Current Events > The radical left has an incentive to never accept that things are getting better

(+) Yeah! (+)

By radical left I'm referring to people who run with what Karl Marx or any of his followers preached.

To these people, the only struggle that matters is the one between the rich and the non-rich. Regardless of how well the non-rich are doing, regardless of how much class mobility there is, regardless of how quickly global poverty is being eliminated, the radical left considers the world to be utterly immoral and evil while there is a "bourgeoisie" and a "proletariat."

So no matter how things improve over time in terms of education, life span, earnings, mobility, happiness, etc...the far left is entirely committed to this root principle of "there can't be peace until there is no bourgeoisie." You can look at the last 150 years of progress on all of these fronts across the entire planet but the mountains of evidence will be lost on the radical left.

The people on the far left are always finding ways to spin how things are "worse than ever" or how things are "falling apart" or how things are in dire straits. But they don't actually care about whether or not things are bad and figuring out how we can actually improve things. That is why the radical left looks at millennial earning power compared with housing costs and immediately jumps to whining about "systemic" issues even though they never bother to compare how many square feet of housing people used to live in when you could afford a house on a single salary quite easily. Etc.

Another example: Marxists have been in favor of open borders since Marx's time. This was before global warming was even a blip on anyone's radar. So the narrative today about how climate change necessitates we completely open borders in order to welcome in the impending tide of "climate refugees" is dishonest. (You can find people making this argument here and elsewhere on the internet). It's dishonest because the amount of progress we are making in the fight against climate change will end climate change before it ever gets that bad. Regardless of how much people lie about us being screwed, we will resolve climate change within the next 15-20 years.

The real reason the radical left wants open borders has nothing to do with climate change. They want it because they believe it will destabilize the west and alter the "status quo" away from the "bourgeoisie" and in favor of the "proletariat." The radical leftist will never even consider that we are making progress against climate change and that we will resolve it, because that reality would completely dismantle their previous justification for why we should have open borders. Their intellectual commitment isn't to truth, but to whatever it takes to force us to go down the Marxian rabbit hole. "We have to do this thing because soon the world will end!"

The far left fundamentally chooses its positions based on "does this hurt who I perceive to be the bourgeoisie" in the same way that the alt right chooses its positions based on the equally delusional "does this hurt who I perceive to be of an inferior ethnicity." That's their only heuristic in their decision making process. Neither of them cares about data or evidence. They care about their narrative first and foremost.

If they can weaponize fears about climate change or immigration in order to push people towards communism or fascism, they will. And they must be called out. Neither of these sides is okay with a status quo that isn't their extreme. Even if we were living in a utopia, people indoctrinated into one of these two religions would feel that the world is a terrible place and that they have a mandate to change things. Even if it means being violent.

Be on the look-out for weaponized pessimism.

Mandatory reading: Enlightenment Now by Steven Pinker.
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how do you spend this much energy yelling at clouds?
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Real talk, do you really believe the stuff you post is changing anyone's mind
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to 500!

spudger posted...

how do you spend this much energy yelling at clouds?

He has nothing better to do in his life.
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Proudclad changes directions more than a compass

Yes there was this group that had every incentive to never accept things were getting better even when it was obvious they were. Problem is that group wasn't the radical left. It was the right who did everything in their power to stop progress. Now they are in charge and suddenly even a small pushback is way too much. They can dish it out but they sure as hell can't take it.

Poor right always the victims even when you are in charge. So sad.

I watch from the center and laugh at both sides.
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spudger posted...

how do you spend this much energy yelling at clouds?

people with his condition don't really do much else

yo guys what did y'all have for dinner tonight

I feel sad for them : (
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Yeah man.

Wages have been stagnant for thirty years
Black wealth has actually decreased
Far-right authoritarianism is on the rise throughout the world
Average life expectancy in America is decreasing
Climate change is ravaging many parts of the country already
The civil war in Yemen is the worst humanitarian crisis of our lifetime
Still no Avengers 4 trailer

But things are on the up and up!

Reis posted...

yo guys what did y'all have for dinner tonight

Tacos. They were good. Also played some Sonic Mania, which is the best Sonic game that's come out in over a decade.
And now I'm not a leftist, apparently, because I acknowledged something got better? It's always amusing when some one else attempts to define me.

Reis posted...

yo guys what did y'all have for dinner tonight

Nothing good tonight but I had veal parm yesterday wbu
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ThanksUglyGod posted...

Still no Avengers 4 trailer

Things are on the up and up!

This unironically
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Gafemage posted...

Reis posted...

yo guys what did y'all have for dinner tonight

Nothing good tonight but I had veal parm yesterday wbu

just same lame rotisserie chicken

I would have cut it up and used it to make something else but it's late and i don't feel like cooking

ThanksUglyGod posted...

Wages have been stagnant for thirty years

After a period of historic inflation and massive labor-market saturation. Stop illegal immigration and invest into infrastructure/renewables and you've got jobs back and paying well.

ThanksUglyGod posted...

Black wealth has actually decreased

Not true at all. Download and read the entire Nielsen report(s) from the last few years.

https://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insights/reports/2016/young-connected-and-black.html

https://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insights/news/2018/black-impact-consumer-categories-where-african-americans-move-markets.html

ThanksUglyGod posted...

Far-right authoritarianism is on the rise throughout the world

Far-left too, and much more prevalent here hence this topic.

ThanksUglyGod posted...

Average life expectancy in America is decreasing

And we're getting fatter than ever, which is likely contributing to that.

ThanksUglyGod posted...

Climate change is ravaging many parts of the country already
The civil war in Yemen is the worst humanitarian crisis of our lifetime

Imagine how people felt during both world wars and the Spanish flu and the Cold War.

Despite the challenges of our time, we've never lived in a better and more promising time for the future of the human race.

ThanksUglyGod posted...

Still no Avengers 4 trailer

You're right, fuck this planet.
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shut the fuck up Proudclad, this topic is about dinner now

Reis posted...

Gafemage posted...

Reis posted...

yo guys what did y'all have for dinner tonight

Nothing good tonight but I had veal parm yesterday wbu

just same lame rotisserie chicken

I would have cut it up and used it to make something else but it's late and i don't feel like cooking

Pan fried some ground beef, made some chili con queso, put all that over some tortilla chips.

fuck my arteries
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Reis posted...

yo guys what did y'all have for dinner tonight

Nothing impressive but I made a pretty damn good shrimp alfredo the other day
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Reis posted...

yo guys what did y'all have for dinner tonight

Burgers and then some pork chops.

I put a little Dijon mustard on my burger because I'm classy af.
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Black wealth is down.

https://cdn.americanprogress.org/content/uploads/2018/02/20130258/RacialWealthGap-fig1-693.png

And radical leftism is most definitely not more prevalent than extreme right wingers.
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Ryangrad posted...

Black wealth is down.

Would you say it's not...

In the black?
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*slow claps for DrizztLink*
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@ThanksUglyGod posted...

Yeah man.

Wages have been stagnant for thirty years
Black wealth has actually decreased
Far-right authoritarianism is on the rise throughout the world
Average life expectancy in America is decreasing
Climate change is ravaging many parts of the country already
The civil war in Yemen is the worst humanitarian crisis of our lifetime
Still no Avengers 4 trailer

But things are on the up and up!

Ugly God still hasnt dropped yet
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DrizztLink posted...

Ryangrad posted...

Black wealth is down.

Would you say it's not...

In the black?

Ryangrad posted...

*slow claps for DrizztLink*

This thread needs more Beatles for some reason.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGlo9LzmOME" data-time="

FLUFFYGERM posted...

To these people, the only struggle that matters is the one between the rich and the non-rich. Regardless of how well the non-rich are doing, regardless of how much class mobility there is, regardless of how quickly global poverty is being eliminated, the radical left considers the world to be utterly immoral and evil while there is a "bourgeoisie" and a "proletariat."

Karl Marx wrote during the time of extreme poverty and oppression in the fallout of the industrial revolution. Over 150 years ago.

Remember the phrase "you have nothing to lose but your chains."

That's what the proletariat meant in those days. You literally had nothing.

Marx was necessary for his time. But his ideas are just not appropriate for the modern world. Same goes for Adam Smith btw. Times change, especially nowadays.
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But yeah, youre right about them not wanting things to work out right now. There will never be a time where the insane extreme left will be okay with capitalist America. Facts dont matter to them. There is no reaching through that many layers of stupid.
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Ryangrad posted...

Black wealth is down.

https://cdn.americanprogress.org/content/uploads/2018/02/20130258/RacialWealthGap-fig1-693.png

And radical leftism is most definitely not more prevalent than extreme right wingers.

No doubt you can cherrypick just the year(s) when the numbers went down, but that doesn't tell the full picture of the last 15 years. You don't see me cherrypicking that year when black wealth exceeded white wealth. In any case, it's pretty clear what the trend is.

https://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insights/reports/2015/increasingly-affluent-educated-and-diverse--african-american-consumers.html
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Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol
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frozenshock posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

To these people, the only struggle that matters is the one between the rich and the non-rich. Regardless of how well the non-rich are doing, regardless of how much class mobility there is, regardless of how quickly global poverty is being eliminated, the radical left considers the world to be utterly immoral and evil while there is a "bourgeoisie" and a "proletariat."

Karl Marx wrote during the time of extreme poverty and oppression in the fallout of the industrial revolution. Over 150 years ago.

Remember the phrase "you have nothing to lose but your chains."

That's what the proletariat meant in those days. You literally had nothing.

Marx was necessary for his time. But his ideas are just not appropriate for the modern world. Same goes for Adam Smith btw. Times change, especially nowadays.

I mean you're not wrong, but you're explaining that to someone who already knows that already. Try telling it to the people who have taken those principles and tried to interpret modern society in those terms.

Ryangrad posted...

But yeah, youre right about them not wanting things to work out right now. There will never be a time where the insane extreme left will be okay with capitalist America. Facts dont matter to them. There is no reaching through that many layers of stupid.

Indeed. And I'd say that there will never be a time when the insane extreme right will be okay with melting pot America even though it's always been that way. What's important is that they all be called out though. And watched closely so that people can call out their dishonesty when they pretend they're holding some view because of evidence but really they're holding the view because of their bias and commitment to their narrative above all else.
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Doom_Art posted...

Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol

More tolerable implies I'm still tolerable.

Whereas you were never tol-*gets shot*
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Doom_Art posted...

Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol

wait, Fluffygerm is Proudclad?

Reis posted...

Doom_Art posted...

Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol

wait, Fluffygerm is Proudclad?

Reis posted...

shut the fuck up Proudclad, this topic is about dinner now

uh
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Reis posted...

Doom_Art posted...

Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol

wait, Fluffygerm is Proudclad?

hold on, CornBarn isn't?

FLUFFYGERM posted...

No doubt you can cherrypick just the year(s) when the numbers went down, but that doesn't tell the full picture of the last 15 years.

How the fuck is that cherry picking years? Its 1989 to 2016 when the report was posted.
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Ryangrad posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

No doubt you can cherrypick just the year(s) when the numbers went down, but that doesn't tell the full picture of the last 15 years.

How the fuck is that cherry picking years? Its 1989 to 2016 when the report was posted.

Because looking at the two years since black wealth exceeded white wealth and then went down is cherrypicking in order to ignore the trend, which I showed you with the link I just posted.

https://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insights/reports/2015/increasingly-affluent-educated-and-diverse--african-american-consumers.html

Black incomes in those tax brackets are rising way faster. And black women are the top demographic for graduating with a college degree. And etc.
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Also note that the really high and rapid increase in income is what matters most, because how people choose to spend their money can affect their total wealth. There's no reason to expect people to have the same amount of wealth. Not even different groups of white people have the same wealth. Say, Romanians vs Germans. There's going to be a disparity there too.
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Doom_Art posted...

Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol

Surprisingly enough, yeah, and he was pretty fucking intolerable then.
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

Also note that the really high and rapid increase in income is what matters most, because how people choose to spend their money can affect their total wealth. There's no reason to expect people to have the same amount of wealth. Not even different groups of white people have the same wealth. Say, Romanians vs Germans. There's going to be a disparity there too.

Reis posted...

shut the fuck up Proudclad, this topic is about dinner now

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Rikiaz posted...

Doom_Art posted...

Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol

Surprisingly enough, yeah, and he was pretty fucking intolerable then.

Cry more brother. No one's forcing you to read the topics. Add me to your ignore list so you won't see them.
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

Rikiaz posted...

Doom_Art posted...

Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol

Surprisingly enough, yeah, and he was pretty fucking intolerable then.

Cry more brother. No one's forcing you to read the topics. Add me to your ignore list so you won't see them.

Not everyone needs a safe space.
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creativerealms posted...

Yes there was this group that had every incentive to never accept things were getting better even when it was obvious they were. Problem is that group wasn't the radical left. It was the right who did everything in their power to stop progress. Now they are in charge and suddenly even a small pushback is way too much. They can dish it out but they sure as hell can't take it.

Poor right always the victims even when you are in charge. So sad.

I watch from the center and laugh at both sides.

Boom, TC = blasted directly in the ass
The right-wing projection must stop

On-topic, I had chili beans and corn bread
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

Rikiaz posted...

Doom_Art posted...

Proudclad was actually more tolerable when he was a religious nut lol

Surprisingly enough, yeah, and he was pretty fucking intolerable then.

Cry more brother. No one's forcing you to read the topics. Add me to your ignore list so you won't see them.

Who said I was crying? I didn't even realize it was your topic until I saw post #6. I'm just going to leave the topic and not return because I don't really care.
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Liberals are the worst
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muchdran posted...

Liberals are the worst

Tbqh I like to think that most liberals are reasonable people trying to be moderates because they learned basic history in school.
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I can see how it comes across as cherry picking. But I was pointing out that when he said black wealth was declining it was. And there is no indication that it has evened back out.

My link had the same info yours did. If you look at the bottom you will see that it shows that AA income has been on the rise.
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

regardless of how much class mobility there is

There's not much.

FLUFFYGERM posted...

Their intellectual commitment isn't to truth

Neither is yours
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Okay chief
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