Current Events > I find it kind of amusing the same people who complain about Russia

(+) Yeah! (+)

are those who wear the hammer and sickle on their shirt

Russia was better off under the Tsar.
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Milkman5 posted...

are those who wear the hammer and sickle on their shirt

Is that true?
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ok
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nicklebro posted...

Milkman5 posted...

are those who wear the hammer and sickle on their shirt

Is that true?

yeah. Antifa wears the hammer and sickle proudly.
where have you been

Milkman5 posted...

nicklebro posted...

Milkman5 posted...

are those who wear the hammer and sickle on their shirt

Is that true?

yeah. Antifa wears the hammer and sickle proudly.
where have you been

Do they? I have been suspecting they'd be going down that road but haven't actually seen any evidence of it. I mean I've seen a ton of anti free speech far left demonstrators sport the hammer and sickle but that's mainly at universities and stuff like that.

Sucks that those kinda people exist, really puts a black eye on the left and is annoyance for regular liberals like myself.
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nicklebro posted...

Do they? I have been suspecting they'd be going down that road but haven't actually seen any evidence of it. I mean I've seen a ton of anti free speech far left demonstrators sport the hammer and sickle but that's mainly at universities and stuff like that.

Antifa is a historically pro-communist organization

the red and black diagonal flag is the symbol of anarcho-communism as well
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Mal_Fet posted...

nicklebro posted...

Do they? I have been suspecting they'd be going down that road but haven't actually seen any evidence of it. I mean I've seen a ton of anti free speech far left demonstrators sport the hammer and sickle but that's mainly at universities and stuff like that.

Antifa is a historically pro-communist organization

the red and black diagonal flag is the symbol of anarcho-communism as well

Historically? Didn't they just pop up within the last year?

And Idk man I'd need to see some actual evidence of this kinda stuff. Like I said, I've seen a ton of ignorant pro commie nonsense coming from the far left, but so far I haven't actually seen anything like that in connection with antifa.

Do you have a picture or something? It won't surprise me at all since I'm pretty sure antifa was organized in the universities, where something like 1 in 5 professors of the humanities are declared Marxists (WTF?!) but I'm still wary of people just throwing around accusations like this with no evidence.
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nicklebro posted...

Historically? Didn't they just pop up within the last year?

No I think the idea of antifa started in spain as resistance to Franco's rule
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It's good to take symbols that represent bad things and change their meaning. We should work on taking back the Swastika, it used to be a pretty cool symbol of peace before Hitler misused it

ThyCorndog posted...

nicklebro posted...

Historically? Didn't they just pop up within the last year?

No I think the idea of antifa started in spain as resistance to Franco's rule

Well that's a bit of a stretch, is there any reason to connect this group who identifies as antifa with those people?

I'm sincerely asking btw, if someone has the fully history of antifa and where they got their name and stuff like that I'd like to know. I just haven't seen any reason to believe that these people existed before a year or so ago.
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they're not the same group, no. it's just the same ideology rather than some sort or continuum between then and now. kinda like neo nazis are related to the nazis but it's not like neo nazis directly descended out of ww2 germany
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nicklebro posted...

Historically? Didn't they just pop up within the last year?

Antifa has been around since 1932

nicklebro posted...

And Idk man I'd need to see some actual evidence of this kinda stuff. Like I said, I've seen a ton of ignorant pro commie nonsense coming from the far left, but so far I haven't actually seen anything like that in connection with antifa.

Do you have a picture or something? It won't surprise me at all since I'm pretty sure antifa was organized in the universities, where something like 1 in 5 professors of the humanities are declared Marxists (WTF?!) but I'm still wary of people just throwing around accusations like this with no evidence.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-WWII_anti-fascism

^ It's all there
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nicklebro posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

nicklebro posted...

Historically? Didn't they just pop up within the last year?

No I think the idea of antifa started in spain as resistance to Franco's rule

Well that's a bit of a stretch, is there any reason to connect this group who identifies as antifa with those people?

I'm sincerely asking btw, if someone has the fully history of antifa and where they got their name and stuff like that I'd like to know. I just haven't seen any reason to believe that these people existed before a year or so ago.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifaschistische_Aktion

Never heard of the Spain thing, but there is this.
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well I was wrong about it starting in spain. there's just been a lot of antifa movements throughout 20th century europe. italy/germany/spain/balkans/etc

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-fascism
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ThyCorndog posted...

they're not the same group, no. it's just the same ideology rather than some sort or continuum between then and now. kinda like neo nazis are related to the nazis but it's not like neo nazis directly descended out of ww2 germany

I wouldn't even call it the same ideology. I mean... Isn't everyone who isn't a fascist anti fascist?

Mal_Fet posted...

nicklebro posted...

Historically? Didn't they just pop up within the last year?

Antifa has been around since 1932

nicklebro posted...

And Idk man I'd need to see some actual evidence of this kinda stuff. Like I said, I've seen a ton of ignorant pro commie nonsense coming from the far left, but so far I haven't actually seen anything like that in connection with antifa.

Do you have a picture or something? It won't surprise me at all since I'm pretty sure antifa was organized in the universities, where something like 1 in 5 professors of the humanities are declared Marxists (WTF?!) but I'm still wary of people just throwing around accusations like this with no evidence.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-WWII_anti-fascism

^ It's all there

It says that group died out over 70 years ago, crushed by the far right Nazis who they opposed. So are you trying to say simple because they adopted the same name, that they're the same group?

Quite a stretch there bud. Lol then again, for someone who thinks the Nazis were a far left organization, this is actually one of your more rational arguments, as wrong as it might be.
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nicklebro posted...

It says that group died out over 70 years ago, crushed by the far right Nazis who they opposed. So are you trying to say simple because they adopted the same name, that they're the same group?

Here's a page specifically on the modern movement

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifa_(United_States)

They tend to be anti-government and anti-capitalist[9] and they are predominantly far-left and militant left,[10][5] which includes anarchists, communists and socialists.[11][12][13][14]

It's pretty cut-and-dried
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Even in that wikipedia it lists the new iteration of American antifa starting in 2016 as being a completely separate group and actually subscribing to anarchism rather than communism.

You're actually doing more to convince me they have no ties to communism at all, which is the exact opposite of what I suspected when I came into this topic.
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UncleBourbon33 posted...

Russia was better off under the Tsar.

Russia always has been and always will be corrupt and poor
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Mal_Fet posted...

nicklebro posted...

It says that group died out over 70 years ago, crushed by the far right Nazis who they opposed. So are you trying to say simple because they adopted the same name, that they're the same group?

Here's a page specifically on the modern movement

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifa_(United_States)

They tend to be anti-government and anti-capitalist[9] and they are predominantly far-left and militant left,[10][5] which includes anarchists, communists and socialists.[11][12][13][14]

It's pretty cut-and-dried

that link is broken. And Idk how "they are predominantly far-left and militant left, which includes anarchists, communists, and socialists" means that the antifa movement supports communism is a "cut-and-dried fact. Seems more like an assumption or implication than anything else.

Does anyone have any pictures of them with any pro communist symbols or anything like that? That'd settle this really quick. Tbh I actually believe you're right, you're just doing a horrible job of proving it.
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nicklebro posted...

that link is broken.

For some reason the hyperlink isn't catching the last parentheses. Copy and paste it.

nicklebro posted...

And Idk how "they are predominantly far-left and militant left, which includes anarchists, communists, and socialists" means that the antifa movement supports communism is a "cut-and-dried fact. Seems more like an assumption or implication than anything else.

See those bracketed numbers next to the sentences? Those are sources which back up the claims. Check them out.
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Mal_Fet posted...

nicklebro posted...

that link is broken.

For some reason the hyperlink isn't catching the last parentheses. Copy and paste it.

nicklebro posted...

And Idk how "they are predominantly far-left and militant left, which includes anarchists, communists, and socialists" means that the antifa movement supports communism is a "cut-and-dried fact. Seems more like an assumption or implication than anything else.

See those bracketed numbers next to the sentences? Those are sources which back up the claims. Check them out.

Its not that the claims need backing up, its that they aren't actually making any factual assertions about this current iteration of antifa.

Again, if antifa is a pro communist organization, it should be very easy to prove. Just show them with a hammer and sickle flag or emblem, as the OP suggested, or show them promoting communistic ideals, show them doing anything that would suggest they are pro communist. The fact that you keep trying to instead connect dots to unrelated groups of the same name and not show any actual evidence is the reason you're making me start to believe you're actually completely wrong, when I came into this topic agreeing with you.

So you've exhausted your wikipedia links arguments, just go find a picture of them with the hammer and sickle somewhere near them. If its as cut and dried as you say it is, it shouldn't be hard to find at all.
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