Current Events > Question for those against reopening the country...

(+) Yeah! (+)

XboxLegendary posted...

What's your endgame? Be honest. Do you think we should the shutter the economy the rest of the year?

Keep it closed all of next year?

Keep it closed until there's a vaccine?

How about keep it closed until delta new cases are negative for 14 consecutive days like every fucking expert on the planet says it should be.

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red states are largely rural and more spread apart from each other and testing is not anywhere near as intense in most of them. naturally its going to take longer for stuff to spread across somewhere like south carolina than it is new york, so the delay in shutting stuff down to flatten the curve wasn't as harmful as it was for majorly populated cities.

the problem is when they reopen, they're absolutely going to crawl up to the point of getting much more widespread outbreaks eventually. everyone acknowledges this, even the government is expecting it and deciding it's a worthwhile sacrifice. so going "maybe those states just magically wont get the virus once mass groupings resume and large scale interstate travel is more common" is more than a little misguided

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XboxLegendary posted...

What's your endgame?

5 million tests a day and contact tracing for all positive results

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KillingMachine posted...

Now is the time to fast-track automation. Things were heading in that direction anyway, the pandemic is good reason to accelerate it.

Statements like this are why the right thinks this is all overblown. too many people jumping for joy at not going to work and hoping it'll last forever. At least give a sign that when a more ligit all clear call comes out, you'll get beck to work without complaint it you don't want people to think you're just faking the country being sick.

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There is always risk in life. So I guess people are just willing to stay at home forever for something that still hasn't killed as many people as the swine flu which we did nothing about.

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XboxLegendary posted...

What's your endgame?

Keeping the virus from spreading and making sure all the social distancing and stay home orders were not in vain.

But sure undo all that because you want a haircut or the mask hurts your face.

lilJoe457 posted...

There is always risk in life. So I guess people are just willing to stay at home forever for something that still hasn't killed as many people as the swine flu which we did nothing about.

The most extreme swine flu estimates place the worldwide death toll at 575,000 in a year. Over 300K people have died of covid in a few months

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lilJoe457 posted...

There is always risk in life. So I guess people are just willing to stay at home forever for something that still hasn't killed as many people as the swine flu which we did nothing about.

so whats your proposal? Open up now and when the next wave hits just stay open through it? Let the virus spread to everyone in the whole country just to get it over with?

all reopening too early will do is cause another shutdown to be needed, unless people want this to be a continuous thing all year round

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got no respect for trolls posting hot takes on freshly minted troll accounts so...

KiwiTerraRizing posted...

I want whatever upsets you personally.

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monkmith posted...

got no respect for trolls posting hot takes on freshly minted troll accounts so...

>account made in 2014
>>freshly minted

Reopening should happen on a voluntary basis. Businesses that want to reopen should, and employees that want to return to work should.

If a business doesn't want to reopen now then they can stay closed and collect government assistance. Employees who don't feel safe going back to work can stay home and collect unemployment.

As far as consumers go it's your choice if you want to go out and shop and if you don't want too then you can stay at home. Either way it should be your choice and not being forced by the government in either direction.

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lilJoe457 posted...

There is always risk in life. So I guess people are just willing to stay at home forever for something that still hasn't killed as many people as the swine flu which we did nothing about.

In America, COVID-19 has dwarfed swine flu and already beaten the normal flu in deaths

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Heavy_D_Forever posted...

Reopening should happen on a voluntary basis. Businesses that want to reopen should, and employees that want to return to work should.

If a business doesn't want to reopen now then they can stay closed and collect government assistance. Employees who don't feel safe going back to work can stay home and collect unemployment.

As far as consumers go it's your choice if you want to go out and shop and if you don't want too then you can stay at home. Either way it should be your choice and not being forced by the government in either direction.

Society would collapse if we all just did what we wanted. It's a lot more complicated when multiple people exist within a society.

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Heavy_D_Forever posted...

Reopening should happen on a voluntary basis. Businesses that want to reopen should, and employees that want to return to work should.

If a business doesn't want to reopen now then they can stay closed and collect government assistance. Employees who don't feel safe going back to work can stay home and collect unemployment.

As far as consumers go it's your choice if you want to go out and shop and if you don't want too then you can stay at home. Either way it should be your choice and not being forced by the government in either direction.

Have we asked SARS-CoV-2 its opinion on whether or not it'd like businesses to reopen?

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lightwarrior78 posted...

Statements like this are why the right thinks this is all overblown. too many people jumping for joy at not going to work and hoping it'll last forever. At least give a sign that when a more ligit all clear call comes out, you'll get beck to work without complaint it you don't want people to think you're just faking the country being sick.

Why do you want to work just to work? Automation should always be the endgame, pandemic or none. The more we can automate, the better

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Heavy_D_Forever posted...

Reopening should happen on a voluntary basis. Businesses that want to reopen should, and employees that want to return to work should.

If a business doesn't want to reopen now then they can stay closed and collect government assistance. Employees who don't feel safe going back to work can stay home and collect unemployment.

As far as consumers go it's your choice if you want to go out and shop and if you don't want too then you can stay at home. Either way it should be your choice and not being forced by the government in either direction.

the problem is some businesses CAN'T stay open unless certain others do as well. that's why so many jobs that most people would never have thought of as essential are considered essential.

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hockeybub89 posted...

Society would collapse if we all just did what we wanted. It's a lot more complicated when multiple people exist within a society.

This. A business can't survive if only 20% of it's employees show up.

If people don't want to return to work, that's their decision. Unemployment won't last forever though.

XboxLegendary posted...

This. A business can't survive if only 20% of it's employees show up.

If people don't want to return to work, that's their decision. Unemployment won't last forever though.

A business can't survive if its employees don't feel safe coming back to work. What's the solution, then?

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It all depends on the death rate. Like, am I more likely to die of corona virus than I am from a car accident? Honest question. If I'm more likely to die from a car crash, then I take my chances and reopen slowly.

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Close your account TC.

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The23rdMagus posted...

A business can't survive if its employees don't feel safe coming back to work. What's the solution, then?

Simple. That business can hire new employees who do feel safe enough to work.
ZMythos posted...

Close your account TC.

Aw HECK naw.

XboxLegendary posted...

Simple. That business can hire new employees who do feel safe enough to work.

And when they get sick, what then?

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The23rdMagus posted...

And when they get sick, what then?

I work at a facility with hundreds of employees and are in constant contact with the public. There have been zero covid outbreaks.

XboxLegendary posted...

I work at a facility with hundreds of employees and are in constant contact with the public. There have been zero covid outbreaks.

Good for you.

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Kazi1212 posted...

It all depends on the death rate. Like, am I more likely to die of corona virus than I am from a car accident? Honest question. If I'm more likely to die from a car crash, then I take my chances and reopen slowly.

Yes, its roughly the same.

"For many hotbeds, the risk of death is in the same level roughly as dying from a car accident during daily commute. For example, the average commute is 31.5 miles per day for Americans according to the American Driving Survey and 44.2 miles per day round trip in Sweden. The highest daily risk of COVID-19 death (in New York) corresponds to a bit less than the risk of dying in a traffic accident while traveling daily from Manhattan to Rochester, NY round trip for these 49 days of COVID-19 fatalities-period. These per day risk estimates as of May 1 are a bit higher than those that we had estimated in the previous version of this work based on data as of April 4. However, given that the deaths have already peaked in most, if not all, examined locations, it is likely that the final perday estimated death risks when the waves mature will become again lower.

People <65 years old have very small risks of COVID-19 death even in pandemic epicenters and deaths for people <65 years without underlying predisposing conditions are remarkably uncommon. Strategies focusing specifically on protecting high-risk elderly individuals should be considered in managing the pandemic."

Source: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.05.20054361v2.full.pdf

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The23rdMagus posted...

Good for you.

Your argument kind of goes out the window when fearmongering doesn't work, huh?

XboxLegendary posted...

Your argument kind of goes out the window when fearmongering doesn't work, huh?

Not really. It doesn't represent what else is going on in the country. It's like saying world hunger doesn't exist because you ate lunch.

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I'm in Arkansas. We never technically shut down but restrictions are starting to lift. You can't extrapolate from this few days points but the last few days (since restrictions began lifting) have been the worst in terms of new hospitalization and new cases. So we're delaying phase 2 where more restrictions were lifted. I just question the logic of slow rolling the reopening when we should ramp up testing capacity and PPE first

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XboxLegendary posted...

I work at a facility with hundreds of employees and are in constant contact with the public. There have been zero covid outbreaks.

sure

has everyone been tested?

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The23rdMagus posted...

Not really. It doesn't represent what else is going on in the country. It's like saying world hunger doesn't exist because you ate lunch.

People need to stop being extreme on both sides. You can go outside and be around people and not get the virus, I've been going to the store almost every day during this whole thing. At the same time there is a threat and it's too soon to be having large gatherings like concerts and sporting events.

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Heavy_D_Forever posted...

Employees who don't feel safe going back to work can stay home and collect unemployment.

Well except in states where you lose your job and unemployment eligibility if they re-open and you don't return to work.

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Heavy_D_Forever posted...

People need to stop being extreme on both sides. You can go outside and be around people and not get the virus, I've been going to the store almost every day during this whole thing. At the same time there is a threat and it's too soon to be having large gatherings like concerts and sporting events.

Look. I've got asthma and a few of my best friends are immunocompromised, and I live in a large city. I'm taking this as seriously as I am because it's very much a matter of life and death. And every time, I get some bullshit variation of "stay home if you're scared". I'm staying home because I give a shit about other people, including myself.

What I want is to be able to go see and hug my dad without worrying I'll get a call from the hospital ten days later.

The experts are saying it's too early to meet the criteria for reopening. I'll believe them over some blowhard with a Twitter account and a team of tacticool cosplayers.

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The23rdMagus posted...

The experts are saying it's too early to meet the criteria for reopening. I'll believe them over some blowhard with a Twitter account and a team of tacticool cosplayers.

I think a hard part of all this is that different areas are in completely different situations. Some states/countries have experts saying it's perfectly fine to reopen while other places are definitely not in a safe time to reopen.

Stay safe man and follow the guidelines of the officials in your area.


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XboxLegendary posted...

>account made in 2014
>>freshly minted

Cant help but notice you didnt deny the trolling part.

Heavy_D_Forever posted...

I think a hard part of all this is that different areas are in completely different situations. Some states/countries have experts saying it's perfectly fine to reopen while other places are definitely not in a safe time to reopen.

Stay safe man and follow the guidelines of the officials in your area.

Some states have politicians saying it's perfectly fine, and the experts are disagreeing.

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I'm working still. I haven't ran into any sort of traffic at all even going to lunch is amazing. This is my only reason for the country staying closed while it is very selfish of me I much prefer to stay like this. Store I've been going too that have reopen don't let crowds go to them only 2 people per family tops.

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Odoylerules posted...

I hope the country falls apart so trump loses.

seems this doesnt need to happen for him to lose

hes terrified of vote by mail
t this must mean that if this becomes a thing countrywide he ll lose

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hockeybub89 posted...

SodomInsane posted...

People be so doom and gloom. What happens if the red states end up not having bad outbreaks and it just the blue states like NY, New Jersey, Massachusetts, and California that get the worst of it. The places where the liberals are most vocal about the US being shut down.

"We need to open up America, but fuck important parts of it because they're liberal. We can survive without them."

We really just need to get it over with and abolish the country. Let 50+ countries operate on their own.

This has reaffirmed my view more so than ever that America really needs to split into multiple smaller countries

Then every state or territory can do whatever it wants without feeling beholden to a federal government
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