Board 8 > Thoughts on Persona 5 *Massive SPOILERS*

(+) Yeah! (+)

If you're reading this and you haven't finished the game, back out now.








I'm warning you.











Ok, you are fully responsible for your own actions, and whatever happens, you chose to suffer the consequences.


So I just beat it tonight, and I have to say it was a lot of fun throughout, and definitely lived up to the hype. The dungeon design was a lot of fun, and allowed for a new element to the gameplay. I actually found that difficulty wise the game was a bit harder than Persona 3 and 4, but once you start becoming able to fuse high level personas that difficulty diminishes a lot. In that sense the curve is pretty similar to the other Persona games. I think the hardest part of it is managing your SP. Until late in the game you really don't have the options of recovery that the other games give you. There is no magic clock or cool fox to give you SP for a price, you need to work your social links to near max capacity before you start getting the good stuff. That makes clearing dungeons in a single go round very difficult, even when you do conserve SP and try to avoid some fights.

It's also a lot harder to clear social links due to the number of roadblocks they have. Most of them have multiple ones, and are difficult to clear until the very end, which makes a blind runthrough getting them all basically impossible. Between stat locks, times where you have to jump into mementos and story reasons for stopping advancement, it's difficult to say the least. I was close to maxing out my links, but I missed out on four of them, Tower because it starts too late and I had others to work on, Star for similar reasons, Hanged Man because I didn't get the guts requirement until like October and then there was another lock in December that screwed me, and Empress because it started late and I didn't have max skill by the time her link started. Despite that it's still a lot of fun, and manageable. Some of the social link perks are absurdly strong like Hermits (Buffs randomly during battle, sometimes HP and SP recovery as well), Star's (swapping party members), and Temperance (Lets you go out at night after finishing a dungeon). Having these powerful effects really make doing the social links feel worthwhile as more than just a raw power boost for Persona fusion.

The QOL upgrades are a big help, and being able to swap your party at will from the menu makes it so party composition doesn't really matter as much. My primary party ended up being Makoto, Ryuuji and Yusuke because I found physical skills were far more important for dungeon crawling, because you could just have Ann and Morgana in reserve throwing out heals when you needed it, and Makoto could Media+ in a pinch.

Anyway, the game was a blast, and I'd highly recommend it for anyone who wants to give it a shot. I'll post more later like my detailed character thoughts, but I just wanted to get my general thoughts out of the way to begin with. I'm going to have Rivers in the Desert stuck in my head for a while.
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Alright, so the characters, we might as well start off with our protagonist, Xander Mobus. Wait, that's his VA's name, not his canon name hahaha. I'll just refer to him as Akira Kurusu to make it easier for me. Anyway, like the other Persona protagonists he's a blank slate character to project yourself onto, but the quirks of his character show through fairly well. Like in P3 you get that the protagonist is pretty laidback and apathetic, and the P4 protagonist is a bit of a goofball, Akira is a bit of a daredevil and does not like to be pushed around. Justice is a pretty heavy theme when it comes to this game, and Akira definitely believes in standing up to his justice no matter what life or the villains throw in his way. He's a perfect mirror to the actual Justice Confidant, Goro Akechi.

While Akira is introduced as a thug and a delinquent, Goro is an ace detective, a TV personality and honor student. He's everything Akira isn't on first glance. However as you learn more about him, that shifts drastically. His ace detective persona is a facade, gained by using his power in the metaverse to trigger psychotic breakdowns and then bring those people to 'Justice' in the real world in a ploy to bolster his popularity. His sense of justice is tainted because he can only think of himself, while Akira is constantly thinking about his close friends who he shares a similar bond with. While Goro wants to be the hero in the limelight, Akira only wants justice for the people who have been wronged by the villains and society's action. I really liked the interplay between the two of them, especially from the moment he was introduced I couldn't trust that guy. It was nice seeing my suspicions rewarded.

The last character who I found really interesting the main villain himself. While he may not have been the last boss, in terms of driving the story and characters, he was the principle mover of the whole affair. That piece of shit is Masayoshi Shido, and the game does a great job of making you hate the guy. His ambition and lust for power is naked and unmatched, and he's willing to do whatever it takes to stomp out any competition using the help of his pawn Goro Akechi to trigger mental shutdowns. His worldview is wholly cynical, trust no one and dispose of them when they've lost their value. Anyone who is not with him is against him, and the world doesn't need those people. While on the face he's a noble politician who wants to bring law and order back to his weak country, in the end all he wants is the seat of power for himself. He was a really refreshing villain to have after 'Bitches and Whores' Adachi, and discount Jesus' gang of nihilists. On the villains front, Persona 5 has it's predecessor beat hands down. Having villains you have a vested interest in seeing get taken down a peg is always a compelling reason to keep playing a game.
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I like that all of your social links have a common theme about them, about being rejected by society and struggling to find their place because of it. It really helps you feel like you have a common bond with them, rather than just being some guy you go out to eat ramen with and find out he's a conman, or some random woman who can't bond with her stepson that you babysit. It makes you feel like your social links matter. It's also on point with the themes of the game, the justice of the weak banding together will overcome the justice of the strong. It definitely made the game feel more cohesive as a whole rather than just being half dungeon crawling, half dating sim.

I don't really think I can do objective Social Link Rankings yet because I wasn't able to complete all of them, and a lot of them were really enjoyable. I could probably do up a waifu ranking, but probably not tonight. I don't expect anyone will be reading this topic for at least another three days or so so I have time. >_>
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Party rankings: Being able to switch party members on the fly is a huge boon, and it means you can just fix your party composition as you need to, rather than having to run back to the entrance to switch your crew around. Therefore I don't really rank them on a playability scale since... well any party can do work, it's dependent on the situation. I found Makoto to be the most useful team mate simply because she's the best all-rounder of the group. So I'll be ranking based on how much I liked their characters.

1. Morgana
He's Teddie done right. He does have some similarities with the blue puffball, but his arc is a lot stronger, he has his doubts and fears and feels more like a real character that helps the party than a massive load. The twist that he was made by the real Igor in a gambit to free him was pretty cool too, and he got a satisfying conclusion to the end of his arc.

2. Futaba
I just wanted to hug this poor girl, Shido's goons basically destroyed her life, and the desire to shut out everyone and everything is something I can personally relate to. Once she gets out of her funk, she's easily the funniest character of the cast, and plays well off of everyone. Not to mention here support skills are pretty absurd once you start working on her social link. She's pretty great.

3. Makoto
The real brains of the phantom thieves, and in terms of relevance to the plot, she's probably just a fraction behind Futaba and the lead for overall importance. She breaks out of her shell as the perfect honour student and finds her place among the Phantom Thieves. She was able to figure out what all of her studying was for at the end of her social link, working to become a Police Commisioner and helping to fix the twisted system that put the phantom thieves in such a terrible situation to begin with.

4. Akechi
I shared most of my thoughts on Akechi before, but he's a character I love to hate as a dark mirror of Akira. Being able to use Curse and Bless skills was really helpful for the one dungeon he was in. He went out as a hero though, and it's up to you to decide whether or not he redeemed himself with his final actions.

5. Haru
6. Yusuke

Haru and Yusuke were pretty close for me. I think Haru is hurt quite a bit by having almost no interaction with her until she shows up in the 5th palace, but she's a strong character in the end game, and her social link seemed pretty interesting, dealing with the fallout of a dead father's massive company. She's pretty similar to Mitsuru in that regard. She's also a bit of a goofball, with a flair for the dramatic, which brings a bit more levity to the team. Yusuke is a dude who is passionate about his art, but completely lacking in common sense which leads him to do stupid things like trying to move into Ann's house and spending all his money to bribe her with sweets. He finally learns how to paint for himself at the end of his social link, which was a nice conclusion to the fear that he was becoming Madarame 2.0.

7. Ryuji
Ryuji is a bro, and the kind of guy who will always have your back. He's also the most aggressively stupid member of your group, often blurting out shit in the middle of crowds. "IT'S A GOOD THING WE'RE THE PHANTOM THIEVES!" Ryuji please. It also helps that he's your first bro character who isn't the magician arcana.

8. Ann
After clearing Kamoshida's dungeon it really only feels like she's there to be eye candy. I mean, I guess that's fine, but I'm not gonna like you much as a character for it. Her social link is also easily the most trite of the party's SLinks. She's fine, but ehh, doesn't really interest me as a character.
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tiny night bump
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I just secured the route to what I assume to be the last palace, which is Shido's. Managed to do it in 1 day but holy shit those last string of boss fights. Thank you Grimehkala. Can I send the calling card immediately and still get the free days afterward? Morgana warned me to be "prepared" so I don't know if that means I should do everything I need to do for those days and then send the calling card.

Logicblade posted...

I like that all of your social links have a common theme about them, about being rejected by society and struggling to find their place because of it. It really helps you feel like you have a common bond with them, rather than just being some guy you go out to eat ramen with and find out he's a conman, or some random woman who can't bond with her stepson that you babysit. It makes you feel like your social links matter. It's also on point with the themes of the game, the justice of the weak banding together will overcome the justice of the strong. It definitely made the game feel more cohesive as a whole rather than just being half dungeon crawling, half dating sim.

I definitely agree with this. I love the social links in the game. I remember hearing that Hifumi was supposed to be a party member and I think she would have fit in with the group. Mishima's social link made me think he could have been a party member too. I loved that after the fake suicide news that a bunch of confidants text you worrying about you.
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Yeah do it immediately. If you haven't noticed you don't have access to some of your social links, so it's best to clear Shido's dungeon as soon as you can. Unless of course you've cleared all of them in which case it doesn't matter.
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Persona 5 Waifu Ranking time. I included any girl you could romance along with a few girls who you couldn't romance but had some plot relevance.

12. Ichiko Ohya
The Devil S-Link, and one of the weirder options for a romanceable character, Ichiko is a reporter determined to find the truth behind her friend's disappearance. Interestingly enough, her backstory is closely related to the main plot of the game, with her friend being an implied victim of Shido's mental shutdown scheme. As for Ichiko as a character, she has an annoying voice, is a crazy drunk and is willing to use less than ethical means to obtain the truth. I respect her as a person, but she just isn't that attractive.

11. Caroline/Justine

I decided to put these two together for obvious reasons. Unlike Elizabeth and Margaret, they simply look too young to be in the protagonist's strike range, or anyone's for that matter. Far be it from me to know the true age of godly creations, but the masochistic little girl is not something I am remotely interested in.

10. Shiho Suzui
Well you never get to see Shiho at her best, her purpose in the game is to spur on Ann's motivation to become a phantom thief by being Kamoshida's victim. She's physically and sexually abused and the torture of her situation leads her to trying to kill herself. Despite that, she still has the compassion to care for others even when her situation is pretty shitty, so I couldn't put her in last.

9. Sadayo Kawakami
Some points in her favour, she's a teacher and a maid, so those are some good fetishes to cover, and she's also voiced by Yukari's VA, so some of that residual appreciation carries over. However I feel like she's only romanceable because she's a female social link, and that actually dating your teacher is pretty unethical. Also she doesn't really look that good so if you're gonna go the unethical route, you better be damn sure that the hotness is worth it. Her social link is pretty good, her confidant bonuses are amazing, but I just don't think she's a worthy waifu for me.

I'll do the rest later.
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Beat the game. I didn't expect a happy ending. Also, I didn't expect Igor to not really be Igor. I thought they just wanted a very different voice considering the VA died. Everyone cheering you on to beat the god was kinda cheesy but it worked well. Really liked how much dialogue the max'd non-party social links got at the endgame. Can't wait to do NG+ and max out the others.
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Yeah, just try saying No to Yaldabaoth when the game starts, and he kicks you out to the start screen. It truly is an unjust game.
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bump
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8. Ann Takamaki
I think I've mentioned it before but Ann has always felt extraneous after the second palace. She's basically just around to be eyecandy, her social link is boring, and she's just not an interesting character. She definitely has more chemistry with Ryuji though, and I can support that ship. Sail away, far away from me.

7. Sae Niijima
Sae spends most of the game hounding you for being a phantom thief, and being incredibly rude to her little sister, but that's because she's being distorted by her desires and the powerful people giving her shit all the way down. Once she is freed from all of that nonsense, you can see the caring and intelligent woman that she really is, working to support the Phantom Thieves' societal reform all the way through, and even letting you spend your christmas eve with your special someone. She looks great in a suit and just has that eye turning presence. She does leave a fairly bad first impression though.

6. Haru Okumura
Haru is incredibly kind and sweet, but she suffers from being introduced way to late in the game to make any real connection with the party until basically the endgame, where the slice of life stuff falls by the wayside for the plot. At least with Naoto in P4, she's hanging out around Inaba providing her own investigation into the cases, Haru shows up in maybe one or two cutscenes before she makes her reveal as the beauty thief in her dad's dungeon. This could change as I wasn't able to finish her social link in my first playthrough (thank you roadblocks), but a little more exposure to her prior to her recruitment would have helped.

5. Futaba Sakura
Futaba is great, she's quirky, fun and charming, but her development in the game is closer to an ersatz little sister than an actual romantic partner. You help her overcome her social anxieties, find friends, and look out for her wellbeing. She's a great girl, but the narrative makes it hard for me to see any sort of romantic relationship between Joker and her. Despite that it's still one of the more likely and believable options in this game.
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bumpo
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4. Hifumi Togo

Hifumi is a lot of fun. She's introduced as an expert Shogi player, but it turns out her skills and abilities are a fabrication due to her mother's influence. The real goal was to use Shogi as a stepping stone to becoming an Idol, but Hifumi was having none of that shit. She's a good looking girl and happens to actually be in the same age range as Akira, which is kind of a rarity in these S-Links. She's also turns into a Chuuni when she's playing Shogi which is jsut endearing enough not to be annoying. She's one of the few links who has realistically good chemistry with the MC, so to 4 she goes.

3. Chihaya Mifune

The Fortune social link ends up being pretty useful, exchanging currency for social link points is a great way to game the system. Chihaya is a girl from a small mountain town who ended up leaving because she's been brandished with the stigma of being a maiden of disaster for her accurate fortune telling. She was easily resigned to her fate of selling hocus holy stones for a cult, until Akira came in and showed her destiny can be changed (if you're a trickster). She turns over a new leaf, gives you back the 100k she stole from you, and falls madly in love with you... if you so choose. I think she's pretty cute, and her social link is pretty fun. However she's a step behind the top two.

2. Tae Takemi

The punk rock doctor and the Death Social Link. Takemi is scorching hot. She's got that hot and she knows attitude, and amazing legs that she loves to flaunt. She's also a surprisingly sweet woman once you get to know her, and her social link is one of my favourites in the game. She's been blacklisted by the medical community at large because of a mistake her superior made, and because JAPAN, she was forced to take the blame for it, short circuiting her promising medical career. However, with the help of Joker she is able to correct 'her' mistake and come up with the cure to the rare disease she was researching, and have her former superior confess to his error. It's a very sweet end to the story, and it helps you get cheap medicine... so bonus! Tae is a great woman and definitely a worthy waifu if you're stumbling on who to choose.

1. Makoto Niijima

Of course, there could only be one who stands at the top, the Priestess SLink, Makoto Niijima. In terms of plot relevance, she has the most among the main party, with only a few exceptions. As the brains of the Phantom Thieves operations, she provides some actual intelligence to the group, which was solely lacking in the early game. She ends up putting the most on the line, risking her life to get into Kaneshiro's palace, stealing her sister's computer data, and a whole bunch of other fun things. She's a beautiful woman with a great booty and pair of legs, and she just kicks a lot of ass. Her awakening was probably my favourite in the game, and she balances cool and smart with 'I'll break your arm if you fuck with me' intensity. Her social link is pretty cute as well and had a nice conclusion, but definitely not the strongest of the set. Still she just has so much more to offer than a lot of the other social links so it was barely a challenge for the top spot. Biker Babe Makoto reigns supreme.
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Kawakami too low.
Chihaya too high.
Makoto at 1st is just as it should be.
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bumpo
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Coasting through NG+, definitely a lot easier when you can bring high level personas into the early palaces, and no need to grind stats to start social links.
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Just beat Shido. Rivers in a Desert is sooooo good.

I might have trivialized the fights against Akechi and Shido by getting Strength to max and fusing a Siegfried and Trumpeter. Debilitate is still good.

Narrative wise, I dunno if it's because I breezed through the seventh palace, but there just wasn't much of a flow to it. You got the scenes with Akechi at the studio, then the phone call where he starts to realize he got duped, then he all of a sudden pops up right when you've got the final letter? Then you get a quick motive rant and then he's effectively dead. Felt slightly anti-climactic given his importance. But I guess fitting that Akechi is discarded in such a manner.

One thing that I did not enjoy was Akechi and Shido's infodump outlining their plan that occurred alongside the Thieves explaining how they tricked Akechi. It felt so unnatural and was just some throw in because...reasons? Needing to explain things to the player more because they couldn't be bothered to have Shadow Shido show up throughout the palace itself?
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They didn't want to spoil Shido's sweet helmet.
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Would've been sweet if they snuck in a Nanomachines references for that third phase.
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Waifu rankings for me would be something like...

Futaba > Makoto > Kawakami > Haru > Sae > Lavenza > Ann > Ichiko > Hifumi > Tae > Chihaya


Party Member rankings something like

Futaba > Makoto > Yusuke > Ryuuji > Haru > Ann > Morgana > Akechi
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NowItsAngeTime posted...

Waifu rankings for me would be something like...

Futaba > Makoto > Kawakami > Haru > Sae > Lavenza > Ann > Ichiko > Hifumi > Tae > Chihaya


Party Member rankings something like

Futaba > Makoto > Yusuke > Ryuuji > Haru > Ann > Morgana > Akechi

Twins whe-

NowItsAngeTime posted...

Tae

O.O
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bump it up now that more people are finishing this.
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Bonus Boss Beaten. Makoto, Ryuji and Yusuke really does make the best party. Lead on Charge + Matarukaja, Marakukaja and Masukukaja, and run wild from there, with Makoto healing when necessary.
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And now I've got all the requests done as well, Just need to complete the compendium, wait for the story to progress to get my max social links trophy, and find out what drinks I missed in the vending machines and I should have all the trophies I'm going to get. Fuck fishing and fuck the batting cages.
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