Board 8 > If people can hate The Dark Knight they can hate anything.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Movie was borderline perfection and people trash it.

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Joyrock
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By definition it's impossible for something to be perfect.

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ShadowHalo17 posted...
By definition it's impossible for something to be perfect.

Then Dark Night must be a pretty tough movie to top.

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Now, I love TDK as much as the next guy I've got a huge poster to my left, but of course it's all we've discussed before subjective. It's like what porn we watch, at the end of the day it's not really indicative of much.

So somebody out there doesn't like a constantly tense thriller about a vigilante trying to stop some crazy guys, I mean while it's terrific to me there are stranger notions.

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I might like Batman Begins a liiiiiiittle bit more, but they're still pretty easily the best two superhero movies I've ever seen.

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Batman Begins definitely has the bulk of Bruce's character work, then he's pretty much just established and left to deal with the craziness around him in Dark Knight. I'd say Batman Begins is stronger for Bale, but TDK is better in other areas and overall.

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Psycho_Kenshin posted...
Now, I love TDK as much as the next guy I've got a huge poster to my left, but of course it's all we've discussed before subjective. It's like what porn we watch, at the end of the day it's not really indicative of much.

So somebody out there doesn't like a constantly tense thriller about a vigilante trying to stop some crazy guys, I mean while it's terrific to me there are stranger notions.

Let me clarify it: I'm not talking about people who dislike the subject matter or just didn't enjoy it. That's completely different and legitimate - it's more about personal tastes than about the film itself.

I'm talking about the people who try to call it bad at what it does, who try and find flaws with the movie wherever they can.

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Joyrock
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people will find reasons to hate anything. Best to just accept that and move on.

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From: PartOfYourWorld | #005
I might like Batman Begins a liiiiiiittle bit more, but they're still pretty easily the best two superhero movies I've ever seen.

Ditto.

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PartOfYourWorld posted...
I might like Batman Begins a liiiiiiittle bit more, but they're still pretty easily the best two superhero movies I've ever seen.

I love BB but I have one or two nitpicks that put it below TDK for me.

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Joyrock
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Lol Chris stalking me now, so pathetic.

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Joyrock
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Convoy scene too good

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Joyrock
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Now on the tower scene!

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Joyrock
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Dark Knight is OK, and I don't hate it, but it's so overrated it burns.

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UltimaterializerX posted...
From: OctilIery | #012
Lol Chris stalking me now, so pathetic.
Uh, maybe he just wants you to play LoL? I don't know any back story or whatever.

And yeah, people hate on anything good. TDK is godlike.

He's trying to drag me back into an argument I long since abandoned.

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Joyrock
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Emporer_Kazbar posted...
Dark Knight is OK, and I don't hate it, but it's so overrated it burns.

Unless you can find some notable flaws with it you can't really call it overrated.

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Joyrock
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No Chris is bugging him because Joyrock said something dumb about League of Legends adding nothing to the genre/adding less than DotA2, which is a DotA port, has, and FD gave him like 40 things and eventually argued him into a corner then Joyrock was like "I'll reply to this later" and never did.

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On topic The Dark Knight might just be my favorite movie ever so I can agree with this.

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Lopen posted...
No Chris is bugging him because Joyrock said something dumb about League of Legends adding nothing to the genre/adding less than DotA2, which is a DotA port, has, and FD gave him like 40 things and eventually argued him into a corner then Joyrock was like "I'll reply to this later" and never did.

Lopen talking about what he doesn't understand again XD

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Joyrock
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TDK good good movie.

Bale needs to lose that voice though.

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Shoenin_Kakashi posted...
TDK good good movie.

Bale needs to lose that voice though.

I'll wait to see the whole movie to hold a judgement.

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Joyrock
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I'll wait to see the whole movie to hold a judgement.

The hell does that mean

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Shoenin_Kakashi posted...

I'll wait to see the whole movie to hold a judgement.


The hell does that mean

Apparently the voice has been tweaked, and if I can watch the whole movie and not be bothered then I won't complain, even if it isn't what I would have chosen.

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Joyrock
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I understand perfectly.

You don't understand how to argue and when someone has the patience instead of getting annoyed by your "no keep trying" crap to actually soundly defeat anything you had resembling a point you you just run away.

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OctilIery posted...
I'm talking about the people who try to call it bad at what it does, who try and find flaws with the movie wherever they can.

These people seriously exist? Ugh.

Lopen posted...
I understand perfectly.

You don't understand how to argue and when someone has the patience instead of getting annoyed by your "no keep trying" crap to actually soundly defeat anything you had resembling a point you you just run away.

Another irrelevant and misinformed post. You have nothing relevant to add to the discussion at hand so you are no longer part of it.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

OctilIery posted...
HanOfTheNekos posted...
UltimaterializerX posted...
From: OctilIery | #012
Lol Chris stalking me now, so pathetic.
Uh, maybe he just wants you to play LoL? I don't know any back story or whatever.


Joyrock dislikes LoL with a very strong passion, preferring. The reasons he gives are very shaky. FD has countered all of Joyrock's arguments, and in response Joyrock pretends the argument never happened.

Basically, FD is calling Joyrock a huge hypocrite. It's fine if LoL is not his cup of tea, but he says that Joyrock actively argues against LoL and calls it bad just because.

You should look up the argument, Ulti. You'd appreciate how worked up and in a frenzy Joyrock got the LoL community.

And another idiot with no understanding of the situation XD

Quit spamming my topic with off topic posts.


That was uncalled for bro. I wasn't calling you stupid or anything. Just explaining the situation to Ulti in the most apparent terms.

Hell, I actually complimented you in that post. And you go and insult me.

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rychu_supadude posted...
OctilIery posted...
I'm talking about the people who try to call it bad at what it does, who try and find flaws with the movie wherever they can.

These people seriously exist? Ugh.

Of course they do! Most of them are trolls, but some I'm sure legitimately believe anything popular is bad.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

You're just annoyed that I call you for what you are.

Some people think you're a troll, I know you're not a troll and actually really are just that dumb. I'm actually very informed on this topic, sadly, having read enough of your arguments to know which are trolling and which aren't-- that's why I can make this judgment.

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HanOfTheNekos posted...
That was uncalled for bro. I wasn't calling you stupid or anything. Just explaining the situation to Ulti in the most apparent terms.

Hell, I actually complimented you in that post. And you go and insult me.

After I had said repeatedly that the discussion is over and not to bring it up. Justified.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

UltimaterializerX posted...
From: OctilIery | #012
Lol Chris stalking me now, so pathetic.
Uh, maybe he just wants you to play LoL? I don't know any back story or whatever.


Joyrock dislikes LoL with a very strong passion, preferring. The reasons he gives are very shaky. FD has countered all of Joyrock's arguments, and in response Joyrock pretends the argument never happened.

Basically, Chris is calling Joyrock a huge hypocrite. It's fine if LoL is not his cup of tea, but he says that Joyrock actively argues against LoL and calls it bad just because.

You should look up the argument, Ulti. You'd appreciate how worked up and in a frenzy Joyrock got the LoL community.

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'Two of the six slides at six flags I assume that is why it is named that for six being its slide number. ' - Whiskey Nick

OctilIery posted...
HanOfTheNekos posted...
That was uncalled for bro. I wasn't calling you stupid or anything. Just explaining the situation to Ulti in the most apparent terms.

Hell, I actually complimented you in that post. And you go and insult me.

After I had said repeatedly that the discussion is over and not to bring it up. Justified.

Not at all. It doesn't make me stupid for explaining a side of the situation to an uneducated party. If I offended you that bad, I apologize, but you took a bit strong of an aggressive stance against me for a little reason.

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'Two of the six slides at six flags I assume that is why it is named that for six being its slide number. ' - Whiskey Nick

It's easy to assume every person on the Internet who acts obnoxious often is a troll. Thing is, I've seen a lot of Joyrock's arguments and at this point I think I can tell to some extent which ones are trolling (I still bite on some of them, but I digress). The difference is though, sometimes you can tell he actually does care enough to argue legitimately about something, something that he might have some passion about, and isn't doing it just to yank people's chain, and while he comes off as slightly more civil in these arguments he's still very... well, you can tell he doesn't "get" how certain concepts of persuasion, presentation, and argumentation work. I'm not sure if he's legitimately slow or is socially incompetent to some extent, but he clearly just doesn't understand some things.

I personally think it's a case of Internet egotism. We all want to think that everyone on the internet, and particularly in our community, is smart and well adjusted unless we're absolutely sure, because that's us, but some people just don't get things. Joyrock is basically a youtube commenter (take this as you will) that stumbled onto b8 and happens to knows how to use spellcheck.

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UltimaterializerX posted...
In joyrock's defense, the guy comes from East Nowhere, Oregon. I don't blame him for trolling people on a message board when you guys are constantly stupid enough to bite. I used to do the same crap back when I had no life, too.

Damn, Ulti. I don't know you very well yet, but this is pretty harsh. Can't a guy like joyrock just be really opinionated and passionate? I mean, I'm planning to go to law school, where this kind of thing is the norm! Just because he gets deeply involved in things you and I may feel are silly doesn't mean he deserves to be pandered. Then again, I get into furious argument about fourth-gen gaming while you (apparently) are into FFT, so maybe one man's silly is another man's hobby.

Anyway.

TDK isn't perfect to begin with, even excluding the "personal taste" line of thinking. Although it's close. The biggest problem is pacing, i.e. it drags in the middle of things. I've also read compelling arguments that it takes itself too seriously, but I happen to prefer the dead-serious approach to comic book films myself.

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I personally don't care how well adjusted any of you are socially, no. No offense.

I'm just clarifying because I think it's an insult to trolls to call Joyrock one. Or vice versa, I suppose, depending on your view of things.

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Westbrick posted...
UltimaterializerX posted...
In joyrock's defense, the guy comes from East Nowhere, Oregon. I don't blame him for trolling people on a message board when you guys are constantly stupid enough to bite. I used to do the same crap back when I had no life, too.

Damn, Ulti. I don't know you very well yet, but this is pretty harsh. Can't a guy like joyrock just be really opinionated and passionate? I mean, I'm planning to go to law school, where this kind of thing is the norm! Just because he gets deeply involved in things you and I may feel are silly doesn't mean he deserves to be pandered. Then again, I get into furious argument about fourth-gen gaming while you (apparently) are into FFT, so maybe one man's silly is another man's hobby.

Anyway.

TDK isn't perfect to begin with, even excluding the "personal taste" line of thinking. Although it's close. The biggest problem is pacing, i.e. it drags in the middle of things. I've also read compelling arguments that it takes itself too seriously, but I happen to prefer the dead-serious approach to comic book films myself.

To the first part: Pretty much. It's actually a mix of both; I'm opinionated and argumentative but I'm also typically bored(especially lately because I'm out of school and all my friends are still in there). But I also am generally pretty damn knowledgeable about the things I seriously argue about, and if someone doesn't know pretty basic information(or is misinformed) I usually don't care enough to educate them in things they should already know, because at that point it isn't worth the effort I'd be putting into it. And thus people write me off as a troll. Lopen has done this repeatedly, and has accordingly been written off repeatedly.

As for the second part - it's absolutely not perfect. I personally don't have a problem with the pacing, but I could understand it and I can accept that as a legitimate complaint. And mind you I'm not calling it perfect - I said borderline :P

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Joyrock
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From: Psycho_Kenshin | #004
It's like what porn we watch, at the end of the day it's not really indicative of much.

It's certainly indicative of what kind of porn you like.

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UltimaterializerX posted...
He can be opinionated when he isn't relying on "lol no, try again". In FPS arguments for example, he probably knows more than anyone here.

Horror too! I'm definitely one of the bigger horror fans on B8.

And if I recall correctly, FPS games was one of the times Lopen tried to argue with me. And lost. Horribly.

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Joyrock
Fresh from my first justified ban. Ever!

I'm not writing you off as a troll that's what I'm saying. I'm saying you're not a troll and legitimately do not understand.

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UltimaterializerX posted...
He can be opinionated when he isn't relying on "lol no, try again". In FPS arguments for example, he probably knows more than anyone here.

It does my heart good to read civility! Sorry if I came across like a sanctimonious ass, by the way.

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Westbrick posted...
UltimaterializerX posted...
He can be opinionated when he isn't relying on "lol no, try again". In FPS arguments for example, he probably knows more than anyone here.

It does my heart good to read civility! Sorry if I came across like a sanctimonious ass, by the way.

You didn't. Your post was just fine :)

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Joyrock
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Rad Link 5 posted...
From: Psycho_Kenshin | #004
It's like what porn we watch, at the end of the day it's not really indicative of much.
It's certainly indicative of what kind of porn you like.

That's true. But I mean, when me and friends go to see a movie for example and somebody's like "that movie sucked, how do you like it" or something, and of course internet arguments like here on b8.... I just don't think it means much at this point in my life.

It's like, you watch something, either you get something out of it and for whatever reason it engrosses you for the length or it doesn't. Sure there can be interest in discussing these things, but when just discussing if something is good or bad, more often than not it's pointless. And just taste.

Much like porn, I just use that example becauce it'd be funny if these kind of debates were about that. "You jerk it off to HER? She's got way too much make-up and she sounds weird, bro.", "Hey so what if I like a chick with an eyepatch and a pegleg, pirate chicks are hot and definitely way hotter than that chick..."

Ha and so on.

As for Joyrock, that he keeps referring to how he "won" when discussing if a piece of entertainment is good or bad with people... yeah. That's just got to go, it doesn't make any sense.

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The Dark Knight is very good but far from "borderline perfection." As mentioned, the pacing could've been better and I thought all the scenes involving Lau were... not very good. Still a top 5 superhero movie, though.

Batman Begins is way better and easily the best superhero movie of all time.

Disclaimer: There are a lot of superhero movies I haven't seen.