LogFAQs > #971542688

EDumey posted...

I'm not sure why I have to summarize Ulti's thoughts on a player for you, when they're literally right there for you to read if you were willing to engage with them. Ulti at latest said that Sultan had bad posts in Topic 1 and then is acting too scared and concerned with how his actions are perceived. Who else has called out Sultan for being too concerned with his image, instead of players just going , "oh Sultan, silly guy not remembering what he's already replied to!"

My point was that if Ulti's posts were truly of any substance, another player would be able to clearly explain them. Because all I've seen from him is "Sultan scum" and that's it. Everything else about Sultan in Ulti's posts have been quotes from other players, and nothing of Ulti's own thoughts on why he thinks Sultan is scum besides "just trust me bro".

Like, I don't recall at all when Ulti said that Sultan was concerned about his own image, and that's what made him look scummy. Could you point me to that post?

EDumey posted...

Like, I'm struggling to understand from a town perspective, why you would be UPSET that a player is coming to the same conclusions as you independently. If he ends up changing his mind once he catches up, great, but it would ostensibly show that he was looking at things from a town perspective as he analyzed, wouldn't it? Especially considering:

I'd be happy if a player came to the same conclusion as me if that conclusion wasn't already proven patently false.

Not to mention I'm no longer concluding the same thing as Ulti because I talked about with Han and Peaf, and we had discussion that ultimately showed my conclusion as highly unlikely. If Ulti still wants to assert that Plum is scum, then I would like him to at least acknowledge and argue against the things that have brought Plum in favor of being town.

But he's not doing that. Ulti is spouting out his own reads without considering the arguments that were already made, and that does nothing productive, as we'd simply retread the same arguments.

Kirby: "I think Plum could still be scum."
Others: "Then why would Plum do x, y, z as scum?"
*cue conversation about Plum's actions at end of day*

~ Hours later ~

Ulti: "PLUM IS SCUM EVERYONE GOSH FREAKING LYNCH THIS DUDE IF I DIE"
Others: "Then why would Plum do x, y, z as scum?"
*cue the exact same conversation that just happened hours ago*

If Ulti had said Plum is scum after acknowledging the arguments already presented on why Plum is town, I'd be fine with it. Otherwise, Ulti's read on Plum is distracting and doesn't present anything new.

EDumey posted...

Then why discredit? I feel it is ironic here that I want to also caveat that my intent is not to say Ulti is town here. I am not defending his takes, I'm finding issue with you seeming to actively discredit his catch-up. I think Lopen said it last game. Town doesn't seek to discredit players, they seek to correct player's misinformation. Scum seeks to discredit players when they can't argue with the information.

I'm not trying to discredit per se. Ulti could be scum trying to seem productive. That's possible, so I can see why you're thinking I'm trying to discredit Ulti.

Ulti could also be town wasting up topic space with no convincing arguments. If that's the case, I'm trying to encourage Ulti to adopt a more productive stance that can help us, as a town, move forward with new information.

Let me be clear: I don't want Ulti to be silent. I just want him to provide more useful posts and reads. Besides, since when was calling people's posts a lot of words but no substance a crime? People literally used that same argument against me on Day 1, and I don't see you attacking those people for it :P