Current Events > Apparently the Supergirl actress was in an abusive relationship

(+) Yeah! (+)

Lol from what i read from this topic

"LMAO just leave you idiot"

Its never that easy
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Paper_Okami posted...

joe40001 posted...

That's an excuse.

Fine, it's hard. They still should get the fuck out. It's insulting to them to imply they don't have that agency.

yup, you don't get it
It has been explained to you a million times and you refuse to understand

What has been explained?

"It's hard"

Ok, so what? Are you saying they should stay in relationships where they are physically abused then?
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kkTheKiller42 posted...

Lol from what i read from this topic

"LMAO just leave you idiot"

Its never that easy

She eventually did leave the relationship so clearly it was possible.

I don't get what you are arguing, she should've stayed because it's too hard to leave?
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@joe40001 do you not understand how emotions/feelings work? Serious question because I know a lot of online folks are bad at normal human interaction/emotional responses. They tend to think in purely logical terms like Vulcans.

No you're argument is that it's super easy when it's not. It took her a long time before she ever even did it. It was a long and hard process filled with empty promises from the other guy and her always forgiving him before she's had enough
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lolife67 posted...

@joe40001 do you not understand how emotions/feelings work? Serious question because I know a lot of online folks are bad at normal human interaction/emotional responses. They tend to think in purely logical terms like Vulcans.

There's nothing wrong with being logical.

If the question is "should we have empathy for people in abusive relationships" the answer is yes

But if the question is "should people in abusive relationships stay in abusive relationships because leaving them can be 'hard'" the answer is hell fucking no.

It's crazy that's at all controversial
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dave_is_slick posted...

Zikten posted...

one time her boyfriend tore her iris of her eye

What the fuck??

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joe40001 posted...

DrizztLink posted...

joe40001 posted...

It's not trivial to leave but if somebody is abusing you, you owe it to yourself to get the fuck out. I think it's more destructive to come up with a bunch of excuses for people in abusive relationships to stay.

We're not coming up with excuses, we're trying to explain to you that it's not that fucking easy.

That's an excuse.

Fine, it's hard. They still should get the fuck out. It's insulting to them to imply they don't have that agency.

Not that I wish it on anyone, but let's see you or one of your loved ones go through it and see just how "easy" it is to get out. Those who haven't gone through it won't truly understand what it's like until it happens to them. And don't you fucking DARE try to say you have, because your responses here say otherwise.
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joe somehow managed to immediately leave a situation where people wanted to hang out with him for once so I can see how his appreciation of this is skewed

joe40001 posted...

But if the question is "should people in abusive relationships stay in abusive relationships because leaving them can be 'hard'" the answer is hell fucking no.

We're not saying they should, we're showing basic fucking empathy for why they don't just nope the hell out at the first sign.

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kkTheKiller42 posted...

No you're argument is that it's super easy when it's not. It took her a long time before she ever even did it. It was a long and hard process filled with empty promises from the other guy and her always forgiving him before she's had enough

I never said it was easy. Just obvious.

And her forgiving a person who physically abuses her is a stupid thing for her to do. I'm not saying she deserved to suffer more but she shouldn't do that shit.

Enabling abusers is shitty. Besides if you are on good enough terms to reconcile you are on good enough terms to leave.

Yeah it's hard, and it's horrible you ever suffered, but you need to get the fuck out.

Look, we have some options, if we all just want to say "you poor helpless flower, every single thing you did was perfect because you were a victim and lying about what is and isn't a good strategy is appropriate because we can't both be sympathetic and logical at the same time" I can play that game, I don't think it's the best game but I can play it.

But if we want to be real and talk about "you know what, physical abuse in relationships is HORRIBLE and we should advocate for people to escape it in whatever way possible, so as little of it happens in the world as possible" that's a different conversation and one I'd rather have.

The best strategy to prevent problems is not to be immobilized by sadness that the problem exists but to talk in realistic terms about the way to deal with it. And the way to deal with physical abuse in relationships is to gtfo and tell police if necessary. It is not to constantly run back into the abusers arms or tell the victims they are helpless to escape.
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Monferno_AQW posted...

joe40001 posted...

DrizztLink posted...

joe40001 posted...

It's not trivial to leave but if somebody is abusing you, you owe it to yourself to get the fuck out. I think it's more destructive to come up with a bunch of excuses for people in abusive relationships to stay.

We're not coming up with excuses, we're trying to explain to you that it's not that fucking easy.

That's an excuse.

Fine, it's hard. They still should get the fuck out. It's insulting to them to imply they don't have that agency.

Not that I wish it on anyone, but let's see you or one of your loved ones go through it and see just how "easy" it is to get out. Those who haven't gone through it won't truly understand what it's like until it happens to them. And don't you fucking DARE try to say you have, because your responses here say otherwise.

I never said it was easy. But unless you are down with people being abused advocating people "nope" the fuck out of situations where they get physically abused is by far the best strategy.
I'd rather hurt somebody's feelings and save them from a beating from a fucked up boyfriend then coddle them and tell them they are helpless and a victim and send them right back to his fists.

I'm sorry you disagree.
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joe40001 posted...

You tell a person they are a helpless victim long enough they are going to believe it.

You almost understood the point people are making, but you fucked it up at the finish line.
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pegusus123456 posted...

joe40001 posted...

You tell a person they are a helpless victim long enough they are going to believe it.

You almost understood the point people are making, but you fucked it up at the finish line.

The point people are making is "the person was in a shitty situation and our empathy for that should trump our desire to advise and help people out of shitty situations"

I don't agree to that.

Look I've said it a bunch of times, but helping people out of abusive scenarios has to be top priority, and you don't help people by insisting that it's too hard for them to leave or that they are helpless.

You can have empathy and still tell people to gtfo and call the police if you are being physically assaulted.

I'd so much rather be on that side then the side that makes excuses and let's it continue indefinitely because leaving is 'hard'.

Getting cancer treatment is hard. Doesn't mean I think people should die of cancer all the time just because I have empathy for their suffering and so I'm not going to dare tell them to go to a doctor because that's insensitive to their struggle.
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joe40001 posted...

The point people are making is "the person was in a shitty situation and our empathy for that should trump our desire to advise and help people out of shitty situations"

No, this is the point people are making.

the person was in a shitty situation

This is the dumb bullshit you're adding to the end of it:

our empathy for that should trump our desire to advise and help people out of shitty situations"

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:(

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pegusus123456 posted...

joe40001 posted...

The point people are making is "the person was in a shitty situation and our empathy for that should trump our desire to advise and help people out of shitty situations"

No, this is the point people are making.

the person was in a shitty situation

This is the dumb bullshit you're adding to the end of it:

our empathy for that should trump our desire to advise and help people out of shitty situations"

Nobody is arguing that the person is not in a shitty situation.

I'm only inferring that thing to the end of it because people are saying "they are in a shitty situation" as some kind of rebuttal to me when I say "they need to get out of the relationship and contact the authorities if necessary".

If you aren't disagreeing then why disagree is what I'm confused by I guess.

Like if we are all in agreement that "yeah it's shitty, and yeah if you are in a relationship where you are physically abused you should gtfo and contact police if necessary" then I don't understand why people are giving me a hard time.
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joe40001 posted...

Nobody is arguing that the person is not in a shitty situation.

I'm only inferring that thing to the end of it because people are saying "they are in a shitty situation" as some kind of rebuttal to me when I say "they need to get out of the relationship and contact the authorities if necessary".

If you aren't disagreeing then why disagree is what I'm confused by I guess.

Like if we are all in agreement that "yeah it's shitty, and yeah if you are in a relationship where you are physically abused you should gtfo and contact police if necessary" then I don't understand why people are giving me a hard time.

Because the way you're arguing implies the person is stupid for not just leaving. Like this argument started by someone pointing out that it isn't as simple as just leaving for people in these relationships and you simply said, "Why not?" and then just repeated that over and over again.
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pegusus123456 posted...

joe40001 posted...

Nobody is arguing that the person is not in a shitty situation.

I'm only inferring that thing to the end of it because people are saying "they are in a shitty situation" as some kind of rebuttal to me when I say "they need to get out of the relationship and contact the authorities if necessary".

If you aren't disagreeing then why disagree is what I'm confused by I guess.

Like if we are all in agreement that "yeah it's shitty, and yeah if you are in a relationship where you are physically abused you should gtfo and contact police if necessary" then I don't understand why people are giving me a hard time.

Because the way you're arguing implies the person is stupid for not just leaving. Like this argument started by someone pointing out that it isn't as simple as just leaving for people in these relationships and you simply said, "Why not?" and then just repeated that over and over again.

I never called anybody stupid. It is simple, maybe it's very hard but it is simple. If somebody is physically abusing you gtfo and contact police if necessary.

They are not bad people for being abused, I have empathy for them, but it's the wrong choice to stay with somebody who is physically abusing you, and I'll confidently stand by that stance.

I have a pet peeve of when people's "empathy" leads to more suffering, and telling people it's too hard to leave abusive relationships or they are basically hostages leads to more unneeded suffering.

Empathy should be in service of helping people, when your empathy starts going into the area where it enables if not encourages people to stay in abusive relationships longer then your empathy is kinda fucked up and I want no part of it.

I'd much rather be an "asshole" that gets a person out of a domestic abuse relationship, than a "empathetic" person that empowers them to stay there feeling helpless.
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joe40001 posted...

I'd much rather be an "asshole" that gets a person out of a domestic abuse relationship, than a "empathetic" person that empowers them to stay there feeling helpless.

Then you severely misunderstand what is being said, and at this point are either too dense or purposely misunderstanding.
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Funkydog posted...

joe40001 posted...

I'd much rather be an "asshole" that gets a person out of a domestic abuse relationship, than a "empathetic" person that empowers them to stay there feeling helpless.

Then you severely misunderstand what is being said, and at this point are either too dense or purposely misunderstanding.

In what way? I think I've been pretty clear this whole time.
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joe40001 posted...

Funkydog posted...

joe40001 posted...

I'd much rather be an "asshole" that gets a person out of a domestic abuse relationship, than a "empathetic" person that empowers them to stay there feeling helpless.

Then you severely misunderstand what is being said, and at this point are either too dense or purposely misunderstanding.

In what way? I think I've been pretty clear this whole time.

Been pretty clear in refusing to actually read what you are being told, yes.
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This is not the first time celebrities conveniently had abuse stories in their pocket to bring up at the right time to collect the sympathy points.

And in those several times, some stories also sounded absurd enough that the allegers eventually were found to be fiction writers.

Her story could very well be true and verifiable in legal settings, but until evidence beyond reasonable doubt have been brought forth, if a story sounds too bad to be true, I will take the it with a grain of salt.

Shadilay posted...

This is not the first time celebrities conveniently had abuse stories in their pocket to bring up at the right time to collect the sympathy points.

And in those several times, some stories also sounded absurd enough that the allegers eventually were found to be fiction writers.

Her story could very well be true and verifiable in legal settings, but until evidence beyond reasonable doubt have been brought forth, if a story sounds too bad to be true, I will take the it with a grain of salt.

I mean, she's the lead in a show that's in no threat of being cancelled. I don't see why she'd make up a story for publicity.
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Funkydog posted...

joe40001 posted...

Funkydog posted...

joe40001 posted...

I'd much rather be an "asshole" that gets a person out of a domestic abuse relationship, than a "empathetic" person that empowers them to stay there feeling helpless.

Then you severely misunderstand what is being said, and at this point are either too dense or purposely misunderstanding.

In what way? I think I've been pretty clear this whole time.

Been pretty clear in refusing to actually read what you are being told, yes.

I read and responded to everything.

What specifically do you disagree with me on?
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Shadilay posted...

This is not the first time celebrities conveniently had abuse stories in their pocket to bring up at the right time to collect the sympathy points.

And in those several times, some stories also sounded absurd enough that the allegers eventually were found to be fiction writers.

Her story could very well be true and verifiable in legal settings, but until evidence beyond reasonable doubt have been brought forth, if a story sounds too bad to be true, I will take the it with a grain of salt.

Which stories were those (where the allegers were fabricating)?

Jussie Smollett comes to mind right away.

Shadilay posted...

Jussie Smollett comes to mind right away.

Lets generalize and shutdown the voices of a group of people who have always had their voices stifled and snuffed because a guy lied.

Do you read the stupid shit you write before you post it?
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Shadilay posted...

Jussie Smollett comes to mind right away.

Smollet wasn't speaking about abuse in the past? But OK, one.. any others?