Current Events > Bill Maher highlights how students treat teachers like jokes these days.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Most of the time I see Bill Maher has lost his way, but on issues like this I do feel he's not just puffing smoke. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hQliqvizbE students do treat teachers like nothing these days, I feel many feel like school is just aftercare and that teachers are just sitters who can't do anything.

If nothing is done I do feel like American Education is going to really just fall apart.

Broken clock etc.

My sister is super passionate about history and became a high school history teacher. Spent more time trying to get kids to listen and behave then she got to actually talk about and teach interesting topics. She quit after 2 years lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXNj2BobjJ4

haloiscoolisbak posted...

My sister is super passionate about history and became a high school history teacher. Spent more time trying to get kids to listen and behave then she got to actually talk about and teach interesting topics. She quit after 2 years lol

Hmm, that's pretty similar to my situation. I'm also currently in year two, contemplating making this my last year.

I taught 7th grade last year and they were feral, I'm in 5th grade now and see the same behaviors on a slightly lower scale (at least the primary school kids arent vaping and fucking, on campus). I love my coworkers and admin but it's the student behavior that is abhorrent.

It'd be great if I could just teach curriculum and not focus so much on disciplinary issues.

Necronmon posted...

If nothing is done I do feel like American Education is going to really just fall apart.

It already has.

Taharqa_ posted...

Hmm, that's pretty similar to my situation. I'm also currently in year two, contemplating making this my last year.

I taught 7th grade last year and they were feral, I'm in 5th grade now and see the same behaviors on a slightly lower scale (at least the primary school kids arent vaping and fucking, on campus). I love my coworkers and admin but it's the student behavior that is abhorrent.

It'd be great if I could just teach curriculum and not focus so much on disciplinary issues.

You had middle schoolers screwing each other at school? WTF!?

ForsakenHermit posted...

You had middle schoolers screwing each other at school? WTF!?

They know the blind spots for the cameras.

The teacher that took my spot has already resigned due to student behavior.

I been subbing myself since 2017, and can you full time teachers agree with me that it seems giving kids a labtop has destroyed there attention spans even further? As a sub half the time is making sure they are not playing a game or watching a movie, and with all the ways to ask each other for questions its become rather insane how hard it is to make sure the kids are in fact doing there own work.

Without taking the labtops away I feel most students feel that school is all about who has the clout and they know that all that really matters is if there parents can let them get away with everything. Somehow it went from revenge of the nerds to double revenge of the jocks cause more and more only care about how well the sports team does cause grades don't matter, hence many jocks feeling untouchable, just doing enough not to get kicked off a team and knowing that nothing else will matter, hence why its in such a pitiful state, ugh.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


I am still struggling with just pushing the fucking button and going for a teaching career, just on things like this. My greatest worry is that I just won't be able to handle it if some kid is being abused at home and I can't legally do anything about it. I've always done something about it, but this time it would cost me a career and a clean record.

The disrespectful behavior has seemingly gotten way worse since i was in school.

I don't know how teachers deal with students who won't pay attention or are disrupting the class.

These stories are why my wife teaches grade school instead of high school

I don't know how teachers deal with students who won't pay attention or are disrupting the class.

Many just do what's needed to fulfill the daily quotas and given up on anything else, the higher ups make it clear in a lot of cases that all they really care about now is the stats looking good over anything else.

A good chunk of the education system has devolved into quotas over any substance because there's no faith in pepole in fact learning anything these days. Many see it as the entire education system is just trying to hide form kids that AI will make most of them not have any future and just keep them distracted till they are adults. Its no offical policy or anything, just the underground mutterings of the fact that AI is just making it so that there is not enough jobs for most in how the future is looking.

Necronmon posted...

Many just do what's needed to fulfill the daily quotas and given up on anything else, the higher ups make it clear in a lot of cases that all they really care about now is the stats looking good over anything else.

Damn

Necronmon posted...

I been subbing myself since 2017, and can you full time teachers agree with me that it seems giving kids a labtop has destroyed there attention spans even further? As a sub half the time is making sure they are not playing a game or watching a movie, and with all the ways to ask each other for questions its become rather insane how hard it is to make sure the kids are in fact doing there own work.

Without taking the labtops away I feel most students feel that school is all about who has the clout and they know it, hence why its in such a pitiful state, ugh.

This is the generation that is raised on smart phones and iPads. Parents just stick electronics in their face and have at it with unfettered access. How can educators compete with scrolling addiction and the instant gratification of TikTok? Also the common practice of districts just pushing kids through when they are failing contributes to the apathy, if you know you're just going to get passed through anyway why bother with trying to do schoolwork? That contributes to the apathy. We had only seven 5th graders that made the A/B honor roll for the 1st 9wks, lots of Ds and Fs. If I brought home a C my ass was grass

When I was 6 years old I was reading the newspaper and encyclopedias. I wasn't a bookworm by any means and still enjoyed doing kid stuff, but the concept of being "on reading level" was foreign to me. My mother is a retired teacher and she was always on me about reading. These children are constantly two to four grades behind on reading level. I can't blame COVID, I look at the parents, because why is your 7th grader reading on an elementary level?

Where I live right now, if a student treats a teacher disrespectfully, that student is getting a caning in front of the all the school's students.

Necronmon posted...

Many just do what's needed to fulfill the daily quotas and given up on anything else, the higher ups make it clear in a lot of cases that all they really care about now is the stats looking good over anything else.

Then the higher ups failed

A good chunk of the education system has devolved into quotas over any substance because there's no faith in pepole in fact learning anything these days. Those with the talent to become the" elite" are giving special attention, but for many they see it as the entire education system is just trying to hide form kids that AI will make most of them not have any future and just keep them distracted till they are adults. Its no offical policy or anything, just the underground mutterings of the fact that AI is just making it so that there is not enough jobs for most in how the future is looking.

If all they care about is quota's, then they're part of the problem.

AI is going to be a huge problem, all Computers / Smart Devices need to be banned from school to prevent cheating & AI assistance. Kids will use ANY form of tech to avoid work. Preventing that is paramount and lettings kids have access to technology is how we failed them.

Taharqa_ posted...

This is the generation that is raised on smart phones and iPads. Parents just stick electronics in their face and have at it with unfettered access. How can educators compete with scrolling addiction and the instant gratification of TikTok? Also the common practice of districts just pushing kids through when they are failing contributes to the apathy, if you know you're just going to get passed through anyway why bother with trying to do schoolwork? That contributes to the apathy. We had only seven 5th graders that made the A/B honor roll for the 1st 9wks, lots of Ds and Fs. If I brought home a C my ass was grass

Then they shouldn't be allowed to pass if they fail, have them be held back until they truly learn the material.

No-Child Left behind policy is stupid and needs to get rescinded.
Proper Standards needs to be established.

Ban ALL Smart Devices & LapTops / Computers from school.

When I was 6 years old I was reading the newspaper and encyclopedias. I wasn't a bookworm by any means and still enjoyed doing kid stuff, but the concept of being "on reading level" was foreign to me. My mother is a retired teacher and she was always on me about reading. These children are constantly two to four grades behind on reading level. I can't blame COVID, I look at the parents, because why is your 7th grader reading on an elementary level?

People are using technology to avoid teaching properly and doing their jobs.

Also, too much dependency on technology when there have been PLENTY of generations who got by just fine w/o technology.

The greatest scientists who brought humanity to the stars and the moon along with creating the modern computer systems that we used today all did so w/o having technology in the class-room as a crutch.

Time to get back to basics.
All a student needs to learn is a 3-Ring Binder, Pen/Pencil & Paper, Notebooks, & Text Books along with bringing themselves to school.

the more i look the more it seems like university is the only time teaching is at its most interesting.

I've read so many horror stories on the teachers subreddit where there's one or more massively disruptive students and the administration just doesn't back up the teacher at all. Or a student does absolutely nothing all semester and the administration wants them to pass the kid anyway.

Insanity.

The lack of tech oversight is part of what's fucking kids up. Not giving them tech is just teaching them how to fail in a world where it dominates all facets of modern society, and "cut out all tech" is just old man yelling at cloud nonsense. It makes far more sense to have proper oversight over what they have in the school; take the phones away sometimes, allow internet sometimes. As always, context is important.

The greatest scientists who brought humanity to the stars and the moon along with creating the modern computer systems that we used today all did so w/o having technology in the class-room as a crutch.

They literally did. The best and brightest got access to mainframes in university, as far back as the 1950s.

Schools without tech would be a very poor preparation for post-school life.

Guide posted...

The lack of tech oversight is part of what's fucking kids up. Not giving them tech is just teaching them how to fail in a world where it dominates all facets of modern society, and "cut out all tech" is just old man yelling at cloud nonsense. It makes far more sense to have proper oversight over what they have in the school; take the phones away sometimes, allow internet sometimes. As always, context is important.

They literally did. The best and brightest got access to mainframes in university, as far back as the 1950s.

They didn't need tech in K-12 to teach the fundamentals.

MainFrame Computers was a thing for University Students.

You can learn all the K-12 fundamentals w/o tech.

ai123 posted...

Schools without tech would be a very poor preparation for post-school life.

Countless students managed to survive and thrive just fine w/o it.

Put learners first: UNESCO calls for global ban on smartphones in schools
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jul/26/put-learners-first-unesco-calls-for-global-ban-on-smartphones-in-schools
Major UN report issues warning over excessive use, with one in four countries already banning the devices

Learners.

I genuinely dont understand why anybody would teach in the US. As I understand it, the pay, conditions and just about everything else is better in so many other countries.

some people don't think they have a choice or anything better, so they just don't try.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Countless students managed to survive and thrive just fine w/o it.

Blanket statements about technology like this are dumb as fuck. Let's say you got your way, and all laptops/computers were banned from schools. What happens when students graduate and have never used excel, outlook, or power point? Should kids have no early access to any form of coding or comp sci?

"Tech bad" takes like this would have absolutely disastrous consequences if anyone took them seriously

Gwynevere posted...

Blanket statements about technology like this are dumb as fuck. Let's say you got your way, and all laptops/computers were banned from schools. What happens when students graduate and have never used excel, outlook, or power point? Should kids have no early access to any form of coding or comp sci?

Having limited Computer Labs is fine, but giving each student a Chrome Book is going too far.

Using Computers at Home to do your assignments like many students had to in the past, that works out just fine.

"Tech bad" takes like this would have absolutely disastrous consequences if anyone took them seriously

This country has basically had a culture that teaches students to not see teachers as anything other than an annoyance since at least the 90s

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Countless students managed to survive and thrive just fine w/o it.

Irrelevant. And not applicable to today's world.

Students need to be prepared for life after school. Not subjected to this 'back in my day' nonsense. What next? Corporal punishment and after school jobs involving heavy machinery? Hey, most kids survived those too.

Not to mention you would be fighting a battle that has already been lost. Humankind needs to learn how to cope with technology, not pretend it doesn't exist.

ai123 posted...

Irrelevant. And not applicable to today's world.

Students need to be prepared for life after school. Not subjected to this 'back in my day' nonsense. What next? Corporal punishment and after school jobs involving heavy machinery? Hey, most kids survived those too.

Not to mention you would be fighting a battle that has already been lost. Humankind needs to learn how to cope with technology, not pretend it doesn't exist.

Doesn't mean you hand over the class-room to Smart Devices and let those devices run the class room.

There's a limit to what you need inside the classroom.

It was bad back then and it's even worse now

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Having limited Computer Labs is fine, but giving each student a Chrome Book is going too far.

Your original post suggested banning all computers from school, which is what my post was in reference to.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

https://www.mckinsey.com/industries/education/our-insights/new-global-data-reveal-education-technologys-impact-on-learning
Tech in the hands of the teacher is fine, not in the hands of the student.

That article is not supporting your argument. From the article, the absolute best conclusion we can draw about how technology is affecting students is "depends entirely on the context"

Is this really such a huge issue in the US? When I was in high school 20 years ago (and in Australia) this sort of thing was basically unheard of. If it was a common problem Id like to think Id have known about it sooner.

Gwynevere posted...

Your original post suggested banning all computers from school, which is what my post was in reference to.

Ok, my bad, let's get a bit more specific.
Ban Tech for students to control / have arbitrary access too.
Teachers can have it.
Limited Computer Labs like the 1990's.
But tech shouldn't be allowed to be so prevalent in the hands of students.

That article is not supporting your argument. From the article, the absolute best conclusion we can draw about how technology is affecting students is "depends entirely on the context"

From the results I saw, the only effective thing I saw was "in the hands of the teacher".
The students shouldn't be given control of tech, EVER.

They will find a way to distract themselves and not focus on the topic at hand.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/sep/11/sweden-says-back-to-basics-schooling-works-on-paper

Theres clear scientific evidence that digital tools impair rather than enhance student learning, Swedens Karolinska Institute, a highly respected medical school focused on research, said in a statement in August on the countrys national digitalisation strategy in education.
We believe the focus should return to acquiring knowledge through printed textbooks and teacher expertise, rather than acquiring knowledge primarily from freely available digital sources that have not been vetted for accuracy.

Sweden is going back to basics, the rest of the world needs to follow.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Doesn't mean you hand over the class-room to Smart Devices and let those devices run the class room.

There's a limit to what you need inside the classroom.

I agree.

There needs to be something between a total ban on tech, and students failing to learn because they are using smart devices inappropriately.

ai123 posted...

I agree.

There needs to be something between a total ban on tech, and students failing to learn because they are using smart devices inappropriately.

Turn Off the Smart Devices, CONFISCATE EVERY single Smart Device that a student may bring into the class-room.

Go old school: paper, pencil, spiral notebook for note taking.

Focus on what the teacher is teaching and writing notes.

It's worked before, it'll work again.

https://www.nea.org/nea-today/all-news-articles/cellphone-bans-school-are-back-how-far-will-they-go

1. According to the National Center for Education Statistics, in 2020, cellphone bans were in place in 76% of U.S. schools.

We need to get to 100% across the nation at all education levels K-12.

1. Some districts and schools have much broader restrictions on cellphones than others. However, struggles with student behavior and mental health have prompted many schools to restrict access to the devices.

Restrict all Smart Devices in students possessions and tell parents to not allow students to even bring them.
If they need a Cell Phone, tell parents to get them a dumb phone and leave them on "OFF".

1. Research shows that cellphones are a major distraction in classrooms. But some experts, concerned about the impact on school culture, urge leaders not to implement overly restrictive policies.

School Culture needs to take a back seat to learning, the US is already behind most of the world, we need to be more like them.

Phones/ipods/Sidekicks weren't allowed in my school

We had metal detectors and that shit got taken instantly if they found it

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Turn Off the Smart Devices, CONFISCATE EVERY single Smart Device that a student may bring into the class-room.

Repeating yourself is no kind of answer.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Go old school: paper, pencil, spiral notebook for note taking.

Writing is slow as hell unless it's for math. Just give them wireless keyboards.

Bill Maher simply wants an excuse to bitch about the younger generation. This is low hanging fruit for him.

ForsakenHermit posted...

You had middle schoolers screwing each other at school? WTF!?

You didnt? A bunch of peers in my middle school were boning while I was going there >_>

Seeing kids be so disciplined in Japan and knowing what kids are like in America, I see why we're so far behind in education >_>

Dark_Arbron posted...

Is this really such a huge issue in the US? When I was in high school 20 years ago (and in Australia) this sort of thing was basically unheard of. If it was a common problem Id like to think Id have known about it sooner.

I think like most things it depends on location. I live in the NE US in a middle class suburb.
There are some problem kids, but in general classes are fine and kids behave. But maybe its because we live in a decent school district where parents want their kids to learn.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Turn Off the Smart Devices, CONFISCATE EVERY single Smart Device that a student may bring into the class-room.

Go old school: paper, pencil, spiral notebook for note taking.

Focus on what the teacher is teaching and writing notes.

It's worked before, it'll work again.

Kinda fucking hard when my kids schools no longer have textbooks. Everything is on the Chromebook.

Teachers have something called Goguardian to monitor what kids are doing on their chromebooks during class.

TheoryzC posted...

Phones/ipods/Sidekicks weren't allowed in my school

In my district kids up to middle school can bring phones but cant touch them during school. Due to kids needing to contact parents after school.

In high school no phones during class. You can use them in the halls, study halls, lunchtime.

Cuticrusader09 posted...

In high school no phones during class. You can use them in the halls, study halls, lunchtime.

In my high school, no phones nor any kind of electronic devices were allowed period. Depending on the teacher that spotted someone with them, they'd either get it taken from them instantly or they'd be told to put it up.

I think when I started high school, beepers were still a thing. Lol.

Guide posted...

Writing is slow as hell unless it's for math. Just give them wireless keyboards.

Writing by hand is also good for helping people learn / memorize information.

Cuticrusader09 posted... Kinda fucking hard when my kids schools no longer have textbooks. Everything is on the Chromebook.

Go back to physical TextBooks

Teachers have something called Goguardian to monitor what kids are doing on their chromebooks during class.

Another expensive technical solution created to solve a problem created by the introduction of Chrome Books.

NeonBoobs posted...

You didnt? A bunch of peers in my middle school were boning while I was going there >_>

There were kids sleeping with each other but not on school grounds.