Current Events > Why does Canada suppress their citizens from voting?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I'm just joking. I love that manipulation though. Calling voter ID laws "voter suppression"

The following countries "suppress" voting:

Canada
Argentina
Brazil
France
Iceland
Israel
Mexico
Netherlands
Norway
Sweden
Northern Ireland

Those who aren't legally entitled to vote, usually vote for the party that those who complain about "voter suppression" like - or at least, that's how said people stereotype those who aren't entitled to vote. That's why it's an issue.

In most of those countries the party the complainers like tend to win anyway, or there are very few people (other than those who are underage to vote) who aren't entitled to vote in the first place.
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Take your meds
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canada literally lets you use your electric bill as a form of id in voting
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http://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=vot&dir=ids&document=index&lang=e
Valid I.D. for voting in Canada

1)One of the following:
-Driver's License
-Provincial/Territory I.D. card
OR
2) Two of the following(at least one must have your address):
-health card
-Canadian passport
-birth certificate
-certificate of Canadian citizenship
-citizenship card
-social insurance number card
-Indian status card
-band membership card
-Mtis card
-card issued by an Inuit local authority
-Canadian Forces identity card
-Veterans Affairs health card
-old age security card
-hospital card
-medical clinic card
-label on a prescription container
-identity bracelet issued by a hospital or long-term care facility
-blood donor card
-CNIB card
-credit card
-debit card
-employee card
-student identity card
-public transportation card
-library card
-liquor identity card
-parolee card
-firearms licence
-licence or card issued for fishing, trapping or hunting
-utility bill (e.g. electricity; water; telecommunications services including telephone, cable or satellite)
-bank statement
-credit union statement
-credit card statement
-personal cheque
-government statement of benefits
-government cheque or cheque stub
-pension plan statement
-residential lease or sub-lease
-mortgage contract or statement
-income tax assessment
-property tax assessment or evaluation
-vehicle ownership
-insurance certificate, policy or statement
-correspondence issued by a school, college or university
-letter from a public curator, public guardian or public trustee
-targeted revision form from Elections Canada to residents of long-term care facilities
-letter of confirmation of residence from a First Nations band or reserve or an Inuit local authority
-letter of confirmation of residence, letter of stay, admission form or statement of benefits from one of the following designated establishments:
student residence
seniors' residence
long-term care facility
shelter
soup kitchen
So, like, for example, I could vote if I brought them my vehicle registration and my Whole Foods Market employee discount card.

Sure, let's create a federal-standard national photo ID that's provided to all citizens at the age of 18 and updated free of charge every few years that also automatically registers people to vote as well. So, if election security is a huge deal and we should strive against any acts of illegal voting, this should be a nice and easy fix regardless of the costs and open to all citizens regardless of all other factors, and with ready access in as many locations as possible to limit any type of delay, hassle, or inconvenience. TC should support this, right?
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K181 posted...

Sure, let's create a federal-standard national photo ID that's provided to all citizens at the age of 18 and updated free of charge every few years that also automatically registers people to vote as well. So, if election security is a huge deal and we should strive against any acts of illegal voting, this should be a nice and easy fix regardless of the costs and open to all citizens regardless of all other factors, and with ready access in as many locations as possible to limit any type of delay, hassle, or inconvenience. TC should support this, right?

What would need to be "updated" every few years? Maybe a new photo every 10 years or so, sure, but generally people's name, SSN or whatever, and date of birth don't change every few years.

But aside from that, this is a really good idea. ID is important to the point that it should be something everyone gets automatically, and this would also be the utter final nail in the coffin for the "voter ID is a vote suppression tactic" brigade, they'll be forced to either give up or admit what they truly want.
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You're right, every few years might be a bit too often. Every ten years sounds good, and as part of buying a home or registering for a new apartment, the process is automated as well so that it's updated when you move, too.
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Goats posted...

Why does America ruin people's lives over pot smoking vileplume?

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But, let's ask France!

elections-legislatives.frThe requirements are fairly limited :

- Age: 18 years;
- French citizenship ; EU citizens residing in France may, however, require to be registered on the supplementary electoral roll to vote in municipal and/or European elections.

Disfranchisement is limited to persons under guardianship and to persons serving certain criminal sentences. When disfranchisement isn't part of the sentence, detained persons may vote by proxy
How does one register to vote in France?

Registration is automatic with coming of age.

Voters may choose to be registered on the electoral roll:

-of their official domicile;
-or of a commune where they have been paying local taxes for at least the last 5 years;
-or of a place of residence if the residence has been actual and continuous for at least the last 6 months;
-or of a commune where civil servants/military personnel have been mandatorily posted.

Is voting compulsory ?

Voting is not compulsary.
How does one vote ?

French voters, once registered, are send a voter's card providing them the address of their polling station, at least 3 days prior to the election. In the smaller municipalities (with a population under 3,500 people), voters may cast their votes when presenting their voter's card only. In the more populated municipalities, a recognized identity document ( i.e. French identity card, driving licence or passport) is required and presenting a voter's card being optional.

Voting is strictly personal and strictly secret : it is an offense to try and control voting choice. It is even an offense to try and know one's voting choice.

Thus polling stations are equipped to protect voting freedom and secrecy :
At the polling station, upon presentation of voter's card and/or identity document, voters are issued an opaque envelope made of recycled paper.

There is one ballot paper per candidate.

All ballot papers are on one same table. Voters must take at least two different ballot papers prior to proceeding into the opaque polling booth where they fold a ballot paper into the envelope. They do not seal the envelope. Once their names are checked by the electoral officer, voters are allowed to put their ballot envelope in the ballot box and sign the electoral register.

http://www.elections-legislatives.fr/en/voting.asp
If you're wondering about how much it costs to get a French I.D. , it runs 35 euros, which is a little more than half what it cost for me to get a driver's license from the state of Connecticut.

K181 posted...

You're right, every few years might be a bit too often. Every ten years sounds good, and as part of buying a home or registering for a new apartment, the process is automated as well so that it's updated when you move, too.

Does the ID even need to have the address physically written on it in the first place? Name, DoB, photo and some kind of identification number (like social security number, assuming I'm not completely missing hte mark about what they are - basically everyone has one and everyone's is unique right?) should be the only things that outright need to be on it; anything else can be cross-referenced to something else if it's needed in a specific case.
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Stop arguing with MilkMan

ElatedVenusaur posted...

If you're wondering about how much it costs to get a French I.D. , it runs 35 euros,

the fuck?

that's 40 dollars

Can homeless people vote in canada?
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Milkman5 posted...

ElatedVenusaur posted...

If you're wondering about how much it costs to get a French I.D. , it runs 35 euros,

the fuck?

that's 40 dollars

In NZ you can get an 18+ card (which despite the name, is a full fledged form of ID) for NZ$45 (about US$30). You do need to get passport-type photos taken as part of the application; that's usually another $10 or so. But a driver's licence or passport, the only other universally-accepted forms of ID, will cost you into the hundreds.

We don't have voter ID laws though. Don't really need them, as we don't tend to get a lot of illegals here. Also, any of these other than an NZ passport wouldn't in and of themself prove eligibility anyway (as literally anyone can get them, citizen or not, provided they're at least 18 (18+ card) or 16 (driver's licence - used to be 15 but that changed quite a while ago and there are no remaining 15 year olds that were grandfathered in)) - though that could easily be checked by cross-referencing.
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Illegals go out in droves to vote. Its the only exception in which they're not scared of being found out.
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ArmieBuff posted...

Do the States not do this

no, because it has been politicized.

Democrats coined Voter Identification as "Voter Suppression" and that it is how it's described in the news.

They take this strange race angle. They claim that a lot African Americans don't have any form of identification. That they don't have a home, a proof of residence, an ID, or any proof that they exist, meaning that they can't drive, don't have a job, don't buy alcohol or anything for people over 18 etc.

I literally have never met a single person, let alone a black person, who didn't have some form of ID.

I have no idea who they are even talking about. Like a group of black people completely off the grid in the deep south or some shit?

It's very strange and it's basically the mainstream opinion here in America that these mythical people without any proof of who they are exist.

Milkman5 posted...

ArmieBuff posted...

Do the States not do this

no, because it has been politicized.

Democrats coined Voter Identification as "Voter Suppression" and that it is how it's described in the news.

They take this strange race angle. They claim that a lot African Americans don't have any form of identification. That they don't have a home, a proof of residence, an ID, or any proof that they exist, meaning that they can't drive, don't have a job, don't buy alcohol or anything for people over 18 etc.

I literally have never met a single person, let alone a black person, who didn't have some form of ID.

I have no idea who they are even talking about. Like a group of black people completely off the grid in the deep south or some shit?

It's very strange and it's basically the mainstream opinion here in America that these mythical people without any proof of who they are exist.

Because that's literally the stated goal of people implementing these laws?

We battled to get voter ID on the ballot for the November 16 election, Wisconsin Attorney General Brad Schimel, who defended the law in court, told conservative radio host Vicki McKenna on April 12. How many of your listeners really honestly are sure that Sen. [Ron] Johnson was going to win reelection or President Trump was going to win Wisconsin if we didnt have voter ID to keep Wisconsins elections clean and honest and have integrity?
That's the Attorney General of Wisconsin.

"Voter ID, which is going to allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania: done,"
-Pennsylvania House Majority Leader Mike Turzai(R), 2012

"Yeah, I think a little bit," Gleason said. "We probably had a better election. Think about this: We cut Obama by 5 percent, which was big. A lot of people lost sight of that. He beat McCain by 10 percent; he only beat Romney by 5 percent. And I think that probably photo ID helped a bit in that."
-Pennsylvania GOP Chairman Robert Gleason
https://tinyurl.com/y8mkpbjz
That's not even all of them. All but the first one come from a single article(it has video!) Like, they straight-up say these laws are designed to help Republicans win more elections.

They believe those 5 percent of votes are fraud.

Which it could be. I find it hilarious how people cite there has been no evidence of fraud in elections, yet without identification, there can't be evidence. That's the point.
Unless the people committing fraud outright admit it.

DarkTransient posted...

K181 posted...

You're right, every few years might be a bit too often. Every ten years sounds good, and as part of buying a home or registering for a new apartment, the process is automated as well so that it's updated when you move, too.

Does the ID even need to have the address physically written on it in the first place? Name, DoB, photo and some kind of identification number (like social security number, assuming I'm not completely missing hte mark about what they are - basically everyone has one and everyone's is unique right?) should be the only things that outright need to be on it; anything else can be cross-referenced to something else if it's needed in a specific case.

To avoid the need for registering to vote manually, there would be a need for at least an automated update system for the voter/citizen information. I would imagine that physically updating the card would be the most convenient way that a person would know that everything was handled and to avoid potential confusion at the polls.
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ElatedVenusaur posted...

Milkman5 posted...

ArmieBuff posted...

Do the States not do this

no, because it has been politicized.

Democrats coined Voter Identification as "Voter Suppression" and that it is how it's described in the news.

They take this strange race angle. They claim that a lot African Americans don't have any form of identification. That they don't have a home, a proof of residence, an ID, or any proof that they exist, meaning that they can't drive, don't have a job, don't buy alcohol or anything for people over 18 etc.

I literally have never met a single person, let alone a black person, who didn't have some form of ID.

I have no idea who they are even talking about. Like a group of black people completely off the grid in the deep south or some shit?

It's very strange and it's basically the mainstream opinion here in America that these mythical people without any proof of who they are exist.

Because that's literally the stated goal of people implementing these laws?

We battled to get voter ID on the ballot for the November 16 election, Wisconsin Attorney General Brad Schimel, who defended the law in court, told conservative radio host Vicki McKenna on April 12. How many of your listeners really honestly are sure that Sen. [Ron] Johnson was going to win reelection or President Trump was going to win Wisconsin if we didnt have voter ID to keep Wisconsins elections clean and honest and have integrity?
That's the Attorney General of Wisconsin.

"Voter ID, which is going to allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania: done,"
-Pennsylvania House Majority Leader Mike Turzai(R), 2012

"Yeah, I think a little bit," Gleason said. "We probably had a better election. Think about this: We cut Obama by 5 percent, which was big. A lot of people lost sight of that. He beat McCain by 10 percent; he only beat Romney by 5 percent. And I think that probably photo ID helped a bit in that."
-Pennsylvania GOP Chairman Robert Gleason
https://tinyurl.com/y8mkpbjz
That's not even all of them. All but the first one come from a single article(it has video!) Like, they straight-up say these laws are designed to help Republicans win more elections.

If preventing those who aren't legally entitled to vote helps one party win, then that simply means that those who are entitled to vote want that party to win.
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Milkman5 posted...

I literally have never met a single person, let alone a black person, who didn't have some form of ID.

I work retail in a ghetto as f*** neighborhood and Ive met plenty who didnt have ID.

Theyll get pissed off when theyre unable to pick up the $20 or so sent to them through Western Union. The sender needs to include a test question of the receiver wont have ID.

Also our store requires ID every for every single purchase of alcohol, tobacco, & some medicines like NyQuil. Plenty of times the would-be customer gets upset, asks for management, then leaves without purchase.
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The irony is that voter id laws would enabe illegals to vote because they often have social security numbers they stole anyways.
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iPhone_7 posted...

Milkman5 posted...

I literally have never met a single person, let alone a black person, who didn't have some form of ID.

I work retail in a ghetto as f*** neighborhood and Ive met plenty who didnt have ID.

Theyll get pissed off when theyre unable to pick up the $20 or so sent to them through Western Union. The sender needs to include a test question of the receiver wont have ID.

Also our store requires ID every for every single purchase of alcohol, tobacco, & some medicines like NyQuil. Plenty of times the would-be customer gets upset, asks for management, then leaves without purchase.

Why do you think they don't have an id?
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NinjaWarrior455 posted...

Take your meds

this should be considered offensive, but the mods are a joke here

Bragging about lowering the opposing voter turnout is not a good look for voter id laws.

Plus he didn't even touch on the fact that several voter id laws have been struck down for being racist.

Maybe if Republicans weren't trying to use voter id laws as an excuse to intentionally disenfranchise voters people would be more on board with them in the US.
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K181 posted...

DarkTransient posted...

K181 posted...

You're right, every few years might be a bit too often. Every ten years sounds good, and as part of buying a home or registering for a new apartment, the process is automated as well so that it's updated when you move, too.

Does the ID even need to have the address physically written on it in the first place? Name, DoB, photo and some kind of identification number (like social security number, assuming I'm not completely missing hte mark about what they are - basically everyone has one and everyone's is unique right?) should be the only things that outright need to be on it; anything else can be cross-referenced to something else if it's needed in a specific case.

To avoid the need for registering to vote manually, there would be a need for at least an automated update system for the voter/citizen information. I would imagine that physically updating the card would be the most convenient way that a person would know that everything was handled and to avoid potential confusion at the polls.

They could update it in a database that's connected to (but not physically written on) the card, and send a "We are confirming your details are updated" letter / email?
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https://www.quora.com/Where-do-illegal-immigrants-usually-get-social-security-numbers

This was interesting if true
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darkphoenix181 posted...

iPhone_7 posted...

Milkman5 posted...

I literally have never met a single person, let alone a black person, who didn't have some form of ID.

I work retail in a ghetto as f*** neighborhood and Ive met plenty who didnt have ID.

Theyll get pissed off when theyre unable to pick up the $20 or so sent to them through Western Union. The sender needs to include a test question of the receiver wont have ID.

Also our store requires ID every for every single purchase of alcohol, tobacco, & some medicines like NyQuil. Plenty of times the would-be customer gets upset, asks for management, then leaves without purchase.

Why do you think they don't have an id?

I dont know but if they dont have one then too bad, no swishers for them.
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DarkTransient posted...

If preventing those who aren't legally entitled to vote helps one party win, then that simply means that those who are entitled to vote want that party to win.

But that isn't what has happened, and there's been numerous court cases where the governing body has explicitly ruled against tactics taken by Republicans in power to suppress voters. You'll find the vast majority of those on the left are more than willing to accept some form of voter ID needed, except it's the Republicans that routinely set up obstacles and barriers with the openly expressed mission to suppress people from voting, and they specifically target those who are likely to not vote for them.

Your fellow Republicans don't want to make voting easier, they don't want to streamline and fix the system, because they know that by both restricting the amount of eligible people that can vote, and again I need to remind you that multiple courts of law have found this to be the case in a number of states, as well as having the boogeyman they can point their base to and scream "DEMOCRATS WANT ILLEGALS VOTING!!", they can both suppress the opposition while driving up their own base. That's simply reality.
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iPhone_7 posted...

darkphoenix181 posted...

iPhone_7 posted...

Milkman5 posted...

I literally have never met a single person, let alone a black person, who didn't have some form of ID.

I work retail in a ghetto as f*** neighborhood and Ive met plenty who didnt have ID.

Theyll get pissed off when theyre unable to pick up the $20 or so sent to them through Western Union. The sender needs to include a test question of the receiver wont have ID.

Also our store requires ID every for every single purchase of alcohol, tobacco, & some medicines like NyQuil. Plenty of times the would-be customer gets upset, asks for management, then leaves without purchase.

Why do you think they don't have an id?

I dont know but if they dont have one then too bad, no swishers for them.

I've also worked retail in a poor as fuck city that has a strong majority of white citizens(78% last checked) and have had multiple situations where I've carded poor people who don't have ID's and get pissed when they can't buy their cigs or Keystone Ice pounders. It's not a race based thing, it's a class based thing.
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