Current Events > The Kavanaugh accusation gets more ridiculous

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Mal_Fet
09/22/18 5:31:57 AM
#1:


For those not up to speed:

The accusation is that Kavanaugh, on an unspecified date, at an unspecified time, at an unspecified location, attempted to rape Ford at a party 35 years ago.

Senator Feinstein got a letter with her accusation in July and claims to believe it, but was apparently ok with there being a rapist serving as a US judge until just before he gets voted into the Supreme Court.

The only alleged witness to this event is Mark Judge, who says it never happened.

The notes from Ford's therapy sessions in 2012 say there were four boys who attempted to rape her, but now she says there were two boys, Kavanaugh and Judge.

Now, she makes a list of crazy requirements in order to testify in court, including having the defense testify first. Not only is that demand ridiculous because she still hasn't given any specifics about the accusation and therefore there's nothing to specifically defend against, but there's also no court proceeding anywhere in the US where the defense testifies without knowing what you're being charged with.

#1. Kavanaugh should not be present during her testimony.
#2. No outside counsel is to ask her questions, only Senators.
#3. The accused Kavanaugh must testify first.
#4. Not on Monday.
#5. Mark Judge and Patryck J. Smyth should be subpoenaed to appear and testify.

Further, it's blatantly unconstitutional to say Kavanaugh isn't allowed to be there. The law has been for about 300 years that you had the right to confront your accuser.

Imagine you are accused of murder, and that's all the relevant information you were told. That at some time, at some place, you murdered somebody, and now you need to argue it never happened. Godspeed.

But this authoritarian "guilty until proven innocent" mindset has permeated a certain sect of politics lately, and frankly it's disturbing.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/09/kavanaugh-confirmation/571021/
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hockeybub89
09/22/18 5:40:33 AM
#2:


I agree. It's pretty crazy to assume someone would commit a crime like falsely reporting rape. What happened to innocent until proven guilty?
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Sativa_Rose
09/22/18 5:40:40 AM
#3:


This won't stop hysterical women from dressing up like characters in The Handmaids Tale and claiming that Kavanaugh is trying to take control of their bodies like some kind of puppet master.
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hockeybub89
09/22/18 5:45:06 AM
#4:


Sativa_Rose posted...
This won't stop hysterical women from dressing up like characters in The Handmaids Tale and claiming that Kavanaugh is trying to take control of their bodies like some kind of puppet master.

I mean he would still be part of an assault on Roe v Wade whether or not he's a rapist.

He shouldn't be confirmed just because of the shit that went on when Obama tried to replace Scalia. It's only fair.
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chrono625
09/22/18 6:05:07 AM
#5:


hockeybub89 posted...
Sativa_Rose posted...
This won't stop hysterical women from dressing up like characters in The Handmaids Tale and claiming that Kavanaugh is trying to take control of their bodies like some kind of puppet master.

I mean he would still be part of an assault on Roe v Wade whether or not he's a rapist.

He shouldn't be confirmed just because of the shit that went on when Obama tried to replace Scalia. It's only fair.


Yeah. Totally fair to accuse someone of rape 35 years after it occurred with zero recollection of what happened at all that day.
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Mal_Fet
09/22/18 6:32:15 AM
#6:


hockeybub89 posted...
I agree. It's pretty crazy to assume someone would commit a crime like falsely reporting rape. What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

She's the one who made the claim, and thus the burden of proof is on her. This isn't difficult.

hockeybub89 posted...
He shouldn't be confirmed just because of the shit that went on when Obama tried to replace Scalia. It's only fair.

If Democrats wanted to be able to block a vote on a SCOTUS nominee then they should have won more seats in 2016.
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StucklnMyPants
09/22/18 6:40:40 AM
#7:


Don't be too hard in her, she probably has TDS.
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Mr_Rian
09/22/18 6:42:45 AM
#8:


It's not a court, there is no trial, Kavanaugh not being there when she is there is not unconstitutional. No one has any such "rights" that you are implying as it pertains to questions from the Senate in a hearing for confirmation to the supreme court.
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Mal_Fet
09/22/18 6:44:25 AM
#9:


Mr_Rian posted...
It's not a court, there is no trial, Kavanaugh not being there when she is there is not unconstitutional. No one has any such "rights" that you are implying as it pertains to questions from the Senate in a hearing for confirmation to the supreme court.

I used the court system as an example for why her demands are ridiculous.
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Mr_Rian
09/22/18 6:54:33 AM
#10:


Mal_Fet posted...
I used the court system as an example for why her demands are ridiculous.

But it isn't court, so it doesn't make her demands ridiculous. It's actually ridiculous to compare the situations and claim Kavanaugh's constitutional rights are being violated when they 100% are not.
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Mal_Fet
09/22/18 7:04:55 AM
#11:


Mr_Rian posted...
But it isn't court, so it doesn't make her demands ridiculous.

It does, because they would be under oath and it would proceed as if they were giving testimonies in a court.
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L0Z
09/22/18 7:10:19 AM
#12:


oddly the accusation came a week after i saw on the news where kavanaugh said roe v wade is law
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scar the 1
09/22/18 7:18:06 AM
#13:


Mal_Fet posted...
I used the court system as an example for why her demands are ridiculous.

You said at least one of her demands is blatantly unconstitutional. It isn't.
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Kazi1212
09/22/18 7:33:48 AM
#14:


Sworn testimonies =\ court proceedings from what i understand
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UnfairRepresent
09/22/18 7:41:13 AM
#15:


The right's response to this is crazy

Their harrasments, threats and bullying of a potential rape victim just demonstrates why women and to a lesser extent men are scared of coming forward.
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creativerealms
09/22/18 7:58:07 AM
#16:


The right just love siding with rapists. You guys have no right to call yourselves the moral majority. You support rapists, you support pedophiles and you would support worse if they are against same sex marriage and abortion.
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0TiamaT0
09/22/18 7:59:13 AM
#17:


UnfairRepresent posted...
The right's response to this is crazy

Their harrasments, threats and bullying of a potential rape victim just demonstrates why women and to a lesser extent men are scared of coming forward.


Because she has zero credibility...

Shes a liberal college professor at a California college and a known Trump hater.

And considering how far the left has shown it will stoop when things dont go their way, why should anyone in the right believe her?

This looks like nothing more than a desperate, Hail Mary attempt to get their way. And if they get to ruin Kavanaughs reputation in the process, thats just a plus for them.
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creativerealms
09/22/18 8:03:11 AM
#18:


0TiamaT0 posted...
UnfairRepresent posted...
The right's response to this is crazy

Their harrasments, threats and bullying of a potential rape victim just demonstrates why women and to a lesser extent men are scared of coming forward.


Because she has zero credibility...

Shes a liberal college professor at a California college and a known Trump hater.

And considering how far the left has shown it will stoop when things dont go their way, why should anyone in the right believe her?

This looks like nothing more than a desperate, Hail Mary attempt to get their way. And if they get to ruin Kavanaughs reputation in the process, thats just a plus for them.

Why does that matter? If she was a conservative Trump supporter I would still take her seriously. Her political position should not matter.
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Lorenzo_2003
09/22/18 9:20:08 AM
#19:


Mal_Fet posted...
hockeybub89 posted...
I agree. It's pretty crazy to assume someone would commit a crime like falsely reporting rape. What happened to innocent until proven guilty?

She's the one who made the claim, and thus the burden of proof is on her. This isn't difficult.


hockeybub is smart enough to know that, he's just being contrarian on this issue because... well, you know why.

Anyway, Republicans are letting themselves be played like puppets if they continue playing up to all this nonsense. The accusation is a serious one, but so much of it is mired in ridiculousness.

Edit: like, not by
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Hawaiian_punch
09/22/18 9:25:01 AM
#20:


@Mal_Fet . The offer still stands. Lets talk. Let me understand you.

Where did your hate for minorities come from? Which ones are the worst IYO?
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#21
Post #21 was unavailable or deleted.
UnfairRepresent
09/22/18 9:30:44 AM
#22:


creativerealms posted...
0TiamaT0 posted...
UnfairRepresent posted...
The right's response to this is crazy

Their harrasments, threats and bullying of a potential rape victim just demonstrates why women and to a lesser extent men are scared of coming forward.


Because she has zero credibility...

Shes a liberal college professor at a California college and a known Trump hater.

And considering how far the left has shown it will stoop when things dont go their way, why should anyone in the right believe her?

This looks like nothing more than a desperate, Hail Mary attempt to get their way. And if they get to ruin Kavanaughs reputation in the process, thats just a plus for them.

Why does that matter? If she was a conservative Trump supporter I would still take her seriously. Her political position should not matter.

IT goes beyond that too.

The day her name was revealed the right went crazy digging up stuff to disrespect her, threaten her family, declare her a liar.

The investigation is ongoing and no testimony has been heard yet a large of people have already concluded what has happened, it's freaky.
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masterpug53
09/22/18 9:43:13 AM
#23:


>Sees topic title in topic list
>Immediately assumes that only two or three people on this board would take such a stance
>was not disappoint
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Knowledge_King
09/22/18 11:38:15 AM
#24:


It is pretty ridiculous. Once you change your story, the credibility is gone.
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Alpha218
09/22/18 11:39:01 AM
#25:


I was waiting for your hot take on this Mal

lmao
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whitelytning
09/22/18 11:49:08 AM
#26:


Mal_Fet posted...
The law has been for about 300 years that you had the right to confront your accuser.


What law? Please copy/paste the specific provision.
*hint -- it begins with "In all criminal prosecutions..." (which is not what is being discussed)

The nomination has become a circus and neither party is without blame but some of crap being spouted is just completely trash. Stop repeating what you hear on fox news or brietbart comments and look some of it up.
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Bio1590
09/22/18 11:51:33 AM
#27:


Generally an actual intelligent person would stop doubling down on something after they've already lost one account to it.
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Blue_Inigo
09/22/18 11:52:17 AM
#28:


So TC defends Nazis AND rapists. Yikes
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Webmaster4531
09/22/18 11:54:34 AM
#29:


whitelytning posted...
Mal_Fet posted...
The law has been for about 300 years that you had the right to confront your accuser.


What law? Please copy/paste the specific provision.
*hint -- it begins with "In all criminal prosecutions..." (which is not what is being discussed)

The nomination has become a circus and neither party is without blame but some of crap being spouted is just completely trash. Stop repeating what you hear on fox news or brietbart comments and look some of it up.

It's been 242 years 2 months 18 days since the declaration of independence too.
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Doom_Art
09/22/18 11:55:52 AM
#30:


According to Mal it's only been 17 years since NATO was formed
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jukester
09/22/18 11:57:51 AM
#31:


Lying about something in order to progress an agenda is actually only a right-wing thing, sorry, V-pals.
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Romes187
09/22/18 11:58:08 AM
#32:


I've kinda stayed away from the news on all this. Is it just accusations or have we had any concrete evidence? I figured there must be some since Republicans are wanting to hear what she has to say...or maybe they just don't want people to say they are sexist

Which is probably a bad political move since they'll be labeled and already are labeled as sexist anyways....
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#33
Post #33 was unavailable or deleted.
spudger
09/22/18 12:15:57 PM
#34:


imagine defending a confirmed piece of shit out of sheer cultish loyalty to the worst president in the history of this nation

damn
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Hawaiian_punch
09/22/18 1:51:06 PM
#35:


Blue_Inigo posted...
So TC defends Nazis AND rapists. Yikes
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Hawaiian_punch
09/22/18 1:51:35 PM
#36:


Hawaiian_punch posted...
@Mal_Fet . The offer still stands. Lets talk. Let me understand you.

Where did your hate for minorities come from? Which ones are the worst IYO?
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Payzmaykr
09/22/18 1:51:55 PM
#37:


This was a major flop. They dragged it out and now the general public doesnt believe it.
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ImTheMacheteGuy
09/22/18 1:54:06 PM
#38:


Imagine literally being mal_fet
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Dark_Spiret
09/22/18 1:55:58 PM
#39:


this whole thing is a shit show.
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Hawaiian_punch
09/22/18 1:57:00 PM
#40:


ImTheMacheteGuy posted...
Imagine literally being mal_fet


He is too afraid of answering my question lol
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CantKeepMeDown
09/22/18 2:00:47 PM
#41:


Payzmaykr posted...
This was a major flop. They dragged it out and now the general public doesnt believe it.

Completely false. Kavanaugh is underwater in public approval. In fact, he's literally the first appointed Justice to be more disapproved than approved of.

At this point, it might HURT the GOP to shove him through. Hardiman or Kethledge would give the same conservative performance without being attempted rapists. They also wouldn't treat Trump above the law, which, let's be honest, is all you care about.
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ImTheMacheteGuy
09/22/18 2:01:38 PM
#42:


Hawaiian_punch posted...
ImTheMacheteGuy posted...
Imagine literally being mal_fet


He is too afraid of answering my question lol


That tends to happen whenever water is wet.
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hockeybub89
09/22/18 2:03:05 PM
#43:


ImTheMacheteGuy posted...
Hawaiian_punch posted...
ImTheMacheteGuy posted...
Imagine literally being mal_fet


He is too afraid of answering my question lol


That tends to happen whenever water is wet.

The wettest from the standpoint of water
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MakoReizei
09/22/18 2:05:18 PM
#44:


Hawaiian_punch posted...
@Mal_Fet . The offer still stands. Lets talk. Let me understand you.

Where did your hate for minorities come from? Which ones are the worst IYO?

@Hawaiian_punch

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question
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Damn_Underscore
09/22/18 2:07:57 PM
#45:


A few days ago I think the general opinion of this board is that he was guilty.

If TC's summary is accurate then her accusation is seriously in doubt. This is why you don't assume people to be guilty based on an accusation.
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TheCyborgNinja
09/22/18 2:14:20 PM
#46:


Kavanaugh is a piece of shit and I don't care how he gets stopped. Representative democracy is a fucking joke of a system and if I had the means I'd see it removed from the planet by force.

Direct democracy with a monarch is the best form of government (Liechtenstein model), meaning in this instance, there should be a list of nominees the senate chooses to put on a ballot and the people vote to determine who gets confirmed. The monarch isn't some self-serving, elected, nouveau-riche trash but the first servant of the state who prioritizes the nation over things like donors, which he/she doesn't require.

/rant
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HiddenLurker
09/22/18 2:16:00 PM
#47:


Romes187 posted...
I've kinda stayed away from the news on all this. Is it just accusations or have we had any concrete evidence? I figured there must be some since Republicans are wanting to hear what she has to say...or maybe they just don't want people to say they are sexist

Which is probably a bad political move since they'll be labeled and already are labeled as sexist anyways....


Unfortunatly the evidence really is all he said she said.

As the "attempt" happened 35 years ago there is nothing to corroborate the story except an eye witness she claims was also in the room except he also denies seeing or hearing anything either.

Oh and this is all you need to know about the accusation:
TheCyborgNinja posted...
I don't care how he gets stopped

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Payzmaykr
09/22/18 2:22:09 PM
#48:


CantKeepMeDown posted...
Payzmaykr posted...
This was a major flop. They dragged it out and now the general public doesnt believe it.

Completely false. Kavanaugh is underwater in public approval. In fact, he's literally the first appointed Justice to be more disapproved than approved of.

At this point, it might HURT the GOP to shove him through. Hardiman or Kethledge would give the same conservative performance without being attempted rapists. They also wouldn't treat Trump above the law, which, let's be honest, is all you care about.

Hes not a fucking attempted racist. These pieces of shit would make lies about any republican candidate. They dont want to admit that they lost. We are not going to put some centrist in there who will side with them. We are going to balance of the radicalism that obama put in there with some normalcy. The kavanaugh appointment = we win the gun rights argument. They hate losing, so they made up some lies.
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Mal_Fet
09/22/18 2:24:49 PM
#49:


shockthemonkey posted...
shockthemonkey posted...
Do you still believe that Ford was sexually assaulted and shes lying about who did it just because Kavanaughs mother foreclosed on Fords parents? This was what you were pushing the other day before you got suspended.

@Mal_Fet

@shockthemonkey She's already changed her story from what it was in her therapy notes. Either she's lying or her memory is heavily impaired
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CantKeepMeDown
09/22/18 2:28:32 PM
#50:


Payzmaykr posted...
CantKeepMeDown posted...
Payzmaykr posted...
This was a major flop. They dragged it out and now the general public doesnt believe it.

Completely false. Kavanaugh is underwater in public approval. In fact, he's literally the first appointed Justice to be more disapproved than approved of.

At this point, it might HURT the GOP to shove him through. Hardiman or Kethledge would give the same conservative performance without being attempted rapists. They also wouldn't treat Trump above the law, which, let's be honest, is all you care about.

Hes not a fucking attempted racist. These pieces of shit would make lies about any republican candidate. They dont want to admit that they lost. We are not going to put some centrist in there who will side with them. We are going to balance of the radicalism that obama put in there with some normalcy. The kavanaugh appointment = we win the gun rights argument. They hate losing, so they made up some lies.

Why would you not want Hardiman or Kethledge then? They'd also vote for gun rights. Without being attempted rapists
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