Current Events > billionaires earned their weal-

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averagejoel posted...

Gen5_AppleJack posted...

1337toothbrush posted...

pls posted...

You can earn above the median wage if you just push yourself and spend time on improving yourself and learning valuable skills.

After that becoming a millionaire is just a matter of time if you save and invest a bit each month.

It isn't rocket science people.

Everyone can earn above median wage!

Under capitalism yes, everyone has the best opportunities in countries that support it.

capitalism necessitates an underclass. in your scenario, it is being outsourced to another country.

Of course, and that's not a bad thing?

I'm not a millionaire nor a business owner nor a politician, etc.

And yet I'm still free to do what I want and I can buy anything, granted buying vehicles and homes would put me into some debt.

Point is, I'm also free to move up as high as I can achieve. Under socialism or communism, you're stuck where ever you were born.

Gen5_AppleJack posted...

Of course, and that's not a bad thing?

Hmm.

I mean it's good for us right now in a selfish way.

But it also relies on cheap labor overseas remaining a thing. Which means we're kinda stepping on countries who aren't as fortunate as us for our own benefit so we can get products/labor for cheap.
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Gen5_AppleJack posted...

averagejoel posted...

Gen5_AppleJack posted...

1337toothbrush posted...

pls posted...

You can earn above the median wage if you just push yourself and spend time on improving yourself and learning valuable skills.

After that becoming a millionaire is just a matter of time if you save and invest a bit each month.

It isn't rocket science people.

Everyone can earn above median wage!

Under capitalism yes, everyone has the best opportunities in countries that support it.

capitalism necessitates an underclass. in your scenario, it is being outsourced to another country.

Of course, and that's not a bad thing?

I'm not a millionaire nor a business owner nor a politician, etc.

And yet I'm still free to do what I want and I can buy anything, granted buying vehicles and homes would put me into some debt.

Point is, I'm also free to move up as high as I can achieve. Under socialism or communism, you're stuck where ever you were born.

but not everyone is free to move up as high as they can achieve
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I don't think anyone should have millions. People should have enough to sustain themselves and their family in the modern age, and the rest should be distributed to others in need. Even movie stars should be done this way. If that means movies and video games stop being made, then so be it.

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Darmik posted...

But it also relies on cheap labor overseas remaining a thing. Which means we're kinda stepping on countries who aren't as fortunate as us for our own benefit so we can get products/labor for cheap.

Considering America's brand of diplomacy it's not just being stepped on, it's being stepped on while always knowing that they have the means to wipe you off the face of the planet (or, more realistically, depose you and install their own leadership) if you don't comply.
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Darmik posted...

Which means we're kinda stepping on countries who aren't as fortunate as us for our own benefit

That's... not how it works. People do not enter into an agreement to buy and sell something unless both sides believe it is beneficial for them. China doesn't build factories to get poorer. Poverty levels across the world are in freefall for a reason.

Dyinglegacy posted...

I don't think anyone should have millions. People should have enough to sustain themselves and their family in the modern age, and the rest should be distributed to others in need. Even movie stars should be done this way. If that means movies and video games stop being made, then so be it.

No one would have enough to sustain themselves if we didn't have an economic system where people are rewarded for innovation. The Soviets couldn't even feed themselves and you think you'd only be giving up movies and video games lol.

Broseph_Stalin posted...

That's... not how it works. People do not enter into an agreement to buy and sell something unless both sides believe it is beneficial for them. China doesn't build factories to get poorer. Poverty levels across the world are in freefall for a reason.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/12/07/nightmare-at-chinese-factories-making-hasbro-and-disney-toys.html

Investigators found there were serious violations at the factories which were endangering workers.

In peak production season, employees were working up to 175 overtime hours per month. Chinese labour law restricts monthly overtime to 36 hours per month, but the report alleged factories would often ask local governments to implement a "comprehensive working hour scheme" to override existing legislation.

Workers were also not being given the legally required 24-hour safety training before commencing work, meaning they were unaware of how to protect themselves from toxic chemicals. The investigation also showed that employers were failing to provide them with the necessary safety equipment to prevent contact with those chemicals.

According to Solidar Suisse, workers often handled chemicals such as benzene, which has been linked to poisoning and leukaemia.

Investigators also found that workers were being forced to sign blank employment contracts and were provided with poor living quarters, which often housed eight people in one room with unsanitary facilities and no hot water.

Price pressure from multinational companies was a huge hurdle to improving Chinese workers' rights, according to the report.

"International brand companies are not accepting responsibility for the rights abuses in their supply chain," it claimed. "To meet their targets, they (use) short-term contracts with a fierce price competition and change orders on a very short-term basis. Every year many companies will request toy factories to increase their production quotas while decreasing the costs of production."

In the Wah Tung factory, an employee producing Disney's Princess Sing and Sparkle Ariel Doll would have a daily quota of up to 2,500 toys per day. They would work 26 days a month, earning $435 per month plus one cent for each doll produced. The Ariel doll currently retails on Amazon at $34.97 in the U.S.

One of many stories I'm sure.
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I didn't say China has amazing workplace conditions, I said people take part in these transactions willingly because they are mutually beneficial. If it wasn't they would have stayed at their jobs in agriculture.

Again, look at poverty rates. Put two and two together.

It's beneficial to an extent. We benefit from their working and living conditions remaining low.

A whole lot of people over there likely don't have all that many options to choose from.
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If hundreds of millions of people in China alone being lifted out of poverty is 'beneficial to an extent" than you probably don't actually care about the global poor.

212 posts of a low-IQ wealth jealousy topic now...
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You're putting words in my mouth. I never said there wasn't any benefit for them. But we still benefit being levels above them. That's all I'm saying. That's what I meant by beneficial to an extent. If their living, pay and working conditions matched ours we wouldn't offshore work to them.
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The Admiral posted...

212 posts of a low-IQ wealth jealousy topic now...

Well TC was trolling making this thread so there was probably little chance the socialists of CE were wanting honest discussion anyway.

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Darmik posted...

But we still benefit being levels above them. That's all I'm saying. That's what I meant by beneficial to an extent. If their living, pay and working conditions matched ours we wouldn't offshore work to them.

The only reason our standard of living, pay and working conditions are better is because we went through the exact same process of industrialization generations ago. The transactions that take place through free trade are mutually beneficial, and the poorer side actually sees larger increases in their quality of life.

Saying "capitalism bad" as a privileged person in the west doesn't actually help anyone, you're just grandstanding.

Again you're putting words in my mouth.

Western countries take advantage of the working conditions in less fortunate countries to get products/labor for cheaper. That's all I said.

No idea how that is grandstanding.
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