Poll of the Day > If there were UBI, would you work?

Topic List	Page List: 1, 2, 3
SpeedDemon20 09/26/19 10:37:10 PM #101:	I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D --- http://orig14.deviantart.net/59f8/f/2009/047/4/9/rylai_crestfall_by_eyue.jpg Crystal Maiden... gal could break your heart in a thousand pieces. -Rucks <cite>SpeedDemon20 posted [p:928000297] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/26/19 10:48:23 PM #102:	zebatov posted... OhhhJa posted... LinkPizza posted... Apparently, with autonomous machines, some think well eventually reach that level. Though how well get there... The only issue with that is how you allocate what to whom because even if A.I. is doing everything for us, there's no way everyone can just have unlimited resources/stuff for free And how do you regulate how much of something someone uses? Thats the problem... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928000787] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>zebatov posted...</cite> <quote>OhhhJa posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted... </cite> <quote>Apparently, with autonomous machines, some think well eventually reach that level. Though how well get there...</quote>The only issue with that is how you allocate what to whom because even if A.I. is doing everything for us, there's no way everyone can just have unlimited resources/stuff for free </quote> And how do you regulate how much of something someone uses?</quote> Thats the problem...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/26/19 10:51:17 PM #103:	SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D But that makes sense. Many of them (younger generation) probably havent worked. Or had a full time job, like most older people. Meaning that it would be new for them to keep working. Especially when not working for them means they can keep doing what they are doing. And if they grow up with AI doing most things for them, they would be use to that. Also, they may not understand the importance of having enough money. My little brother is in that group. I dont think he really knows how expensive it is to live on his own yet... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928000901] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> But that makes sense. Many of them (younger generation) probably havent worked. Or had a full time job, like most older people. Meaning that it would be new for them to keep working. Especially when not working for them means they can keep doing what they are doing. And if they grow up with AI doing most things for them, they would be use to that. Also, they may not understand the importance of having enough money. My little brother is in that group. I dont think he really knows how expensive it is to live on his own yet...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
gloBal enemy 09/26/19 11:37:56 PM #104:	The other major cultural shift is working expectations of the millennials in terms of what they expect from their employers, how much they're willing to give up, etc... as an employer of lots of young people, it's definitely changed the way we market ourselves when recruiting and we bring alot more focus on values and experiences as well as non-monetary benefits and charity work. --- If you can understand this, I'm 2/cosC for you. <cite>gloBal enemy posted [p:928002988] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>The other major cultural shift is working expectations of the millennials in terms of what they expect from their employers, how much they're willing to give up, etc... as an employer of lots of young people, it's definitely changed the way we market ourselves when recruiting and we bring alot more focus on values and experiences as well as non-monetary benefits and charity work. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
gloBal enemy 09/26/19 11:39:15 PM #105:	LinkPizza posted... I think the mods. I dont think you can delete a topic if other people post in it. I think you can lock it, though... I think you were talking to EvilMegas, IIRC... The name sounds vaguely familiar.... but yes, I was really interested to hear what their thought process was around the disconnect between taxes and transfer payments. --- If you can understand this, I'm 2/cosC for you. <cite>gloBal enemy posted [p:928003039] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted... </cite> <quote>I think the mods. I dont think you can delete a topic if other people post in it. I think you can lock it, though... I think you were talking to EvilMegas, IIRC...</quote> The name sounds vaguely familiar.... but yes, I was really interested to hear what their thought process was around the disconnect between taxes and transfer payments. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
OhhhJa 09/27/19 12:16:47 AM #106:	LinkPizza posted... I think the mods. I dont think you can delete a topic if other people post in it. I think you can lock it, though... Weird. It was pretty benign as far as topics here go <cite>OhhhJa posted [p:928004633] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted... </cite> <quote>I think the mods. I dont think you can delete a topic if other people post in it. I think you can lock it, though...</quote>Weird. It was pretty benign as far as topics here go </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 12:38:31 AM #107:	OhhhJa posted... LinkPizza posted... I think the mods. I dont think you can delete a topic if other people post in it. I think you can lock it, though... Weird. It was pretty benign as far as topics here go Yeah. I didn't really see it being mod worthy, either. So, Idk what happened. Maybe he asked a mod to do it. If he couldn't delete it, but still wanted it gone, I think you could do that... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928005300] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>OhhhJa posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted... </cite> <quote>I think the mods. I dont think you can delete a topic if other people post in it. I think you can lock it, though...</quote>Weird. It was pretty benign as far as topics here go </quote> Yeah. I didn't really see it being mod worthy, either. So, Idk what happened. Maybe he asked a mod to do it. If he couldn't delete it, but still wanted it gone, I think you could do that...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Blaqthourne 09/27/19 12:45:03 AM #108:	SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work I'm guessing most people assumed it would be something like $10k per year, which is nowhere close to what you can live on. So, of course, just about everyone is going to continue working in that case. --- Montreal Expos (1969-2004) http://www.backloggery.com/Blaqthourne Now playing: Fire Emblem (GBA) -- started 9/25/2019 <cite>Blaqthourne posted [p:928005457] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work</quote> I'm guessing most people assumed it would be something like $10k per year, which is nowhere close to what you can live on. So, of course, just about everyone is going to continue working in that case.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mead 09/27/19 1:35:46 AM #109:	SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts --- More malicious than mischievous <cite>Mead posted [p:928006777] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 1:47:20 AM #110:	Mead posted... SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928007057] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts</quote> Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mead 09/27/19 1:52:05 AM #111:	LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief... Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job. --- More malicious than mischievous <cite>Mead posted [p:928007167] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts</quote> Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief...</quote> Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 2:01:35 AM #112:	Mead posted... LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief... Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job. I know what it stands for. But he was acting like it was going to be our actual income. You guys are calling two different hings the same thing. You're talking about Yang's VATs as UBI. But he was making it seem like UBI was going to be how we lived once the AIs run everything... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928007408] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts</quote> Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief...</quote> Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job.</quote> I know what it stands for. But he was acting like it was going to be our actual income. You guys are calling two different hings the same thing. You're talking about Yang's VATs as UBI. But he was making it seem like UBI was going to be how we lived once the AIs run everything...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mead 09/27/19 2:06:25 AM #113:	LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief... Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job. I know what it stands for. But he was acting like it was going to be our actual income. You guys are calling two different hings the same thing. You're talking about Yang's VATs as UBI. But he was making it seem like UBI was going to be how we lived once the AIs run everything... There could be some truth to that for some people but that would be far in the future and only if there came a point where most production, manufacturing, and transportation was handled by automation. Realistically though there is gonna be reasons for people who want to work to keep working for the foreseeable future. --- More malicious than mischievous <cite>Mead posted [p:928007504] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts</quote> Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief...</quote> Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job.</quote> I know what it stands for. But he was acting like it was going to be our actual income. You guys are calling two different hings the same thing. You're talking about Yang's VATs as UBI. But he was making it seem like UBI was going to be how we lived once the AIs run everything...</quote> There could be some truth to that for some people but that would be far in the future and only if there came a point where most production, manufacturing, and transportation was handled by automation. Realistically though there is gonna be reasons for people who want to work to keep working for the foreseeable future.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 2:08:58 AM #114:	Mead posted... LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief... Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job. I know what it stands for. But he was acting like it was going to be our actual income. You guys are calling two different hings the same thing. You're talking about Yang's VATs as UBI. But he was making it seem like UBI was going to be how we lived once the AIs run everything... There could be some truth to that for some people but that would be far in the future and only if there came a point where most production, manufacturing, and transportation was handled by automation. Realistically though there is gonna be reasons for people who want to work to keep working for the foreseeable future. The problem is what you said earlier, though. You can't just tell a trucker to learn code. The people who want to work so they aren't living a basic, boring life might not be able to due to not knowing how to do certain tasks... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928007560] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts</quote> Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief...</quote> Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job.</quote> I know what it stands for. But he was acting like it was going to be our actual income. You guys are calling two different hings the same thing. You're talking about Yang's VATs as UBI. But he was making it seem like UBI was going to be how we lived once the AIs run everything...</quote> There could be some truth to that for some people but that would be far in the future and only if there came a point where most production, manufacturing, and transportation was handled by automation. Realistically though there is gonna be reasons for people who want to work to keep working for the foreseeable future.</quote> The problem is what you said earlier, though. You can't just tell a trucker to learn code. The people who want to work so they aren't living a basic, boring life might not be able to due to not knowing how to do certain tasks...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mead 09/27/19 2:10:58 AM #115:	LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... LinkPizza posted... Mead posted... SpeedDemon20 posted... I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief... Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job. I know what it stands for. But he was acting like it was going to be our actual income. You guys are calling two different hings the same thing. You're talking about Yang's VATs as UBI. But he was making it seem like UBI was going to be how we lived once the AIs run everything... There could be some truth to that for some people but that would be far in the future and only if there came a point where most production, manufacturing, and transportation was handled by automation. Realistically though there is gonna be reasons for people who want to work to keep working for the foreseeable future. The problem is what you said earlier, though. You can't just tell a trucker to learn code. The people who want to work so they aren't living a basic, boring life might not be able to due to not knowing how to do certain tasks... There are likely always gonna be some jobs just better suited for humans --- More malicious than mischievous <cite>Mead posted [p:928007608] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>SpeedDemon20 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm surprised by how many people would continue to work! But then again, the GameFAQs demographic is a bit older (and understand the importance of having something to do). I'm thinking younger generations would not want to (while maybe having no work experience at all). Also, be nice everyone! I just want to know if you would work or not. It's a hypothetical scenario. :D</quote> Im not surprised by the results, UBI isnt really supposed to be a replacement for traditional employment, its more about providing some financial relief and boosting the economy Its also notable that historically civilizations make great strides when people have the option to have more idle time for more free and expressive thoughts</quote> Really? Because the way Dark was talking about it in the other topic made it seem like it was going to replace regular employment. He said we wouldn't work, but would get UBI to live off of... Which sounds like more than providing some financial relief...</quote> Its universal basic income The whole idea is that its something there to just barely help people get by, not enough to actually live off of for most people. Its more to help people deal with things like childcare and unplanned expenses or give people enough financial relief to have more freedom when it comes to their employment choices since they wouldnt feel quite as threatened by the prospect of suddenly losing a job.</quote> I know what it stands for. But he was acting like it was going to be our actual income. You guys are calling two different hings the same thing. You're talking about Yang's VATs as UBI. But he was making it seem like UBI was going to be how we lived once the AIs run everything...</quote> There could be some truth to that for some people but that would be far in the future and only if there came a point where most production, manufacturing, and transportation was handled by automation. Realistically though there is gonna be reasons for people who want to work to keep working for the foreseeable future.</quote> The problem is what you said earlier, though. You can't just tell a trucker to learn code. The people who want to work so they aren't living a basic, boring life might not be able to due to not knowing how to do certain tasks...</quote> There are likely always gonna be some jobs just better suited for humans</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 2:13:28 AM #116:	Mead posted... There are likely always gonna be some jobs just better suited for humans Maybe. Though, with the stuff they can make AI do, maybe not. And if they can make an autonomous being do it, why would they want to pay a human when they could maximize profits. Some people may prefer humans. But lots will prefer AI, and profits... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928007650] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>There are likely always gonna be some jobs just better suited for humans </quote> Maybe. Though, with the stuff they can make AI do, maybe not. And if they can make an autonomous being do it, why would they want to pay a human when they could maximize profits. Some people may prefer humans. But lots will prefer AI, and profits...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Kyuubi4269 09/27/19 2:14:57 AM #117:	LinkPizza posted... You can't just tell a trucker to learn code. Sure you can, you say "your job is going to be redundant, get learnin' before you're unemployed." --- Doctor Foxx posted... The demonizing of soy has a lot to do with xenophobic ideas. <cite>Kyuubi4269 posted [p:928007681] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>You can't just tell a trucker to learn code.</quote> Sure you can, you say "your job is going to be redundant, get learnin' before you're unemployed."</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Kyuubi4269 09/27/19 2:17:24 AM #118:	LinkPizza posted... if they can make an autonomous being do it, why would they want to pay a human when they could maximize profits. Not everything is cost-effective with automation. Automation is generally more efficient when dealing with volume, if the job isn't pressed for time then people are relatively cheap. --- Doctor Foxx posted... The demonizing of soy has a lot to do with xenophobic ideas. <cite>Kyuubi4269 posted [p:928007740] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>if they can make an autonomous being do it, why would they want to pay a human when they could maximize profits. </quote> Not everything is cost-effective with automation. Automation is generally more efficient when dealing with volume, if the job isn't pressed for time then people are relatively cheap.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 2:20:20 AM #119:	Kyuubi4269 posted... LinkPizza posted... You can't just tell a trucker to learn code. Sure you can, you say "your job is going to be redundant, get learnin' before you're unemployed." Sure. But apparently, it doesn't work that well. And humans can't always just learn a new skill like that. Some people have a hard time... Kyuubi4269 posted... LinkPizza posted... if they can make an autonomous being do it, why would they want to pay a human when they could maximize profits. Not everything is cost-effective with automation. Automation is generally more efficient when dealing with volume, if the job isn't pressed for time then people are relatively cheap. Maybe somewhat. Still, you never have to pay automation. You pay for it in the beginning, and repairs. But you don't have to pay it a livable wage, or give it benefits. Or PTO, or time off at all... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928007805] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>You can't just tell a trucker to learn code.</quote> Sure you can, you say "your job is going to be redundant, get learnin' before you're unemployed."</quote> Sure. But apparently, it doesn't work that well. And humans can't always just learn a new skill like that. Some people have a hard time... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>if they can make an autonomous being do it, why would they want to pay a human when they could maximize profits. </quote> Not everything is cost-effective with automation. Automation is generally more efficient when dealing with volume, if the job isn't pressed for time then people are relatively cheap.</quote> Maybe somewhat. Still, you never have to pay automation. You pay for it in the beginning, and repairs. But you don't have to pay it a livable wage, or give it benefits. Or PTO, or time off at all...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
OhhhJa 09/27/19 2:20:50 AM #120:	I think most people really just still havent grasped how advanced A.I. is eventually going to be. It's like they think we're close to the ceiling now or something. Shit's gonna get real in the next couple decades <cite>OhhhJa posted [p:928007827] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>I think most people really just still havent grasped how advanced A.I. is eventually going to be. It's like they think we're close to the ceiling now or something. Shit's gonna get real in the next couple decades </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Kyuubi4269 09/27/19 2:27:10 AM #121:	LinkPizza posted... Sure. But apparently, it doesn't work that well. And humans can't always just learn a new skill like that. Some people have a hard time... You don't tell people the day before they're fired, and if they're unwilling to learn, do they deserve to have a job in a shrinking job market? LinkPizza posted... Maybe somewhat. Still, you never have to pay automation. You pay for it in the beginning, and repairs. But you don't have to pay it a livable wage, or give it benefits. Or PTO, or time off at all... The upfront cost is huge for even relatively simple human-operated machines and the harder you work a machine, the more you have to spend on repairs on a very costly machine. They also have a limited service life so you need to replace them entirely on schedule unlike a person who can work for you for 45 years without replacement. --- Doctor Foxx posted... The demonizing of soy has a lot to do with xenophobic ideas. <cite>Kyuubi4269 posted [p:928007944] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Sure. But apparently, it doesn't work that well. And humans can't always just learn a new skill like that. Some people have a hard time...</quote> You don't tell people the day before they're fired, and if they're unwilling to learn, do they deserve to have a job in a shrinking job market? LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Maybe somewhat. Still, you never have to pay automation. You pay for it in the beginning, and repairs. But you don't have to pay it a livable wage, or give it benefits. Or PTO, or time off at all...</quote> The upfront cost is huge for even relatively simple human-operated machines and the harder you work a machine, the more you have to spend on repairs on a very costly machine. They also have a limited service life so you need to replace them entirely on schedule unlike a person who can work for you for 45 years without replacement.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 2:46:26 AM #122:	Kyuubi4269 posted... You don't tell people the day before they're fired, and if they're unwilling to learn, do they deserve to have a job in a shrinking job market? But that's the thing. It's not that they are unwilling all the time. They just don't grasp or understand it sometimes. You do understand that some people just don't get it, right? You make it seem like anybody who can't do it just doesn't want to. But that's not always the case. So, yeah, I do think they deserve a spot in the shrinking (to probably non-existent) job market... Kyuubi4269 posted... The upfront cost is huge for even relatively simple human-operated machines and the harder you work a machine, the more you have to spend on repairs on a very costly machine. They also have a limited service life so you need to replace them entirely on schedule unlike a person who can work for you for 45 years without replacement. No all humans can. And humans get replaced all the time. And keeping someone for 45 years normally cost more, anyway. As they usually get paid a ton if they've been there that long. And eventually, they'll have AI to repair the other AI. Which could make repairs cost less. --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928008370] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>You don't tell people the day before they're fired, and if they're unwilling to learn, do they deserve to have a job in a shrinking job market? </quote> But that's the thing. It's not that they are unwilling all the time. They just don't grasp or understand it sometimes. You do understand that some people just don't get it, right? You make it seem like anybody who can't do it just doesn't want to. But that's not always the case. So, yeah, I do think they deserve a spot in the shrinking (to probably non-existent) job market... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>The upfront cost is huge for even relatively simple human-operated machines and the harder you work a machine, the more you have to spend on repairs on a very costly machine. They also have a limited service life so you need to replace them entirely on schedule unlike a person who can work for you for 45 years without replacement. </quote> No all humans can. And humans get replaced all the time. And keeping someone for 45 years normally cost more, anyway. As they usually get paid a ton if they've been there that long. And eventually, they'll have AI to repair the other AI. Which could make repairs cost less.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
What_The_Chris 09/27/19 2:58:04 AM #123:	I suppose I'd have to because by itself it probably wouldn't be enough --- 2019 St. Louis Cardinals are 88-67 <cite>What_The_Chris posted [p:928008557] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>I suppose I'd have to because by itself it probably wouldn't be enough</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Kyuubi4269 09/27/19 3:36:32 AM #124:	LinkPizza posted... But that's the thing. It's not that they are unwilling all the time. They just don't grasp or understand it sometimes. Like all the other incompetent people now who are too slow to hold a job then. This is what UBI is for, to offset the rising minimum standard to be employed. LinkPizza posted... No all humans can. In a limited job market, they'll be grateful for what they can get. LinkPizza posted... And humans get replaced all the time. With other humans. There's no initial cost to hiring people. LinkPizza posted... And keeping someone for 45 years normally cost more, anyway. As they usually get paid a ton if they've been there that long. That's inefficient and in a limited job market, they can't command much more pay for expertise when the AI are infinitely more expert. LinkPizza posted... And eventually, they'll have AI to repair the other AI. Which could make repairs cost less. Those machines would also need repairs so wouldn't be cheap to operate, and negotiating tight spaces is something we do naturally. A repair machine would require many sensors and complex, vulnerable joints which would be costly to make and more susceptible to damage. Humans are very complex and technical machines that are repaired with and made from cheaply produced renewables. As machines make housing and food production cheaper, living wage also drops. Eventually it would cost basically nothing to sustain a person but AI would still be very energy intensive to produce and operate. This is all ignoring that taxing AI production artificially raises the cost to use AI which allows humans to remain competitive. --- Doctor Foxx posted... The demonizing of soy has a lot to do with xenophobic ideas. <cite>Kyuubi4269 posted [p:928009200] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>But that's the thing. It's not that they are unwilling all the time. They just don't grasp or understand it sometimes.</quote> Like all the other incompetent people now who are too slow to hold a job then. This is what UBI is for, to offset the rising minimum standard to be employed. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>No all humans can.</quote> In a limited job market, they'll be grateful for what they can get. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>And humans get replaced all the time. </quote> With other humans. There's no initial cost to hiring people. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>And keeping someone for 45 years normally cost more, anyway. As they usually get paid a ton if they've been there that long. </quote> That's inefficient and in a limited job market, they can't command much more pay for expertise when the AI are infinitely more expert. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>And eventually, they'll have AI to repair the other AI. Which could make repairs cost less.</quote> Those machines would also need repairs so wouldn't be cheap to operate, and negotiating tight spaces is something we do naturally. A repair machine would require many sensors and complex, vulnerable joints which would be costly to make and more susceptible to damage. Humans are very complex and technical machines that are repaired with and made from cheaply produced renewables. As machines make housing and food production cheaper, living wage also drops. Eventually it would cost basically nothing to sustain a person but AI would still be very energy intensive to produce and operate. This is all ignoring that taxing AI production artificially raises the cost to use AI which allows humans to remain competitive.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 3:56:10 AM #125:	Kyuubi4269 posted... Like all the other incompetent people now who are too slow to hold a job then. This is what UBI is for, to offset the rising minimum standard to be employed. Except UBI won't be enough to live off of... Nor do we really have that much money to hand out to everyone every month every year... Also, it's not that they're too slow. It's just trying to forced a new way of life onto these people. Even if they learn it, it doesn't matter if they can't get a job in the field. Not all of them, plus all the people going into the field straight from school can ALL get jobs... Kyuubi4269 posted... In a limited job market, they'll be grateful for what they can get. Which might be nothing... Kyuubi4269 posted... With other humans. There's no initial cost to hiring people. Yes there is. Lots of jobs require training. Not all jobs, but a good chunk of them. And that has cost. Especially since in some jobs, the new people are useless until trained. Both of my most recent jobs required training cost. My job at the bus station had to train me on driving the bus, paid for the CDL license (and mine was cheaper than the other guys who are taking the school course mostly now), uniforms, and all that jazz. The military pays for a lot. I remember seeing how much it cost to train one person, and they train multiple at a time. It's not cheap... Kyuubi4269 posted... That's inefficient and in a limited job market, they can't command much more pay for expertise when the AI are infinitely more expert. But you were just talking about how they can keep people for 45 years. All I'm saying is that when jobs keep people that long, they are usually getting paid a lot. Some places give raises every year. And if someone in this age has been working for 45 years somewhere already, they probably have better benefits that they were grandfathered into. Kyuubi4269 posted... Those machines would also need repairs so wouldn't be cheap to operate, and negotiating tight spaces is something we do naturally. A repair machine would require many sensors and complex, vulnerable joints which would be costly to make and more susceptible to damage. Humans are very complex and technical machines that are repaired with and made from cheaply produced renewables. As machines make housing and food production cheaper, living wage also drops. Eventually it would cost basically nothing to sustain a person but AI would still be very energy intensive to produce and operate. Yeah. Repairs bots can fix the broken machines and each other. So, you buy multiple repairs bots. They can fix each other. You just have to have the parts. The only way cost start to lower for us (Humans) is once machines do everything for us, which could reduce cost. Though, how much cost is reduced, and which cost are reduced is still a mystery. Especially since we talked about how certain physical things couldn't be free. There is a way for some thing. But if certain things like food was free, it would be limited. Which would make for a really shitty life, in all honesty... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928009498] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>Like all the other incompetent people now who are too slow to hold a job then. This is what UBI is for, to offset the rising minimum standard to be employed.</quote> Except UBI won't be enough to live off of... Nor do we really have that much money to hand out to everyone every month every year... Also, it's not that they're too slow. It's just trying to forced a new way of life onto these people. Even if they learn it, it doesn't matter if they can't get a job in the field. Not all of them, plus all the people going into the field straight from school can ALL get jobs... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>In a limited job market, they'll be grateful for what they can get. </quote> Which might be nothing... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>With other humans. There's no initial cost to hiring people. </quote> Yes there is. Lots of jobs require training. Not all jobs, but a good chunk of them. And that has cost. Especially since in some jobs, the new people are useless until trained. Both of my most recent jobs required training cost. My job at the bus station had to train me on driving the bus, paid for the CDL license (and mine was cheaper than the other guys who are taking the school course mostly now), uniforms, and all that jazz. The military pays for a lot. I remember seeing how much it cost to train one person, and they train multiple at a time. It's not cheap... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>That's inefficient and in a limited job market, they can't command much more pay for expertise when the AI are infinitely more expert.</quote> But you were just talking about how they can keep people for 45 years. All I'm saying is that when jobs keep people that long, they are usually getting paid a lot. Some places give raises every year. And if someone in this age has been working for 45 years somewhere already, they probably have better benefits that they were grandfathered into. Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>Those machines would also need repairs so wouldn't be cheap to operate, and negotiating tight spaces is something we do naturally. A repair machine would require many sensors and complex, vulnerable joints which would be costly to make and more susceptible to damage. Humans are very complex and technical machines that are repaired with and made from cheaply produced renewables. As machines make housing and food production cheaper, living wage also drops. Eventually it would cost basically nothing to sustain a person but AI would still be very energy intensive to produce and operate. </quote> Yeah. Repairs bots can fix the broken machines and each other. So, you buy multiple repairs bots. They can fix each other. You just have to have the parts. The only way cost start to lower for us (Humans) is once machines do everything for us, which could reduce cost. Though, how much cost is reduced, and which cost are reduced is still a mystery. Especially since we talked about how certain physical things couldn't be free. There is a way for some thing. But if certain things like food was free, it would be limited. Which would make for a really shitty life, in all honesty...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Kyuubi4269 09/27/19 4:38:29 AM #126:	LinkPizza posted... Except UBI won't be enough to live off of Depends how much you give. LinkPizza posted... Nor do we really have that much money to hand out to everyone every month every year... GDP suggests otherwise, savings can be made. Or just don't pay everyone at stage 1. Everything is flexible. LinkPizza posted... Also, it's not that they're too slow. It's just trying to forced a new way of life onto these people. Everyone needs to adapt to the changing world. You can't operate nowadays by only using a landline, why is this adaptation the line we can't cross? LinkPizza posted... Even if they learn it, it doesn't matter if they can't get a job in the field. That's why you learn the right skill. People who take art degrees know it won't get them a job. LinkPizza posted... Which might be nothing... If they're in the least skilled section of society, then they shouldn't be employed. Survival of the fittest. LinkPizza posted... Yes there is. Lots of jobs require training. Not all jobs, but a good chunk of them. And that has cost. Especially since in some jobs, the new people are useless until trained. Both of my most recent jobs required training cost. My job at the bus station had to train me on driving the bus, paid for the CDL license (and mine was cheaper than the other guys who are taking the school course mostly now), uniforms, and all that jazz. The military pays for a lot. I remember seeing how much it cost to train one person, and they train multiple at a time. It's not cheap... They don't have to hire untrained people, and with UBI you should be able to get training yourself. --- Doctor Foxx posted... The demonizing of soy has a lot to do with xenophobic ideas. <cite>Kyuubi4269 posted [p:928010147] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Except UBI won't be enough to live off of</quote> Depends how much you give. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Nor do we really have that much money to hand out to everyone every month every year...</quote> GDP suggests otherwise, savings can be made. Or just don't pay everyone at stage 1. Everything is flexible. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Also, it's not that they're too slow. It's just trying to forced a new way of life onto these people. </quote> Everyone needs to adapt to the changing world. You can't operate nowadays by only using a landline, why is this adaptation the line we can't cross? LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Even if they learn it, it doesn't matter if they can't get a job in the field. </quote> That's why you learn the right skill. People who take art degrees know it won't get them a job. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Which might be nothing...</quote> If they're in the least skilled section of society, then they shouldn't be employed. Survival of the fittest. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Yes there is. Lots of jobs require training. Not all jobs, but a good chunk of them. And that has cost. Especially since in some jobs, the new people are useless until trained. Both of my most recent jobs required training cost. My job at the bus station had to train me on driving the bus, paid for the CDL license (and mine was cheaper than the other guys who are taking the school course mostly now), uniforms, and all that jazz. The military pays for a lot. I remember seeing how much it cost to train one person, and they train multiple at a time. It's not cheap...</quote> They don't have to hire untrained people, and with UBI you should be able to get training yourself.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Kyuubi4269 09/27/19 4:38:38 AM #127:	LinkPizza posted... But you were just talking about how they can keep people for 45 years. All I'm saying is that when jobs keep people that long, they are usually getting paid a lot. Some places give raises every year. And if someone in this age has been working for 45 years somewhere already, they probably have better benefits that they were grandfathered into. Places give raises every year to counter inflation, machines would cost more $ every year from inflation. They're still paid the same value, the dollar just represents less value over time. LinkPizza posted... Yeah. Repairs bots can fix the broken machines and each other. So, you buy multiple repairs bots. They can fix each other. You just have to have the parts. The parts for three costly machines to replace one self-repairing human. It's not cost effective. LinkPizza posted... The only way cost start to lower for us (Humans) is once machines do everything for us, which could reduce cost. Though, how much cost is reduced, and which cost are reduced is still a mystery. Anything that can be mass-produced would continuously get cheaper as machines get more efficient. Savings would only stop when machines stop getting more efficient. We get cheaper with them stopping them making us redundant. And again, machines can be taxed to artificially improve our competitiveness, we have absolute control over how much we want them to take control. --- Doctor Foxx posted... The demonizing of soy has a lot to do with xenophobic ideas. <cite>Kyuubi4269 posted [p:928010149] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>But you were just talking about how they can keep people for 45 years. All I'm saying is that when jobs keep people that long, they are usually getting paid a lot. Some places give raises every year. And if someone in this age has been working for 45 years somewhere already, they probably have better benefits that they were grandfathered into.</quote> Places give raises every year to counter inflation, machines would cost more $ every year from inflation. They're still paid the same value, the dollar just represents less value over time. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>Yeah. Repairs bots can fix the broken machines and each other. So, you buy multiple repairs bots. They can fix each other. You just have to have the parts.</quote> The parts for three costly machines to replace one self-repairing human. It's not cost effective. LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>The only way cost start to lower for us (Humans) is once machines do everything for us, which could reduce cost. Though, how much cost is reduced, and which cost are reduced is still a mystery. </quote> Anything that can be mass-produced would continuously get cheaper as machines get more efficient. Savings would only stop when machines stop getting more efficient. We get cheaper with them stopping them making us redundant. And again, machines can be taxed to artificially improve our competitiveness, we have absolute control over how much we want them to take control.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
EvilMegas 09/27/19 6:46:41 AM #128:	LinkPizza posted... OhhhJa posted... gloBal enemy posted... What happened to the other thread about lazy unemployed people? It got deleted. Not sure if it was a mod or the TC but not sure why either way I think the mods. I dont think you can delete a topic if other people post in it. I think you can lock it, though... gloBal enemy posted... OhhhJa posted... It got deleted. Not sure if it was a mod or the TC but not sure why either way nuts. I wondered if it turned into an Unproductive discussion after I went to bed this morning (sydney time). I was waiting to get schooled by someone on how taxes work in response to my argument that higher welfare payments (unemployment benefits) means more taxes or less government spend elsewhere, and thats why I care about unemployed people. I think you were talking to EvilMegas, IIRC... Yeah it was, but I got bored and started working. --- Official King of Black People https://imgur.com/Zk3VS3o http://imgur.com/a/UeQiE https://imgur.com/aSnCUuI <cite>EvilMegas posted [p:928011797] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>LinkPizza posted...</cite> <quote>OhhhJa posted...</cite> <quote>gloBal enemy posted... </cite> <quote>What happened to the other thread about lazy unemployed people?</quote>It got deleted. Not sure if it was a mod or the TC but not sure why either way </quote> I think the mods. I dont think you can delete a topic if other people post in it. I think you can lock it, though... gloBal enemy posted...</cite> <quote>OhhhJa posted... </cite> <quote>It got deleted. Not sure if it was a mod or the TC but not sure why either way</quote> nuts. I wondered if it turned into an Unproductive discussion after I went to bed this morning (sydney time). I was waiting to get schooled by someone on how taxes work in response to my argument that higher welfare payments (unemployment benefits) means more taxes or less government spend elsewhere, and thats why I care about unemployed people. </quote> I think you were talking to EvilMegas, IIRC...</quote> Yeah it was, but I got bored and started working.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
gloBal enemy 09/27/19 10:49:42 AM #129:	EvilMegas posted... Yeah it was, but I got bored and started working. Ok. I think this topic has become about the same "will automation and AI be the future" debate which isn't going to change anyone's views. I'll leave the debaters to keep... debating. --- If you can understand this, I'm 2/cosC for you. <cite>gloBal enemy posted [p:928018111] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>EvilMegas posted... </cite> <quote>Yeah it was, but I got bored and started working.</quote> Ok. I think this topic has become about the same "will automation and AI be the future" debate which isn't going to change anyone's views. I'll leave the debaters to keep... debating. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 12:05:21 PM #130:	Kyuubi4269 posted... -Depends how much you give. -GDP suggests otherwise, savings can be made. Or just don't pay everyone at stage 1. Everything is flexible. If Mead is right, than it's the $1,000 Yang speaks of. If it's what Dark said instead, then it doesn't matter as we probably won't have enough to give to everybody. As $1,000 for everybody alone is way too much a year... Kyuubi4269 posted... Everyone needs to adapt to the changing world. You can't operate nowadays by only using a landline, why is this adaptation the line we can't cross? Technically, you can operate with only a landline. That depends on the person. But that aside, adaption takes time. And even then, not everybody understands certain things. To try to force them to all be good at a very few specific things doesn't, as some people just don't understand certain things. Especially once you get to a certain age. It can be harder to teach them a whole new subject they know nothing about to begin with. Teach older people about certain technologies can be a little hard. It would be much harder to go in depth for some people... Kyuubi4269 posted... That's why you learn the right skill. People who take art degrees know it won't get them a job. That still doesn't help if there are too many people for the jobs. It does matter if you learned the best skill. If there are only 10 job opening with 100 people, it doesn't matter. And with the decline in jobs going up, it doesn't matter what skill you learn. You'll always be competing with way more people. People who have probably been studying this for life while you had another job that was fine until only recently. Unless you psychic, you don't know what the right skill is... Kyuubi4269 posted... If they're in the least skilled section of society, then they shouldn't be employed. Survival of the fittest. Weird that many less skilled people than them will probably survive. People who have no skills have been getting paid to do nothing but sit on their ass at home. But I expect nothing less from you. People talk about others not being human. I see that in you the most the way you post. Sometimes, I just think you're arguing just to argue. Other times, you just sound like a jerk and act all superior. This time, it's seems like both. Kyuubi4269 posted... Places give raises every year to counter inflation, machines would cost more $ every year from inflation. They're still paid the same value, the dollar just represents less value over time. New machine will cost more. And maybe not always. Older machines will start to cost less. Then can do the same thing, but maybe not as fast. Or are "safer". But safety might not matter as much if there are no humans around. And even if they did cost more, who cares. You aren't buying them every year. You buy them once and fix them until you can't anymore. Then you buy another. That will probably be years away. And you will have probably made a sizable profit by then. And if you buy the exact same one, it'll probably be cheap. Or maybe by a newer model for maybe a little more (or maybe the same price that the other one was at first). --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928021022] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>-Depends how much you give. -GDP suggests otherwise, savings can be made. Or just don't pay everyone at stage 1. Everything is flexible.</quote> If Mead is right, than it's the $1,000 Yang speaks of. If it's what Dark said instead, then it doesn't matter as we probably won't have enough to give to everybody. As $1,000 for everybody alone is way too much a year... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>Everyone needs to adapt to the changing world. You can't operate nowadays by only using a landline, why is this adaptation the line we can't cross? </quote> Technically, you can operate with only a landline. That depends on the person. But that aside, adaption takes time. And even then, not everybody understands certain things. To try to force them to all be good at a very few specific things doesn't, as some people just don't understand certain things. Especially once you get to a certain age. It can be harder to teach them a whole new subject they know nothing about to begin with. Teach older people about certain technologies can be a little hard. It would be much harder to go in depth for some people... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>That's why you learn the right skill. People who take art degrees know it won't get them a job.</quote> That still doesn't help if there are too many people for the jobs. It does matter if you learned the best skill. If there are only 10 job opening with 100 people, it doesn't matter. And with the decline in jobs going up, it doesn't matter what skill you learn. You'll always be competing with way more people. People who have probably been studying this for life while you had another job that was fine until only recently. Unless you psychic, you don't know what the right skill is... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>If they're in the least skilled section of society, then they shouldn't be employed. Survival of the fittest.</quote> Weird that many less skilled people than them will probably survive. People who have no skills have been getting paid to do nothing but sit on their ass at home. But I expect nothing less from you. People talk about others not being human. I see that in you the most the way you post. Sometimes, I just think you're arguing just to argue. Other times, you just sound like a jerk and act all superior. This time, it's seems like both. Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>Places give raises every year to counter inflation, machines would cost more $ every year from inflation. They're still paid the same value, the dollar just represents less value over time.</quote> New machine will cost more. And maybe not always. Older machines will start to cost less. Then can do the same thing, but maybe not as fast. Or are "safer". But safety might not matter as much if there are no humans around. And even if they did cost more, who cares. You aren't buying them every year. You buy them once and fix them until you can't anymore. Then you buy another. That will probably be years away. And you will have probably made a sizable profit by then. And if you buy the exact same one, it'll probably be cheap. Or maybe by a newer model for maybe a little more (or maybe the same price that the other one was at first).</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
LinkPizza 09/27/19 12:15:00 PM #131:	Kyuubi4269 posted... They don't have to hire untrained people, and with UBI you should be able to get training yourself. I guess you know how to fix a B-1, then? Since you don't need training, right? Lots of places have to train new people. For example, not many people know how to fix a military aircraft without training. Not to mentioned that all aircraft are different. So, even people who can from a similar, but different, aircraft have trouble learning everything about a new aircraft. Some don't ever fully learn it. People who have only worked on this one aircraft sometimes don't learn everything about it. Then my current job. Not many people have a CDL. And it's hard to get people with them to come work there are other jobs where you need a CDL pay more. So, training people without one of the most common ways to get someone who can do their job. We could sit around being short-staffed and eventually shutting down because we're waiting for someone who has one. But then we're shut down. So, we hired and train. Even if someone is trained on how to do a job, then still need to be trained on location specific stuff. Like, even if you drove a bus in a different city, maybe you need to be trained on different codes for speaking on the radio here. Or learning specific rules, like how there's not standees on the bus in this city. And the uniforms, if they have them, can still cost something... Kyuubi4269 posted... The parts for three costly machines to replace one self-repairing human. It's not cost effective. Depends on the cost of the parts. And not everything is self-repairing for a human. Some have to go to the hospital. And can get workers comp. Or sick leave. Or PTO. That's money that a machine wouldn't need.They do, however need money for parts, though. But humans also need money to repair. Whether is time off while getting paid. Or a hospital bill which may get paid by the job if it happened there under no fault of their own. I don't know where you got self-repairing from. We wouldn't need hospitals or workers comp if were could self-repair everything... Kyuubi4269 posted... Anything that can be mass-produced would continuously get cheaper as machines get more efficient. Savings would only stop when machines stop getting more efficient. We get cheaper with them stopping them making us redundant. And again, machines can be taxed to artificially improve our competitiveness, we have absolute control over how much we want them to take control. What do you mean by taxed? Are you talking about tax for buying them, because that's already a thing. Things only get cheaper when they are cheaper to make or get. Just because there are machines around doesn't mean housing will be cheaper. My landlord doesn't have to drop the price. Many won't as there's no reason to. Food may get cheaper. But probably won't be free. Or it won't last long. Unless there is a limit. Because people could buy all kinds of stuff, only to let it go to waste, just because they wanted to... Things can only get some cheap. And free will probably only be for digital content. Unless we all have to get the same whatever. Like TVs probably won't be free unless we all had to get the same exact type of TV... --- Official King of Kings Switch FC: 7216-4417-4511 Add Me because I'll probably add you. I'm probably the LinkPizza you'll see around. <cite>LinkPizza posted [p:928021389] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>They don't have to hire untrained people, and with UBI you should be able to get training yourself.</quote> I guess you know how to fix a B-1, then? Since you don't need training, right? Lots of places have to train new people. For example, not many people know how to fix a military aircraft without training. Not to mentioned that all aircraft are different. So, even people who can from a similar, but different, aircraft have trouble learning everything about a new aircraft. Some don't ever fully learn it. People who have only worked on this one aircraft sometimes don't learn everything about it. Then my current job. Not many people have a CDL. And it's hard to get people with them to come work there are other jobs where you need a CDL pay more. So, training people without one of the most common ways to get someone who can do their job. We could sit around being short-staffed and eventually shutting down because we're waiting for someone who has one. But then we're shut down. So, we hired and train. Even if someone is trained on how to do a job, then still need to be trained on location specific stuff. Like, even if you drove a bus in a different city, maybe you need to be trained on different codes for speaking on the radio here. Or learning specific rules, like how there's not standees on the bus in this city. And the uniforms, if they have them, can still cost something... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>The parts for three costly machines to replace one self-repairing human. It's not cost effective. </quote> Depends on the cost of the parts. And not everything is self-repairing for a human. Some have to go to the hospital. And can get workers comp. Or sick leave. Or PTO. That's money that a machine wouldn't need.They do, however need money for parts, though. But humans also need money to repair. Whether is time off while getting paid. Or a hospital bill which may get paid by the job if it happened there under no fault of their own. I don't know where you got self-repairing from. We wouldn't need hospitals or workers comp if were could self-repair everything... Kyuubi4269 posted...</cite> <quote>Anything that can be mass-produced would continuously get cheaper as machines get more efficient. Savings would only stop when machines stop getting more efficient. We get cheaper with them stopping them making us redundant. And again, machines can be taxed to artificially improve our competitiveness, we have absolute control over how much we want them to take control.</quote> What do you mean by taxed? Are you talking about tax for buying them, because that's already a thing. Things only get cheaper when they are cheaper to make or get. Just because there are machines around doesn't mean housing will be cheaper. My landlord doesn't have to drop the price. Many won't as there's no reason to. Food may get cheaper. But probably won't be free. Or it won't last long. Unless there is a limit. Because people could buy all kinds of stuff, only to let it go to waste, just because they wanted to... Things can only get some cheap. And free will probably only be for digital content. Unless we all have to get the same whatever. Like TVs probably won't be free unless we all had to get the same exact type of TV...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
gloBal enemy 09/27/19 12:44:08 PM #132:	It's probably a bit late, but the American Factory documentary on Netflix was really interesting. I also better appreciate why there's unions in the US, but it also paints a pretty bleak future for low skilled workers and the ever growing threat of structural changes to the employment landscape. --- If you can understand this, I'm 2/cosC for you. <cite>gloBal enemy posted [p:928022597] in If there w... [t:78038965]...</cite> <quote>It's probably a bit late, but the American Factory documentary on Netflix was really interesting. I also better appreciate why there's unions in the US, but it also paints a pretty bleak future for low skilled workers and the ever growing threat of structural changes to the employment landscape. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Poll of the Day > If there were UBI, would you work? (+) Yeah! (+)

Poll of the Day > If there were UBI, would you work?