Current Events > Why Scarlet/Violet is (probably) gonna be another Sword/Shield **Spoilers**

(+) Yeah! (+)

I saw the trailer. I wanted to like it, but there's some glaring issues I noticed.

• That terrastal seems WAY too much like gigantimax, in the sense that it's overpowered and will probably be banned in competitive play. This is basically following Sword/Shield's footsteps.
• The fact that they're removing a plethora of moves like Tail Glow doesn't seem right to me. It's OK to nerf, but to completely erase a move from existence? No game before Sword/Shield ever did this. Once again, this is basically following Sword/Shield's footsteps where moves like Hidden Power were removed.
• Scald (probably) being limited to only Volcanian is frightening. I support nerfing Scald, but taking away the moves Pokemon can learn has never been done until now (not counting moves from RBY and GSC where you couldn't trade to the later games). How are they going to enforce this? Does this mean you can't transfer pokemon from games prior to Scarlet/Violet? Because LOTS of Pokemon could learn Scald from the previous games. That is not a good sign.

These changes feel too similar to Sword/Shield, and make me not want to try the game. This is all circumstantial evidence, maybe the game will be great, but I'm seeing the writing on the wall right now.

What do you think? Do you agree/disagree?

Kids game

Chunky posted...

Does this mean you can't transfer pokemon from games prior to Scarlet/Violet? Because LOTS of Pokemon could learn Scald from the previous games. That is not a good sign.

When you transfer Pokemon it changes their moves to what they would know based on their level ingame...So the Pokemon aren't locked, they just forget the moves...

I don't think the reason Terastal will get banned is due to strength.

D-Max allowed sweepers to not only double their hp which can let them live practically any hit, but gave them super powered moves that had bonus effects such as raising a stat, decreasing a stat, or starting weather.

Terastal doesn't make the power's moves stronger with extra effects and does not buff any stats. What will likely be the reason it gets banned (for smogon) is that it's impossible to predict. Many pokemon in the past who had great movepools and stats had gotten banned for being impossible to predict.

random_man9119 posted...

When you transfer Pokemon it changes their moves to what they would know based on their level ingame...So the Pokemon aren't locked, they just forget the moves...

For real? Is this just for Scald, or for ALL moves learned by TM or move tutor? No more transfer moves from previous generations?

Chunky posted...

For real? Is this just for Scald, or for ALL moves learned by TM or move tutor? No more transfer moves from previous generations?

All moves... It's how it worked when transferring in BDSP and it's staying that way for ScVi...

I'm ok with most of those changes. Honestly, they could streamline the move pool a bit more. There's way too many at this point to keep track of.

But Pokemon has been really stale for a while now, I'll take any change. I really hope the whole open world thing is done well.

The official competitive format is VGC doubles, not Smogon singles

Removing scald it like removing flamethrower/thunderbolt/icebeam

Just...why

All they had to do is increase the power, but lower the burn rate

Chunky posted...

Scald (probably) being limited to only Volcanian is frightening. I support nerfing Scald, but taking away the moves Pokemon can learn has never been done until now (not counting moves from RBY and GSC where you couldn't trade to the later games). How are they going to enforce this? Does this mean you can't transfer pokemon from games prior to Scarlet/Violet? Because LOTS of Pokemon could learn Scald from the previous games. That is not a good sign.

Been WAAAAY overdue. Get rid of trashy broken moves like Scald. Get rid of old event pokes like Wish Chansey. Normalize the game so there can be some semblance of balance without supporting decades old bad decisions.

Left4Doge posted...

The official competitive format is VGC doubles, not Smogon singles

This, wtf. I hated dynamax but it was the healthiest generation gimmick.

Left4Doge posted...

The official competitive format is VGC doubles, not Smogon singles

Official according to who? Nintendo? With that said, I think you're right. A lot of people seem to be playing doubles, and all of the sponsored tournaments seem to be doubles, but no singles whatsoever. I personally don't agree with this. I prefer singles way more over doubles.

random_man9119 posted...

All moves... It's how it worked when transferring in BDSP and it's staying that way for ScVi...

So no more Softboiled on Clefable.

PowerOats posted...

Removing scald it like removing flamethrower/thunderbolt/icebeam

Just...why

All they had to do is increase the power, but lower the burn rate

This comparsion isn't accurate.

Lava Plume and Discharge are more accurate being 80 BP moves with 100 acc and a 30% status chance. Thank god there's no Ice move with a 30% frozen chance.

What makes Scald a problem is that it inflicted a status move not associated with water pokemon that also cuts atk. This made physical threats that could normally deal with bulky waters like Gyarados risk not being able to set up and sweep due to the burn chance.

Nintendo literally hosts a VGC circuit, so yes, it is the official format lmfao

Tmaster148 posted...

This comparsion isn't accurate.

Lava Plume and Discharge are more accurate being 80 BP moves with 100 acc and a 30% status chance. Thank god there's no Ice move with a 30% frozen chance.

What makes Scald a problem is that it inflicted a status move not associated with water pokemon that also cuts atk. This made physical threats that could normally deal with bulky waters like Gyarados risk not being able to set up and sweep due to the burn chance.

You run scald on Gyarados?

Melzargard posted...

You run scald on Gyarados?

Reading is not your strong suit I see. Gyarados would be switching into scald.

Tmaster148 posted...

Reading is not your strong suit I see. Gyarados would be switching into scald.

tbf, how you typed the sentence it could very well be read as "bulky water types, like Gyrados" and how I read it at first.

Funkydog posted...

tbf, how you typed the sentence it could very well be read as "bulky water types, like Gyrados" and how I read it at first.

I said "physical threats that could deal with bulky waters". Not my fault is people can't read context.

Tmaster148 posted...

This comparsion isn't accurate.

Lava Plume and Discharge are more accurate being 80 BP moves with 100 acc and a 30% status chance. Thank god there's no Ice move with a 30% frozen chance.

What makes Scald a problem is that it inflicted a status move not associated with water pokemon that also cuts atk. This made physical threats that could normally deal with bulky waters like Gyarados risk not being able to set up and sweep due to the burn chance.

Scald is more widely distributed. Lots of water types can learn it, and it was a TM. Discharge and Lava Plume, AFAIK are not widely distributed moves.

Chunky posted...

Scald is more widely distributed. Lots of water types can learn it, and it was a TM. Discharge and Lava Plume, AFAIK are not widely distributed moves.

Accessibility is part of the reason it was so good, but was not the main factor in why it was a problem. If Lava Plume or Discharge was a TM, it would still largely be fire and electric types that could learn the move. Scald was the same way in that it was largely water types having access to the move.

What made Scald a problem was that it gave water types access to the ability to inflict burn status, something that they didn't have the ability to do.

Tmaster148 posted...

What made Scald a problem was that it gave water types access to the ability to inflict burn status, something that they didn't have the ability to do.

I've never played competitive so maybe this is obvious but I don't get it, why is this a problem? Just learn to adapt.

TendoDRM posted...

I've never played competitive so maybe this is obvious but I don't get it, why is this a problem? Just learn to adapt.

Because the bulky water playstyle became:

Am I healthy? Use scald
Am I low on health? use recovery move

There was no interaction. Physical threats can't switch in, because there's a 30% chance they become unusable just from the switch in. And if they don't get burned the first time, they can still burned on the 2nd attack unless they 1HKO a bulky pokemon with no set up.

Plus scald is an attacking move so it also provided chip damage and offensive threats generally don't have recovery, so that damage adds up when the bulky pokemon can recover off and you no longer have the ability to defeat the opposing pokemon due to burn.

Left4Doge posted...

Nintendo literally hosts a VGC circuit, so yes, it is the official format lmfao

Well it doesn't matter anyway. I didn't say anything about smogon. What I said still applies.

TendoDRM posted...

I've never played competitive so maybe this is obvious but I don't get it, why is this a problem? Just learn to adapt.

The chance to burn is only 30%, but it feels like 50%, especially when a LOT of the cast can learn it. Nearly ever team I've seen has at least one pokemon with Scald on it. Don't get me wrong, if I were the developers I wouldn't have removed the move, but just speculating why they might have limited it.

I mean from the very beginning it looked hardly different from Sword and Shield.

As far as the moves go, there's some questionable decisions they seem to have made. Maybe their DLC will rectify some of it. Removing Scald from everyone is fine I think. Maybe a bit harsh, but certainly too many Pokemon were able to learn it.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


You can do ranked singles online. Doubles is just the default format for nintendo tournaments, because it's harder to stall in doubles. A single bulky pokemon can easily fall to 2 offensive pokemon targetting it at once. Moves like Scald and Toxic can only target 1 pokemon meaning getting the status off is less impactful overall.

Plus there's the time limit too, so stall is less incentive to be played when you lose if you timeout.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

Them nerfing stall probably has more to do with the dumb arbitrary 20 minute time limit on online battles. But then they don't do anything to address timer stalling