Current Events > Why is FF rebirth better received than FF16?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Why?

because FFXVI is the definition of a 7/10 game.

Because Rebirth is a better game so it's getting better word of mouth.

because 7 ate 16

Final Fantasy 7 is a game that a significant chunk of millennials would say is the greatest game of all time.

FFXVI was received well when it came out, but it doesn't have the enormous longterm nostalgia factor going for it.

Gobstoppers12 posted...

Final Fantasy 7 is a game that a significant chunk of millennials would say is the greatest game of all time.

FFXVI was received well when it came out, but it doesn't have the enormous longterm nostalgia factor going for it.

Pretty much this. FFXVI is stand alone, Rebirth is riding the wave of a game that's one of the most popular, over the age of 25, with a lot of extra media material

As early as I am in Rebirth, it has nowhere near the polish or production value of 16.

Despite that, I'm probably going to enjoy Rebirth due to the amount of content. The games are still both fantastic in different ways.

7 Rebirth has an entire 2 decades-long media franchise behind it.

The only thing Square was consistently good at before FF12 was character design and character writing. The FF7R trilogy leans heavily on that pedigree. Meanwhile, FF16 has maybe 2 worthwhile characters in a game that feels half-baked, still doughy on the insides.

16 gameplay loop is easy and almost shallow. The action part of the game is half baked, with QTE in most boss fights, ability timed cool downs instead of resource management,and enemy variety being low

16 RPG elements is the lowest of the entire franchise. Stats and equipment don't mean anything but keeping up with upcoming enemies stat wise. Crafting materia hunting is boring cuz there is nothing to build towards except a stronger stat stick

16 Exploration is prime Squeenix crap; wide fields with nothing to do but fight and pick up rocks. Imagine OoT Hyrule field but 8 times bigger for every zone.

16 soundtrack is very good, no issues there

16 story is whatever, but the dialog becomes repetitive and uninteresting quick. Side quests are as generic as can be so when you complete a story beat to do side quests it's often Boring dialog > boring navigating to target > passable combat, > boring dialog > meh reward. That's like 60 % of the quests, another 30% being the above minus combat

I like both but enjoy combat more in Rebirth because I can switch around. Also the open world of Rebirth is far more fun to me. You could argue it has many elements of other open world games and I wouldnt disagree but I enjoy them so far. 16 feels like anything besides the main story is tacked on because they had to. Sidequests are for the most part forgettable and I grew tired of them pretty quick.

Im still only on chapter 4 of Rebirth but I already know ill love it the full way through because the game just clicks for me. 16 is still my favorite mainline game since 10 but its not one of my top tier FF games. After all the DLC is out for 16 ill play it again on hard mode because it is fun.

The combat system is varied and enjoyable. FF16 didn't take ANY lesson from FF7 Remake and it is a bizarre decision. If you could swap to partner characters and slow down time to do actions, it would have been far better received.

I loooooooved 16 but it has some low lows.

It lacks the feverish nostalgia.

And lacks Tifa's boobs

16 is so streamlined that it is an incredibly boring game, especially for people who like RPGs. It isn't a great action game and it is a dogshit RPG. Its saving grace was the story and setting.

7 Rebirth is a straight upgrade of the already well-received 7 remake. The only thing people are upset about is it isn't a 1 to 1 retelling of Final Fantasy 7, which isn't a real criticism.

FF7 re series isn't pure action.

You can customize your characters to be OP via materia and basically just use the menus almost like an old rpg except with the caveat that you gotta mash square to build atb (unless you like running around doing nothing and blocking).
But when you got atb it is similar to command turn based in some ways.

Only thing is few fights will require more action but most you can get through like it was more or less turn based. This is from beating Remake maybe it changes in Rebirth but I think it is mostly the same.

Hayame_Zero posted...

As early as I am in Rebirth, it has nowhere near the polish or production value of 16.

Despite that, I'm probably going to enjoy Rebirth due to the amount of content. The games are still both fantastic in different ways.

The only moment I felt that way was in boss battles

FF16 has better combat, but Rebirth has a tcg card game minigame. Im torn

Japanties posted...

Meanwhile, FF16 has maybe 2 worthwhile characters in a game

Wat? Clive is pog, Joshua is pog, Cid and Mid are pog, Gav is mega pog, Hugo is pog, that one innkeeper from the town that shelters bearers is pog.
Best boy Torgal is giga pog.

LordFarquad1312 posted...

Wat? Clive is pog, Joshua is pog, Cid and Mid are pog, Gav is mega pog, Hugo is pog, that one innkeeper from the town that shelters bearers is pog.
Best boy Torgal is giga pog.

Can't forget mega pog uncle Byron.

I like both, but 16 eschews traditional RPG elements in favor of a decent combat system and fairly mid writing. The boss fights are great and everything, but if you're gonna take away the party aspect, the combat has to be out of this world to make up for it, which it wasn't. Some imaginativeness in the side quests or weapon/inventory system would've been great too. Most of it doesn't utterly fail, but only some of it truly impresses.

Because people will drool over anything 7, look at all the mid spinoffs that get worshipped by its fanboys.
And honestly for a lot of people FF7 was baby's first RPG so they will always hold it in higher regard no matter what.

Vyrulisse posted...

Because people will drool over anything 7, look at all the mid spinoffs that get worshipped by its fanboys.
And honestly for a lot of people FF7 was baby's first RPG so they will always hold it in higher regard no matter what.

Yes but not really. FFVII is well regarded for sure but it didn't stop people from not liking the Compilation due to the shitty writing and subpar gameplay in them. Then comes Remake that seems to do a lot of things right. For me, I don't have nostalgic connection with FFVII (I played it first during the pre-release of Remake) and Rebirth is hitting all the right notes for me as an RPG.

BakonBitz posted...

Yes but not really. FFVII is well regarded for sure but it didn't stop people from not liking the Compilation due to the shitty writing and subpar gameplay in them. Then comes Remake that seems to do a lot of things right. For me, I don't have nostalgic connection with FFVII (I played it first during the pre-release of Remake) and Rebirth is hitting all the right notes for me as an RPG.

That can be true too.
Also the remakes seem to be hitting typical JRPG notes that XVI actively avoided. Weird random humor, goofy minigames, anime dialogue complete with excessive grunts.

XVI was well received overall despite lout shit flingers online and by the time the next actual new FF game rolls around a lot of its haters will suddenly point to it as what "FF should be" like people do with literally every game in this series for some reason. This despite almost every creator of a Final Fantasy game saying the point of the series is that they can all be different.

Vyrulisse posted...

That can be true too.
Also the remakes seem to be hitting typical JRPG notes that XVI actively avoided. Weird random humor, goofy minigames, anime dialogue complete with excessive grunts.

Yeah, XVI definitely tried to be a lot more serious and western-oriented. I thought it was fun and interesting enough at least, but there was very little gameplay variety.

And hey, at the very least Rebirth severely toned down the grunts and random noises for the localization. That's something I'm happy for.

Vyrulisse posted...

That can be true too.
Also the remakes seem to be hitting typical JRPG notes that XVI actively avoided. Weird random humor, goofy minigames, anime dialogue complete with excessive grunts.

I'm not going to get into whether or not XVI's serious and European medieval setting is better or worse than Rebirth's because the type of storytelling for an FF is completely subjective. I think both are fine.

But I will say the "anime" dialogue and humor of Rebirth comes off as way more awkward and stilted. I don't remember it being this bad in Remake.

Vyrulisse posted...

That can be true too.
Also the remakes seem to be hitting typical JRPG notes that XVI actively avoided. Weird random humor, goofy minigames, anime dialogue complete with excessive grunts.

XVI was well received overall despite lout shit flingers online and by the time the next actual new FF game rolls around a lot of its haters will suddenly point to it as what "FF should be" like people do with literally every game in this series for some reason. This despite almost every creator of a Final Fantasy game saying the point of the series is that they can all be different.

you seem to be basing your feelings off some super small friend group or niche circle on the internet cause what youve said does lineup with the fandom at all lol

In my opinion:

16 wasnt really a game. It was a really engaging story with a fun but repetitive combat system and almost nothing else.

7Rebirth has an extremely fun combat system, tonnes of mini games, things to explore and things to do. The story is just icing on the cake

Zeeak4444 posted...

you seem to be basing your feelings off some super small friend group or niche circle on the internet cause what youve said does lineup with the fandom at all lol

Uh huh.
It literally does, people were praising XV and fucking 13 to shit on XVI when it was fresh. It's what Final Fantasy Fans do. They will be using XVI to dump on the next one just like they are using Rebirth to dump on XVI. It's a known pattern with a lot of FF fans and to deny this is silly.

Xerun posted...

16 wasnt really a game. It was a really engaging story with a fun but repetitive combat system and almost nothing else.

???

do you think the same of Dmc ?

Seaman_Prime posted...

FF16 has better combat, but Rebirth has a tcg card game minigame. Im torn

Heavily disagree with this

Vyrulisse posted...

That can be true too.
Also the remakes seem to be hitting typical JRPG notes that XVI actively avoided. Weird random humor, goofy minigames, anime dialogue complete with excessive grunts.

XVI was well received overall despite lout shit flingers online and by the time the next actual new FF game rolls around a lot of its haters will suddenly point to it as what "FF should be" like people do with literally every game in this series for some reason. This despite almost every creator of a Final Fantasy game saying the point of the series is that they can all be different.

Nobody ever called FF13 "what FF should be"

also I don't think it is really that 16 isn't well received but how many people have even played it?

I bet a lot of people bought PS5 to play Rebirth. Many of them are invested from Remake on the PS4.

Not to mention as Final Fantasy fans that makes 2 games exclusive as of this moment to the PS5 making the buy in easier to stomach (even if rumor is 16 comes to PC in april or may).

After Rebirth boosts PS5 sales I bet more people actually play 16.

BakonBitz posted...

Yeah, XVI definitely tried to be a lot more serious and western-oriented. I thought it was fun and interesting enough at least, but there was very little gameplay variety.

And hey, at the very least Rebirth severely toned down the grunts and random noises for the localization. That's something I'm happy for.

Honestly, it was not that much of a problem for me, I like Final Fantasy games having different themes, but even so, being serious doesn't prevent from having some minigames. See the witcher 3 and Gwent for example

yea It has good score

https://www.metacritic.com/game/final-fantasy-xvi/

well received must then not be critical score but how many people are rushing out to buy it

then in that case it was the failure of the PS5 to not really have much reason to buy it last year about this time
"NO GAMES!"

Vyrulisse posted...

Uh huh.
It literally does, people were praising XV and fucking 13 to shit on XVI when it was fresh. It's what Final Fantasy Fans do. They will be using XVI to dump on the next one just like they are using Rebirth to dump on XVI. It's a known pattern with a lot of FF fans and to deny this is silly.

I mean... I know a lot of people who were disapointed with FF16, but still like the main story and soundtrack(duh) that really enjoy rebirth

Also FF16 is a game that gives a pretty good first impression, but you notice the flaws when you progress in game since the highs are really high and the lows are really low

epik_fail1 posted...

Nobody ever called FF13 "what FF should be"

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/c/c1d8c664.png

ellis123 posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/c/c1d8c664.png

to be fair there was a lot of trolling going on back in the FF13 days. Many people liked FF13 no doubt but there were also a lot of trolls who knew that by aggressively liking FF13 they could easily troll the FF fanbase and not be modded for it.

WingsOfGood posted...

to be fair there was a lot of trolling going on back in the FF13 days. Many people liked FF13 no doubt but there were also a lot of trolls who knew that by aggressively liking FF13 they could easily troll the FF fanbase and not be modded for it.

And FFXIII was popular for people who grew up on it in the same way that it was for people who grew up on IV/VI. It goes both ways.

ellis123 posted...

And FFXIII was popular for people who grew up on it in the same way that it was for people who grew up on IV/VI. It goes both ways.

I find most FF fans like a whole slew of them actually no matter which was their first. Example, guy who played 8 first likes FF1-FFX. That is 10 games from different eras more or less.

The thing about FFXIII in which it was able to troll the fanbase was Square gave off stupid excuses that never made sense like "cannot make towns anymore" and "we wanted classes to match up with Call of Duty". So you go into aggressive mode saying FFXIII is not only the best FF but the others aren't very good and you got yourself the easiest trolling you could ever do.

WingsOfGood posted...

I find most FF fans like a whole slew of them actually no matter which was their first. Example, guy who played 8 first likes FF1-FFX. That is 10 games from different eras more or less.

The thing about FFXIII in which it was able to troll the fanbase was Square gave off stupid excuses that never made sense like "cannot make towns anymore" and "we wanted classes to match up with Call of Duty". So you go into aggressive mode saying FFXIII is not only the best FF but the others aren't very good and you got yourself the easiest trolling you could ever do.

That has nothing to do with what I said at all? FFXIII was liked by people who played in their childhood pretty universally, and those same people liked other FF's: just like you said.

ellis123 posted...

and those same people liked other FF's: just like you said.

yes, those who generally liked FFXIII often liked the others FFs

I was just pointing out that FFXIII had A LOT of trolling going on during its time. You would find those trolling on the XIII board weren't about liking other FF.

WingsOfGood posted...

yes, those who generally liked FFXIII often liked the others FFs

I was just pointing out that FFXIII had A LOT of trolling going on during its time. You would find those trolling on the XIII board weren't about liking other FF.

Okay? And the screen grab was just a quick one off of Google from a year ago, waaaaay more recent than "during its time." Thus anything about trolling from that time period doesn't apply.

It's pretty interesting how different XVI and Rebirth are. XVI definitely is majorly lacking in RPG elements so it could only really hold my attention for the first playthrough, I started a NG+ run but quickly got bored. It definitely has good graphics, presentation and soundtrack and a decent combat system but pretty average otherwise. The world felt pretty empty still.

Rebirth on the other hand is like completely opposite, tons of RPG elements and activities for you to engage in, one might argue too many and it still has good combat, music, dialogue etc. Can't comment on story yet since I'm only on chapter 7. I'm not entirely sure if they have the right balance of all these things yet, in particular the side activities. I don't mind doing them as long as the rewards are worth it but there are so many and some are really pretty challenging. But it's much closer to being an amazing game than FFXVI is and perhaps the parts I'm unsure of will fully win me over before the end, really just depends how satisfying the progression is for going through all of it.

ellis123 posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/c/c1d8c664.png

Nobody might be an exageration, but most people who didn't like FF13 didn't start magically liking it later.

Also even the worst ff games usually have a decent soundtrack

epik_fail1 posted...

Nobody might be an exageration, but most people who didn't like FF13 didn't start magically liking it later.

Yeah. I think the phenomenon is moreso that people who didn't like the game moved on, while the people who did like the game stayed and made themselves more vocal. Happens with Zelda, too.

BakonBitz posted...

Yeah. I think the phenomenon is moreso that people who didn't like the game moved on, while the people who did like the game stayed and made themselves more vocal. Happens with Zelda, too.

Exactly, the game left a bitter taste in my mouth, but I won't shit on people's enjoyment

Bonus points for being Final Fantasy 7

WingsOfGood posted...

???

do you think the same of Dmc ?

Never played it. So couldnt tell you

but what I mean is:

theres no loot or anything to find in the world. Not even a single secret

all weapons are straight linear upgrades with no elemental focus

even magic has no real use and is just kind of there to be a small ranged attack

there are no minigames or anything to break up the gameplay.

while there is some really fun stuff you can do with the different Eikon abilities. The amount of abilities you have at endgame is roughly the amount of abilities you have in chapter 1 of Rebirth. (Although thats 1 character to 5).

limiting those abilities to 6 really does limit what you can do.

even Torgal never gains anything new

I loved my story time in FF16, but combat against enemies was incredibly boring after the first hour. Bosses were fun but still kinda boring. The only really stand out part were the Eikon battles which were absolutely worth it.

but as a game I felt it was extremely lacklustre

Nostalgia is the biggest factor, but I think there's more variety in gameplay in FF7R than there was in FF16 that ultimately makes one game have more self expression than the other. Plus FF7R story, so far anyways, hasn't done anything to piss off anyone from its fanbase. Everyone seems to enjoy the new direction it's going, which plays a big role why the nostalgia factor is working in favor of the game.

The problem with Final Fantasy 16 is that it's a Final Fantasy game in name only.
Great game, but not a great Final Fantasy game.