Current Events > Are China the bad guys like North Korea, or are they part of the good guys now?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Is there only the one bad guy now?

China are Schrodinger's Bad Guy. They're both good and bad at the same time.
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They are capitalist which america likes and also commies still which we hate its a double edge sword tbh
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There are no good or bad guys in the world. It's impossible to boil down any country into such a simple moral paradigm. I'd say that China's blatant disregard for human rights definitely makes their government, at best, pretty morally questionable.

Thinking you can describe an entire country as good or bad is such a cold war mindset. A country is made op of millions of people with their own thoughts, hopes, and dreams. Even if the leadership is evil the people may not be and that's what matters.

Edit: ninja'd by a minute!
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Given that North Korea owes it's continued existence to China, I'd say that if you think NK is bad then China can't really be good.

If you look at the definition of fascism and the modern version of the PRC, it's probably the state that most closely resembles that today. Take that how you will. As is the case in general the government is the problem, not the people, and the people do not get to vote for their government or express their opinions freely.
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There are no global bad guys or good guys. That's too simplistic.

it's worse than good or bad they're an increasingly global power
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Dash_Harber posted...

There are no good or bad guys in the world. It's impossible to boil down any country into such a simple moral paradigm. I'd say that China's blatant disregard for human rights definitely makes their government, at best, pretty morally questionable.

There absolutely are bad guys, take the Taliban or ISIS as examples, or the North Korean leadership.

I used to naively believe there aren't bad guys. When you get the majority of a population to murderously demand the death of "apostates" and crack down on every aspect of private life, you are bad guys as far as I'm concerned. Nazis are another obvious example. I'm not sorry for saying that. Unapologetic serial killers and such are more examples.

I think in reality free will is an elaborate illusion, so I don't believe in outright hating people, but I absolutely believe some people are corrupted into an evil manner of conduct, and sadly there are some parts of the world where the brainwashing affects a majority of the population.

China is indeed quite a conundrum though. It's certainly not a good/bad situation there, as it is with more completely murderous societies.

Voxwik posted...

Dash_Harber posted...

There are no good or bad guys in the world. It's impossible to boil down any country into such a simple moral paradigm. I'd say that China's blatant disregard for human rights definitely makes their government, at best, pretty morally questionable.

There absolutely are bad guys, take the Taliban or ISIS as examples, or the North Korean leadership.

I used to naively believe there aren't bad guys. When you get the majority of a population to murderously demand the death of "apostates" and crack down on every aspect of private life, you are bad guys as far as I'm concerned. Nazis are another obvious example. I'm not sorry for saying that. Unapologetic serial killers and such are more examples.

I think in reality free will is an elaborate illusion, so I don't believe in outright hating people, but I absolutely believe some people are corrupted into an evil manner of conduct, and sadly there are some parts of the world where the brainwashing affects a majority of the population.

China is indeed quite a conundrum though. It's certainly not a good/bad situation there, as it is with more completely murderous societies.

I either wasn't clear or you didn't understand me. I was talking about entire countries. Yes there are obviously bad people. No need to fucking evangelize some condescending philosophy vomit at me.

China is a lot like Saudi Arabia in that they're the "good guys" in the sense that we have trade relations with them.

But when it comes to things like human rights and such, nope
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This is a pretty naive take on the complex dynamics of international relations. Democracy does not automatically equal "good", need I remind you of the rather...questionable actions the US committed during the Cold War and beyond? Or that the world's largest "democracy" India is a borderline clusterfuck of social inequalities and internal tension? The post-Mao China despite its authoritarian nature has managed to lift hundreds of millions of people out of poverty, an incredible accomplishment.

For most Chinese people, fancy terms like human rights doesn't put food on the table and most people there would take the stability and economic growth provided by the CCP rather than chance it with a western style democracy.
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any country that bans winnie the pooh cant be the good guys.
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when china can bomb a hospital of innocent people. investigate themselves. blame the missle. then they can be the "good guys"
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China is about to topple America as the world's greatest global power, so they're definitely a rival but more importantly, their government is anti-democracy and against all the good values America (aside from capitalism) has championed since its inception.
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"are china the bad guys like the US/russia are?" is a better comparison because it matches the size scale better. NK talks a lot of shit but is ultimately irrelevant on a global scale, whereas the above 3 all play a significant part

Ricemills posted...

any country that bans winnie the pooh cant be the good guys.

fucked up if true
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anth0ny posted...

Ricemills posted...

any country that bans winnie the pooh cant be the good guys.

fucked up if true

It is true. There was an image of President Obama and Xi Jinping walking was compared to a picture of Winnie the Pooh and Tigger walking. It's pretty common for totalitarian dictatorships to do this, though.

So basically, they're playing both sides?

ShangDoh posted...

This is a pretty naive take on the complex dynamics of international relations. Democracy does not automatically equal "good", need I remind you of the rather...questionable actions the US committed during the Cold War and beyond? Or that the world's largest "democracy" India is a borderline clusterfuck of social inequalities and internal tension? The post-Mao China despite its authoritarian nature has managed to lift hundreds of millions of people out of poverty, an incredible accomplishment.

For most Chinese people, fancy terms like human rights doesn't put food on the table and most people there would take the stability and economic growth provided by the CCP rather than chance it with a western style democracy.

That is what makes it tough and that is why good constitutions are needed. Give some Muslim-majority countries democracy and they get even more murderous and repressive. That is a sad fact, and not bigotry. There are exceptions and that gives a small glimmer of hope.

Democracy only means freedom when people uphold it. Case in point: Here in Wisconsin Republicans got control and Gerrymandered themselves a perpetual majority in the state assembly and senate.

They lost the governorship and attorney general votes. What did they do?
Push through legislation to slash the power of both positions and also curtail early voting in a blatant attempt to suppress the votes of people who oppose them that wouldn't have made it to the polls but did vote early.

These people still have support of nearly half the state and my Republican relatives routinely used to say some people should not be allowed to vote and lament the times only land owners could vote.

Democracy is a freedom, but it can slip away when people vote to curtail it like it's going in here.

Amenadeel posted...

So basically, they're playing both sides?

there aren't "sides". Everyone is looking out for their own interests. Period.

Reality is more complex than that.
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