Board 8 > Box Office Topic II: The Return

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StealThisSheen
12/23/17 9:15:51 PM
#51:


Corrik posted...
I think that Marvel is gonna be in major trouble when they recast Ironman and Captain America.


To be fair, I don't think they're going to recast Ironman and Captain America. I think they're just going to replace them with other characters. Like, Winter Soldier's contract extends a good while after Cap's ends, for instance.
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Corrik
12/23/17 9:16:54 PM
#52:


StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
I think that Marvel is gonna be in major trouble when they recast Ironman and Captain America.


To be fair, I don't think they're going to recast Ironman and Captain America. I think they're just going to replace them with other characters. Like, Winter Soldier's contract extends a good while after Cap's ends, for instance.

They probably have to go that route, but how long are people gonna settle for not having their fave heroes on screen before it tanks the takes at the box office?
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StealThisSheen
12/23/17 9:18:33 PM
#53:


Corrik posted...
StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
I think that Marvel is gonna be in major trouble when they recast Ironman and Captain America.


To be fair, I don't think they're going to recast Ironman and Captain America. I think they're just going to replace them with other characters. Like, Winter Soldier's contract extends a good while after Cap's ends, for instance.

They probably have to go that route, but how long are people gonna settle for not having their fave heroes on screen before it tanks the takes at the box office?


Good question. They've still got things like another Guardians in the pipeline. The test will be the first "Avengers" movie after IM/Cap/etc. are gone.
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Corrik
12/23/17 9:20:33 PM
#54:


StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
I think that Marvel is gonna be in major trouble when they recast Ironman and Captain America.


To be fair, I don't think they're going to recast Ironman and Captain America. I think they're just going to replace them with other characters. Like, Winter Soldier's contract extends a good while after Cap's ends, for instance.

They probably have to go that route, but how long are people gonna settle for not having their fave heroes on screen before it tanks the takes at the box office?


Good question. They've still got things like another Guardians in the pipeline. The test will be the first "Avengers" movie after IM/Cap/etc. are gone.

I think Guardians can survive a loss of everyone but rocket and Groot. Dunno what else can be absorbed. Black widow and Hawkeye is nothing. When u start losing Ironman Thor captain hulk. Then you get into some issues.
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StealThisSheen
12/23/17 9:22:20 PM
#55:


Basically, Marvel has to rely on things like Guardians/Strange/Panther keeping people interested while they establish new characters like Captain Marvel. If they can get the new characters over, they'll be fine. If not, gg.
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StealThisSheen
12/23/17 9:24:08 PM
#56:


Corrik posted...
StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
I think that Marvel is gonna be in major trouble when they recast Ironman and Captain America.


To be fair, I don't think they're going to recast Ironman and Captain America. I think they're just going to replace them with other characters. Like, Winter Soldier's contract extends a good while after Cap's ends, for instance.

They probably have to go that route, but how long are people gonna settle for not having their fave heroes on screen before it tanks the takes at the box office?


Good question. They've still got things like another Guardians in the pipeline. The test will be the first "Avengers" movie after IM/Cap/etc. are gone.

I think Guardians can survive a loss of everyone but rocket and Groot. Dunno what else can be absorbed. Black widow and Hawkeye is nothing. When u start losing Ironman Thor captain hulk. Then you get into some issues.


After the Infinity War movies, the only ones they have for sure are all the Guardians, Strange, Ant-Man, Panther, Soldier, and... Witch, I think? The main Avengers all have their contracts ending. So either they need to resign atleast a few of them, or hope the new characters get over fast.
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Corrik
12/23/17 9:24:20 PM
#57:


StealThisSheen posted...
Basically, Marvel has to rely on things like Guardians/Strange/Panther keeping people interested while they establish new characters like Captain Marvel. If they can get the new characters over, they'll be fine. If not, gg.

I have always felt the marvel universe has a time limit. BUT, that may have had something to do with the strong push to reacquire Fox. More heroes to spread out until the audience forgets enough about the main actors to recast younger basically same characters as them later.
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scarletspeed7
12/23/17 9:27:36 PM
#58:


StealThisSheen posted...
After the Infinity War movies, the only ones they have for sure are all the Guardians, Strange, Ant-Man, Panther, Soldier, and... Witch, I think? The main Avengers all have their contracts ending. So either they need to resign atleast a few of them, or hope the new characters get over fast.

Well, they also have these mutants coming in who could totally job out the Avengers in the inevitable AvX film. Then after keeping the top stars dormant, you could return them to their former glory to pick up the pieces of the defeated Avengers. That way, you establish X-Men as equals to the Avengers in this universe, which will be a necessity if you want X-Men to reach the level worldwide attention as the Avengers.
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Terastodon
12/23/17 9:27:57 PM
#59:


Corrik posted...

They probably have to go that route, but how long are people gonna settle for not having their fave heroes on screen before it tanks the takes at the box office?

Like, you say this - but of the 1.5 billion dollars (worldwide) that Avengers made, what percentage of people had even heard of Iron Man before 2008?
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StealThisSheen
12/23/17 9:29:31 PM
#60:


scarletspeed7 posted...
StealThisSheen posted...
After the Infinity War movies, the only ones they have for sure are all the Guardians, Strange, Ant-Man, Panther, Soldier, and... Witch, I think? The main Avengers all have their contracts ending. So either they need to resign atleast a few of them, or hope the new characters get over fast.

Well, they also have these mutants coming in who could totally job out the Avengers in the inevitable AvX film. Then after keeping the top stars dormant, you could return them to their former glory to pick up the pieces of the defeated Avengers. That way, you establish X-Men as equals to the Avengers in this universe, which will be a necessity if you want X-Men to reach the level worldwide attention as the Avengers.


Yeah, this would be smart.
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Corrik
12/23/17 9:29:48 PM
#61:


Terastodon posted...
Corrik posted...

They probably have to go that route, but how long are people gonna settle for not having their fave heroes on screen before it tanks the takes at the box office?

Like, you say this - but of the 1.5 billion dollars (worldwide) that Avengers made, what percentage of people had even heard of Iron Man before 2008?

I think without the perfect casting of RDJ in that role, Marvel would have tanked right there.
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pjbasis
12/24/17 1:35:49 AM
#62:


I think they can definitely recast the marvel guys.

It's gonna take a little extra work, but you just have to get people to accept that the same character can be portrayed by different actors. Like James Bond.
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Corrik
12/24/17 1:42:25 AM
#63:


pjbasis posted...
I think they can definitely recast the marvel guys.

It's gonna take a little extra work, but you just have to get people to accept that the same character can be portrayed by different actors. Like James Bond.

James Bond isn't the same character though.
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StealThisSheen
12/24/17 1:47:39 AM
#64:


Corrik posted...
pjbasis posted...
I think they can definitely recast the marvel guys.

It's gonna take a little extra work, but you just have to get people to accept that the same character can be portrayed by different actors. Like James Bond.

James Bond isn't the same character though.


Yeah it is.

Save for any specific reboots, Bond is the same character through different actors.
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Corrik
12/24/17 2:02:25 AM
#65:


StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
pjbasis posted...
I think they can definitely recast the marvel guys.

It's gonna take a little extra work, but you just have to get people to accept that the same character can be portrayed by different actors. Like James Bond.

James Bond isn't the same character though.


Yeah it is.

Save for any specific reboots, Bond is the same character through different actors.

Blah. You know what I mean.
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StealThisSheen
12/24/17 2:10:09 AM
#66:


Corrik posted...
StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
pjbasis posted...
I think they can definitely recast the marvel guys.

It's gonna take a little extra work, but you just have to get people to accept that the same character can be portrayed by different actors. Like James Bond.

James Bond isn't the same character though.


Yeah it is.

Save for any specific reboots, Bond is the same character through different actors.

Blah. You know what I mean.


Not really, actually, which is why I made the post. >_>

That said, I think I see your general point. Bond actors tend to go through story arcs and only change after several years. The MCU can't really do that since it has a couple movies a year, so changing an actor would seem much more abrupt of a change.
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Corrik
12/24/17 2:12:07 AM
#67:


StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
pjbasis posted...
I think they can definitely recast the marvel guys.

It's gonna take a little extra work, but you just have to get people to accept that the same character can be portrayed by different actors. Like James Bond.

James Bond isn't the same character though.


Yeah it is.

Save for any specific reboots, Bond is the same character through different actors.

Blah. You know what I mean.


Not really, actually, which is why I made the post. >_>

That said, I think I see your general point. Bond actors tend to go through story arcs and only change after several years. The MCU can't really do that since it has a couple movies a year, so changing an actor would seem much more abrupt of a change.

They really don't have overarching themes between them nor do they even really possess the same personalities. Hell the next bond they get might even be Idris Elba who doesn't even have the same skin color.
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StealThisSheen
12/24/17 2:17:39 AM
#68:


Corrik posted...
They really don't have overarching themes between them nor do they even really possess the same personalities. Hell the next bond they get might even be Idris Elba who doesn't even have the same skin color.


Oh, true. This is a fair point.

People even theorized "James Bond" was more of a title and not actually the name of the man, though Skyfall dashed that completely. And before that, they all had the "dead wife" thing that kept coming up. But otherwise... Yeah, they can be fairly different.
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Corrik
12/24/17 2:20:05 AM
#69:


StealThisSheen posted...
Corrik posted...
They really don't have overarching themes between them nor do they even really possess the same personalities. Hell the next bond they get might even be Idris Elba who doesn't even have the same skin color.


Oh, true. This is a fair point.

People even theorized "James Bond" was more of a title and not actually the name of the man, though Skyfall dashed that completely. And before that, they all had the "dead wife" thing that kept coming up. But otherwise... Yeah, they can be fairly different.

I still think those could just be Easter eggs
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pjbasis
12/24/17 2:53:58 AM
#70:


Corrik posted...
Hell the next bond they get might even be Idris Elba who doesn't even have the same skin color.


I feel like this really misses the point then. James Bond is still the same character even if he's black. Not in the sense that you can imagine all the movies taking place canonically but that it doesn't matter.

Link is literally not the same character canonically in every Zelda game...but really he is from a real world perspective.

Spider-Man is Spider-Man whether it's Maguire or Garfield or a new guy.
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pjbasis
12/24/17 2:55:36 AM
#71:


I mean if you really want to you can take the comic route and Downey Jr. gives the Iron Man suit to someone else.

But I still think it's better if you get audiences to believe the actor means less than the character being portrayed.
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pjbasis
12/24/17 3:02:25 AM
#72:


Looking at the movie posters they increasingly feature less and less of the actual Iron Man mask in favor of Downey's face so...it's gonna be a challenge.
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StealThisSheen
12/24/17 3:16:19 AM
#73:


pjbasis posted...
Corrik posted...
Hell the next bond they get might even be Idris Elba who doesn't even have the same skin color.


I feel like this really misses the point then. James Bond is still the same character even if he's black. Not in the sense that you can imagine all the movies taking place canonically but that it doesn't matter.

Link is literally not the same character canonically in every Zelda game...but really he is from a real world perspective.

Spider-Man is Spider-Man whether it's Maguire or Garfield or a new guy.


Well, this is the issue, here. Things like the James Bond movies are easily to differentiate from each other and you don't run into this problem so much. But the MCU movies are following a pretty specific storyline and time frame, so recasting the actor midstream makes that awkward.

But like said, the MCU doesn't seem to be taking that approach. They seem to be going the direction of... Winter Soldier becomes Cap, War Machine or somebody takes over for IM, etc. Then they can recast down the road if they have to once the characters of Steve Rogers, Tony Stark, and so on have been away for awhile.
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5tarscream
12/24/17 7:51:59 AM
#74:


I see Corrik's point though. Especially in the older Bond films there wasn't really that much carry over of stories or allies or villains from one actor to the next the way there would be with recasting the leading Avengers.
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5tarscream
12/24/17 7:52:50 AM
#75:


But Marvel could do what they always do and just go ta-da this is Cap from another universe and now he's Cap in this universe.
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Raka_Putra
12/24/17 8:16:36 AM
#76:


TagTag.
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Corrik
12/24/17 6:03:56 PM
#77:


TLJ has the biggest drop in first to 2nd weekend in history.

1. Star Wars: The Last Jedi $68.5 million
2. Jumanji: Welcome to the Jungle $34 million
3. Pitch Perfect 3 $20.5 million
4. The Greatest Showman $8.6 million
5. Ferdinand $7.1 million
6. Coco $5.2 million
7. Downsizing $4.6 million
8. Darkest Hour $4.1 million
9. Father Figures $3.2 million
10. The Shape of Water $3.1 million

Estimated to finish somewhere around 1.2 billion in total worldwide and around 500-600million domestic.
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