Current Events > Trump: Akshully i didn't call Nazis very fine people. Is hoax

(+) Yeah! (+)

It is a hoax. Read the transcript.

r25 posted...

What exactly is prager university

It's a little bit like Trump University, in that it's not actually a university.
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I watched that video about Charlottesville lie. It definitely just seemed like a click bait video. Idk why most people get suckered into those.

"Believe me. They said this. Take my word for it. They are bad. No sources."

"you had some very bad people in that group. But you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name.....Im not talking about the neo-Nazis and white nationalists because they should be condemned totally."

Racism is evil, and those who cause violence in its name are criminals and thugs, including the KKK, neo-Nazis, white supremacists, and other hate groups that are repugnant to everything we hold dear as Americans.

Literally condemns white supremacist groups by name in the transcript of his comments.

But yeah just scream racism and try to deflect by misinforming people. Not surprising that the people who are all for changing historic monuments because they are offended are the ones trying to change what Trump said to imply offenses to be outraged over. Gotta change that history to suit your needs.

People showed up to protest the removal of a statue. Just because racists showed up doesn't mean the 2 are the same. Just because racist marched the night before doesn't mean everyone that showed up the next day for the actual protest was racist. It also doesn't mean that there weren't actual racists there mixed in. There was a literal fence separating protesters and counter protesters. There were peaceful protesters and counter protesters on each of of that actual fence. Also on each side of that actual fence there were bad people geared to fight. Literally bOtH SiDeS for people with good intentions and bad intentions. Trump even points it out.

Seriously... fuck white supremacy, fuck violet protester, fuck antifa, and fuck everyone spreading misinformation to cause discourse. Nothing good comes out of any of those things.

There are things you can hate trump for but this is just flat out hate for no real reason.
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If you go to a protest to protest against the removal of a statue that stands for racism (but let's ignore that) and all around you everyone is waving swastika flags, yelling sieg heil, screaming about how best to murder Jews, etc., and you decide "yeah I'm okay with this"

How are you a very fine people?

Also, he didn't clarify the difference between the nazis and the garden variety racists at the protest until his own party had pressured him to do so. Those comments you quoted were three days after his initial comments on Charlottesville.

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Bossdog421 posted...

People showed up to protest the removal of a statue. Just because racists showed up

They didn't just "show up" they were literally the ones who organized it.....
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fenderbender321 posted...

I am just giving Trump the benefit of the doubt.

Look, here's the thing about language...it's 1000x more complex than you guys think it is when it comes to interpreting the intent and point of what people are saying. Yet everyone just seems so damn sure, and that is a problem. So I am trying to help you guys form better habits. It will help you go further in life.

You said it was "pointless to speculate" the reason the DOJ report on internal views regarding white nationalism being quashed. Why do you believe that you should speculate about Trump's motivations in this context?

fenderbender321 posted...

Ruvan22 posted...

fenderbender321 posted...

I am just giving Trump the benefit of the doubt.

Look, here's the thing about language...it's 1000x more complex than you guys think it is when it comes to interpreting the intent and point of what people are saying. Yet everyone just seems so damn sure, and that is a problem. So I am trying to help you guys form better habits. It will help you go further in life.

You said it was "pointless to speculate" the reason the DOJ report on internal views regarding white nationalism being quashed. Why do you believe that you should speculate about Trump's motivations in this context?

I am not speculating. I am saying I dont know what he meant and that I think it's a bit silly to think the president intended to give verbal support to Nazi and white supremacy groups.

You just said (in previous posts) that context matters, and therefore you are speculating - "I (don't) think the president intended to give support". That's speculation - where you ascribe a motive to an action. If you didn't want to speculate, you could have just not posted anything?

TiamatNM posted...

It is a hoax. Read the transcript.

I mean... this... honestly. I don't like Trump, but he did not endorse neo-nazis or white supremacists, he went out of his way to say "I disavow those groups".

But then everyone falls back on "oh so you're saying the neo nazis are FINE PEOPLE?" and it's like "no... I'm just saying Trump didn't endorse them".
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fenderbender321 posted...

Bossdog421 posted...

"you had some very bad people in that group. But you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name.....Im not talking about the neo-Nazis and white nationalists because they should be condemned totally."

Racism is evil, and those who cause violence in its name are criminals and thugs, including the KKK, neo-Nazis, white supremacists, and other hate groups that are repugnant to everything we hold dear as Americans.

Literally condemns white supremacist groups by name in the transcript of his comments.

But yeah just scream racism and try to deflect by misinforming people. Not surprising that the people who are all for changing historic monuments because they are offended are the ones trying to change what Trump said to imply offenses to be outraged over. Gotta change that history to suit your needs.

People showed up to protest the removal of a statue. Just because racists showed up doesn't mean the 2 are the same. Just because racist marched the night before doesn't mean everyone that showed up the next day for the actual protest was racist. It also doesn't mean that there weren't actual racists there mixed in. There was a literal fence separating protesters and counter protesters. There were peaceful protesters and counter protesters on each of of that actual fence. Also on each side of that actual fence there were bad people geared to fight. Literally bOtH SiDeS for people with good intentions and bad intentions. Trump even points it out.

Seriously... fuck white supremacy, fuck violet protester, fuck antifa, and fuck everyone spreading misinformation to cause discourse. Nothing good comes out of any of those things.

There are things you can hate trump for but this is just flat out hate for no real reason.

Great post.

Trump flat out said that he condemned white nationalists and Neo Nazis. I totally forgot about that. How can anyone argue that these are the people Trump meant are "fine" when he condemned them entirely?

The entire argument rests on "There probably wasn't any non-nazis or non-nationalists on this side, so even though Trump specifically condemned nazis and nationalists, he technically praised them when he said fine people on both sides".

Like, really? Worst case scenario was that Trump wasn't entirely up to date with the info about the rally, but also I have had 0 luck in trying to dig up anything that proves beyond any doubt that there wasn't people there just protesting the statue. If anyone has a link that shows the official census and demographics of the entire crowd, please post it.

So now you ARE speculating?

HairyThotter posted...

TiamatNM posted...

It is a hoax. Read the transcript.

I mean... this... honestly. I don't like Trump, but he did not endorse neo-nazis or white supremacists, he went out of his way to say "I disavow those groups".

But then everyone falls back on "oh so you're saying the neo nazis are FINE PEOPLE?" and it's like "no... I'm just saying Trump didn't endorse them".

The Nazis said they heard an endorsement
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fenderbender321 posted...

I am both speculating and not speculating at the same time.

Wow.

That's some 5D Chess bro.
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fenderbender321 posted...

I am both speculating and not speculating at the same time.

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why does steve cortes thinks he is white, anyway?

I have no doubt that there were people in the rallies who were neither neo-nazis nor white supremacists. But that's not all that important of a question in the long run. Sure, we can talk about how there probably were people in that crowd who don't ally themselves with the neo-nazi/white supremacist cause, and how that perhaps it's wrong to say that literally everybody in the crowd is a neo-nazi and/or white supremacist. But that doesn't really matter all that much when the crowd itself was very clearly one dominated by those radical ideologies.

When people condemn a group, it doesn't make sense to defend the voices that said group is drowning out.

There were 0 "fine people" on the nazi side, because they decided to stand besides the nazis. Any "fuine people" would have left. Therefore, Trump called very bad people "fine people," which is wrong to do. Either he supports bad people, or he's too stupid and uninformed to know there were no fine people there. Neither is good, his comments were wrong regardless.
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fenderbender321 posted...

DarkChozoGhost posted...

There were 0 "fine people" on the nazi side, because they decided to stand besides the nazis. Any "fuine people" would have left. Therefore, Trump called very bad people "fine people," which is wrong to do. Either he supports bad people, or he's too stupid and uninformed to know there were no fine people there. Neither is good, his comments were wrong regardless.

"Stand beside the nazis".....like...what does that mean? Are you saying it means they support Nazi beliefs? Because it doesn't. So what is the implication here?

Do you even English?

It means, standing in a place that is right next to them. Imagine the X is the nazi and the O is the "very fine person" :

XO

See? standing beside the x

fenderbender321 posted...

Okay? So if I stand next to a Nazi in a grocery line because we both want to purchase groceries, does that make me a bad person?

No, but if you stand next to a nazi protesting and chanting that makes you a bad person. Pretty simple.
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fenderbender321 posted...

Okay? So if I stand next to a Nazi in a grocery line because we both want to purchase groceries, does that make me a bad person?

If not, then why does it make me a bad person if it happened to be because we were both protesting a statue being removed and nothing more? I mean maybe the Nazi is the protesting more, but that is his business not mine.

Do you even common sense?

No, standing next to one at a grocery store means nothing.

Now, if a nazi convoked for a march, and you decided to go, and then you arrived, and you saw that 99% of the people there are nazis, they have nazi flags, they have nazi shields, they chant nazi chants, they're walking with tiki torches, do you really stand right next to them and choose to spend time with them? Not, unless you're one of them too.

fenderbender321 posted...

DarkChozoGhost posted...

fenderbender321 posted...

Okay? So if I stand next to a Nazi in a grocery line because we both want to purchase groceries, does that make me a bad person?

No, but if you stand next to a nazi protesting and chanting that makes you a bad person. Pretty simple.

What if I am not chanting? What if I am there just to protest the statue? That doesn't mean I am part of the Nazis or that I am supporting Nazi beliefs. It just means that we support ONE single common goal....wanting the statues to stay up. Something like that doesn't need to implicate everyone as party to all their shitty beliefs.

Yeah, because you'd be really comfortable to choose to hang around with people singing the chants, waving the flags, and giving the salutes. You'd be totally fine being surrounded by them. FOR HOURS.

Great logic there

fenderbender321 posted...

YokoGeri posted...

fenderbender321 posted...

Okay? So if I stand next to a Nazi in a grocery line because we both want to purchase groceries, does that make me a bad person?

If not, then why does it make me a bad person if it happened to be because we were both protesting a statue being removed and nothing more? I mean maybe the Nazi is the protesting more, but that is his business not mine.

Do you even common sense?

No, standing next to one at a grocery store means nothing.

Now, if a nazi convoked for a march, and you decided to go, and then you arrived, and you saw that 99% of the people there are nazis, they have nazi flags, they have nazi shields, they chant nazi chants, they're walking with tiki torches, do you really stand right next to them and choose to spend time with them? Not, unless you're one of them too.

Link to the official report of the political parties of every person at that protest?

the fuck?

Link to the official study that says how many licks it takes to get to the center of a tootie pop?

fenderbender321 posted...

What if I am not chanting? What if I am there just to protest the statue?

Still a bad person. You're still supporting the neo-nazis with your actions, even if you "don't share their beliefs."
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So how did you spend your Wednesday?

Oh, you know, the usual. I spent 8 hours arguing about how judging people for marching with Neo-Nazis while chanting The Jews will not replace us is actually really unfair
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fenderbender321 posted...

The question is....what has a person who may have fit the description I am putting forth done to hurt anyone or help Nazis hurt anyone? Answer that, and you win. Dont answer, and you lose. Simple as that.

there is no "winning" or "losing" here. You're giving a dumb argument and we poked holes on it, that's it.

If you go to a rally convoked for a nazi, arrive and see that it's overrun by nazis doing overtly nazi stuff and you choose to hang out with them for hours, you're clearly comfortable with them and their cause, period.

YokoGeri posted...

fenderbender321 posted...

The question is....what has a person who may have fit the description I am putting forth done to hurt anyone or help Nazis hurt anyone? Answer that, and you win. Dont answer, and you lose. Simple as that.

there is no "winning" or "losing" here. You're giving a dumb argument and we poked holes on it, that's it.

If you go to a rally convoked for a nazi, arrive and see that it's overrun by nazis doing overtly nazi stuff and you choose to hang out with them for hours, you're clearly comfortable with them and their cause, period.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P54sP0Nlngg" data-time="

this is the guy who organized it, btw:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=626S18_6h3s" data-time="

fenderbender321 posted...

DarkChozoGhost posted...

fenderbender321 posted...

What if I am not chanting? What if I am there just to protest the statue?

Still a bad person. You're still supporting the neo-nazis with your actions, even if you "don't share their beliefs."

How am I supporting them? Am I giving them money? Am I helping them hurt people? Please be specific and dont respond with abstracts.

You increase the size and power of their mob. They appear to have a more sizable following, which empowers other like them to rise up. That helps them. You help them. You are a bad person for doing so.

fenderbender321 posted...

Were there not groups that were doing their own thing?

Nope
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Fender is moving goalposts again. I guess he'll do anything to defend Nazis and white supremacists. Sad.
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fenderbender321 posted...

You increase the size and power of their mob. They appear to have a more sizable following, which empowers other like them to rise up. That helps them. You help them. You are a bad person for doing so.

Abstract.

Making a mob bigger is not abstract.
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fenderbender321 posted...

You can organize a rally and have all kinds of people show up for it for all kinds of reasons.

what part of THE RALLY WAS ORGANIZED BY A NAZI don't you get?