Current Events > Who is Maya? Why is JK Rowling canceled? Why is she talking about sex?

(+) Yeah! (+)

ThyCorndog posted...

makes sense. but I guess I'm just a more pragmatic leftist and prefer not to make enemies out of allies

So just a little bigotry is okay as long as you're not too obnoxious about it?

---

ThyCorndog posted...

It's a little strange to me that someone basically needs to agree with 100% of all progressive stances in order to not be considered a garbage human being, but whatever. I have no dog in this fight. I don't know who maya is and couldnt give less of a shit about rowling or potter. I'm just first hearing about "terfs" itt

It's more that she has constantly put herself out as a progressive and someone who cares about the marginalised. Her books have often been about the "little guy" standing up for what is right.

And then she goes and shits on a marginalised group and a little guy.

---

shockthemonkey posted...

Shes not an ally to trans people. If she was a racist feminist, would you support her as an ally?

the thing is you're going to run out of allies if you only rely on people who are 100% on your side on every issue

---

Funkydog posted...

It's more that she has constantly put herself out as a progressive and someone who cares about the marginalised. Her books have often been about the "little guy" standing up for what is right.

And then she goes and shits on a marginalised group and a little guy.

this is fair. I forgot about the times in the past she was in the spotlight. I didn't really keep up with her and I only heard about it through secondhand accounts. that hermione stuff I think?

---

People talk about "the left eating itself" as some unique phenomenon like they've never heard the term RINO
---

ThyCorndog posted...

the thing is you're going to run out of allies if you only rely on people who are 100% on your side on every issue

So some racists need to be tolerated? Is that what I'm hearing? What amount of racism is permissible?

---

darkphoenix181 posted...

This is why famous authors, etc shouldn't attempt to be social activists. Well, not the twitter kind at least.

All this time J.K. thought she was a powerful advocate.
She made hermione black despite the book literally describing her as white previously.
https://www.quora.com/Is-Hermione-Granger-necessarily-white
Then she made dumbledore gay.

Surely, she is the epitome of progressiveness for these attempts.
But then she keeps speaking her mind. This is usually how it goes.

Uh oh, something she and others do not see eye to eye with.
And now she is doubling down and it will get worse until she either apologizes or she gets the H.P. Lovecraft treatment.
Apology might not be enough at this point though.

Lmao what is the HP Lovecraft treatment? Last I checked the mans books and stories are still utterly beloved, and people have always known he was a massive shitstain

---

ThyCorndog posted...

this is fair. I forgot about the times in the past she was in the spotlight. I didn't really keep up with her and I only heard about it through secondhand accounts. that hermione stuff I think?

Hermione being played by a black person in a play adaptation (or her support of it, I'm not sure how much role she had in the choice for the stage adaptation honestly) and then the Dumbledore "actually being gay" are some of the bigger stances she has taken in her efforts to appear progressive/supportive, yes.

---

shockthemonkey posted...

What great things has JK Rowling done as an ally to trans people? You keep using the word ally but an ally to who?

I don't mean ally in the progressive sense. I mean it in the literal sense of like, for example, people who will vote with you on the same things politically etc
you know, the opposite of enemy. not like "LGBT ally" or whatever

---

Antifar posted...

People talk about "the left eating itself" as some unique phenomenon like they've never heard the term RINO

That is a thing too. As seen with the recent spat between figures like Nick Fuentes and his Groyper fans antagonizing Charlie Kirk and Turning Point USA.

But it seems more frequent, or at least more visible, on the left.

ThyCorndog posted...

I don't mean ally in the progressive sense. I mean it in the literal sense of like, for example, people who will vote with you on the same things politically etc
you know, the opposite of enemy. not like "LGBT ally" or whatever

TERFs tend to vote conservative and team up with the far right.

---

Esrac posted...

Contrapoints is a progressive, social justice activist transwoman on youtube. You can just search her on youtube.

Oh, so you don't have any actual scientific research paper or biologist showing medical data.

Meaning you have no scientific evidence whatsoever to back up your claim.

---

wormwyrmwyvern posted...

TERFs tend to vote conservative and team up with the far right.

Damn I didn't know JK Rowling was a conservative.

---

shockthemonkey posted...

Do you think people correctly pointing out that shes a TERF will change which party she votes for?

I guess not

wormwyrmwyvern posted...

TERFs tend to vote conservative and team up with the far right.

is that really true? I've never heard of a feminist voting conservative, on any large scale anyway

---

Lol this is like when feminist Margaret Atwood was attacked on Twitter for saying metoo was turned into a witchhunt.

darkjedilink posted...

Oh, so you don't have any actual scientific research paper or biologist showing medical data.

Meaning you have no scientific evidence whatsoever to back up your claim.

I don't think you're quoting the right person here.

ThyCorndog posted...

I guess not

is that really true? I've never heard of a feminist voting conservative, on any large scale anyway

I haven't checked, but I would doubt that. The RF in TERF still stands for "Radical Feminist", which is still a very left wing position. The only thing they don't share is acceptance of transwomen as women.

Phewfus posted...

Lol this is like when feminist Margaret Atwood was attacked on Twitter for saying metoo was turned into a witchhunt.

Yes it's exactly like another rich white woman getting correctly criticized for having a yikes take.
darkjedilink posted...

Oh, so you don't have any actual scientific research paper or biologist showing medical data.

Meaning you have no scientific evidence whatsoever to back up your claim.

Contrapoints does. Watch her.

---

friendbuddypal posted...

Yes it's exactly like another rich white woman getting correctly criticized for having a yikes take.

Contrapoints does. Watch her.

No one wants to watch Contrapoints. May as well say "Watch Aydin Paladin she has studies".

friendbuddypal posted...

Contrapoints does. Watch her.

I'm not giving ad revenue to someone who agrees with you. YOU watch the video, and link me her sources.

---

ThyCorndog posted...

I don't mean ally in the progressive sense. I mean it in the literal sense of like, for example, people who will vote with you on the same things politically etc
you know, the opposite of enemy. not like "LGBT ally" or whatever

She is actively demonising trans people and pushing for equality laws that protect them to no longer protect them. She is essentially taking an active stance against them and can in no way be called an ally.

---

The label of feminist or a history of feminism/other progressive movements doesn't protect you from criticism for saying dumb stuff later. If MLK was still alive and was talking about rounding up gay people, all his activism wouldn't make that view any less trash.

---

friendbuddypal posted...

Yeah shocking how someone has to reject all bigoted fascist viewpoints in order to not be considered a bigoted fascist.

Since when is anti transgender rhetoric a specfically facist view?

---

Funkydog posted...

She is actively demonising trans people and pushing for equality laws that protect them to no longer protect them. She is essentially taking an active stance against them and can in no way be called an ally.

what about ally on every issue except trans rights tho?

but I concede this earlier point to that
[LFAQs-redacted-quote]



---

please stop giving friendbuddypal attention. he's an alt righter that's pretending to be a "far left sjw"

---

friendbuddypal posted...

Yes it's exactly like another rich white woman getting correctly criticized for having a yikes take.

Maybe the problem is assuming everybody on the left agrees with each other.

It's like how the atheist internet movement fell apart after they realized they had nothing in common aside from being atheist.

ThyCorndog posted...

what about ally on every issue except trans rights tho?

but I concede this earlier point to that

She is an ally to trans people, just not on trans issues?

Like, I genuinely don't get what you are trying to say.

---

pikachupwnage posted...

Since when is anti transgender rhetoric a specfically facist view?

Are you unaware of the alt-right and 45's anti-trans policies?

---

shockthemonkey posted...

Do you think people correctly pointing out that shes a TERF will change which party she votes for?

She already doesn't vote Labour! She's a billionaire,
---

RebelElite791 posted...

Lmao what is the HP Lovecraft treatment? Last I checked the mans books and stories are still utterly beloved, and people have always known he was a massive s***stain

You cannot mention his work nowadays without it being pointed out.

So it will be that in any HP discussion someone will be like "JK Rowling is a terrible person, just wanted you to know this."

Unless she fixes this ofc.

Funkydog posted...

She is an ally to trans people

you don't get what i'm saying cause I didn't say this. I explicitly pointed out what I wasn't saying this. I'm saying she's probably generally a progressive and an ally in general progressive issues, even if she isn't on the trans issue. I don't know what you're confused about tbh. thought I seemed clear

---

Funkydog posted...

She is an ally to trans people, just not on trans issues?

Like, I genuinely don't get what you are trying to say.

He didn't say ally to trans people. He's saying she is an ally to progressive causes on the whole. Save this specific one, apparently.

Antifar posted...

She already doesn't vote Labour! She's a billionaire,

Damn, this is disgusting news.

---

ThyCorndog posted...

you don't get what i'm saying cause I didn't say this. I explicitly pointed out what I wasn't saying this. I'm saying she's probably generally a progressive and an ally in general progressive issues, even if she isn't on the trans issue. I don't know what you're confused about tbh. thought I seemed clear

Ah, that's fair enough then. I apologise for the misunderstanding.

I do think she is generally progressive, or at least wants to be seen as such. But that doesn't mean she shouldn't be called out when she then turns into the very thing she calls out/demonises on other issues.

---

darkphoenix181 posted...

You cannot mention his work nowadays without it being pointed out.

So it will be that in any HP discussion someone will be like "JK Rowling is a terrible person, just wanted you to know this."

Unless she fixes this ofc.

Yeah. But what he's saying is no one really cares that it gets pointed out. Yeah, Lovecraft was a racist and anti-racist like to point it out, but so what? His writing is still highly regarded in spite of that and almost no one pays attention to the anti-racists who shit on him.

Rebel, if I'm reading him right, is saying that Lovecraft's racism hasn't had a meaningful negative impact on his legacy as a writer and Rowling not being pro-trans isn't likely going to have a meaningful negative impact on the legacy of her writing.

Lovecraft is dead though.

Funkydog posted...

Ah, that's fair enough then. I apologise for the misunderstanding.

I do think she is generally progressive, or at least wants to be seen as such. But that doesn't mean she shouldn't be called out when she then turns into the very thing she calls out/demonises on other issues.

calling out is fair. my initial point was I just didn't get why someone has to agree on 100% of progressive issues in order to not be #cancelled or whatever. cause there really aren't that many people that are going to be 100% progressive on every issue. most people have some sort of problem with something that would make it so they meet that criteria. it's like vegans who hate vegetarians cause they don't take it all the way. you gotta basically choose between purity or actually getting the things you want done a lot of the time (not all the time). not saying i'm a proponent of gradual change, but i'm definitely a proponent of getting as many people on your side as possible

---

JE19426 posted...

Maya Forstater is a woman who war fire

I know this is supposed to be "was fired", I just wanted to say "the woman who wore fire" sounds so fucking badass, like some sort of mythological diety

---

Kolibri X posted...

Progressives turning on each other for not agreeing on some random issue. Funny, but nothing new.

This is a hot ass take on the validity of trans people

---

Antifar posted...

She already doesn't vote Labour! She's a billionaire,

I mean, source? Everything ive read has her voting for and donating to labour. Plenty of things to criticize her for other than shes rich so shes evil@

---

darkphoenix181 posted...

Lovecraft is dead though.

And Rowling is worth 600 - 700 million dollars. She doesn't have to worry about what some pissed off pro-trans people on twitter and dying gaming message boards think about her political positions.

She doesn't even have to really worry about what news media outlets say about her positions on trans-rights.

Because, A: her fanbase isn't going to abandon Harry Potter en masse over it, and B: arguably most people aren't going to disagree with her because the general population isn't yet quite as on board with trans-rights as they are with race and even gay rights.

How much she worries about it up to how much she personally cares.

shockthemonkey posted...

You can let her be an ally when its appropriate and still call out her bullshit when shes spouting it. What has she done as an ally that makes her worth defending when shes being anti-trans?

I agree with your first half. for the second half i'm not defending her cause I said

couldnt give less of a shit about rowling

I'm not straying from that cause rowling is just a vehicle for my larger point. you can crucify her all you want cause she means nothing to me

---

ThyCorndog posted...

calling out is fair. my initial point was I just didn't get why someone has to agree on 100% of progressive issues in order to not be #cancelled or whatever. cause there really aren't that many people that are going to be 100% progressive on every issue. most people have some sort of problem with something that would make it so they meet that criteria. it's like vegans who hate vegetarians cause they don't take it all the way. you gotta basically choose between purity or actually getting the things you want done a lot of the time (not all the time). not saying i'm a proponent of gradual change, but i'm definitely a proponent of getting as many people on your side as possible

If people want to call her to be #cancelled they can I guess, but it's never gonna actually happen. Potter Mayhem is far bigger and largely beyond her now. At best, her future books will likely just not have the fanbase behind them.

And I think this issue is different to the vegan/vegetarian thing. In this matter, Rowling is actively supporting someone who wants laws changed that protect trans people as the Equality Act in the UK gives them the same rights as anyone else to not face discrimination. By changing this, she is actively campaigning against them and for the erosion of basic rights which future people will want to use to allow them to discriminate against people because of sexuality/race as well.

It isn't about her not being "fully progressive" but an active opponent at this point. She is actively calling for less rights and is making her stance as enemy of trans people known. If she was simply dismissive or doing nothing, that would be entirely different. But in her efforts to "support women" she has shown she is willing to step on the little guy she has long claimed to support.

---

Funkydog posted...

If people want to call her to be #cancelled they can I guess, but it's never gonna actually happen. Potter Mayhem is far bigger and largely beyond her now. At best, her future books will likely just not have the fanbase behind them.

And I think this issue is different to the vegan/vegetarian thing. In this matter, Rowling is actively supporting someone who wants laws changed that protect trans people as the Equality Act in the UK gives them the same rights as anyone else to not face discrimination. By changing this, she is actively campaigning against them and for the erosion of basic rights which future people will want to use to allow them to discriminate against people because of sexuality/race as well.

It isn't about her not being "fully progressive" but an active opponent at this point. She is actively calling for less rights and is making her stance as enemy of trans people known. If she was simply dismissive or doing nothing, that would be entirely different. But in her efforts to "support women" she has shown she is willing to step on the little guy she has long claimed to support.

fair enough. I don't know anything about rowlings beliefs except people were acting like she was super progressive before, so I was just going by that assumption

---