Current Events > House just pass new tax bill.

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Bishop9800 11/16/17 2:02:17 PM #1:	https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/16/us/politics/house-tax-overhaul-bill.html --- I don't have to insult you. I have proven that you are a hypocrite and a fool. That's not insulting you, that's exposing you. PSN-Bishop9800 <cite>Bishop9800 posted [p:890510281] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/16/us/politics/house-tax-overhaul-bill.html</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
John_Galt 11/16/17 2:03:00 PM #2:	Nice --- Who is John Galt? <cite>John_Galt posted [p:890510336] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>Nice</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Damn_Underscore 11/16/17 2:03:09 PM #3:	it will probably go 50-50 in the senate and then Mike Pence will vote for it --- Shenmue II = best game of all time Shenmue = 2nd best game of all time <cite>Damn_Underscore posted [p:890510344] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>it will probably go 50-50 in the senate and then Mike Pence will vote for it</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MysteryMan923 11/16/17 2:05:36 PM #4:	Is this the one that fucks over house owners in high cost of living areas? --- You ain't gotta like me You just mad cuz I tell it how it is and you tell it how it might be <cite>MysteryMan923 posted [p:890510515] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>Is this the one that fucks over house owners in high cost of living areas?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:09:12 PM #5:	Damn_Underscore posted... it will probably go 50-50 in the senate and then Mike Pence will vote for it unlikely the ACA inclusion kills it for--at minimum--collins, possibly also murkowski. They've already lost ron johnson MysteryMan923 posted... Is this the one that fucks over house owners in high cost of living areas? yes --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890510732] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Damn_Underscore posted...</cite> <quote>it will probably go 50-50 in the senate and then Mike Pence will vote for it</quote> unlikely the ACA inclusion kills it for--at minimum--collins, possibly also murkowski. They've already lost ron johnson <cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>Is this the one that fucks over house owners in high cost of living areas?</quote> yes</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
metralo 11/16/17 2:09:41 PM #6:	nice, can't wait for obama to be blamed when the middle class has it worse off --- https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1298321979/image.jpg <cite>metralo posted [p:890510765] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>nice, can't wait for obama to be blamed when the middle class has it worse off</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MysteryMan923 11/16/17 2:11:43 PM #7:	Oh cool. Well I'm closing in less than 2 weeks so hopefully I get grandfathered in. --- You ain't gotta like me You just mad cuz I tell it how it is and you tell it how it might be <cite>MysteryMan923 posted [p:890510887] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>Oh cool. Well I'm closing in less than 2 weeks so hopefully I get grandfathered in.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:12:07 PM #8:	MysteryMan923 posted... Oh cool. Well I'm closing in less than 2 weeks so hopefully I get grandfathered in. not how it works --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890510914] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>Oh cool. Well I'm closing in less than 2 weeks so hopefully I get grandfathered in.</quote> not how it works</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MysteryMan923 11/16/17 2:12:38 PM #9:	Darkman124 posted... MysteryMan923 posted... Oh cool. Well I'm closing in less than 2 weeks so hopefully I get grandfathered in. not how it works For property taxes, no. For mortgage interest isn't that how it works? --- You ain't gotta like me You just mad cuz I tell it how it is and you tell it how it might be <cite>MysteryMan923 posted [p:890510954] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>Oh cool. Well I'm closing in less than 2 weeks so hopefully I get grandfathered in.</quote> not how it works</quote> For property taxes, no. For mortgage interest isn't that how it works?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darkman124 11/16/17 2:13:21 PM #11:	MysteryMan923 posted... For property taxes, no. For mortgage interest isn't that how it works? mortgage interest is still allowed but you either take a standard deduction OR itemize if your itemized deductions are less than your standard deduction they're worthless to you Spooking posted... Does this bill include getting rid of the Obama mandate on health insurance? no --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890511000] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote> For property taxes, no. For mortgage interest isn't that how it works? </quote> mortgage interest is still allowed but you either take a standard deduction OR itemize if your itemized deductions are less than your standard deduction they're worthless to you <cite>Spooking posted...</cite> <quote>Does this bill include getting rid of the Obama mandate on health insurance?</quote> no</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:14:30 PM #12:	Darkman124 posted... but you either take a standard deduction OR itemize if your itemized deductions are less than your standard deduction they're worthless to you wasn't it always this way? --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890511074] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote>but you either take a standard deduction OR itemize if your itemized deductions are less than your standard deduction they're worthless to you</quote> wasn't it always this way?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:15:45 PM #13:	FLUFFYGERM posted... wasn't it always this way? state, local, and property taxes were deductible and would then sum with mortgage insurance to make itemizing a worthwhile venture this bill removes the ability to do that (although it allows property taxes alone to remain, up to 10k, which would not be enough to itemize for anyone who doesn't have a really, really large home loan) but you knew that. --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890511141] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> wasn't it always this way?</quote> state, local, and property taxes were deductible and would then sum with mortgage insurance to make itemizing a worthwhile venture this bill removes the ability to do that (although it allows property taxes alone to remain, up to 10k, which would not be enough to itemize for anyone who doesn't have a really, really large home loan) but you knew that.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:17:10 PM #14:	Darkman124 posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... wasn't it always this way? state, local, and property taxes were deductible and would then sum with mortgage insurance to make itemizing a worthwhile venture this bill removes the ability to do that (although it allows property taxes alone to remain, up to 10k, which would not be enough to itemize for anyone who doesn't have a really, really large home loan) but you knew that. oh okay so it was basically the same before but people getting their McMansions subsidized by other taxpayers was necessary to make it "worth it" got it LOL --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890511244] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> wasn't it always this way?</quote> state, local, and property taxes were deductible and would then sum with mortgage insurance to make itemizing a worthwhile venture this bill removes the ability to do that (although it allows property taxes alone to remain, up to 10k, which would not be enough to itemize for anyone who doesn't have a really, really large home loan) but you knew that.</quote> oh okay so it was basically the same before but people getting their McMansions subsidized by other taxpayers was necessary to make it "worth it" got it LOL</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MysteryMan923 11/16/17 2:19:10 PM #15:	A 500k mortgage loan is nowhere near a McMansion where I live. --- You ain't gotta like me You just mad cuz I tell it how it is and you tell it how it might be <cite>MysteryMan923 posted [p:890511362] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>A 500k mortgage loan is nowhere near a McMansion where I live.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
creativerealms 11/16/17 2:20:29 PM #16:	MysteryMan923 posted... Is this the one that fucks over house owners in high cost of living areas? No the republicans would never fuck over the rich. --- No sig. <cite>creativerealms posted [p:890511442] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>Is this the one that fucks over house owners in high cost of living areas?</quote> No the republicans would never fuck over the rich.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:21:05 PM #17:	MysteryMan923 posted... A 500k mortgage loan is nowhere near a McMansion where I live. it is where I live and where Darkman lives IIRC lol --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890511478] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>A 500k mortgage loan is nowhere near a McMansion where I live.</quote> it is where I live and where Darkman lives IIRC lol</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MysteryMan923 11/16/17 2:23:27 PM #18:	Well then if it works for you guys it must work for everyone. We should all just pack up our lives and move. That seems simple. --- You ain't gotta like me You just mad cuz I tell it how it is and you tell it how it might be <cite>MysteryMan923 posted [p:890511629] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>Well then if it works for you guys it must work for everyone. We should all just pack up our lives and move. That seems simple.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:24:46 PM #19:	MysteryMan923 posted... A 500k mortgage loan is nowhere near a McMansion where I live. it would put you in the jumbo loan category. probably the most visible impact to homeowners, though, will be that it will remove the tax incentive for paying a mortgage vs renting. some of the value of homes is built on that tax incentive, and so housing markets across the nation are certain to decline. up until now, even owners of modest homes in less expensive areas were better off owning than renting, as they could itemize well above the standard deduction. under the bill there'd be no tax benefits associated with owning, and as such the effective value of existing homes would be reduced. homeowners like me, who bought during lows with large down payments, will not be impacted significantly, but many homeowners who bought with very little down--following the rules and paying PMI to do so--will be underwater, and unable to sell. that may compound the issue. --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890511707] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>A 500k mortgage loan is nowhere near a McMansion where I live.</quote> it would put you in the jumbo loan category. probably the most visible impact to homeowners, though, will be that it will remove the tax incentive for paying a mortgage vs renting. some of the value of homes is built on that tax incentive, and so housing markets across the nation are certain to decline. up until now, even owners of modest homes in less expensive areas were better off owning than renting, as they could itemize well above the standard deduction. under the bill there'd be no tax benefits associated with owning, and as such the effective value of existing homes would be reduced. homeowners like me, who bought during lows with large down payments, will not be impacted significantly, but many homeowners who bought with very little down--following the rules and paying PMI to do so--will be underwater, and unable to sell. that may compound the issue.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:26:03 PM #20:	Darkman124 posted... probably the most visible impact to homeowners, though, will be that it will remove the tax incentive for paying a mortgage vs renting. some of the value of homes is built on that tax incentive, and so housing markets across the nation are certain to decline. theyre already declining in states where property taxes keep going up. see: illinois. we're about to get wrecked as a large volume of homes for sale won't sell due to having $8,500 or more in annual property taxes, regardless of deductions. maybe the solution is less property tax so that we aren't dependent on deductions in order to keep people in their own homes. --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890511783] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote>probably the most visible impact to homeowners, though, will be that it will remove the tax incentive for paying a mortgage vs renting. some of the value of homes is built on that tax incentive, and so housing markets across the nation are certain to decline. </quote> theyre already declining in states where property taxes keep going up. see: illinois. we're about to get wrecked as a large volume of homes for sale won't sell due to having $8,500 or more in annual property taxes, regardless of deductions. maybe the solution is less property tax so that we aren't dependent on deductions in order to keep people in their own homes.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:26:48 PM #21:	Darkman124 posted... homeowners like me, who bought during lows with large down payments, will not be impacted significantly, but many homeowners who bought with very little down--following the rules and paying PMI to do so--will be underwater, and unable to sell. that may compound the issue. like I said in my previous post, this is already happening in states with high property taxes. has nothing to do with this new tax bill. --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890511828] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote>homeowners like me, who bought during lows with large down payments, will not be impacted significantly, but many homeowners who bought with very little down--following the rules and paying PMI to do so--will be underwater, and unable to sell. that may compound the issue. </quote> like I said in my previous post, this is already happening in states with high property taxes. has nothing to do with this new tax bill.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:27:22 PM #22:	FLUFFYGERM posted... theyre already declining in states where property taxes keep going up. see: illinois. we're about to get wrecked as a large volume of homes for sale won't sell due to having $8,500 or more in annual property taxes, regardless of deductions. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CHXRSA there does not appear to be a significant decline in IL. nationwide, prices are consistently on the rise. FLUFFYGERM posted... like I said in my previous post, this is already happening in states with high property taxes. has nothing to do with this new tax bill. your previous post was a bunch of bullshit. FLUFFYGERM posted... maybe the solution is less property tax so that we aren't dependent on deductions in order to keep people in their own homes. property taxes primarily pay for public education. I actually agree that paying for it by community creates haves and have nots, and is an ineffective solution. It should be done on the federal level IMO. Very little is done effectively by states. --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890511873] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> theyre already declining in states where property taxes keep going up. see: illinois. we're about to get wrecked as a large volume of homes for sale won't sell due to having $8,500 or more in annual property taxes, regardless of deductions. </quote> https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CHXRSA there does not appear to be a significant decline in IL. nationwide, prices are consistently on the rise. <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> like I said in my previous post, this is already happening in states with high property taxes. has nothing to do with this new tax bill. </quote> your previous post was a bunch of bullshit. <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote>maybe the solution is less property tax so that we aren't dependent on deductions in order to keep people in their own homes. </quote> property taxes primarily pay for public education. I actually agree that paying for it by community creates haves and have nots, and is an ineffective solution. It should be done on the federal level IMO. Very little is done effectively by states.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:28:56 PM #23:	Darkman124 posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... theyre already declining in states where property taxes keep going up. see: illinois. we're about to get wrecked as a large volume of homes for sale won't sell due to having $8,500 or more in annual property taxes, regardless of deductions. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CHXRSA there does not appear to be a significant decline in IL. nationwide, prices are consistently on the rise. FLUFFYGERM posted... like I said in my previous post, this is already happening in states with high property taxes. has nothing to do with this new tax bill. your previous post was a bunch of bullshit. http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-biz-homeowners-leaving-illinois-20170919-story.html https://www.illinoispolicy.org/story/home-is-where-the-hurt-is-how-property-taxes-are-crushing-illinois-middle-class/ http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-illinois-home-sales-0825-biz-20170824-story.html Sales are on a downward trend. Your little graph is not looking at the entire picture, which makes your post a bunch of bullshit lmao. --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890511969] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> theyre already declining in states where property taxes keep going up. see: illinois. we're about to get wrecked as a large volume of homes for sale won't sell due to having $8,500 or more in annual property taxes, regardless of deductions. </quote> https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CHXRSA there does not appear to be a significant decline in IL. nationwide, prices are consistently on the rise. <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> like I said in my previous post, this is already happening in states with high property taxes. has nothing to do with this new tax bill. </quote> your previous post was a bunch of bullshit.</quote> http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-biz-homeowners-leaving-illinois-20170919-story.html https://www.illinoispolicy.org/story/home-is-where-the-hurt-is-how-property-taxes-are-crushing-illinois-middle-class/ http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-illinois-home-sales-0825-biz-20170824-story.html Sales are on a downward trend. Your little graph is not looking at the entire picture, which makes your post a bunch of bullshit lmao.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:29:52 PM #24:	FLUFFYGERM posted... Sales are on a downward trend. Your little graph is not looking at the entire picture, which makes your post a bunch of bulls* lmao. you're tracking volume with those stories, which fluctuates significantly even on a monthly basis the schiller index tracks the price of sold properties learn how the real estate market works --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890512028] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> Sales are on a downward trend. Your little graph is not looking at the entire picture, which makes your post a bunch of bulls* lmao.</quote> you're tracking volume with those stories, which fluctuates significantly even on a monthly basis the schiller index tracks the price of sold properties learn how the real estate market works</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:30:29 PM #25:	Darkman124 posted... property taxes primarily pay for public education. I actually agree that paying for it by community creates haves and have nots, and is an ineffective solution. It should be done on the federal level. This is bull shit. Chicago Public Schools spends $15,000 on average per student per year and they're always bitching about money. There's no lack of funding in the majority of neighborhoods. There's just too much waste and corruption. And punishing communities that attract successful people....by giving their contributions to some other school a state or two away through federal redistribution...seems pretty immoral to me. If I work my way up to joining a great community and want my kids to go to a great school, it's my right to ensure that my livelihood and earnings go towards their education before anyone else's. --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890512065] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote>property taxes primarily pay for public education. I actually agree that paying for it by community creates haves and have nots, and is an ineffective solution. It should be done on the federal level. </quote> This is bull shit. Chicago Public Schools spends $15,000 on average per student per year and they're always bitching about money. There's no lack of funding in the majority of neighborhoods. There's just too much waste and corruption. And punishing communities that attract successful people....by giving their contributions to some other school a state or two away through federal redistribution...seems pretty immoral to me. If I work my way up to joining a great community and want my kids to go to a great school, it's my right to ensure that my livelihood and earnings go towards their education before anyone else's.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MysteryMan923 11/16/17 2:31:23 PM #26:	I just don't see the point is disincentivizing home ownership when we're already near record lows. --- You ain't gotta like me You just mad cuz I tell it how it is and you tell it how it might be <cite>MysteryMan923 posted [p:890512117] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>I just don't see the point is disincentivizing home ownership when we're already near record lows.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Were_Wyrm 11/16/17 2:31:50 PM #27:	Dr. House? --- I was a God, Valeria. I found it...beneath me. - Dr. Doom http://i.imgur.com/9gYddqW.jpg <cite>Were_Wyrm posted [p:890512145] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>Dr. House?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Questionmarktarius 11/16/17 2:33:14 PM #29:	Without some means of enforcing a balanced budget, this is just going to make things hilariously worse. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:890512228] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>Without some means of enforcing a balanced budget, this is just going to make things hilariously worse.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darkman124 11/16/17 2:33:18 PM #31:	FLUFFYGERM posted... This is bull s*. Chicago Public Schools spends $15,000 on average per student per year and they're always bing about money. There's no lack of funding in the majority of neighborhoods. There's just too much waste and corruption. your claim does not extrapolate to all neighborhoods and is thus also 'a bunch of bullshit' http://hechingerreport.org/the-gap-between-rich-and-poor-schools-grew-44-percent-over-a-decade/ http://www.ed.gov/news/media-advisories/secretary-duncan-urban-league-president-morial-spotlight-states-where-education-funding-shortchanges-low-income-minority-students i would suggest instead taking the argument path that the problem lies with parents because we'd agree on that. the biggest performance gaps between rich and poor kids occur over summer break. and then you'd get to blame poor parents. everyone wins. --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890512233] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> This is bull s. Chicago Public Schools spends $15,000 on average per student per year and they're always b***ing about money. There's no lack of funding in the majority of neighborhoods. There's just too much waste and corruption.</quote> your claim does not extrapolate to all neighborhoods and is thus also 'a bunch of bullshit' http://hechingerreport.org/the-gap-between-rich-and-poor-schools-grew-44-percent-over-a-decade/ http://www.ed.gov/news/media-advisories/secretary-duncan-urban-league-president-morial-spotlight-states-where-education-funding-shortchanges-low-income-minority-students i would suggest instead taking the argument path that the problem lies with parents because we'd agree on that. the biggest performance gaps between rich and poor kids occur over summer break. and then you'd get to blame poor parents. everyone wins.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:33:22 PM #32:	MysteryMan923 posted... I just don't see the point is disincentivizing home ownership when we're already near record lows. The powers that be want to render people poor and dependent. This is true of both the left and the right. Home ownership, growing your wealth, and being independent are antithetical to a big government's desire to control everyone and everything. This is why both sides push legislation that hurts the middle class and class mobility. --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890512241] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>I just don't see the point is disincentivizing home ownership when we're already near record lows.</quote> The powers that be want to render people poor and dependent. This is true of both the left and the right. Home ownership, growing your wealth, and being independent are antithetical to a big government's desire to control everyone and everything. This is why both sides push legislation that hurts the middle class and class mobility.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Heineken14 11/16/17 2:34:14 PM #33:	MysteryMan923 posted... Is this the one that fucks over house owners in high cost of living areas? Oh don't worry, I'm sure it fucks over all KINDS of people. obviously I mean only poor people, because... fuck 'em, m i rite, conservatives?!?!?1 ....sarcasm just in case..... --- Rage is a hell of an anesthetic. <cite>Heineken14 posted [p:890512305] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>Is this the one that fucks over house owners in high cost of living areas?</quote> Oh don't worry, I'm sure it fucks over all KINDS of people. obviously I mean only poor people, because... fuck 'em, m i rite, conservatives?!?!?1 ....sarcasm just in case.....</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MysteryMan923 11/16/17 2:34:28 PM #34:	Is it really both sides if not a single Democrat voted for it? --- You ain't gotta like me You just mad cuz I tell it how it is and you tell it how it might be <cite>MysteryMan923 posted [p:890512318] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>Is it really both sides if not a single Democrat voted for it?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:35:24 PM #35:	MysteryMan923 posted... I just don't see the point is disincentivizing home ownership when we're already near record lows. it raises an interesting question why are we near record low homeownership rates if we are also near (though not at) record high real dollar values of homes homes are not supposed to significantly grow in value over time; they're a hedge against inflation not an investment asset yet half of SF and NYC are basically investment assets --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890512368] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>MysteryMan923 posted...</cite> <quote>I just don't see the point is disincentivizing home ownership when we're already near record lows.</quote> it raises an interesting question why are we near record low homeownership rates if we are also near (though not at) record high real dollar values of homes homes are not supposed to significantly grow in value over time; they're a hedge against inflation not an investment asset yet half of SF and NYC are basically investment assets</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:39:18 PM #36:	Darkman124 posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... This is bull s*. Chicago Public Schools spends $15,000 on average per student per year and they're always b*ing about money. There's no lack of funding in the majority of neighborhoods. There's just too much waste and corruption. your claim does not extrapolate to all neighborhoods and is thus also 'a bunch of bullshit' http://hechingerreport.org/the-gap-between-rich-and-poor-schools-grew-44-percent-over-a-decade/ http://www.ed.gov/news/media-advisories/secretary-duncan-urban-league-president-morial-spotlight-states-where-education-funding-shortchanges-low-income-minority-students i would suggest instead taking the argument path that the problem lies with parents because we'd agree on that. the biggest performance gaps between rich and poor kids occur over summer break. and then you'd get to blame poor parents. everyone wins. It's basic math that a rich community will have more money to send towards their childrens' education than a poor community. Why is that a bad thing? It's the community's right to use their funds for improving their offspring's viability. I glimpsed through that link. It talks about how hard it is to collect accurate data about how much money actually goes where. And it talks about how federal funding equalizes inequalities. So Idk the problem seems a lot more nuanced than "THE RICH GIVE THEIR OWN COMMUNITY TOO MUCH FUNDING" or w/e. Maybe the expectation that every school receive the same exact amount of funding is a stupid expectation to begin with. Maybe the more successful communities are entitled to ensure that more of their net worth goes to their own community and offspring. Also, CPS receives more funding than the average Illinois student. Yet the CPS system is complete shit even though it uses a system similar to what you propose (redistribution of funds from other districts and whatnot) https://www.illinoispolicy.org/busting-forrest-claypools-4-big-myths-about-cps-funding/ Clearly more money isn't the end-all be-all of "equalizing" the system. People clamoring for a federal takeover are just socialists who think more nannyism and more funding solves everything. IE lazy uninspired non-thinkers LOL --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes* - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890512555] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> This is bull s*. Chicago Public Schools spends $15,000 on average per student per year and they're always b**ing about money. There's no lack of funding in the majority of neighborhoods. There's just too much waste and corruption.</quote> your claim does not extrapolate to all neighborhoods and is thus also 'a bunch of bullshit' http://hechingerreport.org/the-gap-between-rich-and-poor-schools-grew-44-percent-over-a-decade/ http://www.ed.gov/news/media-advisories/secretary-duncan-urban-league-president-morial-spotlight-states-where-education-funding-shortchanges-low-income-minority-students i would suggest instead taking the argument path that the problem lies with parents because we'd agree on that. the biggest performance gaps between rich and poor kids occur over summer break. and then you'd get to blame poor parents. everyone wins.</quote> It's basic math that a rich community will have more money to send towards their childrens' education than a poor community. Why is that a bad thing? It's the community's right to use their funds for improving their offspring's viability. I glimpsed through that link. It talks about how hard it is to collect accurate data about how much money actually goes where. And it talks about how federal funding equalizes inequalities. So Idk the problem seems a lot more nuanced than "THE RICH GIVE THEIR OWN COMMUNITY TOO MUCH FUNDING" or w/e. Maybe the expectation that every school receive the same exact amount of funding is a stupid expectation to begin with. Maybe the more successful communities are entitled to ensure that more of their net worth goes to their own community and offspring. Also, CPS receives more funding than the average Illinois student. Yet the CPS system is complete shit even though it uses a system similar to what you propose (redistribution of funds from other districts and whatnot) https://www.illinoispolicy.org/busting-forrest-claypools-4-big-myths-about-cps-funding/ Clearly more money isn't the end-all be-all of "equalizing" the system. People clamoring for a federal takeover are just socialists who think more nannyism and more funding solves everything. IE lazy uninspired non-thinkers LOL</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:40:10 PM #37:	Darkman124 posted... why are we near record low homeownership rates if we are also near (though not at) record high real dollar values of homes Where I live it's because people don't want to pay $8,000+ a year in property taxes for a $250,000 home --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890512597] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote>why are we near record low homeownership rates if we are also near (though not at) record high real dollar values of homes </quote> Where I live it's because people don't want to pay $8,000+ a year in property taxes for a $250,000 home</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:42:55 PM #38:	FLUFFYGERM posted... Where I live it's because people don't want to pay $8,000+ a year in property taxes for a $250,000 home normally reductions in home buying results in home values coming down what's bizarre is they are not. --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890512761] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> Where I live it's because people don't want to pay $8,000+ a year in property taxes for a $250,000 home</quote> normally reductions in home buying results in home values coming down what's bizarre is they are not.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 11/16/17 2:43:44 PM #39:	FLUFFYGERM posted... It's basic math that a rich community will have more money to send towards their childrens' education than a poor community. Why is that a bad thing? It's the community's right to use their funds for improving their offspring's viability. Math is never "basic" when government is involved. https://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/20546 <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:890512815] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote>It's basic math that a rich community will have more money to send towards their childrens' education than a poor community. Why is that a bad thing? It's the community's right to use their funds for improving their offspring's viability.</quote> Math is never "basic" when government is involved. https://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/20546</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:43:52 PM #40:	Darkman124 posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... Where I live it's because people don't want to pay $8,000+ a year in property taxes for a $250,000 home normally this results in home values coming down what's bizarre is they are not. I follow Zillow and have family that works in the real estate business. Home values are going up in some places but I'm seeing the areas with higher property taxes move houses more slowly and have price reductions more quickly. It might be another bubble / impending recession in the making. --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890512822] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> Where I live it's because people don't want to pay $8,000+ a year in property taxes for a $250,000 home</quote> normally this results in home values coming down what's bizarre is they are not.</quote> I follow Zillow and have family that works in the real estate business. Home values are going up in some places but I'm seeing the areas with higher property taxes move houses more slowly and have price reductions more quickly. It might be another bubble / impending recession in the making.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:44:26 PM #41:	Questionmarktarius posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... It's basic math that a rich community will have more money to send towards their childrens' education than a poor community. Why is that a bad thing? It's the community's right to use their funds for improving their offspring's viability. Math is never "basic" when government is involved. https://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/20546 Why the fuck is this always the case when it's leftist nannyism at work? Both Detroit and Chicago have been Democrat-run for...fucking decades. Decades. So what the hell is going on? --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890512847] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote>It's basic math that a rich community will have more money to send towards their childrens' education than a poor community. Why is that a bad thing? It's the community's right to use their funds for improving their offspring's viability.</quote> Math is never "basic" when government is involved. https://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/20546</quote> Why the fuck is this always the case when it's leftist nannyism at work? Both Detroit and Chicago have been Democrat-run for...fucking decades. Decades. So what the hell is going on?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:45:53 PM #42:	FLUFFYGERM posted... I glimpsed through that link. It talks about how hard it is to collect accurate data about how much money actually goes where. And it talks about how federal funding equalizes inequalities. So Idk the problem seems a lot more nuanced than "THE RICH GIVE THEIR OWN COMMUNITY TOO MUCH FUNDING" or w/e. that is entirely inaccurate. the second link shows a spreadsheet of the relative spending of poor and wealthy communities on students. your issue is you don't see a problem with spending more on students born in wealthy communities. which is your position to hold, but don't lie and claim that's not what is happening. the entire point of the second link was that how federal funding is intended to close that gap, but fails to do so. --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890512930] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote>I glimpsed through that link. It talks about how hard it is to collect accurate data about how much money actually goes where. And it talks about how federal funding equalizes inequalities. So Idk the problem seems a lot more nuanced than "THE RICH GIVE THEIR OWN COMMUNITY TOO MUCH FUNDING" or w/e. </quote> that is entirely inaccurate. the second link shows a spreadsheet of the relative spending of poor and wealthy communities on students. your issue is you don't see a problem with spending more on students born in wealthy communities. which is your position to hold, but don't lie and claim that's not what is happening. the entire point of the second link was that how federal funding is intended to close that gap, but fails to do so.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:47:14 PM #43:	Darkman124 posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... I glimpsed through that link. It talks about how hard it is to collect accurate data about how much money actually goes where. And it talks about how federal funding equalizes inequalities. So Idk the problem seems a lot more nuanced than "THE RICH GIVE THEIR OWN COMMUNITY TOO MUCH FUNDING" or w/e. that is entirely inaccurate. the second link shows a spreadsheet of the relative spending of poor and wealthy communities on students. your issue is you don't see a problem with spending more on students born in wealthy communities. which is your position to hold, but don't lie and claim that's not what is happening. I don't deny that wealthy communities are able to spend more on education. I don't see a problem with that, especially not when the CPS spends $16,000 per student per year on average. Which is more than the Illinois average. And they're doing it with money that was redistributed in the type of scheme you want implemented at a federal level. Despite the CPS being the most bloated, inefficient, and corrupt shit stain that has ever touched this planet. --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890513005] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote>I glimpsed through that link. It talks about how hard it is to collect accurate data about how much money actually goes where. And it talks about how federal funding equalizes inequalities. So Idk the problem seems a lot more nuanced than "THE RICH GIVE THEIR OWN COMMUNITY TOO MUCH FUNDING" or w/e. </quote> that is entirely inaccurate. the second link shows a spreadsheet of the relative spending of poor and wealthy communities on students. your issue is you don't see a problem with spending more on students born in wealthy communities. which is your position to hold, but don't lie and claim that's not what is happening.</quote> I don't deny that wealthy communities are able to spend more on education. I don't see a problem with that, especially not when the CPS spends $16,000 per student per year on average. Which is more than the Illinois average. And they're doing it with money that was redistributed in the type of scheme you want implemented at a federal level. Despite the CPS being the most bloated, inefficient, and corrupt shit stain that has ever touched this planet.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 11/16/17 2:47:35 PM #44:	FLUFFYGERM posted... Questionmarktarius posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... It's basic math that a rich community will have more money to send towards their childrens' education than a poor community. Why is that a bad thing? It's the community's right to use their funds for improving their offspring's viability. Math is never "basic" when government is involved. https://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/20546 Why the fuck is this always the case when it's leftist nannyism at work? Both Detroit and Chicago have been Democrat-run for...fucking decades. Decades. So what the hell is going on? The default liberal method for problem-solving is throwing money at it. That's what's going on. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:890513025] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote>It's basic math that a rich community will have more money to send towards their childrens' education than a poor community. Why is that a bad thing? It's the community's right to use their funds for improving their offspring's viability.</quote> Math is never "basic" when government is involved. https://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/20546</quote> Why the fuck is this always the case when it's leftist nannyism at work? Both Detroit and Chicago have been Democrat-run for...fucking decades. Decades. So what the hell is going on?</quote> The default liberal method for problem-solving is throwing money at it. That's what's going on.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:49:03 PM #45:	FLUFFYGERM posted... I follow Zillow and have family that works in the real estate business. Home values are going up in some places but I'm seeing the areas with higher property taxes move houses more slowly and have price reductions more quickly. It might be another bubble / impending recession in the making. if you actually followed zillow you'd know they're claiming prices in IL are going up... https://www.zillow.com/il/home-values/ --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890513101] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> I follow Zillow and have family that works in the real estate business. Home values are going up in some places but I'm seeing the areas with higher property taxes move houses more slowly and have price reductions more quickly. It might be another bubble / impending recession in the making.</quote> if you actually followed zillow you'd know they're claiming prices in IL are going up... https://www.zillow.com/il/home-values/</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:49:03 PM #46:	@Darkman124 can you explain to me how a public education system can spend $16,000 per student per year on average and still have money problems --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890513102] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>@Darkman124 can you explain to me how a public education system can spend $16,000 per student per year on average and still have money problems</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 11/16/17 2:49:27 PM #47:	FLUFFYGERM posted... can you explain to me how a public education system can spend $16,000 per student per year on average and still have money problems no, i'm not interested in talking about the one very specific public education system you grew up in, proudclad. i'm interested in national policy, not 'all the ways chicago sucks' --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:890513120] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote>can you explain to me how a public education system can spend $16,000 per student per year on average and still have money problems </quote> no, i'm not interested in talking about the one very specific public education system you grew up in, proudclad. i'm interested in national policy, not 'all the ways chicago sucks'</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:50:25 PM #48:	Darkman124 posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... I follow Zillow and have family that works in the real estate business. Home values are going up in some places but I'm seeing the areas with higher property taxes move houses more slowly and have price reductions more quickly. It might be another bubble / impending recession in the making. if you actually followed zillow you'd know they're claiming prices in IL are going up... https://www.zillow.com/il/home-values/ Idk the areas I look at, especially the ones with high property taxes, are not seeing that trend. i'm guessing stuff in downtown Chicago is bringing up the average or w/e. i track prices of areas i'd like to buy in. btw it's fun to look at a home's property tax history in Illinois. you'll often see 100% or 200% increases over the course of a year or two LMAO --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890513176] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote> I follow Zillow and have family that works in the real estate business. Home values are going up in some places but I'm seeing the areas with higher property taxes move houses more slowly and have price reductions more quickly. It might be another bubble / impending recession in the making.</quote> if you actually followed zillow you'd know they're claiming prices in IL are going up... https://www.zillow.com/il/home-values/</quote> Idk the areas I look at, especially the ones with high property taxes, are not seeing that trend. i'm guessing stuff in downtown Chicago is bringing up the average or w/e. i track prices of areas i'd like to buy in. btw it's fun to look at a home's property tax history in Illinois. you'll often see 100% or 200% increases over the course of a year or two LMAO</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 11/16/17 2:50:50 PM #49:	Darkman124 posted... FLUFFYGERM posted... can you explain to me how a public education system can spend $16,000 per student per year on average and still have money problems no, i'm not interested in talking about the one very specific public education system you grew up in, proudclad. i'm interested in national policy, not 'all the ways chicago sucks' except the way CPS does things is basically the same as the scheme you want implemented at the federal level --- they shall be the first ones against the wall when the revolution comes - averagejoel <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:890513198] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote><cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>FLUFFYGERM posted...</cite> <quote>can you explain to me how a public education system can spend $16,000 per student per year on average and still have money problems </quote> no, i'm not interested in talking about the one very specific public education system you grew up in, proudclad. i'm interested in national policy, not 'all the ways chicago sucks'</quote> except the way CPS does things is basically the same as the scheme you want implemented at the federal level</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 11/16/17 2:51:22 PM #50:	Hold on, let's back up a few steps. Darkman124 posted... http://hechingerreport.org/the-gap-between-rich-and-poor-schools-grew-44-percent-over-a-decade/ http://www.ed.gov/news/media-advisories/secretary-duncan-urban-league-president-morial-spotlight-states-where-education-funding-shortchanges-low-income-minority-students Important bit: The richest 25 percent of school districts receive 15.6 percent more funds from state and local governments per student than the poorest 25 percent of school districts, the federal Department of Education pointed out last month (March, 2015). I suspect some sort of "matching" scheme intended to nudge districts into increasing property taxes, which just ended up backfiring spectacularly. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:890513233] in House just... [t:75997958]...</cite> <quote>Hold on, let's back up a few steps. <cite>Darkman124 posted...</cite> <quote>http://hechingerreport.org/the-gap-between-rich-and-poor-schools-grew-44-percent-over-a-decade/ http://www.ed.gov/news/media-advisories/secretary-duncan-urban-league-president-morial-spotlight-states-where-education-funding-shortchanges-low-income-minority-students</quote> Important bit: <quote>The richest 25 percent of school districts receive 15.6 percent more funds from state and local governments per student than the poorest 25 percent of school districts, the federal Department of Education pointed out last month (March, 2015). </quote> I suspect some sort of "matching" scheme intended to nudge districts into increasing property taxes, which just ended up backfiring spectacularly.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Current Events > House just pass new tax bill. (+) Yeah! (+)

Current Events > House just pass new tax bill.