Current Events > As a business owner, college-educated employees are leagues better workers.

(+) Yeah! (+)

This is just one anecdotal example, but other business owners here can chime in if they'd like.

Since starting my laser tag business three years ago, I've gone through many employees. I'm doing my yearly employee reviews and I've noticed a very steep divide in worker performance over the last few years. My employees with some or a full college education were just much better employees overall. It didn't matter what degree they had. Just the fact that they attended college seemed to improve their work habits and performance.

Curious to find out why, I had a few meetings with my three managers (two current and one ex-manager). I wanted them to list their positive and negative qualities of all our employees with examples. I wanted to find out why the college-educated ones were so much better.

Their comments seemed to match pretty well with my own observations. The key here was problem-solving and critical-thinking skills. The laser tag business is a pretty hectic, fast-paced business. Especially when you have two parties and a retreat going on at the same time and you are dealing with the technology found in the laser tag guns.

The college-educated employees were much more independent when it came to troubleshooting. If something messed up, like a gun malfunctioned, or a kid got hurt, or a customer got angry, or we had a leak somewhere, they would immediately figure out a way to solve the problem. They would make last-second judgments and would generally fill me in later when the problem had been taken care of.

With my non-college employees, they did well enough with their given instructions. But the second something happened that did not have instructions on how to solve, they would freeze. They would stop everything they were doing to call me or a manager for help. Or the decisions they made were the worst decisions they could make and would cost us either money or customers. They weren't able to step back and look at the situation critically and make a sound decision based on the facts surrounding the problem.

As a business owner, this is pretty telling for me the value of a college degree. I've hired sociology majors, business majors, art majors, as well as computer science majors. Regardless of their degree, they showed a much better handling of basic job duties that required ambiguity, quick thinking, and judgment calls.

With my non-college workers, only one was able to show that same level of independence and high job performance. He was a gifted high school student who will easily go very far in life. The rest, while they weren't bad employees per se, just didn't give me the level of quality I've come to expect from the others. The worst of it was when I had to drive an hour to a mobile party to troubleshoot a game glitch for an employee, only to find out they forgot to turn on the administration software, something that was done with a single flip of a switch. An employee I've had for months that couldn't bother to attempt to figure it out before calling me in.

TL:DR: My college-educated employees are much more valuable workers to me because of their critical thinking skills and ability to work more independently and with more ambiguity than my non-college-educated workers.
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Is it possible it's just down to lack of experience in general?

College kids with their four years would have more experience with problem solving and analytical thinking than someone who's only worked say six months.
Different experience but greater amounts.
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TheFireRises posted...

Is it possible it's just down to lack of experience in general?

College kids with their four years would have more experience with problem solving and analytical thinking than someone who's only worked say six months.
Different experience but greater amounts.

It's possible.

My college educated workers ranged from ages 19-28.

My non-college educated workers ranged from 16-40.

There's a larger range among the non-college educated worker. But like I said, of those, only one of them seemed to deliver the same performance as my college-educated ones, and he was a 16-year-old high school student.
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shockthemonkey posted...

How much more do you pay people who have a college degree?

I pay them the same amount as it's part time employment. Though I'm considering upping the pay if it attracts more college-level employees.
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Zanzenburger posted...

It's possible.

My college educated workers ranged from ages 19-24.

My non-college educated workers ranged from 16-40.

There's a larger range among the non-college educated worker. But like I said, of those, only one of them seemed to deliver the same performance as my college-educated ones, and he was a 16-year-old high school student.

Given the ages of the college students, I'm assuming it's because they've had to use those skills recently. Same as the high school worker.

Whereas older ones may not have worked at that type of a job before and thus can't think properly. Or they may just be used to not having a lot of freedom. Though honestly, I'm not sure. I'm just going with my own experience. Based on being locked down a lot to having complete freedom. I suppose the best way to describe is maybe they've not gotten the chance to actually be in charge of themselves.

I do agree that for the most part, college education would make people better at most jobs on the basis of they need to think at a higher standard.
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Mods are always wrong
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TheFireRises posted...

I do agree that for the most part, college education would make people better at most jobs on the basis of they need to think at a higher standard.

I think the point I'm trying to make is that it is hard to quantify the value of a college degree. Just take a look at the other topic about Republicans thinking higher education is bad for America, and the CE users making fun of liberal arts degree.

From my experience (both as an administrator of a university and a business owner), the experience gained from getting a college degree is very valuable and transferrable into the workforce, regardless of the degree.

You could argue the employability of certain degrees versus others, but you still gain pretty in depth critical thinking skills from attending college.
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Doe posted...

Mods are always wrong

http://www.swaylocks.com/sites/default/files/DOE_1.png
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Well that's good for you to notice. When I was halfway through my undergrad I was in a science/engineering major with a GPA above 8.5 and I wanted to work over the summer. Never got a call back from walmart/metro/mcdonalds/wendys/clothes store etc. Stupid online questionnaires. Instead I got hired to work part time in something related to my field which was nice, but more stressful than what I wanted for a summer job.

Hexagon posted...

Well that's good for you to notice. When I was halfway through my undergrad I was in a science/engineering major with a GPA above 8.5 and I wanted to work over the summer. Never got a call back from walmart/metro/mcdonalds/wendys/clothes store etc. Stupid online questionnaires. Instead I got hired to work part time in something related to my field which was nice, but more stressful than what I wanted for a summer job.

Yeah, retail companies are weary of hiring college peeps, specifically because they can be "overqualified" for the job they want them to do. Those jobs are generally very standardized and monotonous, so they don't want someone coming in and getting all fancy with it.

In my company, despite being a part time, blue collar job, I give my employees more independence and authority in how to do their job. But with the added freedom come more judgment calls when things go wrong. Part of the job includes travelling around the state and setting up mobile laser tag parties. I'm not around to fix things if something goes wrong, so they need to be able to figure out a solution quick if things mess up.
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Zanzenburger posted...

I think the point I'm trying to make is that it is hard to quantify the value of a college degree. Just take a look at the other topic about Republicans thinking higher education is bad for America, and the CE users making fun of liberal arts degree.

From my experience (both as an administrator of a university and a business owner), the experience gained from getting a college degree is very valuable and transferrable into the workforce, regardless of the degree.

You could argue the employability of certain degrees versus others, but you still gain pretty in depth critical thinking skills from attending college.

Keep in mind I'm in Ireland but high school here is more or less: study for 3 years (around 15-18), take several exams over two weeks, that decides your future in college, if any. Nothing else matters. Getting As all week but mess up? Doesn't matter.

Now, the reason I'm mentioning that is college here is definitely a major difference to high school. High school is more or less, rote learning. Including memorizing essays to write for say English or history. Outside of math (wherein you just learn the processes, not the whys), it's all rote learning.

So yeah, I'd agree that college education in general is a massive, massive difference - mainly because here at least, you have to take responsibility for your own actions and education. In high school you can quite literally fail everything, dump all your memory down on paper during those two weeks and succeed in getting into a top tier college.
Which changes drastically since college here treats you like you're a dumbass kid most of the time because they kinda expect that you are.
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redhats told me that college was useless
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How is the business going? Are you on the up now?
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TheFireRises posted...

Keep in mind I'm in Ireland but high school here is more or less: study for 3 years (around 15-18), take several exams over two weeks, that decides your future in college, if any. Nothing else matters. Getting As all week but mess up? Doesn't matter.

Now, the reason I'm mentioning that is college here is definitely a major difference to high school. High school is more or less, rote learning. Including memorizing essays to write for say English or history. Outside of math (wherein you just learn the processes, not the whys), it's all rote learning.

So yeah, I'd agree that college education in general is a massive, massive difference - mainly because here at least, you have to take responsibility for your own actions and education. In high school you can quite literally fail everything, dump all your memory down on paper during those two weeks and succeed in getting into a top tier college.
Which changes drastically since college here treats you like you're a dumbass kid most of the time because they kinda expect that you are.

True. Now correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I've gathered from other countries not the US, is that higher education is more valued. As in, people understand the necessity of a college degree, not just for gaining employment, but for the learning aspect of it.

In the US, that's becoming rarer as more people think that college is worthless if it doesn't get you 6-figure salaries immediately after graduation.
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Oh and the whole thing of X degree is useless is really, really stupid to say.
A masters in the history of women in WW2 might or might not be useless. Expecting a job from it solely on the fact you have a masters in the History of Women in WW2 is stupid, yes. But so is expecting to get a job simply because you have a masters in Computer Science.
You need to market what you did and what skills you used.
You take up masters in Computer Science and just go "yeah, I;ve got a masters degree". It's stupid. IT doesn't help.
You still need to market yourself properly.
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Slaya4 posted...

How is the business going? Are you on the up now?

Sort of. We're on a down right now, but that's because of seasonal shifts (summers are horrible for laser tag centers). Even three summers in we're still having to be super resourceful.

But overall, yes, we're on the up. We're consistently making a profit September through May. I just have to create a better summer plan to stay profitable in the summer. Either be open less hours or just save up more throughout the year. I should finish paying off one of my bigger debts the end of this year, though, so that should make my monthly costs much lower going into next summer. That should help.
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Zanzenburger posted...

In the US, that's becoming rarer as more people think that college is worthless if it doesn't get you 6-figure salaries immediately after graduation.

I don't even think it's just the 6-figure salary part and just getting a job in general. With how much debt students can get into just to get a college education, not having any immediate job prospects can really hurt. Doesn't really help a lot of entry level jobs are looking for people with years of experience, because companies would rather get an experienced person for less than to take chances with new talent. Of course this doesn't make the education useless as much as we have a faulty system hurting young people looking to get a job.
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Zanzenburger posted...

True. Now correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I've gathered from other countries not the US, is that higher education is more valued. As in, people understand the necessity of a college degree, not just for gaining employment, but for the learning aspect of it.

In the US, that's becoming rarer as more people think that college is worthless if it doesn't get you 6-figure salaries immediately after graduation.

I'd wager here, outside of STEM (and even then this holds true somewhat) that a degree isn't aimed at getting you a job. It's for the learning aspect also. You're usually encouraged to either go for a specific degree (want to be a nurse? Take up nursing) or else something that actually interests you so you don't drop out. I've worked with people who've studied history and wound up working in HR.
Another woman took up a master degree in something to do with rehabilitation for drug users and wound up as a supervisor for a prison work programme with the company that employed her.

I think the average wage in Ireland is like 35,000 or there abouts after tax. Which is actually pretty good to live on. It's not amazing, mind you. But two people working nets you 70,000 which is more than enough for most familes.
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Tmaster148 posted...

I don't even think it's just the 6-figure salary part and just getting a job in general. With how much debt students can get into just to get a college education, not having any immediate job prospects can really hurt. Doesn't really help a lot of entry level jobs are looking for people with years of experience, because companies would rather get an experienced person for less than to take chances with new talent. Of course this doesn't make the education useless as much as we have a faulty system hurting young people looking to get a job.

I think that's one of the major issues in the US is the cost - in Ireland it's free or mostly in the low thousands, I think maybe 3,000 or there abouts a year. Given that most people still live at home or else live on campus if needed, it's a lot cheaper than the debt college students in the US face. Hence why I think there's so much emphasis on "this needs to get me a good job so I don't have to pay debt back".
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This thread will trigger so many people lol
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Danny?
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People do often try to justify not going to college. But you go to college to learn to be an adult. It's sort of simple as that. It's of course not as simple as "you almost never do the job you learned at college to do" or some variance of that. But some people here are so wrapped up in being in debt and whatnot. There's also a reason why people who went to college earn more on average.

Though some do drop out and still do well. They're naturals and they had a reason and an end goal for dropping out. It isn't baseless, and a lot of those people also end up going to some form of graduate school eventually
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legendarylemur posted...

People do often try to justify not going to college. But you go to college to learn to be an adult. It's sort of simple as that. It's of course not as simple as "you almost never do the job you learned at college to do" or some variance of that. But some people here are so wrapped up in being in debt and whatnot. There's also a reason why people who went to college earn more on average.

Though some do drop out and still do well. They're naturals and they had a reason and an end goal for dropping out. It isn't baseless, and a lot of those people also end up going to some form of graduate school eventually

There's always exceptions, but people can't deny college has its benefits.
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from my perspective:

the thing about college to me is that even if you think the classes for some particular major(s) are fluff or nonsense, attending a university is basically giving a young person an introduction to the skills and thought processes that they will encounter in adult life.

it's all controlled and contained, of course, but you learn problem solving, how to manage your time, how to communicate effectively, adapt to changes, etc.

however the biggest thing i believe colleges teach kids that you don't get in, say, high school is accountability. this is an extremely important aspect of life and is everything when you begin working professionally.

in high school, they teach you that you are RESPONSIBLE for stuff, but not ACCOUNTABLE. what i mean is that in HS you are given a task, and you're expected to do that task, but how much of that task you're ultimately accountable for is pretty minimal.

for example, let's say you're a HS kid and you have a group project with 2 other students. you and group member #2 do your part, but group member #3 never shows up for the meetings and doesn't do his work. you tell the teacher and the teacher grades you based on the work you and group member #2 does, and #3 gets an F.

In the adult world, if you are the owner of a project that needs to get done, even if one person working on it doesn't do their part, you are not only responsible for the tasks getting done, but you are accountable. if you are set to oversee some business process at your job and it fails because someone failed to do their part, you don't just get a pass - as the owner of this process, you're ultimately accountable. it's not fair in the everyday sense of the word but this is the foundation of how all business hierarchies are manged.

what i'm getting at in this rambling post here is that when you apply it to the laser tag business, i think this idea of having a more heightened sense of accountability is what separates the non college educated kids from the college educated ones. the non college ones know they are tasked with a job, but if it messes up in a capacity that isn't directly their fault (kid gets hurt, parent is angry about a bill, etc) then they kind of mentally just pass this issue on to management - they don't feel that they have any sense of ownership in the issue. it's like they're cogs in the machine, rather than looking at the big picture.

when i was in college i used to work at a place that employed HS and college students as well, and I noticed this in many of the employees. The younger HS guys just did not have a developed sense of not only how to work but WHY things were set up the way they are, and their work output showed it.

just my two cents
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