Current Events > C/D: The Nintendo Wii's success was mainly down to a fad.

(+) Yeah! (+)

The Wii is the 7th best selling games console of all time, shipping 101 million units. Of course, the Wii is absolutely inseparable from its impact and identity; motion controls, Wii sports and casual gaming. In legacy discussions about the console, some propose that the console's success was merely a fad, suggesting that the widespread, casual appeal was a flash in the pan with "non-gamers" drawn in by Wii sports and family fun but not sticking with the console for its core titles. This would imply that the 101 million figure is inflated, and not representative of its actual main userbase, in contrast to systems that appealed purely or mostly on their libraries.

Do you agree with this assertion? Was the Wii's success the result of Nintendo striking gold with motion controls, or was it just the cherry on top of a console that would've sold well purely on its own merits and library?

IceCreamOnStero posted...

In legacy discussions about the console, some propose that the console's success was merely a fad, suggesting that the widespread, casual appeal was a flash in the pan with "non-gamers" drawn in by Wii sports and family fun but not sticking with the console for its core titles.

The Wii had a very high attach rate, which, given the amount of consoles sold, is rather impressive, so this doesn't seem accurate.

Motion controls were a fad. But you'll notice Sony and MS tripping over themselves to replicate the success of the Wii, with mixed results.

The Wii demonstrated there is a massive market to in casual gamers, which since has been absorbed by the mobile gaming industry.

StealThisSheen posted...

The Wii had a very high attach rate, which, given the amount of consoles sold, is rather impressive, so this doesn't seem accurate.

Indeed, it's not accurate.

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/finance/hard_soft/index.html

Nintendo reports selling over 900M units of software on the Wii.

Xatrion posted...

Motion controls were a fad. But you'll notice Sony and MS tripping over themselves to replicate the success of the Wii, with mixed results.

Sony has outdone the success of the Wii of the Wii already. The PS4, PS2 and PS1 all outsold it, with them outselling its total software sales as well. While the PS2 had a lot of its success attributed to DVD functionality, the PS1 and PS4 were sold almost entirely on the basis of their games.

Sad_Face posted...

The Wii demonstrated there is a massive market to in casual gamers, which since has been absorbed by the mobile gaming industry.

There is, but I'm not sure how compatible this market is with the "core gamer" market, which is why the mobile landscape has become its home. It may be a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy with how often gamers like to scream about "selling out to the casuals", but I think its tough for a traditional console to really strike at the casual market, especially while also retaining that core crowd. The DS and Wii came closest probably, but as my topic subject and the various criticisms lodged at Nintendo's handling of the core audience during that era, even those systems needed a lot of work in that aspect.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

Sony has outdone the success of the Wii of the Wii already. The PS4, PS2 and PS1 all outsold it, with them outselling its total software sales as well. While the PS2 had a lot of its success attributed to DVD functionality, the PS1 and PS4 were sold almost entirely on the basis of their games.

And now Nintendo have beaten the PS4 and PS1 with the Switch.

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Not what I expected, ngl.

Nintendo identified an untapped market base, advertised to that market, and priced and stocked competitively. Saying "it's a fad" is pretty reductive. If you're just trying to be some gross console war guy, get off CE and go post on those weirdly racist console boards.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

The Wii is the 7th best selling games console of all time, shipping 101 million units. Of course, the Wii is absolutely inseparable from its impact and identity; motion controls, Wii sports and casual gaming. In legacy discussions about the console, some propose that the console's success was merely a fad, suggesting that the widespread, casual appeal was a flash in the pan with "non-gamers" drawn in by Wii sports and family fun but not sticking with the console for its core titles. This would imply that the 101 million figure is inflated, and not representative of its actual main userbase, in contrast to systems that appealed purely or mostly on their libraries.

Do you agree with this assertion? Was the Wii's success the result of Nintendo striking gold with motion controls, or was it just the cherry on top of a console that would've sold well purely on its own merits and library?

With this logic, PS2/3 are also inflated because people are buying them as DVD/Blueray players.

C and it was cheap as hell

100% a fad.

I have friends who's grandparents played the Wii it was that popular. They don't even acknowledge any other form of video games.

Ricemills posted...

With this logic, PS2/3 are also inflated because people are buying them as DVD/Blueray players.

PS2 console sales are highly inflated because it was way cheaper than a stand alone DVD player. A lot of PS2s did sell because of video games but its status as "the highest selling video game console of all time" has a huge *by it.

i mean, the Switch isnt selling well based on the merits of its library, so you could say the same about that

IceCreamOnStero posted...

Of course, the Wii is absolutely inseparable from its impact and identity; motion controls, Wii sports and casual gaming. In legacy discussions about the console, some propose that the console's success was merely a fad, suggesting that the widespread, casual appeal was a flash in the pan with "non-gamers" drawn in by Wii sports and family fun but not sticking with the console for its core titles. This would imply that the 101 million figure is inflated, and not representative of its actual main userbase, in contrast to systems that appealed purely or mostly on their libraries.

I don't think that means it's inflated at all.

It had a casual focus but that library of games still sold the console at the time. So it's not inflated and still important.

The core gaming market isn't the only one that matters.

It was successful because it was cheap as dirt and had good games.

Trying to attribute it to a gimmick is just fanboy cope.

Cheap
Novel
Family/kid friendly
IP brand power

YellowSUV posted...

PS2 console sales are highly inflated because it was way cheaper than a stand alone DVD player. A lot of PS2s did sell because of video games but its status as "the highest selling video game console of all time" has a huge *by it.

Yes, that's what isaid

Yes, it was a fad.

But goddamn, Wii Sports was a ton of fun at the time.

TheGoldenEel posted...

i mean, the Switch isnt selling well based on the merits of its library, so you could say the same about that

If people aren't buying Switches for its library, what are they buying it for?

Yeah it was a fad. A pretty good fad though.

Motion controls were exciting at the time and Wii Sports was a really fun single player and party game for everyone. Then Zelda TP was hyped to come out for it. The Wii Fit game and board really helped with a lot of sales to further the fad also. All that aside, Nintendo and other companies also made a lot of really good games with motion controls for the console. I mean after my grandmother passed away I inherited her Wii console and a few games lol.

TheGoldenEel posted...

i mean, the Switch isnt selling well based on the merits of its library, so you could say the same about that

>Super Mario Odyssey
>Breath of the Wild
>Tears of the Kingdom
>Splatoon 3
>Xenoblade Chronicles 3
>Smash Ultimate
>Metroid Dread
>Pikmin 4
>Mario Kart 8 Deluxe
>Luigi's Mansion 3

SureJan.gif.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

There is, but I'm not sure how compatible this market is with the "core gamer" market, which is why the mobile landscape has become its home. It may be a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy with how often gamers like to scream about "selling out to the casuals", but I think its tough for a traditional console to really strike at the casual market, especially while also retaining that core crowd. The DS and Wii came closest probably, but as my topic subject and the various criticisms lodged at Nintendo's handling of the core audience during that era, even those systems needed a lot of work in that aspect.

The reason for the "distinction" between between casuals and core gamers was because Nintendo opted to delay entering the HD development world with the Wii and left the specs weaker as a result. If the Wii were capable of receiving ports from the PS360, there wouldn't be this distinction. I'm not understanding your point about the casual market's compatibility with the core gamer market. There's wide breadth of people and interests that if you decide to make a game, you're not totally pigeoned holed into chasing after a single demographic for sales, and thus are free to make more unorthodox or laid back games as there is a proven audience for them.

And realize remnants of the Wii are still in recognizable in the Switch, with the Joycons receiving motion functionality on top of building upon the "simple controls" where you can share the joycon controls with one another. I'm sure a lot of folks have the experience of sharing joycons to play Mario Kart 8.

My main problem with calling the Wii a fad is that Nintendo has been building upon the Wii (research and R&D, the lessons learned, etc) with its subsequent successors in the failed commercial product but incredible test product in the Wii U and then the Switch (the Wii U's unanimous approval of off screen play is what gave Nintendo the go ahead for the Switch). And one of Nintendo's biggest new IPs in the past decade, Splatoon, has motion controls as a popular control scheme.

So if you're critical of the Wii not impacting the main core console gaming industry, which is why you're calling it a fad, I can understand where you're coming from. The Wii practically acted as if it were in its own hemisphere while the PS360 duked it out and this led to Nintendo trailing way behind and ignored by the majority of development studios when they released the Wii U.

"Yeah it sold a ton but that obviously doesn't count because it wasn't being purchased by hardcore gamers"

Oh course it was a fad. There's a reason Sony and M$ tried to rush out their own shitty motion control peripherals, and there's a reason nobody cares about that motion control stuff now.

Definition of a fad.

IIRC the Wii had a really low software attach rate and from personal experience I don't know many people that owned any games other than Wii Sports and NSMBW.

CRON posted...

IIRC the Wii had a really low software attach rate and from personal experience I don't know many people that owned any games other than Wii Sports and NSMBW.

Quite the opposite. It had a very high software attach rate, second best of any Nintendo console. Barely beaten out by Gamecube. And that's actually very impressive, since the Wii outsold the Gamecube by so much. Higher attach rates are tougher to maintain, the more consoles you sell.

StealThisSheen posted...

Quite the opposite. It had a very high software attach rate, second best of any Nintendo console. Barely beaten out by Gamecube.

That's surprising news to me.

CRON posted...

That's surprising news to me.

Yeah, that's why I don't consider it a fad. Its high attach rate is much more impressive than Gamecube's due to selling so many more consoles, for example. The Wii averages over 9 games per console.

EDIT: Honestly, people buying so many games for it despite the wonky motion controls being forced in everything is probably a testament.

CRON posted...

That's surprising news to me.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/4/6/0/AAWh3OAAEspk.jpg

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/finance/hard_soft/index.html

Sad_Face posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/4/6/0/AAWh3OAAEspk.jpg

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/finance/hard_soft/index.html

Wow, Wii U is that bad?

Ricemills posted...

Wow, Wii U is that bad?

Even worse than the GC which sold 21 million units. However, as mentioned before, the Wii U was also was a massive success as a test case. Everyone tried offscreen play loved it and the only criticism was its limited functionality. This gave Nintendo the greenlight and blessings to revolve the successor console around that feature; switching from the TV to handheld.

Nintendo does a lot of internal testing with games to determine its future even on failed consoles. I recall hearing Nintendo developed the Donkey Kong congo game on the Gamecube specifically to gauge if people enjoyed being in the same room with others playing in playing games (I might be messing up the experiment here) to help bolster confidence in the direction they were taking with the Wii.

VGAddict90 posted...

>Super Mario Odyssey
>Breath of the Wild
>Tears of the Kingdom
>Splatoon 3
>Xenoblade Chronicles 3
>Smash Ultimate
>Metroid Dread
>Pikmin 4
>Mario Kart 8 Deluxe
>Luigi's Mansion 3

SureJan.gif.

consider that this is a console that has been available over six years and some of those you listed are Wii U ports (indeed, two of the top four best selling Switch games are Wii U ports)

I love nintendo games, but nintendo is not doing a good job supporting the switch at all, and the library is not notably better than the Wii Us

so no, I dont think that the switch selling so much is based on the merits of its library when compared to previous consoles

Yup wii sports really sold it to the masses.

TheGoldenEel posted...

consider that this is a console that has been available over six years and some of those you listed are Wii U ports (indeed, two of the top four best selling Switch games are Wii U ports)

I love nintendo games, but nintendo is not doing a good job supporting the switch at all, and the library is not notably better than the Wii Us

so no, I dont think that the switch selling so much is based on the merits of its library when compared to previous consoles

I'm not sure this logic tracks. Based on console and software sales for both Wii U and Switch, most people buying the Wii U ports likely never played them on Wii U. Thus, to them, it's new content, and would indeed count toward the merits of the Switch library.

The Switch also has a rather high software attachment rate, suggesting people are indeed buying games for it at a pretty decent rate.

It's easy to try to dismiss things by saying "Look at all the Wii U ports," but so few people bought a Wii U that the games are basically brand new to the majority of people.

StealThisSheen posted...

I'm not sure this logic tracks. Based on console and software sales for both Wii U and Switch, most people buying the Wii U ports likely never played them on Wii U. Thus, to them, it's new content, and would indeed count toward the merits of the Switch library.

The Switch also has a rather high software attachment rate, suggesting people are indeed buying games for it at a pretty decent rate.

It's easy to try to dismiss things by saying "Look at all the Wii U ports," but so few people bought a Wii U that the games are basically brand new to the majority of people.

Its also disingenous because that list isn't close to the boundary of the Switch's library

Cashed in on that casual market before mobile came along and took it all away.

Dakimakura posted...

Cashed in on that casual market before mobile came along and took it all away.

Like I said earlier in the thread, I'm not sure the casual market fits for a traditional console. Mobile is a good fit thanks to the low barrier of entry and long term monetisability of a game. In the traditional model of selling consoles at a loss to recoup it with software sales, how exactly are you making a profit off users who aren't interested in keeping up with all the core titles and instead prefer accesible, simple games they can keep coming back to?

IceCreamOnStero posted...

Like I said earlier in the thread, I'm not sure the casual market fits for a traditional console. Mobile is a good fit thanks to the low barrier of entry and long term monetisability of a game. In the traditional model of selling consoles at a loss to recoup it with software sales, how exactly are you making a profit off users who aren't interested in keeping up with all the core titles and instead prefer accesible, simple games they can keep coming back to?

Nintendo Wii was the first console ever to not sell for a loss.

Absolute fad. The Wii's first two or three years were the success years, fueled by existing in an era where smartphones hadn't yet become huge. Once phones became more advanced and motion tech became more of a commodity, the Wii was shot dead, and that moment arrived pretty fast.

For those who stuck around with the Wii in the decline years (2009-2011, roughly), it was clear that nearly everyone had moved on from the system and even Nintendo seemed disinterested in releasing any quality titles for it. Skyward Sword kept getting delayed and when it released, it felt so clunky and half-baked (no wonder it sold like trash). There was clamor for a "Wii HD" for many years, and Nintendo was far too slow to appease the market, which led to the complete lolcow failure of the Wii U.