Current Events > If you knew your child would be born transgender, but there was a pre-natal cure

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LinksLiege 07/17/17 11:55:29 PM #51:	hockeybub89 posted... If we had the technology to read fetal minds, then a lot less trans people would probably be dysphoric since they could be supported from day 1, not to mention society is continually growing accepting of people. Ok? I fail to see the point of this, as it's entirely different from the TC's hypothetical. Not to mention, even if there's support from day 1, they still have a bunch of issues to handle, some only once, some lifetime commitments. What if your trans kid comes up to you when they're older and asks you, "Why did you choose to make me have to deal with all of this if you could've stopped it?" Even if society is 100% accepting of trans people (which it should be regardless), that's not the point. The point is keeping my child from dealing with problems that I could stop. --- This is LinksLiege's signature. It is fantastic. <cite>LinksLiege posted [p:883117482] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>If we had the technology to read fetal minds, then a lot less trans people would probably be dysphoric since they could be supported from day 1, not to mention society is continually growing accepting of people.</quote> Ok? I fail to see the point of this, as it's entirely different from the TC's hypothetical. Not to mention, even if there's support from day 1, they still have a bunch of issues to handle, some only once, some lifetime commitments. What if your trans kid comes up to you when they're older and asks you, "Why did you choose to make me have to deal with all of this if you could've stopped it?" Even if society is 100% accepting of trans people (which it should be regardless), that's not the point. The point is keeping my child from dealing with problems that I could stop.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MangaFan462 07/17/17 11:58:07 PM #52:	Yes --- Posted using GameFlux https://i.imgur.com/Il34cSX.jpg / https://i.redd.it/zwfbqetu2b8y.jpg <cite>MangaFan462 posted [p:883117613] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Yes</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 12:04:48 AM #53:	Monday posted... hockeybub89 posted... Monday posted... I can't imagine any trans people who'd be against this. Transgenderism is a mental illness. You're talking about being able to cure it right out of the gate. It's lunacy to be against such an idea. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not. This is one of those things where you're just being nitpicky. But then again, your reputation speaks for itself, yeah? It's not nitpicky. Gay people used to have a lot more mental problems than they do now. We thought they had a mental illness. We tried to cure them in various ways. I think support goes a long way and I cannot get behind generic engineering to prevent social issues. I can empathize with a parent wanting it on an individual level, but I can't help but think long-term, big picture and there is just way too much room for abuse of such sci-fi power. "If people don't like a thing, just edit it out of the gene pool so they can't discriminate against anyone over it." --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883117916] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>Monday posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Monday posted...</cite> <quote>I can't imagine any trans people who'd be against this. Transgenderism is a mental illness. You're talking about being able to cure it right out of the gate. It's lunacy to be against such an idea.</quote> Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not.</quote> This is one of those things where you're just being nitpicky. But then again, your reputation speaks for itself, yeah?</quote> It's not nitpicky. Gay people used to have a lot more mental problems than they do now. We thought they had a mental illness. We tried to cure them in various ways. I think support goes a long way and I cannot get behind generic engineering to prevent social issues. I can empathize with a parent wanting it on an individual level, but I can't help but think long-term, big picture and there is just way too much room for abuse of such sci-fi power. "If people don't like a thing, just edit it out of the gene pool so they can't discriminate against anyone over it."</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/18/17 12:05:57 AM #54:	hockeybub89 posted... Monday posted... hockeybub89 posted... Monday posted... I can't imagine any trans people who'd be against this. Transgenderism is a mental illness. You're talking about being able to cure it right out of the gate. It's lunacy to be against such an idea. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not. This is one of those things where you're just being nitpicky. But then again, your reputation speaks for itself, yeah? It's not nitpicky. Gay people used to have a lot more mental problems than they do now. We thought they had a mental illness. We tried to cure them in various ways. I think support goes a long way and I cannot get behind generic engineering to prevent social issues. I can empathize with a parent wanting it on an individual level, but I can't help but think long-term, big picture and there is just way too much room for abuse of such sci-fi power. "If people don't like a thing, just edit it out of the gene pool so they can't discriminate against anyone over it." so you would literally let a kid be born with a disease/illness/disorder even if you could prevent it got it <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883117981] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Monday posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Monday posted...</cite> <quote>I can't imagine any trans people who'd be against this. Transgenderism is a mental illness. You're talking about being able to cure it right out of the gate. It's lunacy to be against such an idea.</quote> Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not.</quote> This is one of those things where you're just being nitpicky. But then again, your reputation speaks for itself, yeah?</quote> It's not nitpicky. Gay people used to have a lot more mental problems than they do now. We thought they had a mental illness. We tried to cure them in various ways. I think support goes a long way and I cannot get behind generic engineering to prevent social issues. I can empathize with a parent wanting it on an individual level, but I can't help but think long-term, big picture and there is just way too much room for abuse of such sci-fi power. "If people don't like a thing, just edit it out of the gene pool so they can't discriminate against anyone over it."</quote> so you would literally let a kid be born with a disease/illness/disorder even if you could prevent it got it</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
#55	Post #55 was unavailable or deleted.
JohnLennon6 07/18/17 12:07:41 AM #56:	I see the regulars are melting down as expected. --- He has good daygame - MasterOfMissions <cite>JohnLennon6 posted [p:883118048] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>I see the regulars are melting down as expected.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Xelltrix 07/18/17 12:09:27 AM #57:	Um, yeah. Why wouldn't I do that instead of making them go through the surgery and turmoil? --- Reading this post may induce one or more of the following: Nausea / Butt-Hurt / Lulz / UM? Syndrome / Angst / Diarrhea <cite>Xelltrix posted [p:883118118] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Um, yeah. Why wouldn't I do that instead of making them go through the surgery and turmoil?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 12:09:32 AM #58:	Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... Monday posted... hockeybub89 posted... Monday posted... I can't imagine any trans people who'd be against this. Transgenderism is a mental illness. You're talking about being able to cure it right out of the gate. It's lunacy to be against such an idea. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not. This is one of those things where you're just being nitpicky. But then again, your reputation speaks for itself, yeah? It's not nitpicky. Gay people used to have a lot more mental problems than they do now. We thought they had a mental illness. We tried to cure them in various ways. I think support goes a long way and I cannot get behind generic engineering to prevent social issues. I can empathize with a parent wanting it on an individual level, but I can't help but think long-term, big picture and there is just way too much room for abuse of such sci-fi power. "If people don't like a thing, just edit it out of the gene pool so they can't discriminate against anyone over it." so you would literally let a kid be born with a disease/illness/disorder even if you could prevent it got it In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse of such technology. --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883118123] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Monday posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Monday posted...</cite> <quote>I can't imagine any trans people who'd be against this. Transgenderism is a mental illness. You're talking about being able to cure it right out of the gate. It's lunacy to be against such an idea.</quote> Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not.</quote> This is one of those things where you're just being nitpicky. But then again, your reputation speaks for itself, yeah?</quote> It's not nitpicky. Gay people used to have a lot more mental problems than they do now. We thought they had a mental illness. We tried to cure them in various ways. I think support goes a long way and I cannot get behind generic engineering to prevent social issues. I can empathize with a parent wanting it on an individual level, but I can't help but think long-term, big picture and there is just way too much room for abuse of such sci-fi power. "If people don't like a thing, just edit it out of the gene pool so they can't discriminate against anyone over it."</quote> so you would literally let a kid be born with a disease/illness/disorder even if you could prevent it got it</quote> In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse of such technology.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/18/17 12:10:14 AM #59:	hockeybub89 posted... In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883118159] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. </quote> time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Dragonblade01 07/18/17 12:10:43 AM #60:	Yes. --- PSN: kazukifafner <cite>Dragonblade01 posted [p:883118189] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Yes.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 12:12:30 AM #61:	Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? I made a fine post in an Admiral topic of all places and you need to derail shit. Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago. --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883118257] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. </quote> time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people</quote> That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? I made a fine post in an Admiral topic of all places and you need to derail shit. Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/18/17 12:13:36 AM #62:	hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago. im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883118307] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. </quote> time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people</quote> That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago.</quote> im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mal_Fet 07/18/17 12:14:42 AM #63:	Transgenders have something like a 40% suicide rate, with or without GRS. Not worth it. --- Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear. -George Orwell <cite>Mal_Fet posted [p:883118355] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Transgenders have something like a 40% suicide rate, with or without GRS. Not worth it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Tryhaptaward 07/18/17 12:15:07 AM #64:	Obviously, what kind of shit person would want their child to be born feeling the opposite gender? <cite>Tryhaptaward posted [p:883118369] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Obviously, what kind of shit person would want their child to be born feeling the opposite gender?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 12:18:09 AM #65:	Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago. im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh I have taken your honesty under advisement and decided to not give a shit. I say "I think eugenics is wrong" and you go "Oh you would literally ban medicine because Nazis and let children suffer?" Come on, bruh. Have you completely stopped pretending to be intelligent? --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883118515] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. </quote> time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people</quote> That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago.</quote> im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh</quote> I have taken your honesty under advisement and decided to not give a shit. I say "I think eugenics is wrong" and you go "Oh you would literally ban medicine because Nazis and let children suffer?" Come on, bruh. Have you completely stopped pretending to be intelligent?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Glass_Phantom 07/18/17 12:18:13 AM #66:	hockeybub89 posted... Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not. Gender dysphoria and transsexualism are much the same, and neither one is a mental illness. (They were declassified as a mental disorder in the DSM-5.) The evidence shows gender dysphoria likely has a physical-neurological basis, caused by genetics or exposure to certain hormones around conception. It isn't something which can be treated or "cured." <cite>Glass_Phantom posted [p:883118517] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not.</quote> Gender dysphoria and transsexualism are much the same, and neither one is a mental illness. (They were declassified as a mental disorder in the DSM-5.) The evidence shows gender dysphoria likely has a physical-neurological basis, caused by genetics or exposure to certain hormones around conception. It isn't something which can be treated or "cured."</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
cerealbox760 07/18/17 12:19:26 AM #67:	No. God intended for them to be that way. Its only logical to follow gods will. You people need stop playing gods will. Its a sin. ....kidding. The world isn't ready transgenders. Too many hateful people that dont want to be peaceful with transgenders. --- Clevo P775 QHD 120hz / i7 7700k 4.5GHZ / GTX 1070 8GB / DDR4 16GB/ 256gb m.2 SSD /Magni-Modi DAC_AMP combo/ ie800. Laptop on the outside. Desktop on the inside. <cite>cerealbox760 posted [p:883118568] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>No. God intended for them to be that way. Its only logical to follow gods will. You people need stop playing gods will. Its a sin. ....kidding. The world isn't ready transgenders. Too many hateful people that dont want to be peaceful with transgenders.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/18/17 12:20:06 AM #68:	hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago. im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh I have taken your honesty under advisement and decided to not give a shit. I say "I think eugenics is wrong" and you go "Oh you would literally ban medicine because Nazis and let children suffer?" Come on, bruh. Have you completely stopped pretending to be intelligent? > asks if someone else stopped pretending to be intelligent > thinks that a slippery slope about eugenics somehow invalidates the premise in the OP and would literally prohibit curing prenatal diseases <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883118597] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. </quote> time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people</quote> That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago.</quote> im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh</quote> I have taken your honesty under advisement and decided to not give a shit. I say "I think eugenics is wrong" and you go "Oh you would literally ban medicine because Nazis and let children suffer?" Come on, bruh. Have you completely stopped pretending to be intelligent?</quote> > asks if someone else stopped pretending to be intelligent > thinks that a slippery slope about eugenics somehow invalidates the premise in the OP and would literally prohibit curing prenatal diseases</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 12:21:21 AM #69:	Glass_Phantom posted... hockeybub89 posted... Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not. Gender dysphoria and transsexualism are much the same, and neither one is a mental illness. (They were declassified as a mental disorder in the DSM-5.) The evidence shows gender dysphoria likely has a physical-neurological basis, caused by genetics or exposure to certain hormones around conception. It isn't something which can be treated or "cured." Thanks for clearing that up. That was another thing I was going to get to. It doesn't appear to be something that could be cured as Such, but I guess literally anything is possible with hypothetical future tech. --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883118641] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>Glass_Phantom posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being trans is not.</quote> Gender dysphoria and transsexualism are much the same, and neither one is a mental illness. (They were declassified as a mental disorder in the DSM-5.) The evidence shows gender dysphoria likely has a physical-neurological basis, caused by genetics or exposure to certain hormones around conception. It isn't something which can be treated or "cured."</quote> Thanks for clearing that up. That was another thing I was going to get to. It doesn't appear to be something that could be cured as Such, but I guess literally anything is possible with hypothetical future tech.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
lukabrosci 07/18/17 12:24:20 AM #70:	how can anyone say no? if they are transgender aren't they gonna want to become that other gender, why not just make them that gender already? <cite>lukabrosci posted [p:883118790] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>how can anyone say no? if they are transgender aren't they gonna want to become that other gender, why not just make them that gender already?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
DrizztLink 07/18/17 12:25:56 AM #71:	DrizztLink posted... It's actually a very good argument against my whole system. I believe in LGBT, etc. I believe that genetic engineering is the future. Not making your child one way or the other, curing genetic diseases like CF or Huntington's. Does that freedom to alter your child's genome extend to something like this? Essentially like insurance for medical procedures not covering cosmetic? It keeps me up at night. Fairly sure I'm like one of three open to real debate. If the other two of you are willing. --- http://guidesmedia.ign.com/guides/9846/images/slowpoke.gif <cite>DrizztLink posted [p:883118849] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>DrizztLink posted...</cite> <quote>It's actually a very good argument against my whole system. I believe in LGBT, etc. I believe that genetic engineering is the future. Not making your child one way or the other, curing genetic diseases like CF or Huntington's. Does that freedom to alter your child's genome extend to something like this? Essentially like insurance for medical procedures not covering cosmetic? It keeps me up at night.</quote> Fairly sure I'm like one of three open to real debate. If the other two of you are willing.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 12:26:57 AM #72:	Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago. im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh I have taken your honesty under advisement and decided to not give a shit. I say "I think eugenics is wrong" and you go "Oh you would literally ban medicine because Nazis and let children suffer?" Come on, bruh. Have you completely stopped pretending to be intelligent? > asks if someone else stopped pretending to be intelligent > thinks that a slippery slope about eugenics somehow invalidates the premise in the OP and would literally prohibit curing prenatal diseases Most of the people saying yes have cited society as to why they would do it. There were even a couple mentions of homosexuality too. The topics is on the slope. I do not agree with generating social harmony though genetic modification. Enough. You're making Admiral look like my best friend. --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883118893] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. </quote> time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people</quote> That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago.</quote> im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh</quote> I have taken your honesty under advisement and decided to not give a shit. I say "I think eugenics is wrong" and you go "Oh you would literally ban medicine because Nazis and let children suffer?" Come on, bruh. Have you completely stopped pretending to be intelligent?</quote> > asks if someone else stopped pretending to be intelligent > thinks that a slippery slope about eugenics somehow invalidates the premise in the OP and would literally prohibit curing prenatal diseases</quote> Most of the people saying yes have cited society as to why they would do it. There were even a couple mentions of homosexuality too. The topics is on the slope. I do not agree with generating social harmony though genetic modification. Enough. You're making Admiral look like my best friend.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Xelltrix 07/18/17 12:29:01 AM #73:	Uh, society? Nah, more like the kid themselves and not wanting them to deal with feeling like they have the wrong body... how is it kinder forcing them to deal with having the wrong body until they're old enough to get surgery? And said surgery won't ever be as good as just having the right body from the get go. --- Reading this post may induce one or more of the following: Nausea / Butt-Hurt / Lulz / UM? Syndrome / Angst / Diarrhea <cite>Xelltrix posted [p:883118974] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Uh, society? Nah, more like the kid themselves and not wanting them to deal with feeling like they have the wrong body... how is it kinder forcing them to deal with having the wrong body until they're old enough to get surgery? And said surgery won't ever be as good as just having the right body from the get go.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Capn Circus 07/18/17 12:31:43 AM #74:	Lol @ the 7 people who voted for their child to go through life questioning themselves, undergoing hormone therapy and surgery. --- "I think that man will be president right about the time when spaceships come down filled with dinosaurs in red capes" - Tom Hanks <cite>Capn Circus posted [p:883119103] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Lol @ the 7 people who voted for their child to go through life questioning themselves, undergoing hormone therapy and surgery.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Glass_Phantom 07/18/17 12:33:59 AM #75:	To the topic, it's a really difficult question for me on moral and religious grounds, to say nothing of the ethicality of eugenics. (One of the thing that most concerns me about the future is the idea that genetic engineering will one day allow wealthy people to create designer babies, with DNA tailored to make them smarter, stronger, and superior to normal children, leading to enormous socioeconomic disparity. This question dances on the edge of that.) I suppose I would need more information. What would the cure be? Would it be re-configuring the child's neurons, or switching its physical gender to correspond with its neurological gender in the womb? It's hard to know what's right here, what's moral. I think in the end, I would probably do it. I wish our society were kinder towards transsexuals, and our surgical abilities better able to give them the bodies they were meant to have. If that pain could be avoided, I might do it for my child. <cite>Glass_Phantom posted [p:883119211] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>To the topic, it's a really difficult question for me on moral and religious grounds, to say nothing of the ethicality of eugenics. (One of the thing that most concerns me about the future is the idea that genetic engineering will one day allow wealthy people to create designer babies, with DNA tailored to make them smarter, stronger, and superior to normal children, leading to enormous socioeconomic disparity. This question dances on the edge of that.) I suppose I would need more information. What would the cure be? Would it be re-configuring the child's neurons, or switching its physical gender to correspond with its neurological gender in the womb? It's hard to know what's right here, what's moral. I think in the end, I would probably do it. I wish our society were kinder towards transsexuals, and our surgical abilities better able to give them the bodies they were meant to have. If that pain could be avoided, I might do it for my child.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Xelltrix 07/18/17 12:36:00 AM #76:	I mean, how is it any worse than prenatal surgeries or medications if we're curing a problem? This isn't some "make your child smarter or stronger" thing. --- Reading this post may induce one or more of the following: Nausea / Butt-Hurt / Lulz / UM? Syndrome / Angst / Diarrhea <cite>Xelltrix posted [p:883119294] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>I mean, how is it any worse than prenatal surgeries or medications if we're curing a problem? This isn't some "make your child smarter or stronger" thing.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 12:36:54 AM #77:	DrizztLink posted... DrizztLink posted... It's actually a very good argument against my whole system. I believe in LGBT, etc. I believe that genetic engineering is the future. Not making your child one way or the other, curing genetic diseases like CF or Huntington's. Does that freedom to alter your child's genome extend to something like this? Essentially like insurance for medical procedures not covering cosmetic? It keeps me up at night. Fairly sure I'm like one of three open to real debate. If the other two of you are willing. I don't know if I'm one, but I think Admiral brought up a great moral quandary here. Genetic engineering will be a hot topic for years to come and will hardly be as cut and dry as my troll sidekick wants to make it. It has kept me up at night as well. --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883119334] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>DrizztLink posted...</cite> <quote><cite>DrizztLink posted...</cite> <quote>It's actually a very good argument against my whole system. I believe in LGBT, etc. I believe that genetic engineering is the future. Not making your child one way or the other, curing genetic diseases like CF or Huntington's. Does that freedom to alter your child's genome extend to something like this? Essentially like insurance for medical procedures not covering cosmetic? It keeps me up at night.</quote> Fairly sure I'm like one of three open to real debate. If the other two of you are willing.</quote> I don't know if I'm one, but I think Admiral brought up a great moral quandary here. Genetic engineering will be a hot topic for years to come and will hardly be as cut and dry as my troll sidekick wants to make it. It has kept me up at night as well.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Vicious_Dios 07/18/17 12:38:13 AM #78:	I'm proud of these results. Good job, Current Events. However... --- S / K / Y / N / E Twitch/YouTube/GT: *Adzeta* <cite>Vicious_Dios posted [p:883119388] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>I'm proud of these results. Good job, Current Events. However...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
_Near_ 07/18/17 12:41:38 AM #79:	Glass_Phantom posted... leading to enormous socioeconomic disparity. This question dances on the edge of that Well, if people are smart, they would have regulations to keep everyone within the same range. But with the capitalist system (especially with healthcare), the 1% will have super-babies, while the working class dies to curable genetic diseases. --- http://i.imgur.com/QoIYepz.gif Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you. <cite>_Near_ posted [p:883119539] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>Glass_Phantom posted...</cite> <quote> leading to enormous socioeconomic disparity. This question dances on the edge of that</quote> Well, if people are smart, they would have regulations to keep everyone within the same range. But with the capitalist system (especially with healthcare), the 1% will have super-babies, while the working class dies to curable genetic diseases.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Glass_Phantom 07/18/17 12:42:20 AM #80:	_Near_ posted... Well, if people are smart, they would have regulations to keep everyone within the same range. But with the capitalist system (especially with healthcare), the 1% will have super-babies, while the working class dies to curable genetic diseases. Well, that is where we are headed. Expect it in 25 to 30 years. <cite>Glass_Phantom posted [p:883119571] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>_Near_ posted...</cite> <quote>Well, if people are smart, they would have regulations to keep everyone within the same range. But with the capitalist system (especially with healthcare), the 1% will have super-babies, while the working class dies to curable genetic diseases.</quote> Well, that is where we are headed. Expect it in 25 to 30 years.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/18/17 12:59:07 AM #81:	you guys are hilarious did the rich develop and keep smart phones for themselves? what about automobiles or antibiotics or other medicines? no. we don't live in that kind of society. no medical breakthroughs can happen in isolation. once upon a time, sequencing the human genome was so expensive that only the rich could afford it. but now it's affordable for pretty much anyone. the same will be true of all upcoming technological and medical breakthroughs. the trend is that technology gets cheaper and more powerful over time, and all medical breakthroughs will rely on cheap technology. everyone will benefit, not just some rich bogeymen the way you've envisioned. shelve your narrative before you become consumed by childish thoughts. <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883120270] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>you guys are hilarious did the rich develop and keep smart phones for themselves? what about automobiles or antibiotics or other medicines? no. we don't live in that kind of society. no medical breakthroughs can happen in isolation. once upon a time, sequencing the human genome was so expensive that only the rich could afford it. but now it's affordable for pretty much anyone. the same will be true of all upcoming technological and medical breakthroughs. the trend is that technology gets cheaper and more powerful over time, and all medical breakthroughs will rely on cheap technology. everyone will benefit, not just some rich bogeymen the way you've envisioned. shelve your narrative before you become consumed by childish thoughts.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
GiftedACIII 07/18/17 1:23:52 AM #82:	hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... hockeybub89 posted... In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago. im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh I have taken your honesty under advisement and decided to not give a shit. I say "I think eugenics is wrong" and you go "Oh you would literally ban medicine because Nazis and let children suffer?" Come on, bruh. Have you completely stopped pretending to be intelligent? > asks if someone else stopped pretending to be intelligent > thinks that a slippery slope about eugenics somehow invalidates the premise in the OP and would literally prohibit curing prenatal diseases Most of the people saying yes have cited society as to why they would do it. There were even a couple mentions of homosexuality too. The topics is on the slope. I do not agree with generating social harmony though genetic modification. Enough. You're making Admiral look like my best friend. No, you are just completely in the wrong, like you often are. If you could make the body and brain match to begin with, why would you not? There are tons and tons of other problems that surround trans people besides societal acceptance like hormones, puberty, the dysphoria of even looking at their genitals etc. so why would you make things harder for them because of some stupid slippery slope? It's very likely if your child learns that you prevented the hypothetical fix from getting applied because of you selfishly only thinking of your own ideals they would rightfully consider you a shitty parent. Why have to make them suffer through all of that after they're born when you could make them have a much happier life by doing something before their birth? You just sound exactly like an anti-vaxxer here. --- </topic> <cite>GiftedACIII posted [p:883121211] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote>In this hypothetical, yes. Too much room for abuse. </quote> time to ban medicine and surgery because of the abuse by the nazis and other terrible people</quote> That sounds ridiculous. Why are you strawmanning? Seriously. Who are you? 6 year old account, but I have never seen you before a few days ago.</quote> im the fucking Proudclad and your paranoia about prenatal cures is the only thing that sounds ridiculous tbqh</quote> I have taken your honesty under advisement and decided to not give a shit. I say "I think eugenics is wrong" and you go "Oh you would literally ban medicine because Nazis and let children suffer?" Come on, bruh. Have you completely stopped pretending to be intelligent?</quote> > asks if someone else stopped pretending to be intelligent > thinks that a slippery slope about eugenics somehow invalidates the premise in the OP and would literally prohibit curing prenatal diseases</quote> Most of the people saying yes have cited society as to why they would do it. There were even a couple mentions of homosexuality too. The topics is on the slope. I do not agree with generating social harmony though genetic modification. Enough. You're making Admiral look like my best friend.</quote> No, you are just completely in the wrong, like you often are. If you could make the body and brain match to begin with, why would you not? There are tons and tons of other problems that surround trans people besides societal acceptance like hormones, puberty, the dysphoria of even looking at their genitals etc. so why would you make things harder for them because of some stupid slippery slope? It's very likely if your child learns that you prevented the hypothetical fix from getting applied because of you selfishly only thinking of your own ideals they would rightfully consider you a shitty parent. Why have to make them suffer through all of that after they're born when you could make them have a much happier life by doing something before their birth? You just sound exactly like an anti-vaxxer here.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 1:37:00 AM #83:	Transcendentia posted... you guys are hilarious did the rich develop and keep smart phones for themselves? what about automobiles or antibiotics or other medicines? no. we don't live in that kind of society. no medical breakthroughs can happen in isolation. once upon a time, sequencing the human genome was so expensive that only the rich could afford it. but now it's affordable for pretty much anyone. the same will be true of all upcoming technological and medical breakthroughs. the trend is that technology gets cheaper and more powerful over time, and all medical breakthroughs will rely on cheap technology. everyone will benefit, not just some rich bogeymen the way you've envisioned. shelve your narrative before you become consumed by childish thoughts. I'm sorry I thought we lived in America where millions can't afford their healthcare. It's not about the rich keeping it to themselves, but the rich being able to afford it better. I for one do not think medical treatments should be like buying luxury cars. --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883121713] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote>you guys are hilarious did the rich develop and keep smart phones for themselves? what about automobiles or antibiotics or other medicines? no. we don't live in that kind of society. no medical breakthroughs can happen in isolation. once upon a time, sequencing the human genome was so expensive that only the rich could afford it. but now it's affordable for pretty much anyone. the same will be true of all upcoming technological and medical breakthroughs. the trend is that technology gets cheaper and more powerful over time, and all medical breakthroughs will rely on cheap technology. everyone will benefit, not just some rich bogeymen the way you've envisioned. shelve your narrative before you become consumed by childish thoughts.</quote> I'm sorry I thought we lived in America where millions can't afford their healthcare. It's not about the rich keeping it to themselves, but the rich being able to afford it better. I for one do not think medical treatments should be like buying luxury cars.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
JohnLennon6 07/18/17 1:41:31 AM #84:	JohnLennon6 posted... I see the regulars are melting down as expected. --- He has good daygame - MasterOfMissions <cite>JohnLennon6 posted [p:883121861] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote>I see the regulars are melting down as expected.</quote></quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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hockeybub89 07/18/17 1:49:48 AM #86:	I am not completely wrong. I have an opinion on an impossible hypothetical based on what is going to be a highly debatable hot topic and Proud decided to derail it with shitposting. I also don't know if selfish is the right word when my argument was big picture. It's not like I said I would never treat my children for problems because I am so edgy that I would let them die just to be different. Just that I think there are huge ethical questions to this specific type of treatment, and that is one thing that is very true. We will be talking about genetic engineering for a long time, so it is disingenuous to compare it to something as patently wrong as anti-vaxxing and assert that I enjoy children suffering. --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883122140] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>I am not completely wrong. I have an opinion on an impossible hypothetical based on what is going to be a highly debatable hot topic and Proud decided to derail it with shitposting. I also don't know if selfish is the right word when my argument was big picture. It's not like I said I would never treat my children for problems because I am so edgy that I would let them die just to be different. Just that I think there are huge ethical questions to this specific type of treatment, and that is one thing that is very true. We will be talking about genetic engineering for a long time, so it is disingenuous to compare it to something as patently wrong as anti-vaxxing and assert that I enjoy children suffering.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
hockeybub89 07/18/17 1:54:50 AM #87:	ArmieBuff posted... hockeybub89 posted... Transcendentia posted... you guys are hilarious did the rich develop and keep smart phones for themselves? what about automobiles or antibiotics or other medicines? no. we don't live in that kind of society. no medical breakthroughs can happen in isolation. once upon a time, sequencing the human genome was so expensive that only the rich could afford it. but now it's affordable for pretty much anyone. the same will be true of all upcoming technological and medical breakthroughs. the trend is that technology gets cheaper and more powerful over time, and all medical breakthroughs will rely on cheap technology. everyone will benefit, not just some rich bogeymen the way you've envisioned. shelve your narrative before you become consumed by childish thoughts. I'm sorry I thought we lived in America where millions can't afford their healthcare. It's not about the rich keeping it to themselves, but the rich being able to afford it better. I for one do not think medical treatments should be like buying luxury cars. When people put their political beliefs over making their children happy. I believe my implication here was that America treats healthcare in a way that won't necessarily make my children or millions of other children happy. That would be one of many concerns that will be argued over as genetic engineering develops and the healthcare debate rages on. Or we could just go "You would let your children DIE, you liberal monster?" --- http://card.psnprofiles.com/1/NIR_Hockey.png http://www.last.fm/user/hockeybub89/ <cite>hockeybub89 posted [p:883122298] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>ArmieBuff posted...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote>you guys are hilarious did the rich develop and keep smart phones for themselves? what about automobiles or antibiotics or other medicines? no. we don't live in that kind of society. no medical breakthroughs can happen in isolation. once upon a time, sequencing the human genome was so expensive that only the rich could afford it. but now it's affordable for pretty much anyone. the same will be true of all upcoming technological and medical breakthroughs. the trend is that technology gets cheaper and more powerful over time, and all medical breakthroughs will rely on cheap technology. everyone will benefit, not just some rich bogeymen the way you've envisioned. shelve your narrative before you become consumed by childish thoughts.</quote> I'm sorry I thought we lived in America where millions can't afford their healthcare. It's not about the rich keeping it to themselves, but the rich being able to afford it better. I for one do not think medical treatments should be like buying luxury cars.</quote> When people put their political beliefs over making their children happy.</quote> I believe my implication here was that America treats healthcare in a way that won't necessarily make my children or millions of other children happy. That would be one of many concerns that will be argued over as genetic engineering develops and the healthcare debate rages on. Or we could just go "You would let your children DIE, you liberal monster?"</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
#88	Post #88 was unavailable or deleted.
Medz2017 07/18/17 2:15:29 AM #89:	But pre natural cures can cause down syndrome --- Hi <cite>Medz2017 posted [p:883122989] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>But pre natural cures can cause down syndrome</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
gunplagirl 07/18/17 2:17:08 AM #90:	Eugenics is wrong --- Pokemon Moon FC: 1994-2190-5020 IGN: Vanessa <cite>gunplagirl posted [p:883123036] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Eugenics is wrong</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
JohnLennon6 07/18/17 2:18:37 AM #91:	gunplagirl posted... Eugenics is wrong You don't know what that word means. --- He has good daygame - MasterOfMissions <cite>JohnLennon6 posted [p:883123094] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>gunplagirl posted...</cite> <quote>Eugenics is wrong</quote> You don't know what that word means.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
gunplagirl 07/18/17 2:20:27 AM #92:	JohnLennon6 posted... gunplagirl posted... Eugenics is wrong You don't know what that word means. Designer babies are also wrong since even if I clarify how it's eugenics you'd hand over ears it. --- Pokemon Moon FC: 1994-2190-5020 IGN: Vanessa <cite>gunplagirl posted [p:883123157] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>gunplagirl posted...</cite> <quote>Eugenics is wrong</quote> You don't know what that word means.</quote> Designer babies are also wrong since even if I clarify how it's eugenics you'd hand over ears it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
#93	Post #93 was unavailable or deleted.
JohnLennon6 07/18/17 2:25:22 AM #94:	gunplagirl posted... JohnLennon6 posted... gunplagirl posted... Eugenics is wrong You don't know what that word means. Designer babies are also wrong since even if I clarify how it's eugenics you'd hand over ears it. It's not a designer baby. --- He has good daygame - MasterOfMissions <cite>JohnLennon6 posted [p:883123317] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>gunplagirl posted...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>gunplagirl posted...</cite> <quote>Eugenics is wrong</quote> You don't know what that word means.</quote> Designer babies are also wrong since even if I clarify how it's eugenics you'd hand over ears it.</quote> It's not a designer baby.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RockRapDubstep 07/18/17 2:27:55 AM #95:	Yes, I'd have to be a terrible person to knowingly let my child have mental illness when I could've prevented it from ever happening. --- in response to how much CJayC made selling GameFAQs Rumor has it that CBS put his money on a train and he's having trouble following it - Tropicalwood <cite>RockRapDubstep posted [p:883123395] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Yes, I'd have to be a terrible person to knowingly let my child have mental illness when I could've prevented it from ever happening.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
EnragedSlith 07/18/17 2:38:58 AM #96:	Yes, I would give my child whatever genetic advantage could be afforded to them, and you'd be an idiot not to --- http://i.imgur.com/gIoselB.gif https://i.imgur.com/p8iCfHF.jpg <cite>EnragedSlith posted [p:883123695] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>Yes, I would give my child whatever genetic advantage could be afforded to them, and you'd be an idiot not to</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Lorenzo_2003 07/18/17 2:43:08 AM #97:	I'm curious if people would abort or not, instead of going the hypothetical cure route. There are people who abort based on a variety of reasons, but I've never seen it applied to the trans topic. --- ... <cite>Lorenzo_2003 posted [p:883123842] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>I'm curious if people would abort or not, instead of going the hypothetical cure route. There are people who abort based on a variety of reasons, but I've never seen it applied to the trans topic.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Dragonblade01 07/18/17 2:44:58 AM #98:	In the case of prenatal genetic modification, it's obvious that we would need to have tiered options. Things that cure medical diseases would be on a higher, more necessary tier that should be available to everyone. Essentially, they would be like vaccinations are now. The regulation of the rest is still a very interesting and tricky question, however. --- PSN: kazukifafner <cite>Dragonblade01 posted [p:883123897] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>In the case of prenatal genetic modification, it's obvious that we would need to have tiered options. Things that cure medical diseases would be on a higher, more necessary tier that should be available to everyone. Essentially, they would be like vaccinations are now. The regulation of the rest is still a very interesting and tricky question, however.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
DrizztLink 07/18/17 3:36:40 AM #99:	hockeybub89 posted... DrizztLink posted... DrizztLink posted... It's actually a very good argument against my whole system. I believe in LGBT, etc. I believe that genetic engineering is the future. Not making your child one way or the other, curing genetic diseases like CF or Huntington's. Does that freedom to alter your child's genome extend to something like this? Essentially like insurance for medical procedures not covering cosmetic? It keeps me up at night. Fairly sure I'm like one of three open to real debate. If the other two of you are willing. I don't know if I'm one, but I think Admiral brought up a great moral quandary here. Genetic engineering will be a hot topice for years to come and will hardly be as cut and dry as my troll sidekick wants to make it. It has kept me up at night as well. I'll double check. I'll also look into the lot of you who aren't carving out placements. --- http://guidesmedia.ign.com/guides/9846/images/slowpoke.gif <cite>DrizztLink posted [p:883125220] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote><cite>hockeybub89 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>DrizztLink posted...</cite> <quote><cite>DrizztLink posted...</cite> <quote>It's actually a very good argument against my whole system. I believe in LGBT, etc. I believe that genetic engineering is the future. Not making your child one way or the other, curing genetic diseases like CF or Huntington's. Does that freedom to alter your child's genome extend to something like this? Essentially like insurance for medical procedures not covering cosmetic? It keeps me up at night.</quote> Fairly sure I'm like one of three open to real debate. If the other two of you are willing.</quote> I don't know if I'm one, but I think Admiral brought up a great moral quandary here. Genetic engineering will be a hot topice for years to come and will hardly be as cut and dry as my troll sidekick wants to make it. It has kept me up at night as well.</quote> I'll double check. I'll also look into the lot of you who aren't carving out placements.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Valfalk 07/18/17 3:44:17 AM #100:	i have multiple transgender friends and they are all extremely depressed gender dysphoria is a cruel disease so yes assuming you could stop gender dysphoria pre-birth i absolutely would <cite>Valfalk posted [p:883125388] in If you kne... [t:75577103]...</cite> <quote>i have multiple transgender friends and they are all extremely depressed gender dysphoria is a cruel disease so yes assuming you could stop gender dysphoria pre-birth i absolutely would</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Current Events > If you knew your child would be born transgender, but there was a pre-natal cure (+) Yeah! (+)

Current Events > If you knew your child would be born transgender, but there was a pre-natal cure