Board 8 > Sir Chris Music Mafia Topic 11: All Star

(+) Yeah! (+)

And we have two more lingering questions.

No one ever claimed a recruit by Panthera, so if we assume he killed himself, that makes it much more likely that Eaed stopped a kill on Corrik night 1, because this team feels weak enough as it is without at least an extra kill.

That would suggest the final two scum are something with an extra kill and something that can janitor. We should pay attention to Scare's flip.

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Im not sure why unscannable would mean I couldnt see him. Thats a ninja.

Like, did you guys miss the part where my target was Sheep?

Okay, that makes sense. But then the context makes red's role not very good.

It MAY have scanned innocent to a direct cop scan. Or it MAY have returned a failed result.

Even in the best case scenario red would essentially have been a Godfather but with a distinct disadvantage because he would be outed if he was ever targetted by the Watcher. Right?

So we have a cop and a scum role that might have countered it. And a watcher, but so far nothing that seems to interact with it.

Crescent-Moon posted...

I was wondering last night if scum has a pretty powerful role we haven't seen yet.

My thoughts exactly, but then as you go on to say... what is even left?

Is there just an infinite use ninja available? But then why not use that last night? Does ninja get murdered by an elite bodyguard? But if red was "taking the hit" for a more powerful role by attacking into the potential EBG target...why not just target the EBG?

I definitely need to sleep on this. The good news is my wife starts work again tomorrow (she works at a school) so i'll be awake early (well, early for me) and will have time to play before work, rather than having to stay up late after work. I'll see you all in the morning. Let's try not to end too early. 1 vs 8 seems impossible to lose, but I feel like some theory crafting is still in order before we end the day.
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Scum had to simply hope Sultan guessed wrong. I was hoping he would target Sheep after being told to target Tony so much.

That was probably a desperation move to get rid of Sheep. But speaking of a role scum could be hiding..

If the game gets to final 6 (maybe even 8) I would heavily suggest to disregard all innocent scans. Unscannable is NOT godfather, its a crap half godfather, and we just had a game with two godfathers where town wifomed itself half to death.

And basically any role can have godfather attached. I was Mafia Super Godfather Detective, after all.

Forceful_Dragon posted...

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Im not sure why unscannable would mean I couldnt see him. Thats a ninja.

Like, did you guys miss the part where my target was Sheep?

Okay, that makes sense. But then the context makes red's role not very good.

It MAY have scanned innocent to a direct cop scan. Or it MAY have returned a failed result.

Even in the best case scenario red would essentially have been a Godfather but with a distinct disadvantage because he would be outed if he was ever targetted by the Watcher. Right?

So we have a cop and a scum role that might have countered it. And a watcher, but so far nothing that seems to interact with it.

Crescent-Moon posted...

I was wondering last night if scum has a pretty powerful role we haven't seen yet.

My thoughts exactly, but then as you go on to say... what is even left?

Is there just an infinite use ninja available? But then why not use that last night? Does ninja get murdered by an elite bodyguard? But if red was "taking the hit" for a more powerful role by attacking into the potential EBG target...why not just target the EBG?

I definitely need to sleep on this. The good news is my wife starts work again tomorrow (she works at a school) so i'll be awake early (well, early for me) and will have time to play before work, rather than having to stay up late after work. I'll see you all in the morning. Let's try not to end too early. 1 vs 8 seems impossible to lose, but I feel like some theory crafting is still in order before we end the day.

I just gave a conspiracy theory of my own~

Also scum doesnt waste so much time blocking Tony if they have something like infinite use ninja, it wouldn't make sense.

In fact, why send Red at all? He still has a viable power. He could have potentially drawn Sheep to him.

This theory brings up a question: What if scum wanted Red to be watched by Tony. The immediate thought was to treat unscannable as some sort of godfather variant. What if that's the trap?

At the very least, test MZero at final 6 and ignore all innocent scans at that point. Not like I'll still be alive if it gets that far.

Oh and Death, dont overreact. Tony's had many personal attacks on me this game, I only responded to the one because I'm agitated tonight. It won't be a mistake I repeat when I'm more stable tomorrow.

I suppose if Scare doesnt flip godfather or janitor, the last scum could be a godfather janitor.

Scum did get 2 deifferent anti-scan roles in a recent game.

That said, reds suicidal move could just as easily be them trying to get us to look at innocent scans again.
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Also I'm feeling an inkling that Ben is town. I'm not entirely sure where its coming from.

I just dont like fighting <.<'
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The good thing is, with just 1 scum left, sentences like that cant be part of an agenda anymore. Heh.
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htaeD posted...

I suppose if Scare doesnt flip godfather or janitor, the last scum could be a godfather janitor.

Scum did get 2 deifferent anti-scan roles in a recent game.

That said, reds suicidal move could just as easily be them trying to get us to look at innocent scans again.

That's the thing though. That logic makes no sense.

Without a godfather we already were still looking at the innocent scans. What did Red's flip do? Drive us away from looking at the innocent scans.

(Which, going by this theory, we'll get a third one of tomorrow)

That is true. But I still think scum could have just had red kill the bodyguard to achieve the same effect.
Not like we trusted red either at this point.
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Right now I am playing as Phoenix Wright, following a tenuous trail of logical connections to a conclusion I cannot yet prove.

But I feel good about this theory, because there's another piece of logic.

It backfired, but why was Sultan blocked instead of Sheep on night 3? I don't think Eaed targeted him.

Why not block Tony/Eaed and just kill Sheep? He just mowed down two scum after that decision.

Maybe there's someone they want Sheep to scan?

But in that case, why try to kill him last night? It contradicts leaving him unblocked night 3.

htaeD posted...

That is true. But I still think scum could have just had red kill the bodyguard to achieve the same effect.
Not like we trusted red either at this point.

That's part of the point. It suggests scum wanted Red to be watched.

Unless scum came up with this insane Gamble and had Red shoot Sheep, knowing he'd be watched and hoping he'd be EBG'd.

Talk about a conspiracy theory.

Ultimately though, Red drawing a scan clearly increases his lifespan, but they had Red shoot someone they knew would be watched.

The question is why. I feel like scum wanted to get rid of Red instead of keep him.

I mean in BFZ Ulti shot his own teammate so it's happened before

Yay conspiracy

Crescent-Moon posted...

Right now I am playing as Phoenix Wright, following a tenuous trail of logical connections to a conclusion I cannot yet prove.

But I feel good about this theory, because there's another piece of logic.

It backfired, but why was Sultan blocked instead of Sheep on night 3? I don't think Eaed targeted him.

Why not block Tony/Eaed and just kill Sheep? He just mowed down two scum after that decision.

Maybe there's someone they want Sheep to scan?

There is no way eaed blocks sheep either though.
I really think eaed was just that accidentally selfdestructive.
That said, watcher can catch scum directly. Cops will always have the godfather factor against them. Regardless of what is true, that they are causing this much doubt is in their favor.
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Crescent-Moon posted...

But in that case, why try to kill him last night? It contradicts leaving him unblocked night 3.

There was also plenty of reason to doubt sheep, with Leo's mysterious claim preparations and plums flip.

But all that went out the window, once we lynched their RB.
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I read nothing into Leo's fakespew.

And I know it's insane but I cannot consider Sheep 100% confirmed.

But this is paranoia fueled by seeing scum shoot scum before I know.

This ending isn't going to be as easy as people want to think though, I think scum has some sort of trump card left to play.

Don't forget I faked a scan on my scummate Leo and got him killed in Blade Mafia!

(I was an Usurper though)
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And nobody flipped so far has been a godfather either.
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Not really a meaningful comparison.

At least I got a little more sleep, but this is going to be a rough day.

Unscannable and Godfather aren't the same role though, yes. And given the scan we know Scare isn't it.

I dont see why scum would get a godfather and an unscannable, when both are apparently weak to watchers.

On the other hand we got Two bodyguards.
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htaeD posted...

I dont see why scum would get a godfather and an unscannable

This doesn't mean much. We make sense with what we have to work with.

So, let's see what happened while I slept. Crescent vs Puns is very interesting. I think it's Town v Town as someone else (Ben?) said but I definitely see the logic on both sides.

By the way, I actually scanned Ben town. Which was honestly kinda confusing, cause I was pretty sure he was scum. With Red dead and Sultan flipping town last night I was a little confused. I had no clue where to look next since basically everyone else was a town read. Hence, the Scare "scan". Some observations:

I don't think Crescent goes off about how she should be given credit for the Scare scan/lynch if she knows he doesn't scan that way. Hence she's either scum with him, or town. If Scare is town then Crescent very probably is too.

Scare has given me absolutely no reason to think my fake scan was wrong. No attempt to call me on my bluff (unless I missed it), no argument except a few weak ones including the good ol' framer excuse. Obviously he couldn't really call me scum because that's suicidal. It wasn't as impactful as I hoped, but I do think that Scare is the right lynch today. If anyone has a better suggestion (that includes you, Scare), please feel free.

I'm a bit more worried about Puns than I was yesterday, his votes have been poor for quite a while, but the Leo thing is very difficult to explain if he is town. I think Tange and MZero are both town, so if I were to pick a godfather here it would be Ben, but I definitely feel a lot better about him than before and won't even consider lynching him. I suggest you all don't either until we get near LYLO. Especially if there's no Janitor/Jack flip.
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The whole reason I voted Sultan was just to see if anyone would go for it and thus implicate themselves.

I did think it was rather odd nobody really called me out. I mean...look, I put Sultan as my #1 most trusted player and said I was going to advocate for him if he didn't die.

The vote meant nothing.

And Crescent, to say I was "freaking out" about a potential bombproof is a very silly exaggeration.

So I had a thought while driving about the watcher.

What if "two godfathers" isn't the only concept he took from that game?

Chris himself, our extra kill, was "ninja vig". His extra kill was track and watch proof.

turbopuns2 posted...

The whole reason I voted Sultan was just to see if anyone would go for it and thus implicate themselves.

I did think it was rather odd nobody really called me out. I mean...look, I put Sultan as my #1 most trusted player and said I was going to advocate for him if he didn't die.

The vote meant nothing.

Hence why I said Dumey took the cheese, because he did.

(Now watch Scare flip ninja vig and me get suspected for guessing the existence of the role)

That'd be pretty amazing~

Really another person lied about a scan? I just read back up.

Scare has acted all day like caught scum. Very little difference between his action's and Leo's.

A claimed scan is not a be all end all. I get the feeling Scare believed the claim and just packed it in.

This scum team is going to have traumatic flashbacks every time they get dressed from now on, the way we pantsed 'em so good.

That was my feeling as well. I think if Scare was Town he would have fought back, not just said "well lol wait til you see my flip".
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Interesting that Sheep more or less excluded the possibility that I could be town that was simply right about Scare.

So that tacks on yet another person to suspect me based on a bus job I would never have committed to as scum. How quaint.

I don't think I've ever gotten so much suspicion for a correct read before.

Sheep007 posted...

That was my feeling as well. I think if Scare was Town he would have fought back, not just said "well lol wait til you see my flip".

Correct.

This is basically all Leo did, too.

I also love how that was the second person to insinuate being wrong about Scare would make me town, for that matter.

Oh and I hold my actions only make sense as scum if Scare is town.

I probably deserve to be buried if he flips town. I can't fathom how that would make people look at me more favorably.

Crescent, if you don't pull your head out of your ass and stop acting so arrogant, you are 100% getting lynched this game.

I'm just letting you know.

Crescent-Moon posted...

Interesting that Sheep more or less excluded the possibility that I could be town that was simply right about Scare.

Was it not implied that you would have been right about Scare if you are town and he is scum? Furthermore, am I meant to ignore the fact that you might bus? I've never played with you before, so how should I suppose that you wouldn't commit to a bus just because you say so?
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tag
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Crescent, why are you pretending you had anything to do with why people considered Scare as Scum?
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for the record, this post basically jumped out of the screen and smacked me in the face suggesting Scare as scum

ScareChan posted...

Sultan is elite

...lmao

HanOfTheNekos posted...

Crescent, why are you pretending you had anything to do with why people considered Scare as Scum?

Pretending? No one was even looking at him until I practically begged people to.

I mean though, not much I can do against "You were right on Red and Scare so you must be scum" anyway.

But anyone pursuing this narrative should get major scum points after I die.

Goddamnit Sheep.
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