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Board 8 > Let's talk about Dr. Pulaski. (spoilers)

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abiggeebabigee
05/05/12 8:53:00 PM
#1:


Poor old Dr. Pulaski, who last appeared in "Shades of Gray", perhaps the crappiest of all TNG episodes, and then was never seen again.

She couldn't have come back for a cameo or something to have a better send-off?

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Kaxon
05/06/12 1:06:00 AM
#2:


Did anyone actually want her to come back for a cameo or better sendoff?

(spoilers: no.)

I mean, the brought back both Yar and Wesley, who were also pretty crappy characters, so I have to assume there was literally no one on the staff who thought bringing Pulaski back was a good idea.

To be fair, Yar was a lot cooler when she came back as a guest star than she was as a regular. And Wes was decent in that one episode with Ashley Judd.

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Kaxon
05/06/12 1:08:00 AM
#3:


Although it is a little weird how there was no indication Crusher was leaving until after the fact, and then the same happened with Pulaski. I'm still not completely sure what the deal was with Gates McFadden leaving the show for one year.

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OmarsComin
05/06/12 1:10:00 AM
#4:


Pulaski was bad, at least Dr Crusher was mostly inoffensive as a character

the sex with a ghost in a candle episode withstanding of course

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Kaxon
05/06/12 1:13:00 AM
#5:


Crusher was definitely a lot better than Pulaski... but still toward the bottom end as far as TNG characters go. I don't know why but Star Trek has a kind of bad track record with making interesting female characters.

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OmarsComin
05/06/12 1:15:00 AM
#6:


honestly I think most of the TNG cast is either bad or boring

Picard, Worf, and Data are all great

Riker has a few great moments

rest of the main cast, no thanks

really a lot of TNGs good characters were only occasional types, like Q, Gowron, Ro Laren, etc.

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Kaxon
05/06/12 1:18:00 AM
#7:


That's already more than half of the final main cast >_>

Personally I thought TNG's guest characters were mostly pretty boring, aside from Q. But all 7 of the mains were at least pretty good. Yar and Wes were kinda bad, but fortunately they were both gone for the last few seasons.

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OmarsComin
05/06/12 1:23:00 AM
#8:


yeah Yar and Wes were not good Dr Crusher was mostly boring and Troi was mostly stupid. "I SENSE THEIR INTENTIONS ARE HOSTILE" etc. not a huge Geordi fan either though he's another character who's mostly inoffensive instead of bad.

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Jeff Zero
05/06/12 2:07:00 AM
#9:


TNG's cast was basically a few amazing characters (one of which only stopped sucking in the third season, conveniently when the series itself took off for the most part) and then a bunch of boring people. DS9 and even VOY beat it in this regard, although there is only one Picard.

I'm still not completely sure what the deal was with Gates McFadden leaving the show for one year.

Gates was getting hit on rather inappropriately by one of the original creators, Hurley or something. Name currently escapes me. She felt terribly uncomfortable around him. He was a fat ugly slob with no redeeming qualities; hell, the show only got better with his departure. The only thing he ever did right was insult "Shades of Grey", which if you look on Memory Alpha shows that he called the episode a piece of s***, which is apt enough.

When he left they had McFadden come back and since Pulaski's actress wasn't exactly shaking any boots they let her go. As much as Pulaski could be kind of obnoxious it would have been nice for her to get a sendoff (and for Crusher to have gotten one as well) but it was all early-Trek reboot behind-the-scenes immature drama crap that wouldn't rear its ugly head again until Robert Beltran and Brannon Braga butted stupid-heads on Voyager.

This has been another "JZ knows about Star Trek, here's the proof" presentation.

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Jeff Zero
05/06/12 2:08:00 AM
#10:


They actually hyped Pulaski's entrance into the show though. Her actress played in some TOS episode so they played that up like it meant something.

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OmarsComin
05/06/12 2:10:00 AM
#11:


DS9 has a better overall cast, I agree

so many good characters

Voyager though lol

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Jeff Zero
05/06/12 2:12:00 AM
#12:


From: OmarsComin | #011
DS9 has a better overall cast, I agree

so many good characters

Voyager though lol


No, I will seriously take Voyager's overall cast over TNG's. I seriously will. DS9 blows them both out of the water but I will type that and I will even mean it.

Picard and Data alone almost wipe the floor with Voyager but The Doctor and Seven do a lot toward keeping it closer. I know most of Voyager's cast is dull but man, the focus episodes on people like Geordi were literally the same thing over and over again -- "Geordi finds love, ruh-roh, he's kind of a creep though!"

I kinda-sorta still like TNG's cast for the most part anyway, just because you can tell that's not really what the show is about is trying very hard to expand upon them. And sure, it's a better television show than Voyager. But Voyager's writers knew how to write a handful of its characters better than TNG's writers ever bothered to attempt writing most of its cast.

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Jeff Zero
05/06/12 2:13:00 AM
#13:


And I don't really get the Anagram focus group Riker lovefest either. There's a lot of "Riker so underrated" in the occasional Board 8 Trek talks but I don't get it, he's OK but he's mostly just a skirt-chasing space man. I mean if that's what you're lookin' for...

He does play the sax, which is automatically a +2, but eh

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hideto
05/06/12 3:01:00 AM
#14:


Jeff Zero posted...
And I don't really get the Anagram focus group Riker lovefest either. There's a lot of "Riker so underrated" in the occasional Board 8 Trek talks but I don't get it, he's OK but he's mostly just a skirt-chasing space man. I mean if that's what you're lookin' for...

He does play the sax, which is automatically a +2, but eh

I thought he played the trombone...

Anyway, I couldn't stand Riker when I was a kid, but now I find that I like him quite a bit more than I expected. He's still no Picard, Data, or Worf, but he's pretty enjoyable for me now.

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OmarsComin
05/06/12 3:05:00 AM
#15:


my feeling on Riker is that he's not completely awful, but he's seriously not great either. I can count his good episodes on one hand (the insane asylum one, the twin transporter accident one, the "I raped a woman just kidding no I didn't" one, and the "my old captain has a cloaking device and is crazy" one). the rest of the episodes I'm indifferent and sometimes he can be pretty bad!

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Jeff Zero
05/06/12 3:37:00 AM
#16:


Oh yeah, trombone.

Insane asylum episode ("Frame of Mind") was stellar but that doubling one I thought was kind of dumb. It is something of a fan favorite but the Riker/Troi stuff always bores me to no end and the climax is just a trite "we had best work together or workplace accidents will occur" scene, haha.

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Jeff Zero
05/06/12 3:40:00 AM
#17:


Oh, the seventh-season one with the old command and Locke from LOST (a show I didn't really like all that much but that's a good way of referencing the actor) is indeed also ace, yeah. I'm too tired to really pull all the stops with my Trek knowledge though as the episode name escapes me...

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Kaxon
05/06/12 10:50:00 AM
#18:


From: Jeff Zero | #012
No, I will seriously take Voyager's overall cast over TNG's. I seriously will. DS9 blows them both out of the water but I will type that and I will even mean it.

Picard and Data alone almost wipe the floor with Voyager but The Doctor and Seven do a lot toward keeping it closer. I know most of Voyager's cast is dull but man, the focus episodes on people like Geordi were literally the same thing over and over again -- "Geordi finds love, ruh-roh, he's kind of a creep though!"

I kinda-sorta still like TNG's cast for the most part anyway, just because you can tell that's not really what the show is about is trying very hard to expand upon them. And sure, it's a better television show than Voyager. But Voyager's writers knew how to write a handful of its characters better than TNG's writers ever bothered to attempt writing most of its cast.


I don't even know what to say... other than lol at the idea of Voyager's writers knowing how to write characters. I remember someone on this board (Anagram?) posting a rant about how ridiculously inconsistent Janeway's character was, and it seemed pretty spot on to me.

The doctor on Voyager was awesome. But literally everyone else on that show was a zero. Like the Doctor was Picard tier, and every other character was Wesley tier. Not a good cast.

DS9 had a good cast, but I just can't place them above TNG, if we're judging by the people with their names in the credits. For one thing, they didn't have any single standout who was on the level of Picard/Spock/Data/The Doctor. Who's the best character on DS9, maybe Quark? Except that Quark was in a position where he was kinda tangential to the main plot of the show. Some of the mains could be pretty annoying... Kira and Odo bugged me WAY more than Bev and Troi ever did. Sisko was alright, but there's a reason people debate Kirk vs Picard and no one ever debates Sisko vs Picard.

If you were including the secondary characters then maybe that puts DS9 over the top, but TNG had better mains.

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Kaxon
05/06/12 10:52:00 AM
#19:


From: Jeff Zero | #017
Oh, the seventh-season one with the old command and Locke from LOST (a show I didn't really like all that much but that's a good way of referencing the actor) is indeed also ace, yeah. I'm too tired to really pull all the stops with my Trek knowledge though as the episode name escapes me...


The Pegasus.

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abiggeebabigee
05/06/12 11:36:00 AM
#20:


From: Jeff Zero | #010
They actually hyped Pulaski's entrance into the show though. Her actress played in some TOS episode so they played that up like it meant something.


Two TOS episodes, in fact, as different characters. Kind of like that Vulcan doctor chick mysteriously turning into K'Ehleyr.

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Jeff Zero
05/06/12 2:21:00 PM
#21:


Kaxon, Seven of Nine's character development is most certainly not Wesley-tier, no matter how hamfisted it gets toward the end. And of course Janeway is inconsistent, I'd never argue that. Anagram is spot-on there. I've written rants just the same.

Kira, Odo and Quark are all very nearly Picard-tier, but I'm well-aware the Kira thing in particular isn't the most typical of opinions around these parts. Sisko is up there as well. I like him more than the other captains but as a captain he's clearly outclassed. Worf, Dax, Bashir, O'Brien... No way man, I gotta stick to my guns on this. DS9's cast is just so much more flavorful, interesting than TNG's overall.

Once you bring in the recurring cast things just get twice as heavy in DS9's favor. Garak, Dukat, Winn, Weyoun, Female Founder, Damar, Gowron, Martok, the Nagus, Rom, Nog, man... Such an incredible ensemble. I even like Vic and Leeta.

I realize O'Brien and Gowron were in TNG a bit as well of course.

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Jeff Zero
05/06/12 2:22:00 PM
#22:


As for Kira and Odo bugging someone more than Troi, I don't know what say either. Top ten franchise characters for me, both of them.

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