Current Events > Is FF1 as bad as FF2?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I've been meaning to play these games on the PSP again.
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Depends on why you hated 2.

It has a traditional level up system, and a minimal plot that pushes you around the continent until you end up at the final dungeon.

Battle system is largely the same, but the custom team composition makes for interesting replay value.

The OG FF1 (and I think the Origins remake) have a "per day" MP system for each magic level, that resets with each rest at an inn. But everything else replaces it with the traditional MP system of later games. IDK about the PSP version specifically.

Over all, I had a lot of fun with it. Some parts are frustratingly difficult though.
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NO! FF2 is the WORST by far.

FF1 is atleast a playable game. FF2 is so bad, and then you get into the magic leveling system and it's like *turn off game*
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Nothing is as bad as Final Fantasy 2.
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Action 52 is better than Final Fantasy 2
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I thought FF2 was actually pretty good, but I only played the GBA version.
FF1 is great of course but I don't think it's aged well, not even the remakes.
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FF2 is one of the worst games in a publisher's catalogue that includes Unlimited SaGa.

FF1 is not only much better than 2, but arguably better than 3 as well.
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ChromaticAngel posted...

FF1 is not only much better than 2, but arguably better than 3 as well.

lets not get ahead of ourselves
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hyperpsycho posted...

Action 52 is better than Final Fantasy 2

Well, action 52 has cheetahmen... of course its better.
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@ChromaticAngel posted...

FF2 is one of the worst games in a publisher's catalogue that includes Unlimited SaGa.

You take that back right now! Nothing is worse than that nonsensical, Dungeons and Dragons wannabe, broken slot-machine masquerading as a "video game".

ChromaticAngel posted...

FF1 is ... arguably better than 3 as well.

Okay, that's a bad opinion, but you're allowed to have it.
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DoomSwell posted...

You take that back right now! Nothing is worse than that nonsensical, Dungeons and Dragons wannabe, broken slot-machine masquerading as a "video game".

I can't tell if you're talking about Unlimited SaGa or FF7 Crisis Core.


ayy lmao

Seriously though. I didn't say it was worse than Unlimited SaGa, just one of the worst games among a collection of games that includes Unlimited SaGa
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ChromaticAngel posted...

FF7 Crisis Core

My gawd. If the damn cutscene-slots would stop for two seconds I could mash X faster!

ChromaticAngel posted...

didn't say it was worse than

I guess... but U.Saga is still in a league of it's own where no game deserves to be compared to it.
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I have been curious to play the 2nd, is it reallt THAT bad?
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epik_fail1 posted...

I have been curious to play the 2nd, is it reallt THAT bad?

You level up your stats by using them.

So you level up your HP by getting your ass beat.

So if you're good at the game you'll get murdered lol.
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epik_fail1 posted...

I have been curious to play the 2nd, is it reallt THAT bad?

YES. It is REALLY stupid. Leveling spells takes literally -days-
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FF1 (the GBA version is what I played, but the psp is very similar) is amazing. Extremely replayable and fun. Idk if it's better than Ill but it's definitely more replayable thanks to its simplicity and shorter length

How to cheat at FF2:

Equip shields on both hands of all characters.

Fight weak enemies.

Hold attack button for like an hour.

Switch out shields with weapons you want characters to learn.

Kill enemies.

Voila! You now have insanely levelled weapon skills!

Edit: Also FF3 sucks.
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epik_fail1 posted...

I have been curious to play the 2nd, is it reallt THAT bad?

The GBA version isn't half bad.
The original NES version is broken as all hell. On the bright side, you can kill the final boss with Toad even though it's supposed to be immune to it.

Etherealfare posted...

epik_fail1 posted...

I have been curious to play the 2nd, is it reallt THAT bad?

YES. It is REALLY stupid. Leveling spells takes literally -days-

Even in the remake?
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E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial is better than Final Fantasy 2
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epik_fail1 posted...

Etherealfare posted...

epik_fail1 posted...

I have been curious to play the 2nd, is it reallt THAT bad?

YES. It is REALLY stupid. Leveling spells takes literally -days-

Even in the remake?

the only version I have ever played was my Origins game for PS1. And yes
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jumi posted...

How to cheat at FF2:

Equip shields on both hands of all characters.

Fight weak enemies.

Hold attack button for like an hour.

Switch out shields with weapons you want characters to learn.

Kill enemies.

Voila! You now have insanely levelled weapon skills!

That's not how you cheat at FF2.

You cheat at FF2 by.

attack -> Target Enemy -> Cancel -> Attack -> Target Enemy -> Cancel -> repeat 20 times -> End Battle
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Ride to Hell: Retribution is better than Final Fantasy 2
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ChromaticAngel posted...

jumi posted...

How to cheat at FF2:

Equip shields on both hands of all characters.

Fight weak enemies.

Hold attack button for like an hour.

Switch out shields with weapons you want characters to learn.

Kill enemies.

Voila! You now have insanely levelled weapon skills!

That's not how you cheat at FF2.

You cheat at FF2 by.

attack -> Target Enemy -> Cancel -> Attack -> Target Enemy -> Cancel -> repeat 20 times -> End Battle

My method requires less effort.
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Unlimited SaGa is amazing.

But I like FF2 as well so IDK.
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FF1 is great. It's not deep and the mechanics are insanely old, but it's a great rpg none the less if you can get over that.

FF2 is a dog turd, though.

ChromaticAngel posted...

attack -> Target Enemy -> Cancel -> Attack -> Target Enemy -> Cancel -> repeat 20 times -> End Battle

Pretty sure that doesn't work on the remakes

scar the 1 posted...

Unlimited SaGa is amazing.

But I like FF2 as well so IDK.

FF2 is good, everyone in this topic is just meme-ing it up.
You're wrong about U.Saga though. Maybe you're confusing it with Romancing Saga.
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DoomSwell posted...

You're wrong about U.Saga though. Maybe you're confusing it with Romancing Saga.

No, I'm a big SaGa fan. I know very well the difference between Unlimited and Romancing. Both are great, Unlimited is a lot less accessible. Usually people who don't like it dismiss it quite quickly. It's by no means perfect, but it's an incredibly rich and rewarding game.
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scar the 1 posted...

DoomSwell posted...

You're wrong about U.Saga though. Maybe you're confusing it with Romancing Saga.

No, I'm a big SaGa fan. I know very well the difference between Unlimited and Romancing. Both are great, Unlimited is a lot less accessible. Usually people who don't like it dismiss it quite quickly. It's by no means perfect, but it's an incredibly rich and rewarding game.

Maybe, you can explain how: You use your sword so much it breaks, then at the end of the chapter they offer you Axe Lv2 which you put on your Head to raise your magic stat? Or how you fail diplomacy slots, so you have to fight battles with 0 HP, hoping to dodge every hit cause you only have 10 LP. Your weapons break and the monsters don't give any Exp or Money. You're supposed to get money and items from treasure chests, but the slots keep making them blow up; damaging you if I recall, possibly alerting nearby monsters to ambush you.

None of that is the makings of a game, much less a "great" one. Its more akin to a torture device, like the guillotine.
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DoomSwell posted...

Maybe, you can explain how: You use your sword so much it breaks, then at the end of the chapter they offer you Axe Lv2 which you put on your Head to raise your magic stat? Or how you fail diplomacy slots, so you have to fight battles with 0 HP, hoping to dodge every hit cause you only have 10 LP. Your weapons break and the monsters don't give any Exp or Money. You're supposed to get money and items from treasure chests, but the slots keep making them blow up; damaging you if I recall, possibly alerting nearby monsters to ambush you.

None of that is the makings of a game, much less a "great" one. Its more akin to a torture device, like the guillotine.

I'm not sure what you want me to tell you? You obviously had an awful experience playing a game that didn't make sense to you. I can't fix that, but your awful experience doesn't make the game somehow intrinsically bad. Is it bad at teaching the player how to play? Fuck yes, it has a godawful learning curve. Is it a good game if you overcome that (admittedly large) hurdle? IMO definitely.

And the guillotine isn't a torture device, it's an execution device. Beheading someone isn't torture.
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epik_fail1 posted...

Etherealfare posted...

epik_fail1 posted...

I have been curious to play the 2nd, is it reallt THAT bad?

YES. It is REALLY stupid. Leveling spells takes literally -days-

Even in the remake?

The PSP version doesn't take that long. You can increase your stats like HP by attacking yourself too. It's easy to make yourself OP. There was one dungeon that I had trouble with because I was really underleveled. I just beat myself up for like an hour and I cleared it easy.
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The thing with spells in FF II is that most of them aren't really worth leveling up. That kinda sucks, because I really like the general idea. However the only spells you need are Cure, Life, Esuna/Basuna, buffing spells like Berserk and Haste, and perma death spells like Warp and Teleport. Osmose is really OP once you get it, but these alone break the game. Essentially you don't need high weapon levels thanks to Berserk and Haste, and Warp/Teleport will get rid of literally any tough random encounter once you get enough levels into it. Spread out on several characters, those spells aren't too bad to level up enough, but getting them to 16 will take for literal ever.

And that is FF II's biggest flaw - a cool system that has shit balance. You need to grind forever to get damaging spells that even come close to the DPS of buffed up attacks. And that's not even mentioning Ultima, which scales off of the levels of all your spells. Yikes.
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I don't get FF2. I played on gba. I spent a couple hours outside the starting town getting stats really high. Went slightly north, some ogres or something appeared and instantly dealt 3 times the damage of my (what I thought was) high max health.

And I didn't save once. How fucking much was I supposed to grind st the start?
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Spidey5 posted...

I don't get FF2. I played on gba. I spent a couple hours outside the starting town getting stats really high. Went slightly north, some ogres or something appeared and instantly dealt 3 times the damage of my (what I thought was) high max health.

And I didn't save once. How fucking much was I supposed to grind st the start?

Not that much. You faced difficult mobs because you went the wrong way. FF II is almost completely open - except that if you go the wrong way you'll be severely underleveled and killed.
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scar the 1 posted...

The thing with spells in FF II is that most of them aren't really worth leveling up. That kinda sucks, because I really like the general idea. However the only spells you need are Cure, Life, Esuna/Basuna, buffing spells like Berserk and Haste, and perma death spells like Warp and Teleport. Osmose is really OP once you get it, but these alone break the game. Essentially you don't need high weapon levels thanks to Berserk and Haste, and Warp/Teleport will get rid of literally any tough random encounter once you get enough levels into it. Spread out on several characters, those spells aren't too bad to level up enough, but getting them to 16 will take for literal ever.

And that is FF II's biggest flaw - a cool system that has shit balance. You need to grind forever to get damaging spells that even come close to the DPS of buffed up attacks. And that's not even mentioning Ultima, which scales off of the levels of all your spells. Yikes.

That was how I felt about FFVI. I was so bored playing that game that I just casted X-Zone and Vanish on every boss to kill them and rush through the game.
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Holy_Cloud105 posted...

That was how I felt about FFVI. I was so bored playing that game that I just casted X-Zone and Vanish on every boss to kill them and rush through the game.

To be fair, many of the FF titles have systems that are easily broken in some manner. FF VIII is another outstanding example; a couple of hours' worth of card playing and learning the right GF abilities will net you end-game gear, stats and spells.
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scar the 1 posted...

Spidey5 posted...

I don't get FF2. I played on gba. I spent a couple hours outside the starting town getting stats really high. Went slightly north, some ogres or something appeared and instantly dealt 3 times the damage of my (what I thought was) high max health.

And I didn't save once. How fucking much was I supposed to grind st the start?

Not that much. You faced difficult mobs because you went the wrong way. FF II is almost completely open - except that if you go the wrong way you'll be severely underleveled and killed.

As it was from the starting town, I specifically remember there being only 1 way to go. And that was north.
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Spidey5 posted...

scar the 1 posted...

Spidey5 posted...

I don't get FF2. I played on gba. I spent a couple hours outside the starting town getting stats really high. Went slightly north, some ogres or something appeared and instantly dealt 3 times the damage of my (what I thought was) high max health.

And I didn't save once. How fucking much was I supposed to grind st the start?

Not that much. You faced difficult mobs because you went the wrong way. FF II is almost completely open - except that if you go the wrong way you'll be severely underleveled and killed.

As it was from the starting town, I specifically remember there being only 1 way to go. And that was north.

You're not supposed to go very far north, though. You went too far if you faced those mobs. Heck, IIRC some villagers even warn you not to go too far. If you go even to the south coast quite close to the starting town, you'll face strong enemies.
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Big Rigs is better than Final Fantasy 2
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scar the 1 posted...

I'm not sure what you want me to tell you?

How to level sword skills and strength without putting axes on my forehead. I mean I probably put it on my arm for strength but what do I do to level my sword mastery? Use magic? That looks pretty complicated to learn too...

What's the point of fighting if Diplomacy gives you "exp" too? Assuming you can get it to work...
How to replace my broken weapons when the monsters don't drop money?

How to open chests without them blowing up in my face? Obviously you win at the slots, which are rigged in your favor if you have more levels of Lockpicking but how are you supposed to learn that or open chests in chapter one without it?

How to keep my HP? is that even a thing? Are you supposed to have 0?

I've tried to play the "game" on no less than three occasions because I thought the third time might be the charm. For about two hours at a time (total of >6), mostly the pirate chick who I hear is one of the easiest?

scar the 1 posted...

And the guillotine isn't a torture device, it's an execution device. Beheading someone isn't torture.

That was my point, U.Saga is as much of a game as a guillotine is a torture device.
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scar the 1 posted...

I'm not sure what you want me to tell you? You obviously had an awful experience playing a game that didn't make sense to you. I can't fix that, but your awful experience doesn't make the game somehow intrinsically bad.

Square Enix literally apologized for the game and even the Japanese hated it.

I'm not sure what you're trying to prove by suggesting the game has any kind of redeemable features.
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2 is only bad because you can abuse the fuck out of the leveling system.

also, UNLIMITED Saga was great after you spent a while trying to figure out how it all works.
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DoomSwell posted...

How to level sword skills and strength without putting axes on my forehead. I mean I probably put it on my arm for strength but what do I do to level my sword mastery? Use magic? That looks pretty complicated to learn too...

What's the point of fighting if Diplomacy gives you "exp" too? Assuming you can get it to work...
How to replace my broken weapons when the monsters don't drop money?

How to open chests without them blowing up in my face? Obviously you win at the slots, which are rigged in your favor if you have more levels of Lockpicking but how are you supposed to learn that or open chests in chapter one without it?

How to keep my HP? is that even a thing? Are you supposed to have 0?

I've tried to play the "game" on no less than three occasions because I thought the third time might be the charm. For about two hours at a time (total of >6), mostly the pirate chick who I hear is one of the easiest?

For mastery, using a sword will make you more likely to get sword mastery. But there's a lot of chance involved.
Fighting can help you spark techs, make you more likely to get certain panels, level up your magic tablets, etc. Quite good.
About opening chests, you answered your own question. Sometimes you have to weigh the pros and cons. Can you afford to risk damage here? Etc.
With HP, you can actually rest for a turn on missions. You'll regain HP but some aggressive monsters might hunt you down. And some missions have turn limits, remember? There are also spells that heal you.
Oh and about money, you get it from loot.

You might not like this, but I recommend watching this really long tutorial. If you're interested in actually trying the game again, of course. It will answer your questions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1brcx4bDoFY&list=PL4F21C2CF117D81A7
That guy also has a huge let's play on the same game.

DoomSwell posted...

That was my point, U.Saga is as much of a game as a guillotine is a torture device.

Lol, that wasn't the point you made but sure.
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ChromaticAngel posted...

Square Enix literally apologized for the game and even the Japanese hated it.

I'm not sure what you're trying to prove by suggesting the game has any kind of redeemable features.

I'd like to see that apology. Not because I don't believe you, but I'd like to see it anyway. And like I've said, the game does have huge issues with accessibility. Its learning curve is similar to something like Dwarf Fortress. I'm not sure what you're trying to prove by suggesting that there's such a thing as an objectively wrong opinion on how good a game is.
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Superman 64 is better than Final Fantasy 2
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scar the 1 posted...

Spidey5 posted...

scar the 1 posted...

Spidey5 posted...

I don't get FF2. I played on gba. I spent a couple hours outside the starting town getting stats really high. Went slightly north, some ogres or something appeared and instantly dealt 3 times the damage of my (what I thought was) high max health.

And I didn't save once. How fucking much was I supposed to grind st the start?

Not that much. You faced difficult mobs because you went the wrong way. FF II is almost completely open - except that if you go the wrong way you'll be severely underleveled and killed.

As it was from the starting town, I specifically remember there being only 1 way to go. And that was north.

You're not supposed to go very far north, though. You went too far if you faced those mobs. Heck, IIRC some villagers even warn you not to go too far. If you go even to the south coast quite close to the starting town, you'll face strong enemies.

I don't know what part of "there is no other direction for me to go" You aren't understanding. There was nothing to progress the game in any way other than going that direction. Then I hit a wall of mobs that are 4 times more powerful than me and the game essentially comes to an end.
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FF2 is easily the worst mainline Final Fantasy title
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@scar_the_1 thank you for providing a reasonable defense of Unlimited SaGa, too many people don't have the patience and write it off after an hour. It's not my favorite in the series but I still really enjoyed it a fair bit and it has the usual incredible world building SaGa is known for.
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Spidey5 posted...

I don't know what part of "there is no other direction for me to go" You aren't understanding. There was nothing to progress the game in any way other than going that direction. Then I hit a wall of mobs that are 4 times more powerful than me and the game essentially comes to an end.

I literally played this part three days ago. Do you want me to record a playing session showing you what to do? I've played the game tons of time, and only the first time did I make the mistake you made. Even that was because I ignored the instructions given to me by everyone; "Go north to Fynn and talk to the rebels there". I'm half certain some villagers even explicitly tell you to stay close to the lake as you round it. The game doesn't force you into those encounters, if you had them you went the wrong way.
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