So someone said I'd like Factorio, I'll explain why I don't like games like this

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Poll of the Day » So someone said I'd like Factorio, I'll explain why I don't like games like this
It's a common misunderstanding that I'd like games like this, as I've liked games with similar types of mechanics in the past (like Rimworld).
The reality is that I do not like games with "lots of mechanics" unless I can easily cheese to eliminate as many mechanics as possible. In Rimworld, I played it very early on in development, and basically turned it into a Tower Defense game. After I got that pattern down, I ruined any enjoyment I could have ever had in the game.

Factorio? The game has too many mechanics for my liking. I like simple gameplay loops. If I'm discouraged in the tutorial due to "too many mechanics" being presented all at once, there's no way I can enjoy the game proper.

Over complicating a game doesn't make it good. It makes it complicated. Complicated things are almost never good.
It's not about me.
Complicated can definitely be good, you just need an appropriate level of payoff so it feels worth it
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Factorio is fairly simple, it's just inputs and outputs. The complexity comes with scaling those inputs and outputs.

The tower defense stuff is just about automating defenses, it's just another line in the factory.

If you're struggling to keep towers fed with ammo, create a loop of ammo around your base. If you're struggling with the amount of turrets you need, automate the creation of turrets. If you're struggling with the amount of ore, start expanding and pulling resources in. Use giant belts. Use trains. Use robots when you get to them. The factory must grow in space and complexity, from simple inputs and outputs. Making green circuits is easy, making enough of them, and the right amount of them, is hard.
Judgmenl posted...
I like simple gameplay loops.

Factorio's core gameplay loop is a pretty simple matter of identifying bottlenecks and fixing them. There are a lot of different tools available to solve those bottlenecks, but the loop still boils down to that simple process. By the nature of its continual expansion, each time you solve a bottleneck something new ends up bottlenecking the inexorable growth of the factory, and that's what makes it so compelling: Until you reach whatever ultimate goal you set for yourself (whether that's launching a rocket, launching a million rockets, some arbitrary science per minute target, or building a ray casting engine to play Doom), it's just a steady stream of solving bite-sized problems that give tangible progress toward something more.

Judgmenl posted...
The game has too many mechanics for my liking.

It can be overwhelming to look at the big picture and try to comprehend everything that's going on, but the mechanics are really very simple. At every level, it's just inputs and outputs, whether that's putting ore into a furnace and getting out plates, or combining a dozen different items together in three different production chains spanning several machine types to build a rocket. Mechanically, it all boils down to:

  • Move items around with belts, trains, or bots (each of which has advantages and disadvantages that are fairly intuitive, none of which are actually mandatory if you struggle with or don't like them)
  • Move fluids around with pipes and trains
  • Use inserters/pipe connections to put items/fluids into machines and take out the desired products
  • Make sure you're generating enough power (which mostly involves a combination of the above mechanics)
  • Apply diplomacy to the natives as needed (optional, enemies can be completely turned off if you would rather just build)
That's really it. The complexity comes in figuring out how to connect each step together and how to get the quantities needed, not in the core mechanics involved. That complexity builds quite gradually, too, with your first science pack being just two ingredients and one processing step past the smelting, and each subsequent one mostly requiring you to automate the production of items that you're already going to want to automate at that stage of the game (like belts and inserters for the second one). You're never going to be thrown into the middle of an existing factory and required to fix it. There can be a few hiccups along the way, like nuclear power isn't overly intuitive and you'll probably end up just getting the ratios from the wiki, and train signalling can get tricky if you build a more complex network, but none of that is actually required to launch a rocket and you can therefore take it at your own pace (or skip it entirely, if you'd rather).

I and others keep recommending it to you because it lines up with your interests in programming and problem solving. A huge portion of the game's fanbase is either programmers or engineers, so for a software engineer, the recommendation is pretty obvious. Toss in that you've mentioned liking problem solving and getting enjoyment out of games where you can engineer a solution that automates large chunks of the game for you, and a game about engineering solutions to automation problems (especially when it's a really good game of that sort) is a no-brainer. But you don't have to take our word for it. There's a free demo that walks through the early steps of that automation. My understanding is that the sample of combat the demo provides is a bit more intense than it is in the actual game (at least on default settings), but otherwise it's a great demo and will give you an accurate picture of what the full game experience is like. Give it a try, the only thing you've got to lose is an hour or two if you don't like it (or several thousand if you do).

https://factorio.com/download
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BoomerKuwanger posted...
Yes we know you don't like video games
I played 2 hours of Tevi and 2 hours of WitchSpring R this week.
It's not about me.
Judgmenl posted...
I played 2 hours of Tevi and 2 hours of WitchSpring R this week.

BoomerKuwanger posted...
Yes we know you don't like video games

A friend got me in to Civilization and while I like the game, there's too much shit you need to optimize/monitor every damn turn if you actually want to win even on lower difficulties.

I like a challenge, but this is kinda like for the kid who finishes a math final in 12 minutes while I am still on problem #2, and will likely get a C or D, and thats only because the teacher grades you partial credit for correct steps even if the answer is wrong.
Ive been really into Mindustry lately, which is like Factorio but with more RTS and tower defense elements. Maps are separate places, but you can eventually move resources between maps. I think ultimately it might be a bit more simple than Factorio though? But has more gamey elements to it. I like to think of each map as a puzzle How do I defend for the next 30 waves while building up the industry to make this new resource?
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argonautweakend posted...
A friend got me in to Civilization and while I like the game, there's too much shit you need to optimize/monitor every damn turn if you actually want to win even on lower difficulties.

I like a challenge, but this is kinda like for the kid who finishes a math final in 12 minutes while I am still on problem #2, and will likely get a C or D, and thats only because the teacher grades you partial credit for correct steps even if the answer is wrong.
When I played Civ V/VI would always do a 1 city challenge as I would try and optimize the non-combat output of a single city. The main reason I don't play Civ anymore is that it's really stale and I don't like their DLC model.
It's not about me.
Which is why Enrico Dandolo of Venice is my favorite one because it's easy to get hundreds of credits every turn and just buy everything!!!
I very much preferred building tall in Civ V instead of wide. Not necessarily a one-city challenge, but usually no more than 3-4 cities unless I'm using a civ that really needs to build wide. Part of that was probably the simplification of not having to worry about when to dedicate production to a settler instead of something else, part of it was the fact that other civs started to get uppity if you made a fifth city (forcing more emphasis on combat instead of being able to fly under the radar of warmongers), and part of it was just the satisfaction of seeing big numbers and sniping all of the wonders. There's a satisfaction in seeing the whole map covered by a wide empire as well, but I like me some big numbers.

argonautweakend posted...
Which is why Enrico Dandolo of Venice is my favorite one because it's easy to get hundreds of credits every turn and just buy everything!!!

I especially like when an enemy's city is close enough to my territory to cause problems, so I ask them what they want in exchange for the whole city. They tell me there's no way to make the deal work. I offer them 40,000 gold. Apparently there was a way to make the deal work.
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argonautweakend posted...
Which is why Enrico Dandolo of Venice is my favorite one because it's easy to get hundreds of credits every turn and just buy everything!!!
Yes I had tons of fun with Venice when I played Civ V.
It's not about me.
Judgmenl posted...
Over complicating a game doesn't make it good. It makes it complicated. Complicated things are almost never good.
you must know from experience that things that seem complicated when you don't understand them yet will look a whole lot less complicated once you do understand them. it takes some effort to gain the understanding, but it's not impossible and often very rewarding.

are there games (or more generally systems) that you regret understanding?

even a bad game must be on some level understood to evaluate negatively. to say that you refuse to understand something is just an unwillingness to learn and grow.
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Can't say you're wrong there.
It's not about me.
Poll of the Day » So someone said I'd like Factorio, I'll explain why I don't like games like this