Lurker > DoomTheGyarados

23 minutes, plenty of time to discuss now. I wanted my one on one chess match with Oddity and I got it.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Okay so here is Oddity's list he posted and my notes based off what he said.

Town

VI – Top of the list but questionable? That doesn't make sense. When this list was requested it was asked to be done in order, but his answer doesn't reflect this.
Pez – Second to top but conflicted? Same with VI, when put on the spot this doesn't make a lot of sense.
Tom – Believes room mate powers works one way and uses that to elevate tom to a town list.
Sbell – Thought Sbell made astute observations on a town read of his being scum, thought he had style.



Of note Oddity has 4 town reads, and 3 of them are severely hedged here. VI at the top of this list but he questions it, Pez he has gone back and forth on a lot but despite only having a vague sense of why he likes him (because 'he is right') he decides to put Tom in this small list almost entirely due to pez based on 'roommate powers' and a vague sense that pez is town.

Scare - “thinks” he has a town read on Scare, as if he is drawing from a memory of a statement made and not a genuine feeling.
dowolf - “I thought I put him on my town list” instead of saying “I think he is town”, there's a degree of separation between having a read and making a list of reads and I think that shows in this case with his answer to this one.

Both of these next two he uses muddied language on his reads of them. Thinks he has a town read and he thinks he puts them on a town list. He has expressed almost no real conviction that anyone at all is town of this list.

????
plum – Would shoot Plum, but barely, despite having Scare in an entire different tier on this list. Seems to be hedging.
Red
Lolo

Scumish
Death – repeated the phrase 'capitalized on my weakness' like a mantra, I tend to think that's a trait of someone repeating memorized lines rather than being genuine.
Phoenix
KBM – Lists as vig suspect.

Scummy
Scep – Bottom on his totem pole but not up for a vigging by Oddity, shows lack of integrity when making this list (logical integrity, not like the merit)
Chris – At the time of his unvote I don't think I was curious about him at all.

If Oddity is scum based off these answers (and not anyone's play) I think Sbell is scum because I don't feel like a scum Oddity wants to say town are town and Sbell was the only person he was firm about being town, I think Scare is also one of his scum buddies due to the phrasinf of 'I think I have a town read on Scare' and I think Phoenix is the last scum because he never mentioned him once throughout this entire process, subtly avoiding him.

Oddity/Sbell/Phoenix/Scare based solely on Oddity reads if he is scum. Also Red is the first alternate on this list for Phoenix reasons.

Also he literally forgot Lolo while making this, if Oddity is scum Lolo is super confirmed town.

I am comfortable with an Oddity lynch based off of this questioning. You lot may continue now.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Oddity you've had five minutes.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Vengeful_KBM posted...

I will say that telling people not to contribute to the topic is unusually anti-town behavior for a Town Chris. I remember him having lambasted people for saying such things.

I put Oddity off limits for 30 minutes, it's all going to be okay.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

If you could kill any player in the game in this moment which would it be and why?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

What town tell of mine did I exhibit to make you unvote me?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Tom I have asked for a moment alone with the suspect, it has been a long, fruitful day. There there.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Why do you not trust Tom's ROOM MATE POWERS read of Pezloco?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Ir you could shoot one of Scare or Plum, which one would you shoot and why?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Oddity posted...

dowolf? I thought I put him on my town list?

My mistake.

Why do you think sbell is town?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Don't.

Why do you suspect dowolf?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Also not to be that guy but I would ask others to please stop engaging Oddity at this time if you're just going to be fruitless. We have 48 minutes and I am going extreme here in my methods. Stop distracting the suspect.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

What is the best thing VI has done this game in your view, Oddity?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

What do you think of the fact that pezloco has given you such a strong benefit of the doubt? When looking at the game state, do you believe it is natural for him to have done so given the number of people who think otherwise? Why?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Just focus on our chess game Oddity, we don't have time for you to side track.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

We have a chessboard with 13 pieces on it. You and I are both Kings on this board, opposing, or so the premise goes.

But let's look at the central conflict of the last 24 hours, my pursuit of you, and let's look at our pieces.

Does a scum Deathvote Oddity and then do the bidding of a town Chris to go after a town Oddity? Why or why not?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Plum I learned in other communities that my fire which used to drive me only made me vulnerable if I let it out of my grasp. When I am composed and don't let my emotions cloud my judgment I make smart mafia moves.

Hey Oddity, want to trigger Scare and play a game of mafia Chess? This is vague, but I hope you say yes.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

I mean, in a statement that means nothing but makes me smile: yes, I am town. I am town doing my best to play a polite, reasoned game.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

I have never seen someone supposedly so mad over calm reason and discussion over a period of hours. I haven't blindsided you, I haven't done anything dirty. I just noticed comparisons that everyone either agrees with or at least understands the problem. You waltz in and just go "grr"
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

If you are town Oddity you truly have not the first clue what makes a Chris a scum Chris.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Oddity's just going through the five stages of scum grief.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Oh yeah, Dowolf is probably town who just has maybe lost his fine touch.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Vengeful_KBM posted...

Oddity posted...

Chris' argument against me is complete bullshit. The hoppy vote thing is true, I've put my vote a lot of different places, but it's just how I play day 1.

No matter how many times I read this it sounds like you're saying:

Chris' argument is complete bullshit except that what he's saying is true. It's just what I do though.

How can something be complete bullshit if you admit that it has a basis in reality?

KBM can I sing you beautiful music from musicals under an oak tree sometime?
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

No one thinks your attitude towards me is the same between M4 and here.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Even people who are defending Oddity like pez noted there is clearly a difference. It is just that to them, in theory, differences can be explained by circumstance.

Oddity as scum though felt like that point was make or break and has to defend it. "No you are wrong," he protests. No, I'm not. I've laid out my argument clearly and without being unfair in any way.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

I mean you say you're past caring but then you try to go super saiyan on me with the big roar and stuff and I am not going to feed into that.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Oddity posted...

Look, I don't care what I posted in that game, this is this game. My attitude towards you is exactly the same in both games. I default towards scummy unless I see something that gives me a towntell. I laid more groundwork for the scummy thing in that game because it had been a long time and I could easily describe the reasons behind my scumread of you. In this game I believe I said I have gut that you are scum or some such. That's it. What more do you want me to say? Gut in itself is indescribable in this particular case. It's just how I feel.

By the way folks, here it is. I don't care what I posted in that game, my attitude towards you is the exact same.

Plum my old friend, do you remember what I always tell you about how scum are afraid to show weakness?

"my attitude towards you is exactly the same."

Can't even admit it isn't, a tragic flaw to scum.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Dowolf you are welcome to that belief but I don't think it has much of a basis in reality.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

No, not that at all actually. The comparison between YOU. No towntells is what it is, but you trying to say you've acted similar between M4 and this game is wildly inaccurate and we have the posts to prove it, and posted them. You engaged me a lot in M4 while drawing a conclusion that I could be scum, here you didn't lay the groundwork properly.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Okay let me take off my coat.

*Folds it neatly on the chair*

Now please excuse me as I drink a bottle of water, I am a bit parched.

*Drinks some water*

All better.

Alright, I'm fucking pissed. I know it's not going to avert my lynch but fuck it, I'm past caring.

Anyway for those not familiar with technical mafia terms this is called an 'appeal to emotion.' Oddity is noting he is pissed, for some reason or another. Perhaps it is the calm, deliberate, and focused way I have garnered votes to his lynch. He uses a lot of language in this post that is meant to draw sympathy and characterize me as unreasonable, and we'll get to that. But Oddity here is just appealing to people's general belief that town is fiery and scum is stoic without bringing anything to the table.

Chris' argument against me is complete bullshit. The hoppy vote thing is true, I've put my vote a lot of different places, but it's just how I play day 1. What really pisses me off is he seems to think my behavior has changed from this game to last game. What did death report back? I was initially wary of Chris but found some towntells on him without 'defaulting to scum' or some such shit. Hmm... what's different here? I found no fucking towntells is what happened here. So my default to scum read never went away.

Here's the problem though, he starts calling it complete bullshit but then kind of veers off into the realm of vagueness. We all saw exactly what Death reported back, and we don't need Oddity retelling us the events with his slant to know what we saw,. In that previous game Oddity didn't mention any sort of default slant on me - he mentioned behavior in that game that made him wary. Here because I had "burned him a lot" he starts off as being suspicious of me without laying the proper groundwork for that suspicion, which is a stark and obvious departure from Mercs 4 mafia. Only by not going 1 for 1 and twisting his words to suit his needs can Oddity attempt to match the two games together. What I had Death do was much more telling and obvious to the naked eye that Oddity's stance on how he treats me completely changed game to game. That he is trying to say otherwise now is just a poor attempt to shift the argument.

Also awhile back he mentioned something about 'actually considering my arguments instead of just default to scum' or something. Hmmmmm... when did I do that this game? Was it when I tried to figure the whole scare situation out? Yah it might be that time. I did vote scare to get some information out of him. And then what was the end result of that? I disagreed with chris. Maybe that was my fucking sin, I didn't immediately agree with chris. Was scare's argument bad? Yah, but I think scum scare is smart enough to fabricate something besides chess board. Totally subjective call obviously, but that's what happened.

Again you rely on vagueness and a bit of a twisting of the words. It's a clever attempt, I grant you, but the problem is it misses its mark here. When I say 'consider my arguments' I actually meant both ways there. In M4 you considered my early game and went "by golly, that's scummy" because it didn't match what you remembered from me, whereas here you don't really have anything like that before going "Oh yeah, I always have Chris phobia" when I think you are one of the players who doesn't really have that to such a degree and you certainly didn't with how you handled M4.

My argument is actually very sound, thank you very much.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Appeal to emotion. Yawn.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Fine, mental exercise, I get it.

Pez because his logic on Oddity, if he is town, is basically 'oh boy look at me, I called oddity town I told you guys'
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Not a single one for you, Sbell. That boy ain't flipping town.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

If Oddity flips town I make a note to talk to Oddity post game about changing his approach to me 100% game to game for no reason.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

I do try.

Anyway Oddity is a great lynch, glad I pushed it.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

I am around, but so far this topic is 'blah blah' so Oddity dying it is.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

I like the people who piled on Oddity tbh
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Yup Scare and Oddity, epic scum buddies???
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

kbm is probably right, dowolf is town.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Uh dowolf, we aren't lynching you today bud.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

That is entirely a member of town seeing something and going "that's a read I have" tbqh
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Phoenix-Smasher posted...

Definitely agree on Lolo being a bad lynch. If he flips town, we learn just about nothing from it. It would have been a freebie for scum. And if he's scum? Well, we'd have one less to worry about, but minimal info still. Day 2 would pretty much be day 1 plus night 1 action results.

DoomTheGyarados posted...

Kbm is probably town

Could I get your reasoning on this? I fail to see anything more than null for KBM at the moment

Sure, my literal thought "what kind of scum walks into the topic, buddies with dowolf or not, and says he is one of their 3 town reads."
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Kbm is probably town
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

We are not lynching an inactive day one. The reason for disliking Lolo is 90% lack of content which is NOT a reliable scum trait day one. Someone scan scan the dude night 1.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

By the way I am getting off work in 5 and am going to grab some food and then I am here until deadline for the most part. I am going to strangle the rest of this day.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Basically Pez Oddity stated that he always leans a bit suspicious of me to start but in M4 he didn't just do this as a blanket statement - he was quite clear with his reasoning.

It feels less like you are feeling 'good' about Oddity and morel like you are just making things up to feel he might not be scum. It's kind of absurd, really.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Everything he has done today is completely different to his last game with me where he was town. I am a bit shocked you could even spin it that way, Pez.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Think Pez might be a bit rusty with those reads.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Not much, but town Plum was always way more relaxed than scum Plum tbh
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality

Tom is probably town.
---

Sir Chris
The Cult of Personality