularly relevant, especially if the primary concern is the ongoing consent of the mother.

If the offspring doesn't have any right to take residence in her body against her will, then it doesn't have any right to that residence being clean and healthy against her will.

If removing the offspring from her results in its death, hey, that sucks, but it didn't have any right to her body and you don't have any right to tell her otherwise. If her drinking and doing drugs kills it or otherwise fucks it up, hey, that suck, but it didn't have any right to be there and you have no right to tell her otherwise.

Because the primary issue is what she consents to do with her own body.

You understand that, if it is carried through to birth, any defects as a result of intentional usage of such substances that would bring risk to the fetus would indeed be the fault of the mother?

Your logic doesn't hold up because it takes no consideration of the fact that the thing will become an entity with legal rights if it isn't terminated.

---

Guide posted...

You understand that, if it is carried through to birth, any defects as a result of intentional usage of such substances that would bring risk to the fetus would indeed be the fault of the mother?

Your logic doesn't hold up because it takes no consideration of the fact that the thing will become an entity with legal rights if it isn't terminated.

That's just the natural extent of the pro-abortion position that the primary concern should be the on-going consent of the mother to carry the offspring and that society can not place restrictions on what people can do with their bodies.

The offspring will develop into their own legal entity if they aren't killed, but if it is okay to kill them because the mother's consent and bodily autonomy should not be restricted by society, then it follows that she should be able to do other things to her body that consequently negatively impact her offspring. Because the offspring apparently doesn't have any rights or expectations while its inside her.

The expectation is that you aren't going to abort the baby you're shooting up heroin while carrying, especially in the late months. You'll be guilty of child abuse the day you give birth. It's like why we consider murdering a pregnant woman to be a double murder. We should push abortion heavily for these women and strip them of parental rights immediately if the child manages to be born

Bad_Mojo posted...

No, I understand the difference. But you can't count it as a living thing for one person and not the other. The argument is that they're not really alive, so it's not murder. Then it can't be murder by anyone unless it's alive. And if it's alive, then the mother is guilty of murder

It can't be both ways

A fetus is a living being and it is not murder to remove them. No one has a right to your body the moment you stop allowing it

---

Pretty simple, if you purposefully stop someones heart beating, you are killing them. Fetuss have heartbeats. Its murder.

---

-l___________l- posted...

I don't care about abortion (I'm not a woman) but what do people think about abortions that happen in the ninth month or where the fetus could survive as a baby? I know it's illegal in some places, do people think they should be legal?

I personally think it should be legal. The issue is the woman's right to bodily autonomy. That shouldn't be trumped by the age of the fetus inside of her. If it is, then that right never truly mattered at all.

That said, no one is just waiting until nine months in to have an abortion for funsies. All these laws against late term abortions do is make it harder for people to terminate wanted pregnancies for health reasons. It even kills women (like that one in Ireland who died of sepsis because the Catholic hospital she was in refused to remove the already dead fetus from her body).

Bad_Mojo posted...

But if you kill a expecting mother, you get a harsher sentence for the death of the fetus.

I'm only against late term abortions. First few months is okay, but there are some psychos out there that think 7-9 months is right, which I disagree with

Hi. Want to explain why you think I'm a psycho?

If abortion isnt murder, why is it considered a double homicide if a pregnant woman is killed?

Im pro choice, but lets be real. Its murder

---

Wolf_J_Flywheel posted...

Pretty simple, if you purposefully stop someones heart beating, you are killing them. Fetuss have heartbeats. Its murder.

Self-defense is murder by this logic

---

hockeybub89 posted...

DevsBro posted...

You don't have the pontificate authority to decide an unborn child is part of its mother's body.

It's not part of the mother's body, but no body has a right to another body. If it can't survive as its own body, that's just unfortunate. I view a fetus as a unique human body and fully support legal abortion.

If you can get a viable fetus out of a woman that doesn't want it, then by all means try to save it with medicine.

I'd like if more pro choice people fully said and acknowledged that. Maybe they do, but it doesn't seem like it to me. I just really dislike the flippancy of how abortion is described by some.
---

i find the "her body her choice" argument to be very disingenuous, it takes the life of the fetus completely out of the conversation so that getting an abortion can be equated with getting a tattoo or haircut or something

---

emblem boy posted...

hockeybub89 posted...

DevsBro posted...

You don't have the pontificate authority to decide an unborn child is part of its mother's body.

It's not part of the mother's body, but no body has a right to another body. If it can't survive as its own body, that's just unfortunate. I view a fetus as a unique human body and fully support legal abortion.

If you can get a viable fetus out of a woman that doesn't want it, then by all means try to save it with medicine.

I'd like if more pro choice people fully said and acknowledged that. Maybe they do, but it doesn't seem like it to me. I just really dislike the flippancy of how abortion is described by some.

Like, the whole "it's just a clump of cells" talking point that used to be popular years ago is just so disingenuous
---

Romulox28 posted...

i find the "her body her choice" argument to be very disingenuous, it takes the life of the fetus completely out of the conversation so that getting an abortion can be equated with getting a tattoo or haircut or something

We should not try to shame people into giving up bodily autonomy just because dead fetuses make us sad.

The vast majority of abortions of convenience are done early in development anyway.

---

Don't make me feel bad. I'm just murdering my developing child. Like..get over it lol

/s

---

The anti-choice crowd is really riled up.

---