Lurker > averagejoel

you're probably right. most jobs have difficult aspects to them.

good job sticking with it!
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joe_stalin518 posted...

Must be a good place to live if this is the worst thing happening to them

montreal is a good place to live, but this is not the worst thing happening to them
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Zodd3224 posted...

The Admiral posted...

KStateKing17 posted...

averagejoel posted...

lol funeral homes aren't going to go under just because homophobic dipshits refuse to go there

"You got GAYS working here? No we don't want your business. We'll just throw Uncle Jimmy in the river."

Issue isn't about gays, it's about a transwoman. And yes, if the funeral director comes out looking like Mrs. Doubtfire, many religious families will just use another funeral home. Ultimately, both the funeral home that employed the transgender and the transgender herself will just be out of work anyway.

Usually I feel like you are somewhat reasonable, but this is ridiculous.

he's never reasonable when it comes to social issues, but he's usually a bit more deft at disguising it
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KStateKing17 posted...

averagejoel posted...

lol funeral homes aren't going to go under just because homophobic dipshits refuse to go there

"You got GAYS working here? No we don't want your business. We'll just throw Uncle Jimmy in the river."

even if they did refuse to go there, it's not like there's a shortage of people dying
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lol funeral homes aren't going to go under just because homophobic dipshits refuse to go there
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spikethedevil posted...

America continues to be one of the if not the most backwards first world country.

and the biggest reason why so many third world countries are so backwards
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lol no one has ever gotten fired for being heterosexual

but regardless, "sexuality" or "sexual orientation" is the protected class. it does not differentiate between the various orientations
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myzz7 posted...

if you're a lefty who says its okay for facebook and twitter and whatever social media to kick off people with opinions they don't like than i don't know how u can oppose this lgbt fire at will thing.

because kicking someone off twitter for being an awful person is not the same thing as firing someone for being gay. awful people are not a marginalized group
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they're getting bolder every day
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Kisai posted...

KainWind posted...

You lost me at the topic title.

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Muffinz0rz posted...

I'm not asking you to teach me anything. I just want to hear your solutions, which you seemed so happy to share until I pressed you to take things a step further than idealistic drivel.

I went from explaining why landlords are parasites to answering questions about your ex girlfriend renting out the top floor of a house. you've done nothing but move the goalposts the entire time. no matter what I say, you just come up with some other question that's slightly less relevant to the actual topic at hand.

on the off chance that you legitimately want to learn this stuff, read a book or something. or, as I suggested before, pay me. this is my last post in this topic until I get some money coming into my paypal account.
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anthony bourdain had never done it until he shared it with a friend on his show
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a live bear
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Muffinz0rz posted...

I'm not trying to get you to say you're wrong; I'm trying to get you to bring specific examples of the change you wish to see in the system. You aren't being specific, you're just giving vague notes like "tighter restrictions" and whatnot. It's not disingenuous to ask for specifics, which is what seems to be triggering you.

I challenged you to provide specific ideas, not vague ones, and you couldn't. That's not at all loaded or uninteresting, especially considering you're the one who brought up some vague ideas for fixes in the first place.

Take the L or provide some specifics.

I'm not your damn teacher

though, as I offered before, I can be. if you want me to educate you about this, pay me up front and I will.
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Muffinz0rz posted...

Perform all the mental gymnastics you want, you backed out. You took the L in a perfectly rational conversation.

Just own up to it man. It's not a big deal admitting when you're wrong. Which, by the way, I'm not making you do. I'm not shutting the door on allowing you to respond. The conversation can still go on and you don't have to take the L. But as long as you continue this paypal noise, that's you backing out.

Spin it all you want, you backed out. Either answer my very rational, logical questions, or stop replying and hold your L.

I'm not wrong, I didn't take an L, and I'm not performing any mental gymnastics.

your questions are loaded and your posts are disingenuous and uninteresting. it is not worth my time to answer your questions unless you are paying me to do so.
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also:

Muffinz0rz posted...

I do it because getting them to back out in spectacular fashion (i.e. demanding paypal for responses) is a great feeling.

don't flatter yourself. I'm not backing out. you're just boring and give 0 indication that you're even listening to what I say, and I'm not willing to engage with that without compensation
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Muffinz0rz posted...

Joel, do you support point #4?

Muffinz0rz posted...

What in any of my posts would lead you to believe that?

no comment until you pay me
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fenderbender321 posted...

If Fascists are actively doing harmful things to people, then yes peace isn't going to work in terms of stopping them in particular and preventing them from doing more damage. But that's what I mean about short-term vs long-term.

there's no "if"

fascists are actively doing harmful things to people
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fenderbender321 posted...

There's a peaceful solution to EVERYTHING. You're thinking way too short-term.

are you suggesting we wait until after they've killed all the jews, black people, LGBT+ people, disabled people, and anyone who opposes them?
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fenderbender321 posted...

averagejoel posted...

fenderbender321 posted...

pinky0926 posted...

Guys lets calmly and reasonably debate the pros and cons (but mostly pros) of exterminating millions of jews, please keep it civil

- /r/debatefascism

Imagine getting an in-depth look into the brains of fascists...seeing what makes them tick. Seeing how they rationalize things that are so intuitively evil and irrational to you and I.

You can't see any benefit in that?

I can see plenty of benefit for the fascists. none for people who are opposed to them.

So you don't understand how knowledge can be beneficial toward implementing peaceful solutions?

there isn't a peaceful solution to fascism
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fenderbender321 posted...

pinky0926 posted...

Guys lets calmly and reasonably debate the pros and cons (but mostly pros) of exterminating millions of jews, please keep it civil

- /r/debatefascism

Imagine getting an in-depth look into the brains of fascists...seeing what makes them tick. Seeing how they rationalize things that are so intuitively evil and irrational to you and I.

You can't see any benefit in that?

I can see plenty of benefit for the fascists. none for people who are opposed to them.
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fenderbender321 posted...

So assuming those things are examples of fascism comparable to Mussolini and Hitler's rule, would censorship have prevented those things from coming to fruition?

killing the fascists certainly would have helped
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fenderbender321 posted...

averagejoel posted...

fenderbender321 posted...

Look at America. We still have our democratic-republic after all these years despite the fact that we have free speech. People in this country, such as college professors, philosophers, inventors, politicians, etc....they've engaged in and discussed even some of the most radical philosophies ever encountered....fascism, socialism, communism, feudalism, etc. And people are free in this country to step up and say "I believe in fascism" and they are free to preach it.

Yet, extreme political ideologies are not prevalent in this country. Why? Because we are educated. We know right from wrong. And that is a result of us tolerating the discussion and thus spreading of knowledge among such a wide range of ideas.

I don't see how you guys can disagree with that.

because fascism is prevalent in the US, so your entire premise is wrong

No it's not.

Name one Fascist in power or one example of how the American people are subject to fascism.

Donald Trump
police being able to kill black people with impunity
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Muffinz0rz posted...

averagejoel posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

How is anything I've said asinine or disingenuous? All I'm doing is pressing you for specific solutions to something you adamantly seem to care about. It's not at all coming from a place of hostility, it's just coming from simple curiosity.

do you want my paypal or not?

Lol backing out of an honest, civil discussion because you don't actually have solutions. Don't dive too deep next time fam.

you weren't being honest. you were wasting my time. my time is valuable. if you want me to continue, you have to make it worth my while
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Muffinz0rz posted...

How is anything I've said asinine or disingenuous? All I'm doing is pressing you for specific solutions to something you adamantly seem to care about. It's not at all coming from a place of hostility, it's just coming from simple curiosity.

do you want my paypal or not?
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fenderbender321 posted...

Look at America. We still have our democratic-republic after all these years despite the fact that we have free speech. People in this country, such as college professors, philosophers, inventors, politicians, etc....they've engaged in and discussed even some of the most radical philosophies ever encountered....fascism, socialism, communism, feudalism, etc. And people are free in this country to step up and say "I believe in fascism" and they are free to preach it.

Yet, extreme political ideologies are not prevalent in this country. Why? Because we are educated. We know right from wrong. And that is a result of us tolerating the discussion and thus spreading of knowledge among such a wide range of ideas.

I don't see how you guys can disagree with that.

because fascism is prevalent in the US, so your entire premise is wrong
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Muffinz0rz posted...

Would you rather those people be homeless?

no

Muffinz0rz posted...

I personally am not. But people do. My ex is renting the top floor of a house from an older couple. What happens in that case? Does the couple lose the entire house and it all becomes public housing? Or will my ex still get to live there, but she no longer has to pay rent?

this is the type of shit to be worked out on a case by case basis

Muffinz0rz posted...

What would you have that limit be? (In USD)

I would have it be determined by whoever institutes the law, after considering minimum wage, the cost of living, consulting tenants, and probably many other factors

anyway, I've given you enough of my time for free. if you want me to answer any more of your disingenuous asinine questions, I'm gonna have to ask that you compensate me for my time. $10 per question, paid in advance. I'll give you the link to my paypal if you agree.
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fenderbender321 posted...

pinky0926 posted...

yes you would

It's the best course toward eliminating potentially harmful ideas. It's when we censor and suppress that people start to wonder if they're on the right side.

Sounds counter-intuitive, but reality is reality.

this is objectively incorrect
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I hope someone with more computer knowledge than me knows what must be done
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might go a bit higher than $100, but not much. hard limit 120
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come to the dark side.

we have... sandwiches


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Muffinz0rz posted...

Balrog0 posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

A land-value tax actually makes sense. My dad's big cabin out in the middle of buttfuck nowhere Wisconsin shouldn't be getting gutted as much as a house in a nice suburb of LA or whatever.

That has nothing to do with why landlords shouldn't be allowed to profit off their own property though.

It's related because some share of the profits from most rental properties are not due to effort on the part of the landlord (for the reasons I listed above). Which gives credence to the idea that landlords are unjustly extracting rents (in the economic sense of rent-seeking) rather than providing a service -- because they are to some extent.

So if we taxes property based on the value of the land it rests on, rather than the improvements made to that land, I think you'd see more genuine competition between rental properties that might do things like lower prices... or at least provide housing that's worth the cost.

But they are providing a service; they're literally giving you a roof over your head

they aren't providing a service. the money that they make is not predicated on them doing anything. they just own the property and make money from peoples' continued existence
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Muffinz0rz posted...

I'm renting out my house. Your idea was to seize all rented property and make it public housing.

How are you not getting this?

this is the first time you specified that you were renting out your house.

it's also not "because averagejoel said so"

Literally what? I'm not asking for the "nature" of the restrictions you're proposing; I'm asking for restrictions themselves, which you voluntarily brought up as a solution.

some examples include:
putting a hard limit on the amount that landlords can charge for rent
making it illegal to keep properties empty if there is someone in the area who needs a home

So what's your solution?

averagejoel posted...

the first two that come to mind:
-place heavy restrictions on landlords, institute harsh penalties for not following them, and incorporate strong rent control
-seize all rented property and make it into public housing

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CapnMuffin posted...

shelter is still a basic human need, and they exploit the fact that it's a basic need

Im not sure what your premise is anymore. Are farmers parasitic in nature too because they simply own farm land and livestock which happens to provide a basic human need?

Someone who owns property expends time, money and resources to build or maintain it. Exploiting a need is economy 101. Not certain how that pertains to parasitism as by definition thats not analogous at all.

the money that farmers make depends on them doing work to maintain and harvest crops.

the money that landlords make does not depend on them doing any work. it depends 100% on them owning the property
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Muffinz0rz posted...

averagejoel posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

So I just lose my house because averagejoel said so?

no

where on earth did that idea come from

averagejoel posted...

-seize all rented property and make it into public housing

"I just lose my house because averagejoel said so" does not follow logically from "seize all rented property and make it into public housing"

please elaborate.

Like what? You're the one proposing the restrictions, why can't you come up with any?

the specific nature of the restrictions is besides the point.

I feel like you should know what already exists since you're the one posing a drastic change since apparently what exists isn't good enough by your standards.

what exists varies greatly by area.

if there are homeless people in an area, the housing laws aren't good enough

if there are people in an area who are on the verge of being homeless, the housing laws aren't good enough

If the price is too high, take your business elsewhere. Or sign a lease that locks you in for a year without increasing the rent. The lease is there to protect the renters too.

the problem is systemic and will not be solved by one person moving elsewhere or signing a lease
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Muffinz0rz posted...

So I just lose my house because averagejoel said so?

no

where on earth did that idea come from

Such as?

heavier restrictions that what currently exist. use your imagination.

Are there not any already?

if they do, they're not severe enough

Doesn't that already exist? IIRC rent cannot go up by more than a certain percentage a given year.

in some places. I'm talking everywhere. and make it more restrictive
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CapnMuffin posted...

If they just own land I could see that being a fair analogy. But if they own property on that land then no. They are providing and maintaining a resource with costs in exchange for money.

shelter is still a basic human need, and they exploit the fact that it's a basic need

Muffinz0rz posted...

What's another option then?

there are several. the first two that come to mind:
-place heavy restrictions on landlords, institute harsh penalties for not following them, and incorporate strong rent control
-seize all rented property and make it into public housing
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Muffinz0rz posted...

averagejoel posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

averagejoel posted...

he's correct

So rather than renting out his property for money, he should just let people live there for free? Otherwise he's a parasite?

landlords are exploiting a basic human need (shelter) for profit. they make money by owning things rather than by doing things. that makes them parasites.

So renting should be illegal and it's either have enough to outright purchase a house or be homeless?

are you legitimately incapable of thinking of other options or are you just trolling
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ForestLogic posted...

Then season 3 just immediately starts off with politics and government corruption bullshit that was only ever lightly touched on, if at all in the first 40 or so episodes. It came out of nowhere.

dude their society is fascist and heavily corrupt. if that wasn't blindingly obvious in the first two seasons then I don't know what to tell you
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SpinKirby posted...

averagejoel posted...

SpinKirby posted...

You're missing the point, less whole numbers in C are used, which means measurements are less accurate overall in terms of people living/weather.

this is very different from your original point

this has been my point at the entire time

then this post was extremely poorly worded
SpinKirby posted...

It is though, because it's temperate you're very likely to experience.

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SpinKirby posted...

You're missing the point, less whole numbers in C are used, which means measurements are less accurate overall in terms of people living/weather.

this is very different from your original point
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BigSLM1993 posted...

TBH I feel that when same sex marriage got legalized was when things got worse.

Back when we had landmark advancements in 2013, I remember trans members of the LGBT club saying "Yay yay. We're celebrating with you guys but don't forget about us alright?" And it put a weird energy in the room.

I saw their point that trans rights are further behind but it stood out to me just how different the communities were. And how if one community feels they're winning the fight and the other is behind, that can cause tension.

I think even internally, there's been an increase in hostility towards white gay men. Like it wasn't until after same sex marriage get ratified that I noticed more rhetoric being directed towards them, or open conversations in the Pride center about "disliking white people" or how "we cant be racist to them" (im not exaggerating). Im black btw

It felt like one of those moments when an army wins a war and then you get that "now what?" moment. And then it collapses to infighting.

Not saying that gay issues are non existent but it feels like the infighting has increased.

no one kicks down harder than the people on the first rung of the ladder
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SpinKirby posted...

averagejoel posted...

SpinKirby posted...

averagejoel posted...

jumi posted...

Metric makes sense, but Fahrenheit is superior to Celsius in every way. Neither is base 10, so why not use Fahrenheit, which is both more exact and more intuitive to the human body. So what if water freezes at 0 C and boils at 100 C? Fuck water. Once you know water freezes at 32 F and boils at 212 F, Celsius is inferior in every way.

it's not more intuitive to the human body

It is though, because it's temperate you're very likely to experience.

that depends on which country you're in. if you're in basically any country other than the US, you're far more likely to experience temperature in Celsius.

Uhhh, nah

We're all in the same hemisphere.

Realistically, on this planet, everyone may or may not experience -50 F to 110 F
For Celsius, that's like -45 C to 45 C

and -45C to 45C

is in

*gasp*

Celsius
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SpinKirby posted...

averagejoel posted...

jumi posted...

Metric makes sense, but Fahrenheit is superior to Celsius in every way. Neither is base 10, so why not use Fahrenheit, which is both more exact and more intuitive to the human body. So what if water freezes at 0 C and boils at 100 C? Fuck water. Once you know water freezes at 32 F and boils at 212 F, Celsius is inferior in every way.

it's not more intuitive to the human body

It is though, because it's temperate you're very likely to experience.

that depends on which country you're in. if you're in basically any country other than the US, you're far more likely to experience temperature in Celsius.
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reposting:

MuayThai85 posted...

Difference is a) South African farmers have valuable skills/abilities (you know, farming)

owning land =/= knowing how to farm

plus, there's a surplus. there are already too many farms in the US

b) they are more than willing to assimilate while not forcing their beliefs down everyone else's throats

1. they're beneficiaries of apartheid who only returned stolen land to its owners when they were forced to. lol great assimilation
2. the idea that immigrants to the US are forcing their beliefs down everyone else's throats is... incorrect. stop buying into the fear mongering.

c) they can speak English

lots of people all over the world can speak english
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Muffinz0rz posted...

averagejoel posted...

he's correct

So rather than renting out his property for money, he should just let people live there for free? Otherwise he's a parasite?

landlords are exploiting a basic human need (shelter) for profit. they make money by owning things rather than by doing things. that makes them parasites.
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MuayThai85 posted...

Eat More Beef posted...

averagejoel posted...

BlueMage279 posted...

I'd say they should have preference over certain other nation's refugees because (a) they already speak English, (b) we know they are already skilled in a specific type of labor, and (c) they are more likely to have values compatible with our own as they're part of a westernized country.

I would like to direct you to post 36 where I already addressed these issues

Also, I enjoy the narrative that South African's have skills that can be put to use, however, brown people are all shiftless layabouts with no skills what-so-ever.

Trained farmers are a valuable commodity anywhere they go. Russia even offered them assylum because they realize they have a skill that can be greatly put to use.

you still haven't addressed post 36
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jumi posted...

Metric makes sense, but Fahrenheit is superior to Celsius in every way. Neither is base 10, so why not use Fahrenheit, which is both more exact and more intuitive to the human body. So what if water freezes at 0 C and boils at 100 C? Fuck water. Once you know water freezes at 32 F and boils at 212 F, Celsius is inferior in every way.

it's not more intuitive to the human body
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BlueMage279 posted...

I'd say they should have preference over certain other nation's refugees because (a) they already speak English, (b) we know they are already skilled in a specific type of labor, and (c) they are more likely to have values compatible with our own as they're part of a westernized country.

I would like to direct you to post 36 where I already addressed these issues
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an archaeology dig
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