Current Events > Is there any reason to be against Net Neutrality?

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billcom6 07/12/17 4:16:02 PM #1:	Other than working for an internet service provider and wanting more money? Like are there even any actual arguments against it? --- Because most days are bad days... --- Steam and XBOX Live: billcom6 My Teams: The Ohio State Buckeyes, New York Yankees, Buffalo Bills, The CBJ, Cavs <cite>billcom6 posted [p:882793407] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>Other than working for an internet service provider and wanting more money? Like are there even any actual arguments against it?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ShinyMasamuneZ 07/12/17 4:17:19 PM #2:	Free market woooooooo! Options are good! Not having net neutrality is racist and anti-poor because it's just a one-size fits-all-solution. --- Currently Playing: Breath of the Wild Recently Finished: Final Fantasy XV, Dark Cloud, Specter Knight <cite>ShinyMasamuneZ posted [p:882793480] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>Free market woooooooo! Options are good! Not having net neutrality is racist and anti-poor because it's just a one-size fits-all-solution.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Anarchy_Juiblex 07/12/17 4:17:50 PM #3:	Uhhh. A stupidly principled stance on freedom. --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:882793505] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>Uhhh. A stupidly principled stance on freedom.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mikablu 07/12/17 4:18:29 PM #4:	Not really. <cite>Mikablu posted [p:882793542] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>Not really.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
BLAKUboy 07/12/17 4:18:49 PM #5:	billcom6 posted... Other than working for an internet service provider and wanting more money? Like are there even any actual arguments against it? You named the only possible argument against it. --- Aeris dies if she takes more damage than her current HP - Panthera http://signavatar.com/26999_s.png <cite>BLAKUboy posted [p:882793565] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>billcom6 posted...</cite> <quote>Other than working for an internet service provider and wanting more money? Like are there even any actual arguments against it?</quote> You named the only possible argument against it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Lightsasori 07/12/17 4:22:16 PM #6:	Honestly, the only thing I hear from "libertarians" is that they don't trust the government enough to give them this much power over the internet. But it's such a stupid argument that I honestly think a lot of people against Net Neutrality only have that position because they're Trump supporters. --- "Yare yare daze" ~ Jotaro Kujo "Children are pure, they know who's the strongest." ~ MaskDeSmith <cite>Lightsasori posted [p:882793770] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>Honestly, the only thing I hear from "libertarians" is that they don't trust the government enough to give them this much power over the internet. But it's such a stupid argument that I honestly think a lot of people against Net Neutrality only have that position because they're Trump supporters.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ChromaticAngel 07/12/17 4:24:03 PM #7:	ShinyMasamuneZ posted... Free market woooooooo! Options are good! Not having net neutrality is racist and anti-poor because it's just a one-size fits-all-solution. "free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition. like I imagine one day internet competition was so fierce we just wouldn't need net neutrality laws--that providers would voluntarily do it on their own because it would be the only way to stay competitive and not lose customers by the millions. but we are not there yet. --- https://puu.sh/tcLsT/24f4611235.png <cite>ChromaticAngel posted [p:882793895] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>ShinyMasamuneZ posted...</cite> <quote>Free market woooooooo! Options are good! Not having net neutrality is racist and anti-poor because it's just a one-size fits-all-solution.</quote> "free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition. like I imagine one day internet competition was so fierce we just wouldn't need net neutrality laws--that providers would voluntarily do it on their own because it would be the only way to stay competitive and not lose customers by the millions. but we are not there yet.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Anarchy_Juiblex 07/12/17 4:25:21 PM #8:	ChromaticAngel posted... "free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition. No, that's not what the term means nor does it imply that. --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:882793967] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>ChromaticAngel posted...</cite> <quote>"free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition.</quote> No, that's not what the term means nor does it imply that.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ChromaticAngel 07/12/17 4:28:26 PM #9:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... ChromaticAngel posted... "free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition. No, that's not what the term means nor does it imply that. I mean the whole "we don't need NN because free market regulates itself" argument predicates competition. otherwise you don't have a free market. you have one guy calling all the shots. --- https://puu.sh/tcLsT/24f4611235.png <cite>ChromaticAngel posted [p:882794138] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote><cite>ChromaticAngel posted...</cite> <quote>"free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition.</quote> No, that's not what the term means nor does it imply that.</quote> I mean the whole "we don't need NN because free market regulates itself" argument predicates competition. otherwise you don't have a free market. you have one guy calling all the shots.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ShinyMasamuneZ 07/12/17 4:32:08 PM #10:	I was more going along the lines that NN is essentially a government-imposed regulation and regulations only serve to hinder the free market. --- Currently Playing: Breath of the Wild Recently Finished: Final Fantasy XV, Dark Cloud, Specter Knight <cite>ShinyMasamuneZ posted [p:882794354] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>I was more going along the lines that NN is essentially a government-imposed regulation and regulations only serve to hinder the free market.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ChromaticAngel 07/12/17 4:53:34 PM #11:	ShinyMasamuneZ posted... I was more going along the lines that NN is essentially a government-imposed regulation and regulations only serve to hinder the free market. I'd rather have a fair market than a free one. --- https://puu.sh/tcLsT/24f4611235.png <cite>ChromaticAngel posted [p:882795569] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>ShinyMasamuneZ posted...</cite> <quote>I was more going along the lines that NN is essentially a government-imposed regulation and regulations only serve to hinder the free market.</quote> I'd rather have a fair market than a free one.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ShinyMasamuneZ 07/12/17 4:55:02 PM #12:	I'd agree. Those are just the arguments I've seen posed. --- Currently Playing: Breath of the Wild Recently Finished: Final Fantasy XV, Dark Cloud, Specter Knight <cite>ShinyMasamuneZ posted [p:882795660] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>I'd agree. Those are just the arguments I've seen posed.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
uwnim 07/13/17 6:45:22 PM #13:	ShinyMasamuneZ posted... I was more going along the lines that NN is essentially a government-imposed regulation and regulations only serve to hinder the free market. In this case it helps one market while somewhat hindering another market that has little to no competition. Without net neutrality of some sort, you can't actually have a free internet market since there would be outside groups that have excessive power to influence it. --- I want a pet Lavos Spawn. [Order of the Cetaceans: Phocoena dioptrica] <cite>uwnim posted [p:882863108] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>ShinyMasamuneZ posted...</cite> <quote>I was more going along the lines that NN is essentially a government-imposed regulation and regulations only serve to hinder the free market.</quote> In this case it helps one market while somewhat hindering another market that has little to no competition. Without net neutrality of some sort, you can't actually have a free internet market since there would be outside groups that have excessive power to influence it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
PostCrisisJ2 07/13/17 7:04:17 PM #14:	There was one person who didn't care for net neutrality because they figured it would mean more regulation to protect children from predators. This person failed to take into account that such predators would simply find ways around such regulation. So... yeah. There's that. --- spritual powah will never die Don't be shy to drop a PM to me, I'm always open for conversation. <cite>PostCrisisJ2 posted [p:882864017] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>There was one person who didn't care for net neutrality because they figured it would mean more regulation to protect children from predators. This person failed to take into account that such predators would simply find ways around such regulation. So... yeah. There's that.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Solar_Crimson 07/13/17 7:36:27 PM #16:	Mr Hangman posted... If ISPs have abusive traffic practices, you should focus your energy on getting the ISP to change its practices, Which won't happen; they'll just laugh at you and continue on. --- http://i.imgur.com/wKOoZkP.jpg http://i.imgur.com/mipFVFw.png http://backloggery.com/SolarCrimson <cite>Solar_Crimson posted [p:882865730] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mr Hangman posted...</cite> <quote>If ISPs have abusive traffic practices, you should focus your energy on getting the ISP to change its practices,</quote> Which won't happen; they'll just laugh at you and continue on.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Axiom 07/13/17 8:03:35 PM #18:	Dumb reasons like "I love Trump and will defend anything related to him to the death" and "It will allow competition even though the few ISPs that exist are infamous for anti-consumer practices and are borderline monopolies" <cite>Axiom posted [p:882867188] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote>Dumb reasons like "I love Trump and will defend anything related to him to the death" and "It will allow competition even though the few ISPs that exist are infamous for anti-consumer practices and are borderline monopolies"</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
CircleOfManias 07/13/17 8:06:27 PM #19:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... ChromaticAngel posted... "free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition. No, that's not what the term means nor does it imply that. So you believe an unregulated monopoly is good for the general public? --- Sick liaisons raise this monumental mark The sun sets forever over Blackwater Park <cite>CircleOfManias posted [p:882867361] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote><cite>ChromaticAngel posted...</cite> <quote>"free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition.</quote> No, that's not what the term means nor does it imply that.</quote> So you believe an unregulated monopoly is good for the general public?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Annihilated 07/13/17 8:10:14 PM #20:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... ChromaticAngel posted... "free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition. No, that's not what the term means nor does it imply that. Yes it does. ISPs do NOT exist in a free market space in many areas, and much of that is due to red tape and getting approval from municipalities, not to mention disputes over which providers are allowed to use the telephone poles by existing entities such as AT&T, despite the fact that they are public. This is why people in rural areas with only one ISP option pay $90 a month for the fraction of the speed they would get in a city. If a market is not free, it either needs to be made free or it needs government intervention to prevent it from being abused. <cite>Annihilated posted [p:882867578] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote><cite>ChromaticAngel posted...</cite> <quote>"free market" would have to imply that ISPs had actual competition.</quote> No, that's not what the term means nor does it imply that.</quote> Yes it does. ISPs do NOT exist in a free market space in many areas, and much of that is due to red tape and getting approval from municipalities, not to mention disputes over which providers are allowed to use the telephone poles by existing entities such as AT&T, despite the fact that they are public. This is why people in rural areas with only one ISP option pay $90 a month for the fraction of the speed they would get in a city. If a market is not free, it either needs to be made free or it needs government intervention to prevent it from being abused.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ChromaticAngel 07/14/17 12:26:39 AM #21:	Mr Hangman posted... can you really think of that many times they have been abusive? Anything that lasted more than a very short time? Yes. Mr Hangman posted... Many times you want certain traffic to be prioritized. This should be the responsibility of clients and hosts. not providers. Mr Hangman posted... And fast lanes? What do you think CDNs are? CDNs are not fast lanes. They're cached static content. They still transfer at the same speed that other content does. --- https://puu.sh/tcLsT/24f4611235.png <cite>ChromaticAngel posted [p:882880309] in Is there a... [t:75558158]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mr Hangman posted...</cite> <quote>can you really think of that many times they have been abusive? Anything that lasted more than a very short time? </quote> Yes. <cite>Mr Hangman posted...</cite> <quote>Many times you want certain traffic to be prioritized.</quote> This should be the responsibility of clients and hosts. not providers. <cite>Mr Hangman posted...</cite> <quote> And fast lanes? What do you think CDNs are?</quote> CDNs are not fast lanes. They're cached static content. They still transfer at the same speed that other content does.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Current Events > Is there any reason to be against Net Neutrality? (+) Yeah! (+)

Current Events > Is there any reason to be against Net Neutrality?