Current Events > self-checkout is proven actually slower than human checkout

(+) Yeah! (+)

ellis123 posted...

Stores do not min:max for time, they min:max for cost. Something being faster doesn't matter if the slower option costs them less and people are still going to go with them.

But in this case, it works for both.

You need 1x Person monitoring 2x-8x Self-CheckOut Counters which happens to move more total # of people faster.

It's a Win/Win for the Store, not necessarily for you as a individual since the speed of checkout is dependent on you.

WingsOfGood posted...

excuse me?

You were asking for trouble trying to do anything other than just scan a few items at a self check

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

You need 1x Person monitoring 2x-8x Self-CheckOut Counters which happens to move more total # of people faster.

false

WingsOfGood posted...

Still is not.

That is only true when store has cut down the lines of paid employee checkout to 1 or so.

Back in the day when every line had an employee, self-checkout couldn't even begin to compete with the speed.

I am telling you I can literally see the same people who were waiting in line are still waiting in line as I'm leaving the store. That's not a "trick" that's lines just get really backed up and self checkout doesn't (usually).

Dat_Cracka_Jax posted...

You were asking for trouble trying to do anything other than just scan a few items at a self check

but I only had a few items and they only had 1 employee paid lane open and it had like 3 full buggies

maybe they should make coupon not require a supervisor authorization to my unpaid labor you know?

The thing is, it depends entirely on the person checking out in self-check, and the cashier.

I don't really care about the minute to minute speed as long as it's being done at a reasonable rate either way... whatever, right?

I am perfectly okay with both types of checkout existing.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

But in this case, it works for both.

You need 1x Person monitoring 2x-8x Self-CheckOut Counters which happens to move more total # of people faster.

It's a Win/Win for the Store, not necessarily for you as a individual since the speed of checkout is dependent on you.

It does not, no. The self checkout is slower and thus it is chosing one over the other.

Its weird how desperately youre clinging to the argument that its faster if the stores employed enough cashiers that there is always one waiting for you to walk up with no other customers in the line. Having enough cashiers on duty that they are frequently just waiting for people to walk up is stupid and I dont blame stores for not doing that at all.

WingsOfGood posted...

so human over the machine right?

No, I've been over why you're wrong a few times already.

If anything, I'd say the flow is

Self -> Guest -> Aisle

Self is almost always empty, guest normally has at most 1-2 people, and aisle is almost always full.

Absolutely untrue if you include hand scanners. Every product only has to be handled once: pickup from shelf, scan and straight into the bag. Checkout is just pay and go.

Compared to:
pickup from shelf and into cart (handle once)
wait in line
move all items from cart onto belt (handled 2x)
cashier scans (handled 3x)
move all items from belt into bag (handled 4x)

Tenlaar posted...

Having enough cashiers on duty that they are frequently just waiting for people to walk up is stupid

explain

WingsOfGood posted...

explain

It's Tenlaar.

ellis123 posted...

It does not, no. The self checkout is slower and thus it is chosing one over the other.

I guarantee I am faster in self checkout, even with all the nonsense and glitches.

However, I would like to see both types of checkout continue to exist. Self Checkout is amazing when you just have a few items and also use your own re-usable bags like I do.

The issue I have, is some of the stores make it really hard to self check and use your own bag.

WingsOfGood posted...

False. You can't even mimic what a paid checkout person does how the quickly pickup the items from the belt and scan them.

idk what super human chad cashiers you have, but the ones here are all slow fucks that just want to waste the clock. It's like watching old people fuck waiting for my shit to get scanned

ellis123 posted...

It's Tenlaar.

yea no doubt he gonna say cause it saves money

not because it improves anything

WingsOfGood posted...

which is the point of the video and the article

timewise it is ACTUALLY slower and takes MORE TIME

but your brain is tricked into thinking it is faster because you aren't waiting in a line just doing the unpaid labor for longer than you would be waiting

Not really.

One being faster than the other all depends on many factors like:
What each party is purchasing.
How fast the cashier is
How fast you are
Lines
Any problems occurring with items
And a few others I might be forgetting.

You can definitely breeze through a self checkout faster than going through a cashier.

Torgo posted...

I guarantee I am faster in self checkout, even with all the nonsense and glitches.

you aren't
literally impossible

Torgo posted...

I guarantee I am faster in self checkout, even with all the nonsense and glitches.

However, I would like to see both types of checkout continue to exist. Self Checkout is amazing when you just have a few items and also use your own re-usable bags like I do.

And I can guarantee that one person being faster means jack crap for averages and no one in the industry believes that it is faster.

WingsOfGood posted...

Didn't see it. Can you give a tl;dr?

My guess is airlines trick people in some way?

This ignores the psychology, but I love talking about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAHbLRjF0vo

WingsOfGood posted...

So the basic principles is humans hate lines and would rather be given some sort of busy work instead?

There's another study where people are asked, "Would you pay money to avoid an unpleasant shock of electricity?" Then they're left alone in an empty room with nothing to do but think or, if they wish, receive an electric shock. Many participants (67% of men and 25% of women) chose to shock themselves rather than do nothing. The conclusion was that many people would rather experience something mildly negative rather than have nothing to do.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2016/may/29/would-you-zap-yourself-to-avoid-being-alone-with-your-thoughts
(very readable) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4330241/

WingsOfGood posted...

explain

Because it is often paying people to literally just stand there. That is not a reasonable expectation to have of a business.

WingsOfGood posted...

you aren't
literally impossible

It's not impossible at all.

ChocoboMog123 posted...

This ignores the psychology, but I love talking about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAHbLRjF0vo

Thanks will watch.

Surely they don't pick the slower method over the faster right?
yet kinda already know they did and will

just like the self checkout

sad

DKBananaSlamma posted...

idk what super human chad cashiers you have, but the ones here are all slow fucks that just want to waste the clock

I am pretty sure the checkout cashiers in your area work hard and efficiently at their thankless dead end job and you are just impatient. At the same time I can definitely self-checkout faster than a cashier checkout lane.

I don't see why it's an either or... I love that stores have both. It's win-win.

Tenlaar posted...

Because it is often paying people to literally just stand there. That is not a reasonable expectation to have of a business.

Oh you must be the shittiest boss ever

hopefully you aren't actually a boss of anyone I feel so sad for them

ChocoboMog123 posted...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAHbLRjF0vo

wow just goes to show Capitalism is ANTI progress

literally choosing the worth method cause of incentives and perks

Dude, that is what you are arguing for here. In order for cashier checkouts to be faster you have to completely remove the element of waiting in line, which means that they would have to spend a not insignificant part of their shift just standing there waiting for customers to come up.

There should be both depending on the situation and severity of the backup. Self-checkout is superior for small amounts of goods, I have found my self actively avoiding certain stores without self-checkout when I only want to run in and grab something and leave.

But standing in line for self checkout can also be a chore so when things get busy it is nice to have the chance at a more consistent experience and not be at the mercy of random people's competence.

Human checkout is obviously faster.
You have a much larger area to unload your groceries to scan w/ a damn conveyor belt to move them along, and a person to ring them up as you're unloading them, and help w/ bagging afterwards.

(I have seen self-checkouts that use the entire aisle a human cashier would, but usually they're these small compact stations; even if you do have the same space, it's objectively 2 people vs. 1, and one of the people is a trained/experienced employee that can look up produce codes and such faster than you)

The ONLY reason to use self-checkout over human is because everyone else (outside of CE, apparently....holy shit that Bill Burr topic's responses were like the damn Twilight Zone) knows this too, so the human checkouts always have a line of people. If it's a line of people w/ a lot of stuff and I don't have much, I'll use self-checkout.
Otherwise, human is usually faster.

Tenlaar posted...

Dude, that is what you are arguing for here. In order for cashier checkouts to be faster you have to completely remove the element of waiting in line, which means that they would have to spend a not insignificant part of their shift just standing there waiting for customers to come up.

and there is nothing wrong with that

pay them well and they will be happy
also let them sit
making them stand is just stupid elitist bullshit of terrible bosses who have tiny egos and have to feel like they are better than others

streamofthesky posted...

Human checkout is obviously faster.

100%

TheShadowViper posted...

There should be both depending on the situation and severity of the backup. Self-checkout is superior for small amounts of goods, I have found my self actively avoiding certain stores without self-checkout when I only want to run in and grab something and leave.

But standing in line for self checkout can also be a chore so when things get busy it is nice to have the chance at a more consistent experience and not be at the mercy of random people's competence.

I agree.

But what we seen is that more self checkout is accepted and ignorantly justified as unpaid labor the more stores get rid of human employee lines.

WingsOfGood posted...

false

I've literally experienced it in person.

I've had people with similar # of customers in line on Assited Checkout with similar grocery loads compared to Self-Check out.

I was In/Out much faster than the other line, and I was last in line, and long gone by the time the other last in line moved up by 1-2x spots.

Hornezz posted...

Absolutely untrue if you include hand scanners. Every product only has to be handled once: pickup from shelf, scan and straight into the bag. Checkout is just pay and go.

Compared to:
pickup from shelf and into cart (handle once)
wait in line
move all items from cart onto belt (handled 2x)
cashier scans (handled 3x)
move all items from belt into bag (handled 4x)

We are apparently the only people that live in areas where these exist. We're from the future.

If you saw me at the self-checkout, you'd be so wet from the sheer speed and elegance of me checking out all my groceries and getting the fuck out in record time. You don't even know, bro!

There definitely is something wrong with expecting stores to pay so many staff that they are standing around not working for a significant part of their shift.

Jiek_Fafn posted...

We are apparently the only people that live in areas where these exist. We're from the future.

hand scanners still don't make you faster

you would need the conveyor belt as well and stand on the other side of it

you just can't beat them, not possible

There's no self checkout at the grocery store I go to.

Is someone seriously trying to argue that 1 cashier scanning 1 customer at a time can process more customers per hour than 1 attendant monitoring 6+ self check kiosks?

Even from the customers perspective, if you would have to wait behind even 1 person in a checkout line it should be faster to go to an empty self check kiosk, much less if there are 2 to 3 people waiting to be checked out

DKBananaSlamma posted...

If you saw me at the self-checkout, you'd be so wet from the sheer speed and elegance of me checking out all my groceries and getting the fuck out in record time. You don't even know, bro!

Also this

Unless you are at the mythical store with an abundance of staffed lines, the self-check out will almost always have a materially shorter line. Whatever speed advantage a cashier has at ringing up the items over you will almost certainly not offset the line difference. So the self-check will still be fast in most situations. Especially if you are not making large purchases with numerous items.

Also, I guarantee my former-cashier self is faster than most cashiers at ringing up 30 item or less loads. More than that and they probably gain an advantage as it become a bit more cumbersome.

ellis123 posted...

It does not, no. The self checkout is slower and thus it is chosing one over the other.

For some folks, if they don't move particularly fast or process their own stuff fast enough.

Sure, it's slower for them.

For me, I move & react pretty quickly to the machine, so it's a non-issue.

The speed of a Store Clerk processing can vary dramatically based on what type of clerk you get.

Are they young & well trained, are they old & kind of slow, did they have a off day?

There's ALOT of variability with what type of clerk you get.

VS

You know how fast you can process your groceries.

If you're a naturally slow person, by all means, use Assisted-CheckOut.

If you are a naturally fast person, you should probably use Self-CheckOut

There's no "Right Answer" despite what TC would like you to believe.

Both are viable options.

Tenlaar posted...

There definitely is something wrong with expecting stores to pay so many staff that they are standing around not working for a significant part of their shift.

waiting is working
their job is to receive customers and that is part of it

think flight attendants during turbulence

OMG THEY AREN'T DOING ANYTHING WHY SHOULD I PAY THEM

get out of here with that ignorance

WingsOfGood posted...

hand scanners still don't make you faster

you would need the conveyor belt as well and stand on the other side of it

you just can't beat them, not possible

You scan as you shop. You carry the scanner around the store and place it directly into your bags in your cart. It cuts out multiple steps

I dunno. Waiting an extra <30 minutes to board a plane or paying extra to board early isn't that big a deal. Like you've shown, people prefer an orderly system where they're free to utilize their wait time as they wish to one where they have to stand in line to progress. It's better to sit in the terminal and look at your phone until your group has been called than shove you way through people to get seated quicker.
But, yeah, personally I'd rather just board free-style and get on the plane faster. Even if the airlines weren't preventing it, you'd still have a plurality of passengers saying, "Why can't everyone board back-to-front, so we can all get on faster," even though that's actually much slower.

On the otherhand, Disney's fastpass is a great example of failed capitalism: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yjZpBq1XBE
That video really digs into the math and benefits of various theme park fast pass systems and how paid fast passes have large negative impacts on the average park goer.

WingsOfGood posted...

waiting is working
their job is to receive customers and that is part of it

Paying enough cashiers at any time to keep the lines going without significant backup is reasonable. Paying enough cashiers at any time for there to never ever be any lines is not, and thats what would be required for your its always faster fantasy to actually be true.

DKBananaSlamma posted...

If you saw me at the self-checkout, you'd be so wet from the sheer speed and elegance of me checking out all my groceries and getting the fuck out in record time. You don't even know, bro!

this like the whole "I work 80 hours! I am hussling!"

congrats on being the best unpaid worker for a big billion dollar corporation

hope they thank you

WingsOfGood posted...

waiting is working

LOL, I'd like to see you tell that to a bunch of bosses & they'll LAUGH at you so hard that they wet their pants.

ChocoboMog123 posted...

On the otherhand, Disney's fastpass is a great example of failed capitalism: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yjZpBq1XBE
That video really digs into the math and benefits of various theme park fast pass systems and how paid fast passes have large negative impacts on the average park goer.

but it makes money right?

That's like saying "You're an unpaid worker if you move around the store on your own. They should have workers put me in the cart and wheel me around to the items I want instead."

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

LOL, I'd like to see you tell that to a bunch of bosses & they'll LAUGH at you so hard that they wet their pants.

cause they are idiots and most of their day is on the golf course

they just don't want others to have a moment of breathing cause they have small egos

do they not pay flight attendant for sitting during turbulence? huh they are...waiting

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

For some folks, if they don't move particularly fast or process their own stuff fast enough.

Sure, it's slower for them.

For me, I move & react pretty quickly to the machine, so it's a non-issue.

The speed of a Store Clerk processing can vary dramatically based on what type of clerk you get.

Are they young & well trained, are they old & kind of slow, did they have a off day?

There's ALOT of variability with what type of clerk you get.

VS

You know how fast you can process your groceries.

If you're a naturally slow person, by all means, use Assisted-CheckOut.

If you are a naturally fast person, you should probably use Self-CheckOut

There's no "Right Answer" despite what TC would like you to believe.

Both are viable options.

An irrelevant concept to be sure. On average it is slower to do self-checkout, amd whether or not any person is faster is irrelevant in this context. It would be like saying that driving is faster than flying because you constantly speed and getting into/out of the airport is a pain: the end result is completely independent of reality and the justifications, while true, are irrelevant in a statistical sense.