Board 8 > ~~Japanese History~~ Mafia Topic 4 - Revere the Emperor, Expel the Foreigners

(+) Yeah! (+)

Vengeful_KBM posted...

Because you look like fucking scum and I can say that if I want?

Then say you think I'm scum. Don't dance around with your words like this is some fort of ballet.Vengeful_KBM posted...

And I'm not trying to get you to shut up by calling you scum either. I'm trying to call you scum. You can talk to your heart's desire, I'm not some Chris.

There you go. Good job. You're an idiot, but good job.
---

Stop
---

Saying "you look bad" means "you look like scum" in mafia. At best, you're being dense on purpose.

The weirdest thing about Scare is his last login is all the way to 10pm pst last night.

Saying "you're making yourself look bad" is not the same as "you look bad."

Come now, KBM.
---

dowolf posted...

There you go. Good job. You're an idiot, but good job.

And I do hope you're scum because all you're doing right now is being an asshole.

Leafeon13N posted...

The weirdest thing about Scare is his last login is all the way to 10pm pst last night.

Really, Red?

Are we really going with lol timestamps?
---

dowolf posted...

Saying "you're making yourself look bad" is not the same as "you look bad."

Come now, KBM.

........

There is a marginal semantical difference at best.

dowolf posted...

Leafeon13N posted...

The weirdest thing about Scare is his last login is all the way to 10pm pst last night.

Really, Red?

Are we really going with lol timestamps?

Wtf is wrong with you?

He isn't making an argument. He is just pointing out information. What is wrong with that?
---

As long as we're getting super picky about semantics:

I didn't say YOU were making yourself look bad, I said the situation was making you look bad.

Which simplifies to "you look bad".

So even in this stupid semantical argument you're still wrong.

dowolf posted...

Leafeon13N posted...

The weirdest thing about Scare is his last login is all the way to 10pm pst last night.

Really, Red?

Are we really going with lol timestamps?

When the timestamp is hours from his post, yes.

You sound like the "I'm just asking questions" folks.
---

no it doesn't, KBM.

But I am done arguing this point.
---

masterplum posted...

Wtf is wrong with you?

Leafeon13N posted...

dowolf posted...

Leafeon13N posted...

The weirdest thing about Scare is his last login is all the way to 10pm pst last night.

Really, Red?

Are we really going with lol timestamps?

When the timestamp is hours from his post, yes.

Also I had noticed this too but didn't want to get yelled at for mentioning it. Hell, I even @'ed him and he hasn't shown up, even for so much as another brief three-word post.

Nah, people with actual information care more about the game than this.

timestamps could also just mean he's taking a long snooze for the weekend

and lets not bite each others heads of here
---

never understood hate for timestamp arguments anyway when its just done to keep track of people's online schedule...
scare is in a normal US timezone right?
---

I believe so

If he is west coast he could still be asleep....

Maybe
---

plum actually being around and consistent makes me definitely prefer a pez lynch over a plum lynch
---

Oh hi VI
---

Hi SBell!

Plum, I remember you arguing that Scare's vote and then unvote on Oddity doesn't make sense as scum, do you still feel that way?
---

VI. Why was tom killed?
---

I have no clue, my guess is he was reasonably active and generally well liked by the Town. I also remember Tom being pretty good at mafia even if it has been a long time since I've played with him

It looks doubly bad on herring, who was his roommate and someone who Tom suspected for a good chunk of the day
---

wait, just to get it straight
who is herring?
---

htaeD posted...

wait, just to get it straight
who is herring?

Communism is a red herring
---

Herring is pezloco, see him go by both
---

ah
almost thought it was a cute nickname for red
---

So now that conversation is dead. Who hasn't shown up.
---

think Vi was the last to chime in

also despite what the Opening post list says I dont think Oddity is back among the living
---

VeryInsane posted...

Hi SBell!

Plum, I remember you arguing that Scare's vote and then unvote on Oddity doesn't make sense as scum, do you still feel that way?

Sure.

All of his actions have been super bizarre.
---

...Look. One last appeal.

If Pez is scum, we learn nothing.
If Pez is town, we learn nothing.

If Plum is scum, Pez is probably town.
If Plum is town, Scare is scum.

Scare not being superactive is not a counterargument to any of that!
---

I dont think Plums alignment says anything about Pez tho
---

htaeD posted...

I dont think Plums alignment says anything about Pez tho

If they are both scum together, that was a pretty hard bus.
---

dowolf posted...

...Look. One last appeal.

If Pez is scum, we learn nothing.
If Pez is town, we learn nothing.

If Plum is scum, Pez is probably town.
If Plum is town, Scare is scum.

Scare not being superactive is not a counterargument to any of that!

This is wrong on so many levels
---

We could resolve things even more easily if we lynched Scare.
---

Well, it would seem that dowolf loosened up quite a bit. Am I the only one noticing he kinda has a savior complex of sorts (at least this game)? Like, he latches on to a player and tries to do whatever he can to not get them killed.

It feels abnormal, to say the least.
---

...You think it is abnormal to not want your town reads to be lynched?

Though that doesn't really apply here. I simply want Plum dead. If Plum is town, we lynch Scare and Pez in that order. If Plum if scum, we figure things out from there.
---

htaeD posted...

...what were your thoughts about sceptile and Lolo at the time of day's end?

As you noted in the post below, LoLo was on my concerned list. I had no read on Scept. I didn't like the reasoning on him anymore than the reasoning on Oddity. The difference between the two was my own read. I read Oddity as town and still have no read on Scept. But I thought both lynch trains were bad.

htaeD posted...

Then I'd vote them instead. I was waiting for Death, Leo (who dropped off my list cause Red replaced), LoLo, Dowolf, and Phoenix. None of them voted Scare. Except Dowolf,

probably is a pattern to this random selection of names
since Pez doesnt seem to want to go quiet even with a scan pining him down, he might even explain or point out the source

but there were other players who voted Oddity/Scare and he rarely/never mentioned them before and after the votes.. and I wonder why

Are you purposely misunderstanding me here? My reads on those 5 were concerning. Death, Dowolf, and Phoenix at the time for being present (at times) but not contributing much. Obviously my opinion of Dowolf changed a lot in that regard. I learned Phoenix was 18 and realized he probably thought what he was doing was contributing. Also he explained one of his posts that stuck out. LoLo had that weird vote on Scept as well as popping in and doing almost nothing. Leo just wasn't around. Red replaced and I gave him a chance.

Obellisk posted...

The only thing Pez has going for him right now is scum hunting. He needs to stay active if he wants to prove his miller claim. He has to know falling silent now will just seal his fate.

I have a family. I'm active when I can be. But my two kids are 3 and 19 months. They keep me pretty busy during the day. My wife is putting the little one down for a long (hopefully) nap. The older one doesn't nap but watches movies while the little one naps. So, I'm here for a bit. But I'll be gone again after nap time.

htaeD posted...

hmph
not many people talk about pez
scare and sceptile say they like him, but then I liked him too for a while day1, so that doesnt say much to me

also despite pez asking for alternatives to voting me, and sceptile presenting himself, he never took the oppurtunity to vote sceptile

puts attention on sceptile, but not enough
also I would have suspected that push towards sceptile near the end anyway

I think I've addressed this above, but just to be clear, I didn't like the reasoning for his lynch anymore than the ones for Oddity.

masterplum posted...

Wait

Did pez really jump from scare to me

Really?

Really?

Sure why not? Of Plum, Death, and Scare two are scum. I'm fine with lynching any of them. There are even WIFOM reasons that it could be all three.

My reasons on Death haven't changed.

Scare looks bad because he claimed a scan but gave us nothing else. Then he disappeared. I'm not caught up so I don't know if he's back yet or not.

Plum still thinks the Oddity lynch was good. And then calls those of us not on it lucky. He should be smart enough to realize at least in hindsight that the argument was correct (not just the conclusion). And he has a potential scanner accusing him.
---

htaeD posted...

if pez had claimed miller right away and/or not looked terrible at the end of day1
then I might have felt more lenient towards him
but as it stands, him being scum just fits everything better

How did I look terrible? Because I laid out why the lynch was bad and wouldn't join another lynch that admittedly had no reasons behind it? LoLo never gave a reason. Oddity admitted it was gut that was at first not much, just the scummiest. Then he continued to not like him and bumped his personal odds to 70/30. Dowolf was looking to vote anyone other than Oddity that was present to defend himself. As I already mentioned I think Death did enough that he was still the best target even if he wasn't there to defend himself. That makes me look terrible apparently.

Vengeful_KBM posted...

dowolf posted...

It literally serves no purpose except to try to get me to shut up. It doesn't convince people to go after me, it doesn't even imply that I'm scum. It just implies that you want me to shut the fuck up.

So yeah, a translation of this:

"Lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies lies".

Nothing he says here is true.

To be fair, your response to him could be seen as the same. Except instead of lies it would be Fake News.

Vengeful_KBM posted...

Saying "you look bad" means "you look like scum" in mafia. At best, you're being dense on purpose.

But look like doesn't equate to you are.

Anyway this back and forth between KBM and Dowolf is entertaining. But distracting from the topic. KBM and Dowolf are both off limits. Scare may have claimed first but KBM was appropriately hinting a scan on me before Scare. Dowolf is the only other person to have recognized the poor reasoning on the Oddity lynch. This is a null tell. But
that with him actually developing other scenarios and being the most active in doing so and it leans town imo.
---

VeryInsane posted...

plum actually being around and consistent makes me definitely prefer a pez lynch over a plum lynch

Addressed earlier. I have kids that keep me busy during the day. I was active this morning when we were all home. Been out for most the rest of the day so far. Kids are napping now. I'm here and catching up.

VeryInsane posted...

I have no clue, my guess is he was reasonably active and generally well liked by the Town. I also remember Tom being pretty good at mafia even if it has been a long time since I've played with him

It looks doubly bad on herring, who was his roommate and someone who Tom suspected for a good chunk of the day

Depends on what you mean by good chunk. He initially didn't like me. Then later said he didn't want to push me. It was the political comment I made that tweaked him a bit. I've gotten more political since I've moved. I also live in Texas instead of where he lives, which is largely liberal. I'm a lot more cynical about people now having lived as adult in Texas again. htaeD posted...

ah
almost thought it was a cute nickname for red

On AIM my screen name was RedHerring22. I got called Red a bit. Red didn't like it. But yes I go by Herring and Pezloco or Pez. masterplum posted...

dowolf posted...

...Look. One last appeal.

If Pez is scum, we learn nothing.
If Pez is town, we learn nothing.

If Plum is scum, Pez is probably town.
If Plum is town, Scare is scum.

Scare not being superactive is not a counterargument to any of that!

This is wrong on so many levels

It's only sort of wrong on one level. It ignores that lynching you or Scare leaves us in the same boat tomorrow of deciding on me. But the same could be said about delaying the lynch on one of you or Scare.
dowolf posted...

...You think it is abnormal to not want your town reads to be lynched?

Though that doesn't really apply here. I simply want Plum dead. If Plum is town, we lynch Scare and Pez in that order. If Plum if scum, we figure things out from there.

Dowolf, I want to make sure I'm following you. You prefer Plum over Scare because you read him scummy. You don't prefer Scare because while his actions aren't helpful, it's a null tell. You think the meta of two scanners and a miller fits somewhat. But do you read his D1 actions as town at all?

I thought Scare was town D1. Hence watching his lynch train for the people I was concerned about bandwagoning. That scan claim concerned me a bit. But that was because I had already realized KBM was claiming cop. I'd still prefer to lynch Scare over Plum. But I'm fine with either. Just so it's not forgotten later, I think Death is scum.
---

Need to read the topic still but saw plum checked in

not even bothering to counter vote
---

pezloco posted...

But do you read his D1 actions as town at all?

Honestly, I was neutral on Scare d1. Don't recall having a strong opinion one way or the other.
---

hi scare.

please catch up quickly. Things have gone crazily.
---

dowolf posted...

pezloco posted...

But do you read his D1 actions as town at all?

Honestly, I was neutral on Scare d1. Don't recall having a strong opinion one way or the other.

Was the rest of that paragraph correct, i.e. my understanding of your position?
---

Scare info please. Fuck reading. Explain
---

Are you purposely misunderstanding me here? My reads on those 5 were concerning. Death, Dowolf, and Phoenix at the time for being present (at times) but not contributing much. Obviously my opinion of Dowolf changed a lot in that regard. I learned Phoenix was 18 and realized he probably thought what he was doing was contributing. Also he explained one of his posts that stuck out. LoLo had that weird vote on Scept as well as popping in and doing almost nothing. Leo just wasn't around. Red replaced and I gave him a chance.

..what does age have to do with anything??
and I was more asking because I was curious what you thought about the other Scare/Oddity voters
suppose I have my answer

I think I've addressed this above, but just to be clear, I didn't like the reasoning for his lynch anymore than the ones for Oddity.

okay
and you felt sceptile was just as much town as Oddity?

How did I look terrible? Because I laid out why the lynch was bad and wouldn't join another lynch that admittedly had no reasons behind it? LoLo never gave a reason. Oddity admitted it was gut that was at first not much, just the scummiest. Then he continued to not like him and bumped his personal odds to 70/30. Dowolf was looking to vote anyone other than Oddity that was present to defend himself. As I already mentioned I think Death did enough that he was still the best target even if he wasn't there to defend himself. That makes me look terrible apparently.

you asked for an alternative but stopped posting afterwards
that looked questionable at best
it makes you look terrible because you called Oddity townwhile you, in the end, didnt help him live
---

Obellisk posted...

Scare info please. Fuck reading. Explain

should we tell him?
---

htaeD posted...

I think I've addressed this above, but just to be clear, I didn't like the reasoning for his lynch anymore than the ones for Oddity.

okay
and you felt sceptile was just as much town as Oddity?

Again, you're voting me and apparently not reading what I'm saying or purposefully misreading it. Here's a snippet of the same post you quoted where I answer this.

pezloco posted...

htaeD posted...

...what were your thoughts about sceptile and Lolo at the time of day's end?

As you noted in the post below, LoLo was on my concerned list. I had no read on Scept. I didn't like the reasoning on him anymore than the reasoning on Oddity. The difference between the two was my own read. I read Oddity as town and still have no read on Scept. But I thought both lynch trains were bad.

---

Did pez literally come at me then vote plum
---

htaeD posted...

How did I look terrible? Because I laid out why the lynch was bad and wouldn't join another lynch that admittedly had no reasons behind it? LoLo never gave a reason. Oddity admitted it was gut that was at first not much, just the scummiest. Then he continued to not like him and bumped his personal odds to 70/30. Dowolf was looking to vote anyone other than Oddity that was present to defend himself. As I already mentioned I think Death did enough that he was still the best target even if he wasn't there to defend himself. That makes me look terrible apparently.

you asked for an alternative but stopped posting afterwards
that looked questionable at best
it makes you look terrible because you called Oddity townwhile you, in the end, didnt help him live

Making sure town lives D1, is not the primary goal unfortunately. I wasn't going to press another player who since I don't have a read on is more likely town than scum (because no read means random) at the end of day and cause a B8 special. I feel those are more beneficial to scum. But yes I recognize that it made me look bad. I still think it was the right thing to do.
---