Current Events > Is it a form of bigotry to refuse to date any and all who are trans?

(+) Yeah! (+)

The premise of this topic aims to argue for example that a cis woman would be a bigot if she refused to date a trans woman.

No, the premise of this topic was merely a question with no further expansion or further post from the TC.

Nobody worth responding to has made the argument that a presumably heterosexual cis woman refusing to date a transwoman would mean she was a bigot. Nor has anybody worth responding to presented that a homosexual cis woman refusing to date a trans man was, or a heterosexual cis woman refusing to date a trans woman who still had a penis. The vast majority of this thread, regardless of "vibes" and "concerns" of being "forced," has absolutely said that matters of children or genital preference are perfectly fine. This is merely an argument presented by people wanting to feel "forced" so as to attack a community.
bsp77 posted...

I am trying to make people question why, whether they will admit it or not

They never will. They would rather cry that they're being called a bigot and that everybody is forcing them to date people they don't want to.

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Are you seriously criticizing me for this?

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This.

I think when it comes to accepting any kind of lifestyle that is very different from into your own, it takes a certain level of exposure and conversation and thought process. I know it did for me.

If anyone is triggered, please hide it or stop looking. But if others want me to stop, especially those in the trans community, I will. In which case, mods need to close this.

bsp77 posted...

Other than the biological children argument, you are now talking about things that have no bearing on this conversation. If someone is into dating women but would reject every single trans woman out there, then the question is why?

It has every bearing on this topic. Just because it's an argument you don't really like to acknowledge anymore doesn't change it is a major bearing on this topic when the premise is for example a cis woman must be open to dating the trans woman. Biological children is a major potential reason regardless if you personally dont care for biological children.

The premise of this topic is if she refuses to date any cis woman OR trans woman she's a bigot to trans people and women. Emphasis on being a big for refusing to date type of people you aren't attracted to.

And to your why question. Again, the premise of your question is like asking gay men why they are attracted men or a bi woman why they are attracted to men and woman.

And I am not calling every single person that would refuse a bigot, I said to do some soul-searching because there might be some biases there, whether personal or social.

Which is it.
Do you acknowledge that not everyone is a bigot if they refuse to date types of people they aren't attracted to?
Or does anyone who refuse to date trans need to do some soul searching?

Also I ask again, would you for example tell the lesbian woman who is attracted to woman, why she is not sexually attracted men? Would you call her a "bigot" to men just because she refused to date men?

What about the cis woman who refuses to date other women including transwomen? Is she a bigot to women? Is she a bigot to trans people? Despite in my last post of her being greatly supportive of both?

glad we're getting a 500 out of this. thank you for being respectful allies. real nice

GranEu posted...

They never will. They would rather cry that they're being called a bigot and that everybody is forcing them to date people they don't want to.

I changed... took time but conversations like this were critical. I started realizing I just had a bunch of excuses to disregard an entire group of people based on internal biases I was unaware of.

bsp77 posted...

I changed... took time but conversations like this were critical. I started realizing I just had a bunch of excuses to disregard an entire group of people based on internal biases I was unaware of.

but if bottom surgery is the reason you are acting like "people need to do some thinking" you should have spelled it out.

bsp77 posted...

I changed... took time but conversations like this were critical. I started realizing I just had a bunch of excuses to disregard an entire group of people based on internal biases I was unaware of.

You weren't peddling that trans people were forcing you to date them. The people I am referring to ran in with that exact take away and are continuing to argue it, even against you who has never made the claim that anybody needs to date anybody else.

You we're posting in good faith, and it showed.

Genuinely amazed that this topic is nearing the final page and not a single account has been lost yet.

Rai_Jin posted...

but if bottom surgery is the reason you are acting like "people need to do some thinking" you should have spelled it out.

Because I didn't mean that. I thought everyone knows bottom surgery exists.

NatsuSama posted...

It has every bearing on this topic. Just because it's an argument you don't really like to acknowledge anymore doesn't change it is a major bearing on this topic when the premise is for example a cis woman must be open to dating the trans woman. Biological children is a major potential reason regardless if you personally dont care for biological children.

The premise of this topic is if she refuses to date any cis woman OR trans woman she's a bigot to trans people and women. Emphasis on being a big for refusing to date type of people you aren't attracted to.

And to your why question. Again, the premise of your question is like asking gay men why they are attracted men or a bi woman why they are attracted to men and woman.

Which is it.
Do you acknowledge that not everyone is a bigot if they refuse to date types of people they aren't attracted to?
Or does anyone who refuse to date trans need to do some soul searching?

Also I ask again, would you for example tell the lesbian woman who is attracted to woman, why she is not sexually attracted men? Would you call her a "bigot" to men just because she refused to date men?

What about the cis woman who refuses to date other women including transwomen? Is she a bigot to women? Is she a bigot to trans people? Despite in my last post of her being greatly supportive of both?

Seriously, you are just blathering about unrelated things. Most people* are attracted to gender and/or certain genitalia, or a mix. Gender has nothing to do with cis or trans, and genitalia can go either way. Your examples are ridiculous.

* people attracted to emotional connections, intellect, etc.

I am not discarding the biological children argument, as was only putting it aside. I know that could potentially be a reason. But some use it as a handy excuse, and some who don't want biological children, will still refuse.

And to be clear, I am NOT calling all of them outright bigots.

GranEu posted...

You weren't peddling that trans people were forcing you to date them. The people I am referring to ran in with that exact take away and are continuing to argue it, even against you who has never made the claim that anybody needs to date anybody else.

You we're posting in good faith, and it showed.

If I had been active here 7 years ago, I might have peddled some stupid shit

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I do think some people here, especially lurkers, might gain something.

I am also hopelessly optimistic about people. I think you know that.

bsp77 posted...

Seriously, you are just blathering about unrelated things. Most people* are attracted to gender and/or certain genitalia, or a mix. Gender has nothing to do with cis or trans, and genitalia can go either way. Your examples are ridiculous.

I'm blathering about related things you just don't want to hear.

People are attracted to a variety of things including sex, gender, body shape, religion, politics, similar interests, and the genitalia you have. You aren't saying anything I already said posts ago.

The example isn't ridiculous, you just don't like it because it addresses the serious problem with the premise of this topic. Like it or not, the premise of this topic mandates that if a cis woman refuses to date another woman or trans woman than said hypothetical woman is a bigot to women and trans people. Regardless of her supports and efforts to uplift both women and trans people. That is the premises of this topic and your argument.

Bigots like MTG or DeSantis existing doesn't justify the premise of this topic that attempts to make a blanket sweeping statement. Despite that, pointing at bigots existing seems to be your supporting argument to defend a sweeping claim or else someone needs, "soul searching."

hiding the thread would be all well and good, but that does nothing to the idea that a thread can go on for 500 posts using me and ppl like me as an excuse to make shit up about like we arent here. its like the hornyposting threads. i didnt post in those threads but they were still contributing to the objectification of women and coloring the board's perception as a whole

you are not doing any good here, full stop. the conversation has been exhausted, and exhausted, and exhausted. this topic has existed for 100s of posts as an excuse for people like tmaster to dehumanize us consequence free, and for everyone to see him do it

how can i break it down any simpler than that

bsp77 posted...

If I had been active here 7 years ago, I might have peddled some stupid shit

That probably sounded argumentative, sorry if it did. I more meant in the context of this thread.

Take for instance that there is now a push to represent the premise/logic of the thread to try to bring sexuality, which nobody worth responding to has brought up, into it but is now being used as the very core of a thread that started with, the title, a poll, "Is it?" then no other post by the TC.

They need to present "but is a cis het woman a bigot for not dating a trans woman" as the core of the thread, despite nobody worth responding to making that claim.

Hey Shock, don't quote "allies" at me. If my arguments are truly not helpful to anyone (which we don't know), then I am ineffective and maybe misguided, but not a false ally.

Dungeater posted...

how can i break it down any simpler than that

Right, I get where your feelings are coming from, but at the same time... it's not really helpful or productive to heckle and complain from the sidelines of a discussion that you aren't actively participating in. Especially if that discussion is stressing you out to this degree.

Discussions can happen with or without your consent. I think you're getting a little too wrapped up in the need to stop other people from having a discussion/debate/whatever you want to call it.

It doesn't seem like you're doing yourself any good by continuing to read it.

Okay, I will stop if Dungeater wants it to as well. Pretty sure others won't stop..

But don't question my sincerity. Call me an idiot or misinformed or anything, but don't question my sincerity.

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I just saw that post and responded

Whats the alternative?

Well we could not make this obviously bad faith topic hit 500, for starters.

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Feels to me that he is less trying to show he cares, than he is trying to prove to everyone that he cares the most.

bsp77 posted...

Okay, I will stop if Dungeater wants it to as well. Pretty sure others won't stop..

But don't question my sincerity. Call me an idiot or misinformed or anything, but don't question my sincerity.

thank you

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When did I not listen? I saw a call to stop from a trans person, and I stopped. If there was an earlier mention, I missed it.

I also did listen to trans people throughout this topic. I interacted with a quite a few yesterday, listened & learned, and thanked them and apologized if I said anything ignorant.

If this topic should die, stop bumping it to argue with me and Gladius.

This will be my final post. DM if want to discuss.

I abandoned this thread and stopped bumping it when I saw it was on the main GameFAQs page. CE is absolutely cooked if threads like this keep showing up there. That's a very bad look.

There is no way there is 453 people on CE lol

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Nah you and bsp are doing fine. Shock and Hair dont speak for every trans person. Shock himself used to dig his heels in on making things worse by just being petty and spiteful or trolling them back when people genuinely wanted education which lead to a lot of moderations for him. Theres probably still some resentment from that thats fueling this.

Curious how many times someone that isn't trans demands that anyone that isn't trans stop arguing. You would think it would just be once.

GeraldDarko posted...

Curious how many times someone that isn't trans demands that anyone that isn't trans stop arguing. You would think it would just be once.

I mean, were ignoring the trans people saying this is a dumb argument so seems par for the course.

Everyone wants to come off as a good ally, but engaging in dumb thought experiments like this only shows that youre viewing our existence as something you can debate, rather than give us any humanity.

Like, this isnt even a complicated topic. If you wont date someone purely because theyre trans, yeah youre a transphobe sorry. If you wont date them because their genitals arent what you prefer or you want biological kids or anything where you would also be excluding cis women with the same characteristics, cool youre not transphobic.

Like its so trivially simple and this is going to be a 500 topic mostly centered around cis people intellectually fellating themselves.

thats dumb.

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I wouldn't tell you to stop when I'm still posting, as well. Shock could stop. Especially if he is telling you to and everyone else to stop.