Current Events > PS5 - 46.6 million units sold

(+) Yeah! (+)

I'll buy one when GTA6 comes out.

PraetorXyn posted...

4 years ago how is that at all relevant to the discussion at hand when it costs me nothing in regards to playing Spider Man 2 and a PS5 would cost me $500 plus the cost of a bigger SSD?

because it doesn't matter when you spent the money for a PC or a console, if you are going to factor in that cost then factor in the fucking cost.

Friends,

I WISH I DID!!!!

I bought a stupid xbox x, and starfield, and that game sucks.

I was happy with my xbox one, and skyrim and fallout with mods. but this, just is a polished turd.

CrimsonGear80 posted...

because it doesn't matter when you spent the money for a PC or a console, if you are going to factor in that cost then factor in the fucking cost.

Yes it does, because were talking about the requirement to play a specific game. It doesnt cost me anymore than $30-40 and waiting a few years to play it on the PC I already had, whereas if I want to play it now, Ill have to buy a PS5 since I dont have one. This is not a difficult concept to grasp, so stop doing mental gymnastics to well ackshully! fanboy for Sony or whatever your motivation is.

PraetorXyn posted...

Yes it does, because were talking about the requirement to play a specific game. It doesnt cost me anymore than $30-40 a pond waiting a few years to play it on the PC I already had, whereas if I want to play it now, Ill have to buy a PS5 since I dont have one. This is not a difficult concept to grasp, so stop doing mental gymnastics to well ackshully! fanboy for Sony or whatever your motivation is.

I just want some fucking consistency from you.

what if someone bought a PS5 a day before spider-man came out? does that cost factor in?? a day after??

if you are factoring in the cost of the platform you are going to play the game on, then it does not matter when you bought your PC or console you FACTOR IN that price.

and don't do that fucking weak-ass thing where you dismiss someone rightfully calling you out as "fanboy" stuff, you are getting called out for not making any fucking sense and not having any consistency in your argument.

CrimsonGear80 posted...

what if someone bought a PS5 a day before spider-man came out? does that cost factor in?? a day after??

if you are factoring in the cost of the platform you are going to play the game on, then it does not matter when you bought your PC or console you FACTOR IN that price.

If they're buying an entire console specifically for one game on it then it's absolutely fair to factor the cost of the console into the game's price

If somebody already owned a PS5 for unrelated reasons and then bought Spider-Man then the game cost them $70

If they bought a PS5 in advance specifically for Spider-Man because they knew it was coming or didn't want to wait out the exclusivity period, then the game cost them $570

CrimsonGear80 posted...

I just want some fucking consistency from you.

what if someone bought a PS5 a day before spider-man came out? does that cost factor in?? a day after??

if you are factoring in the cost of the platform you are going to play the game on, then it does not matter when you bought your PC or console you FACTOR IN that price.

and don't do that fucking weak-ass thing where you dismiss someone rightfully calling you out as "fanboy" stuff, you are getting called out for not making any fucking sense and not having any consistency in your argument.

I truly do not understand how you aren't getting it. It is painfully obvious what PraetorXyn is saying.

"Hmmm. I want to play Spider-Man 2. Do I buy a PS5 + game now (because I do not have a PS5 yet obviously which means I would have to buy a whole ass PS5)? Or do I buy the PC version for the PC I currently have (again, I currently have a PC so I do NOT need to buy another PC)."

It's not fucking rocket science.

The only PS5 exclusive content that appeals to me is the DLC for Forbidden West, and I'm not getting an entire system just for one DLC. I'll just wait for it to come to PC.

CrimsonGear80 posted...

I just want some fucking consistency from you.

what if someone bought a PS5 a day before spider-man came out? does that cost factor in?? a day after??

if you are factoring in the cost of the platform you are going to play the game on, then it does not matter when you bought your PC or console you FACTOR IN that price.

and don't do that fucking weak-ass thing where you dismiss someone rightfully calling you out as "fanboy" stuff, you are getting called out for not making any fucking sense and not having any consistency in your argument.

Im being logically consistent. Youre not.

The discussion is about Spider Man 2. I did not buy my PC to play Spider Man 2. When I built my PC, I never even considered that Sony might start releasing their exclusives on PC.

Likewise, if someone already owned a PS5 to play Demons Souls Remastered or something, I would not factor that cost into the cost of playing Spider Man 2. If they bought a PS5 whether before or after Spider Man 2 came out specifically to play Spider Man 2, then Spider Man 2 cost them $570.

The discussion is about a game and what times platform exclusivity makes it cost. Youre the one trying to make the discussion about platform versus platform. If you want to include past costs that have already been paid to compare platform versus platform, buying a PS5 plus whatever portion of my 1050 odd Steam games that are available for PS5 on PS5 is going to cost way more than what I paid to build my PC, as Steam calculator values my library at $5591 for lowest prices and $18877 at current prices right now.

Jupiter posted...

"Hmmm. I want to play Spider-Man 2. Do I buy a PS5 + game now (because I do not have a PS5 yet obviously which means I would have to buy a whole ass PS5)? Or do I buy the PC version for the PC I currently have (again, I currently have a PC so I do NOT need to buy another PC)."

i don't give a fuck about what he wants to play the game on, I give a fuck about his reasoning to factor in the cost of hardware when you buy a game for said hardware. the hardware and the game are two different things with two different costs.

if I bought a PS5 today, with a copy of SM2 and an extra controller, and I told someone that I did, and that someone asked me "how much was the PS5", I would tell then the PS5 was 500 bucks, because that would be the NORMAL thing to do. I would not be like "well PS5 plus game plus controller I paid 700 blah blah blah" no, that is NOT how things work.

so if you must factor in the cost of your hardware when you buy a game, whether you bought the hardware just for a game, for many games, or you bought it today or years ago, then do so.

consistency in one's argument, is all I ask...

PraetorXyn posted...

Im being logically consistent.

you are not.

CrimsonGear80 posted...

i don't give a fuck about what he wants to play the game on, I give a fuck about his reasoning to factor in the cost of hardware when you buy a game for said hardware. the hardware and the game are two different things with two different costs.

if I bought a PS5 today, with a copy of SM2 and an extra controller, and I told someone that I did, and that someone asked me "how much was the PS5", I would tell then the PS5 was 500 bucks, because that would be the NORMAL thing to do. I would not be like "well PS5 plus game plus controller I paid 700 blah blah blah" no, that is NOT how things work.

so if you must factor in the cost of your hardware when you buy a game, whether you bought the hardware just for a game, for many games, or you bought it today or years ago, then do so.

consistency in one's argument, is all I ask...

He's looking at it from his personal situation (in which he already has a PC); not giving advice to someone with neither system.

well im sure those Numbers went up as soon as there were those restocks...

anyway, i bought mine early this year and its been a blast so far!

Trumble posted...

He's looking at it from his personal situation (in which he already has a PC); not giving advice to someone with neither system.

As was the guy he initially responded to. Thats why this thread is so hilarious. Nobody was even badmouthing PlayStation, we were only saying it made little sense for us to buy one for the purpose of playing Spider Man 2 and hes nearly had an aneurysm.

I've owned one since launch.

I love my ps5.

PraetorXyn posted...

Yes, but thats irrelevant in the context of what you replied to. When choosing a platform, PC is objectively the best one, cost of entry aside, as it gets all exclusives but Nintendos (and it can emulate the Nintendo exclusives better than Nintendos consoles can natively run them). Plus, theres no concern about backwards compatibility, as thats just the default.

You can resell the physical media for a pittance, unless its out of print and rare like any other collectible. As for the rest, youre completely uninformed about the PC gaming marketplace. Steam sells games directly, and outlets like GreenManGaming, Fanatical, Amazon, GamesPlanet, Humble Bundle, etc., sell Steam keys. They are constantly competing with each other on price, and there are constant sales, so you can buy games for a fraction of the cost of console prices if youre willing to wait a short time. For instance, at launch, you can basically guarantee a game will be 12% off or so at GreenManGaming. When I bought Tales of Arise, I got it for 35% off a month or so after launch. Humble Bundle in particular is ridiculous value wise, you get games for pennies on the dollar.

Youre wrong though, as I explained above. They drop in price quickly and drastically on PC. The reason they dont on consoles is because consoles are closed platforms, and Microsoft / Sony / Nintendo have the only storefront and they can charge whatever they want, as theyre youre only option. Physical plays a part here too, as Wal-Mart and such would throw a shitfit if Microsoft and Sony were undercutting physical games with digital prices, so they literally couldnt even if they wanted to, or stores would refuse to stock physical games.
Thats not a digital games thing, its a broadband becoming ubiquitous thing. They started doing patches long before digital games were a thing. The difference back then was that they couldnt assume everyone had broadband. A 10 GB patch was a non-starter when most people had shitty internet, so they had to make sure the actual released product was good.

I trust Valve not to do that, as theyre a privately owned company who isnt beholden to shareholders and they have a long history of being extremely pro consumer at this point. If they ever do that in some hypothetical dystopia, Ill just start pirating games again and I havent really lost a thing, because Im on PC, am open platform where its easy to do whatever I want.

I'm pretty sure we've talked about all this before as well so I'm gonna keep it brief so it doesn't feel like we're just re-litigating everything.

1. PC is the best if you want to put in the elbow grease yes, but that's also if you want to do Linux, or really know your way around Windows since a lot still doesn't work on Linux still. But not everyone wants to drop the entry cost for that obviously.
2. I wasn't going to list off every single digital storefront as we were originally talking about specifically Sony > PC, but yes Green Man has discounts here & there, GOG does as well, even Epic Games and their monthly free games they do while they lost millions of dollars. But this is again a trend that PC gaming started. You lost physical discs first, disc drives disappeared, then everything became digital media. Consoles have slowly but surely followed, & like you say, Sony/Microsoft do price gouge & we've ended up spending more now on games even when digital was hyped to lower those costs for the consumers. This is my point that the worst trends started in the PC gaming sphere, & console players were much too late to really do anything about it.
3. Stores are supposed to compete under capitalism though, so if the stores refuse to actually compete, then the free market is obviously fixed & price leadership takes precedent over actually offering goods at lower & more competitive prices so that the consumer ends up getting fucked anyways. This is an issue in all industries, but clearly in the gaming industry it can be pretty insidious as even Walmart in your example is not even all that cheaper for most goods now. Digital games should be undercutting physical sales anyways, it's 1s & 0s in a digital storefront, that's not either of our faults though.
4. A whataboutism, the prevalence of broadband & internet being more widespread is not an excuse for discs to just be a license check so they can sell broken products on release that require internet to actually patch & update the game. I can't understand why anyone would argue FOR that practice to become the norm but that's your stance I guess. If years ago I could buy something on a console that had internet connection capability, but didn't need it to launch & install & run the software, any deviation from that is just flat out laziness & anti-consumer.
5. Valve is currently involved in more than one lawsuits though. One is antitrust, which is true they do have a very heavy monopoly leaning presence in the industry compared to all the other storefronts which are either so garbage they're pointless to use, or are so tiny that the meager offerings they have basically has no blip on the radar like Bethesda's or Ubisofts. A company is not above breaking the law & screwing over consumers, regardless of how their reputation may seem. Remember how positively viewed CD Projekt Red was before Cyberpunk, Nintendo calls themselves a family friendly company while they nickle & dime over nothing, break up tournaments, artificially supply to increase demand, etc etc. The other lawsuit with Valve is BS though & I hope they prevail on that, it concerns rumble functions & the patent troll company suing them says Valve is infringing on it. If Valve is pro consumer, they'll pull off a win against them. But given Apple & Nintendo didn't bother & just settled, we'll see how it goes.

Either way, it's a tangled ball of yarn of bullshit & nonsense in gaming at the end of the day, single people are powerless to change much, but I do write my senators & complain about it a lot for more consumer protection like what the EU & AUS gets. I remember being promised cheaper games because of digital shit by Sony & Microsoft back in the 360/PS3 days, but that never happened & those markets have just gotten worse. That's why I bought a steam deck & have begun building up a steam library like I told you before.

hereforemnant posted...

I'm pretty sure we've talked about all this before as well so I'm gonna keep it brief so it doesn't feel like we're just re-litigating everything.
1. PC is the best if you want to put in the elbow grease yes, but that's also if you want to do Linux, or really know your way around Windows since a lot still doesn't work on Linux still. But not everyone wants to drop the entry cost for that obviously.

What elbow grease? 99.9% of the time, you simply click Install, then click Play. The times when you have to put in elbow grease are mainly Windows 95 / 98 era games on modern versions of Windows, and in those cases, you just wouldn't be able to play them on console at all.

2. I wasn't going to list off every single digital storefront as we were originally talking about specifically Sony > PC, but yes Green Man has discounts here & there, GOG does as well, even Epic Games and their monthly free games they do while they lost millions of dollars. But this is again a trend that PC gaming started. You lost physical discs first, disc drives disappeared, then everything became digital media. Consoles have slowly but surely followed, & like you say, Sony/Microsoft do price gouge & we've ended up spending more now on games even when digital was hyped to lower those costs for the consumers. This is my point that the worst trends started in the PC gaming sphere, & console players were much too late to really do anything about it.
3. Stores are supposed to compete under capitalism though, so if the stores refuse to actually compete, then the free market is obviously fixed & price leadership takes precedent over actually offering goods at lower & more competitive prices so that the consumer ends up getting fucked anyways. This is an issue in all industries, but clearly in the gaming industry it can be pretty insidious as even Walmart in your example is not even all that cheaper for most goods now. Digital games should be undercutting physical sales anyways, it's 1s & 0s in a digital storefront, that's not either of our faults though.

My point was more that PC is an open platform, and the rampant competition in the space makes it impossible to just price gouge and put up a middle finger, because if you do, consumers can simply go elsewhere.

4. A whataboutism, the prevalence of broadband & internet being more widespread is not an excuse for discs to just be a license check so they can sell broken products on release that require internet to actually patch & update the game. I can't understand why anyone would argue FOR that practice to become the norm but that's your stance I guess. If years ago I could buy something on a console that had internet connection capability, but didn't need it to launch & install & run the software, any deviation from that is just flat out laziness & anti-consumer.

Wrong. I don't support it, I think it's bullshit. I'm just telling you THAT is the reason the practice became widespread, not because digital games exist. If digital games had never become a thing and broadband had become ubiquitous, it would be exactly the same way. Greedy corporations are famous for forcing developers to crunch to rush games out the door, do you think they're going to be any more careful when it comes to waiting for the game to be finished before they start printing discs and packaging game boxes, when ubiquitous broadband means they can just fix it later? No.

5. Valve is currently involved in more than one lawsuits though. One is antitrust, which is true they do have a very heavy monopoly leaning presence in the industry compared to all the other storefronts which are either so garbage they're pointless to use, or are so tiny that the meager offerings they have basically has no blip on the radar like Bethesda's or Ubisofts. A company is not above breaking the law & screwing over consumers, regardless of how their reputation may seem. Remember how positively viewed CD Projekt Red was before Cyberpunk, Nintendo calls themselves a family friendly company while they nickle & dime over nothing, break up tournaments, artificially supply to increase demand, etc etc. The other lawsuit with Valve is BS though & I hope they prevail on that, it concerns rumble functions & the patent troll company suing them says Valve is infringing on it. If Valve is pro consumer, they'll pull off a win against them. But given Apple & Nintendo didn't bother & just settled, we'll see how it goes.

Valve doesn't have a monopoly, as they don't really care. They don't pay anyone for exclusives, and they're happy for games to be sold on as many platforms as possible. They may as well have a monopoly from a functional standpoint, as their product and service is so good people largely don't give a fuck about any of the other ones. GOG has a niche of support because of DRM free games. I used to buy primarily on GOG until I changed my mind when Valve released Proton and single handedly advanced Linux gaming more than it had in decades in a handful of years, then I decided I valued the Steam platform more than that. Literally no one wants the EA, Ubisoft, Epic, etc. stores to exist, because there's simply no need for them. Additional storefronts need to have a purpose for consumers, and GOG is the only one mainstream one that does.

Either way, it's a tangled ball of yarn of bullshit & nonsense in gaming at the end of the day, single people are powerless to change much, but I do write my senators & complain about it a lot for more consumer protection like what the EU & AUS gets. I remember being promised cheaper games because of digital shit by Sony & Microsoft back in the 360/PS3 days, but that never happened & those markets have just gotten worse. That's why I bought a steam deck & have begun building up a steam library like I told you before.

On PC, you do get cheaper digital games, which has largely been my point. The "lowest Steam price" for my library is over $5000, and I guarantee you I didn't pay even close to that for it thanks to Humble Bundle and the key sites. It's valued at over $18000 as of "right now" prices. Buying about $1050 physical console games would have cost an absolute fortune, and there's no debating it.