Current Events > It's very clear I'm from a different generation of gamers.

(+) Yeah! (+)

It's evident that every time I give my point of view my arguments are constantly countered with selfish remarks.

Back in my day loads of games had difficulty settings.
If I bring this up i'm quickly told to "git gud".
OK, mustering skill isn't the issue here.
It's about how you want to enjoy your game at that time.

Many games from the 4th generation (16-bit era) and even 5th and 6th offered plenty of difficulty settings.
Anything from very easy to very hard.

Why is the concept of challenging yourself when you're ready such a foreign concept to these younger gamers?

Want to take it easy and just enjoy your game without much challenge? Play on easy.
Want to challenge yourself? Play normal or hard. Push your skills to the limits? Very hard.
Clearly it's not something that's difficult to follow.

But with gamers today it's their way or the highway as if changing something will some how affect their game directly.
When someone says they want an easy mode automatically they think their game will now be too easy.
IDIOT! No, it doesn't change the base game in any sense of the meaning.

Why is this?
I just don't understand these newer generation of players.
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Son, you need to lay down.
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Most games are easier than ever now lmao what are uou even talking about
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Guarantee poster 2 and 3 are millennials.
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knightimex posted...

Guarantee poster 2 and 3 are millennials.

I actually don't disagree/agree with what you said I just posted your sig
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Get off my lawn you damn kids!!

*shakes cane*
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Not a single game of this era can compare to the difficulty of NES games, if anything games need more harder difficulties than "pussy ass bitch" base difficulty and "babystroller" hardmode.
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Most games still offer a wide range of difficulties and most games are pretty easy compared to SNES/Genesis (the earliest era of games I've played) unless you're actively seeking out things known for their difficulty like Dark Souls, Cuphead, Super Meat Boy, etc.
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DocileOrangeCup posted...

knightimex posted...

Guarantee poster 2 and 3 are millennials.

I actually don't disagree/agree with what you said I just posted your sig

haha, that's funny.
Forgot about my sig. But it doesn't change my point of view.

apolloooo posted:
Most games are easier than ever now lmao what are uou even talking about
Have they gotten easier or has technology improved quality of life due to less hardware\media limitations?
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Cookie Bag posted...

Not a single game of this era can compare to the difficulty of NES games, if anything games need more harder difficulties than "pussy ass bitch" base difficulty and "babystroller" hardmode.

NES difficulty was mostly due to what they had to work with.
Many of the "hard" nes games were actually very poor in both design and programming.

No chance the hardest levels on Super Mario bros nes is harder than those found in Super Mario 3d world.

Conta on NES, hard?
Say hello to cuphead!
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Looks like you've been triggered harder than a machine gun fired by Rambo.
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No you shitpost
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Guerrilla Soldier posted...

Looks like you've been triggered harder than a machine gun fired by Rambo.

Well yeah, I have every right to be.
Games in general have gotten significantly worse since then.
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Tell these people to beat Contra 3 on Hard.
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knightimex posted...

Guerrilla Soldier posted...

Looks like you've been triggered harder than a machine gun fired by Rambo.

Well yeah, I have every right to be.
Games in general have gotten significantly worse since then.

I've been gaming since the late 80's and will never understand this sentiment.
It's like people forget the mountains of crap you had to sort through for those few dozen actual good games. It's just the same in that regard
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knightimex posted...

Conta on NES, hard?
Say hello to cuphead!

Contra is hard, cuphead isn't.

But then again this is all subjective and i find cuphead easy because i'm used to bullet hell and platforming games.
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fusespliff posted...

I've been gaming since the late 80's and will never understand this sentiment.
It's like people forget the mountains of crap you had to sort through for those few dozen actual good games. It's just the same in that regard

The problem is good games are getting harder and harder to find.
Sorry but Final Fantasy 15 just doesn't do it for me like Final Fantasy 7 did.
And FF15 is supposed to be a "good game". Future isn't looking good if that's the case.

I've been gaming before NES was even available to the public.
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knightimex posted...

fusespliff posted...

I've been gaming since the late 80's and will never understand this sentiment.
It's like people forget the mountains of crap you had to sort through for those few dozen actual good games. It's just the same in that regard

The problem is good games are getting harder and harder to find.
Sorry but Final Fantasy 15 just doesn't do it for me like Final Fantasy 7 did.
And FF15 is supposed to be a "good game". Future isn't looking good if that's the case.

I've been gaming before NES was even available to the public.

Fine, you've been gaming for 2-3 years longer than I have. This automatically invalidates my opinion.

Good games aren't getting harder to find. Maybe stop buying just the mass marketed stuff?
You're on a freakin website dedicated to it. You could compile a list of good to great games on current systems within the hour. Back in the day, you would've played dozens upon dozens of mediocre to shit games to get such a list
I have the same problem with FFXV btw, I simply realized that me being over 30 years old rather than the 12 I was during FFVII plays a huge factor in it.

Basically, it's a mostly "you" thing
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The vast majority of games these days do have difficulty options though. The only ones I can think of that don't are things like Dark Soul, which quite frankly, are so explicitly built around their "hard" mechanics that any attempt to lower the difficulty would result in an entirely different game. They are a very small subset of the market and it is absolutely fine if you dont enjoy them. But

knightimex posted...

IDIOT! No, it doesn't change the base game in any sense of the meaning.

Nah, it kinda does. Pretty drastically as far as design goes actually.

You need to have a baseline difficulty when building your game. If you balance around easy mode, harder modes essentially become attrition checks (hp sponge enemies, gimmicky oneshots, excessively long checkpoint cycles, etc) to make up for the easy AI/level design. If you balance it around a hard mode, then anything easier requires removing integral game mechanics and building what is basically "cutscene only" mode. Neither choice is ideal when trying to deliver an experience to your players.

It also matters a lot which genre you're looking at. A platformer inherently can't have "difficulty modes" outside of giving the player more (less) lives (which I would argue does not actually change the difficulty) or blatant "cheats" to bypass areas that are too hard. You build a level and it is either designed to be hard or it isnt. You can certainly design multiple levels, usually starting the game with "easier" ones to let the player acclimate to your mechanics, but the bulk of the game still needs to follow a baseline level of difficulty.

Using a "normal mode" as your balance line still results in compromising the player's experience when you add in "easy" and "hard" modes. No matter what you do the players opting for those tertiary modes are getting a subpar experience. Whether they actually care (the dev or the player) is a different issue.

Despite that we are in the "Accessibility era" now more than ever. If you honestly feel that you can't find games that appeal to you anymore then that is unfortunate, but its not the fault of "them younglings" being selfish.
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Sputnik1337 posted...

The vast majority of games these days do have difficulty options though. The only ones I can think of that don't are things like Dark Soul, which quite frankly, are so explicitly built around their "hard" mechanics that any attempt to lower the difficulty would result in an entirely different game. They are a very small subset of the market and it is absolutely fine if you dont enjoy them. But

knightimex posted...

IDIOT! No, it doesn't change the base game in any sense of the meaning.

Nah, it kinda does. Pretty drastically as far as design goes actually.

You need to have a baseline difficulty when building your game. If you balance around easy mode, harder modes essentially become attrition checks (hp sponge enemies, gimmicky oneshots, excessively long checkpoint cycles, etc) to make up for the easy AI/level design. If you balance it around a hard mode, then anything easier requires removing integral game mechanics and building what is basically "cutscene only" mode. Neither choice is ideal when trying to deliver an experience to your players.

It also matters a lot which genre you're looking at. A platformer inherently can't have "difficulty modes" outside of giving the player more (less) lives (which I would argue does not actually change the difficulty) or blatant "cheats" to bypass areas that are too hard. You build a level and it is either designed to be hard or it isnt. You can certainly design multiple levels, usually starting the game with "easier" ones to let the player acclimate to your mechanics, but the bulk of the game still needs to follow a baseline level of difficulty.

Using a "normal mode" as your balance line still results in compromising the player's experience when you add in "easy" and "hard" modes. No matter what you do the players opting for those tertiary modes are getting a subpar experience. Whether they actually care (the dev or the player) is a different issue.

Despite that we are in the "Accessibility era" now more than ever. If you honestly feel that you can't find games that appeal to you anymore then that is unfortunate, but its not the fault of "them younglings" being selfish.

Uh what?
What kind of shit is this?
You build around NORMAL (AS INTENDED) then give or take balance adjustments from there.

LMAO who the fuck starts with easy then goes upward?
That's not how it works, broski.
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knightimex posted...

fusespliff posted...

I've been gaming since the late 80's and will never understand this sentiment.
It's like people forget the mountains of crap you had to sort through for those few dozen actual good games. It's just the same in that regard

The problem is good games are getting harder and harder to find.
Sorry but Final Fantasy 15 just doesn't do it for me like Final Fantasy 7 did.
And FF15 is supposed to be a "good game". Future isn't looking good if that's the case.

I've been gaming before NES was even available to the public.

Looks like someone is just getting old. It happens pop pop. I bet you used to play games with your hands like a babys toy.
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Sputnik1337 posted...

The vast majority of games these days do have difficulty options though. The only ones I can think of that don't are things like Dark Soul, which quite frankly, are so explicitly built around their "hard" mechanics that any attempt to lower the difficulty would result in an entirely different game.

Yeah, this.

I mean, an easy mode Super Meat Boy? That's just a shit game.
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IWBYD posted...

Looks like someone is just getting old. It happens pop pop. I bet you used to play games with your hands like a babys toy.

I did indeed.
You're aware of it you you probably did as well.
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Majority of games today let you choose your difficulty.
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knightimex posted...

IWBYD posted...

Looks like someone is just getting old. It happens pop pop. I bet you used to play games with your hands like a babys toy.

I did indeed.
You're aware of it you you probably did as well.

Apparently you're not old enough to get the BTTF2 reference there =P
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pegusus123456 posted...

Sputnik1337 posted...

The vast majority of games these days do have difficulty options though. The only ones I can think of that don't are things like Dark Soul, which quite frankly, are so explicitly built around their "hard" mechanics that any attempt to lower the difficulty would result in an entirely different game.

Yeah, this.

I mean, an easy mode Super Meat Boy? That's just a shit game.

To be fair, use different characters makes meat boy easier.
Didn't change the game at all.
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knightimex posted...

To be fair, use different characters makes meat boy easier.
Didn't change the game at all.

Easy being a relative term here. It was still hard as shit.
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pegusus123456 posted...

knightimex posted...

To be fair, use different characters makes meat boy easier.
Didn't change the game at all.

Easy being a relative term here. It was still hard as shit.

Depending on the character a once very hard level ended up being cake.
Use the wrong type of character and said level becomes near impossible to finish.

Going to bed.
I won't reply for at least 8 hours.
Cheers!
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You're still piddling with one example while ignoring the larger point.
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knightimex posted...

Cookie Bag posted...

Not a single game of this era can compare to the difficulty of NES games, if anything games need more harder difficulties than "pussy ass bitch" base difficulty and "babystroller" hardmode.

NES difficulty was mostly due to what they had to work with.
Many of the "hard" nes games were actually very poor in both design and programming.

No chance the hardest levels on Super Mario bros nes is harder than those found in Super Mario 3d world.

Conta on NES, hard?
Say hello to cuphead!

Whatever I beat Super Mario 3D world easily. Mario on NES is still hard for me today though.
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knightimex posted...

Uh what?
What kind of shit is this?
You build around NORMAL (AS INTENDED) then give or take balance adjustments from there.

LMAO who the fuck starts with easy then goes upward?
That's not how it works, broski.

That is quite literally how it works.

Easy mode, Normal, Hard, Vergil, Suicidal, Please Dont Hurt Me, Hyper Ex Double Violence, Story. You can call the difficulties whatever you want but you're still going to be building around a certain level of challenge (ability/commitment from your player). People who play on "easy" are going to see "normal" as a harder mode and people who play on "hard" are going to see it as an "easy" mode. Its all relative.

Super Meat Boy is a great example though. It starts off simple enough with its "tutorial" levels and then quickly ramps up into "impossible" mode for many players. It ties its difficulty "slider" to the unlockable characters, which is a neat approach. The level design isn't compromised for an "easy" or "hard" mode here because the different characters themselves offer tools to bypass tricky obstacles. Still, while those characters make the game more accessible and offer players a better chance to get into the game, it remains a "hard" game at its core. Anyone who outright relies on the "easy" characters to progress will likely hit a wall they never manage to break.

The Dark World is also a perfect example of why designing your core game around an "easy" (normal) level and then trying to add a "hard" one on top of it is not great.
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knightimex posted...

fusespliff posted...

I've been gaming since the late 80's and will never understand this sentiment.
It's like people forget the mountains of crap you had to sort through for those few dozen actual good games. It's just the same in that regard

The problem is good games are getting harder and harder to find.
Sorry but Final Fantasy 15 just doesn't do it for me like Final Fantasy 7 did.
And FF15 is supposed to be a "good game". Future isn't looking good if that's the case.

I've been gaming before NES was even available to the public.

FF 15 was such a let down because it had all the elements to make an incredible entry in the series and started out very strong. Man did it go downhill fast though

I have to say though I still think games today are very fun and last gen was one of the best ever imo. South Park comes out tomorrow and that looks fantastic. Still, going back to old games; I haven't played a SNES in almost 20 years and I am now completely addicted to games on the SNES classic (especially games I never really got a chance to get through like Castlevania)

So I agree and disagree with the topic, but I think we can all agree on one thing

Anyone who is trying to feel superior over others over video games of all things is a giant douche
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Not a single game of this era can compare to the difficulty of NES games, if anything games need more harder difficulties than "p**** ass b****" base difficulty and "babystroller" hardmode.

If you had to restart most modern games from the beginning after dying three times, you wouldn't think they were so easy.

Sometimes people say the NES Mega Man games were super hard, but really they were pretty easy by NES standards for that very reason. I'm guessing those people gave up after their first game over.
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