Current Events > Jeff Bezos retires with 739,489 times the median American's wealth.

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.businessinsider.com/personal-finance/average-american-net-worth



That median net worth figure looks to be for those aged 65 to 74. Considering how much you need to have a comfortable retirement, that's actually very low. Also consider that a lot of that net worth is in their overpriced housing. It's not a pretty picture. The huge difference between average and median shows how much this country favors the rich.


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whitelytning posted...

Good for him. Awesome.

It's sad that there are so many people that actually want to live as peasants.

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Shadow Don posted...

It's sad that there are so many people that actually want to live as peasants.

right? If youre planning on retiring with anything less than 100 billion dollars dont even FUCKING talk to me bro

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SevenTenths posted...

Read your first paragraph.

For a guy who preaches anything less than perfect isnt worth celebrating you sure are awfully willing to be imperfect.

The one that says I work for a major corporation posting big profits? What?

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One can hate on him and Amazon for being shitty employers, but that seems to be second to the innate hatred towards the rich that some people possess.

Kinda hope his "spacecraft" burns up on reentry.

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Broseph_Stalin posted...

Jeff Bezos retires owning 11% of a company he founded.

You'd think he were the devil for retaining a stake in his immensely valuable company based on folks here literally wishing death on him
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Nemu posted...

One can hate on him and Amazon for being shitty employers, but that seems to be second to the innate hatred towards the rich that some people possess.

The problem is that those two things are quite intimately connected.

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People having that much wealth is absolutely toxic for our society. You don't get that much without exploiting the hell out of workers, breaking anti-trust law, manipulating the tax system etc. It breeds hero worship. It lets specific individuals exercise immense control over the lives of others, politically and economically. It encourages those people to act like they're not bound by the rule of law or like they're fundamentally above other human beings. It creates people who are loyal only to wealth, not country, society, or even humanity. It pretends that hoarding of resources while human beings on this planet starve, get sick, or freeze/burn to death from a lack of resources is not a ghoulish thing to do. Then when they start foundations to give that away, even that reinforces the idea that wealth should remain in their hands and all societal progress should be directed by them and proceed on their wishes.

You can criticize all of that without jealousy entering the picture at all. We recognized in the gilded age that excessive wealth is terrible and yet we've forgotten.

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You need about $2 million to retire comfortably (i'm shooting higher than that) yet the average net worth for retirement age American is only about $1 million. Messed up we let Jeff get away with paying no taxes for so long

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Another thing to consider. Jeff didn't just steal from his workers, he stole from his family.

It's been said that Amazon wasn't profitable at first, so who bailed Jeff out? His family. So why aren't they the majority shareholder of Amazon instead of him? The answer is is he is the richest man alive today for a reason.

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BlingBling22947 posted...

That median net worth is $266,400, Business Insider reported, citing data from the Federal Reserve. Jeff Bezos will step down as CEO of Amazon with an estimated $197 billion.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/lucianapaulise/2021/07/02/jeff-bezos-adds-2-leadership-principles-before-retiring-as-amazons-ceo

Didnt even realize my net worth was several times the median.

pick4six posted...

Another thing to consider. Jeff didn't just steal from his workers, he stole from his family.

It's been said that Amazon wasn't profitable at first, so who bailed Jeff out? His family. So why aren't they the majority shareholder of Amazon instead of him? The answer is is he is the richest man alive today for a reason.

Uh they made an equity investment in Amazon and received shares for their investment, whether they chose to sell their shares or not was their own decision. His siblings also bought shares in Amazon also.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-07-31/a-hidden-amazon-fortune-bezos-parents-could-be-worth-billions

He (Mike Bezos) bought 582,528 shares in February 1995, according to the 1997 prospectus. Five months later, Jackie Bezos bought 847,716 shares. The wider Bezos family held this stock through four trusts at the end of 1999, another filing shows. The Jacklyn Gise Bezos 1996 Revocable Trust held 8.9 million shares, followed by the Miguel A. Bezos 1996 Revocable Trust with 4.8 million shares, while the Bezos Family Trust and the Bezos Generation Skipping Trust held 2.9 million and 675,000, respectively.


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legendary_zell posted...

Then when they start foundations to give that away, even that reinforces the idea that wealth should remain in their hands and all societal progress should be directed by them and proceed on their wishes.

Its terrifying how little regard you must have for individual freedoms and private property to think this way
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pinky0926 posted...

Goddamn Americans do love slobbering on the cocks of billionaires dont they

Many Americans believe that billionaires embody the American Dream, the idea that anybody can become unfathomably wealthy through pure work ethic, skill and determination.

Bringing up the fact that luck, privilege and a willingness to exploit others for their hard work plays a major role in how they've amassed their wealth completely shatters the myth of a meritocracy, and for many Americans, that myth is literally the only thing keeping them sane. The alternative is realizing they've thrown their life away in service to the gods of the free-market.

So for them, it's much easier to do some billionaire pole-polishing than to admit that their beloved American Dream doesn't really exist.

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RchHomieQuanChi posted...

Many Americans believe that billionaires embody the American Dream, the idea that anybody can become unfathomably wealthy through pure work ethic, skill and determination.

Bringing up the fact that luck, privilege and a willingness to exploit others for their hard work plays a major role in how they've amassed their wealth completely shatters the myth of a meritocracy, and for many Americans, that myth is literally the only thing keeping them sane. The alternative is realizing they've thrown their life away in service to the gods of the free-market.

So for them, it's much easier to do some billionaire pole-polishing than to admit that their beloved American Dream doesn't really exist.

Have you ever talked to a real person about this or just straw men?
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No point in whining about Bezos. Human inequality won't be fixed even he spent every waking moment handing out stacks of $100 bills to the homeless

Slayerblade11 posted...

No point in whining about Bezos. Human inequality won't be fixed even he spent every waking moment handing out stacks of $100 bills to the homeless

Billionaires are pretty much directly responsible for inequality. The money he makes has to come from somewhere and he's certainly not the one doing the actual producing. So where is it coming from?

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RchHomieQuanChi posted...

Billionaires are pretty much directly responsible for inequality. The money he makes has to come from somewhere and he's certainly not the one doing the actual producing. So where is it coming from?

It's coming from the price of Amazon stock. He doesn't have that money. He has a net worth of that much because of his stock.

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Tyranthraxus posted...

It's coming from the price of Amazon stock. He doesn't have that money. He has a net worth of that much because of his stock.

That's completely irrelevant. He's still becoming wealthier from all the value that's being extracted from the workers doing the actual labor.

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RchHomieQuanChi posted...

That's completely irrelevant. He's still becoming wealthier from all the value that's being extracted from the workers doing the actual labor.

Don't ask a question you don't want the answer to.

Just because a piece of garbage I own today is worth a million dollars next year doesn't mean I make a million dollars a year

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https://mkorostoff.github.io/1-pixel-wealth/

Wierd website link, but its a visual representation of bezos wealth i found on reddit.
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g980 posted...

Its terrifying how little regard you must have for individual freedoms and private property to think this way

It's terrifying how little recognition you have for the dangers of allowing individuals to direct public health around the world or decide what anti-poverty measures are tried because they hoarded wealth like a dragon and decided to give some of it away for tax and reputation laundering purposes.

It conflicts with individual freedom to have individuals with such disproportionate resources and economic power.

It doesn't conflict with individual freedom to tax people more so that they don't have such power or to organize our economy so that more wealth goes to more people rather than a few at the top soaking up everything.

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Tyranthraxus posted...

Don't ask a question you don't want the answer to.

Just because a piece of garbage I own today is worth a million dollars next year doesn't mean I make a million dollars a year

This still has absolutely nothing to do with what I said.

The reason Amazon stock is worth so much is because of all the value the workers are generating, value that is mostly being extracted from them and being sent upwards to the shareholders, who amass wealth literally just for owning the stock.

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1337toothbrush posted...

https://www.businessinsider.com/personal-finance/average-american-net-worth



That median net worth figure looks to be for those aged 65 to 74. Considering how much you need to have a comfortable retirement, that's actually very low. Also consider that a lot of that net worth is in their overpriced housing. It's not a pretty picture. The huge difference between average and median shows how much this country favors the rich.

I feel better knowing I'm above the median net worth for my age group so I'm not as poor as I thought lmao


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RchHomieQuanChi posted...

This still has absolutely nothing to do with what I said.

The reason Amazon stock is worth so much is because of all the value the workers are generating, value that is mostly being extracted from them and being sent upwards to the shareholders, who amass wealth literally just for owning the stock.

You know they get paychecks and can quit whenever they want right
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legendary_zell posted...

It's terrifying how little recognition you have for the dangers of allowing individuals to direct public health around the world or decide what anti-poverty measures are tried because they hoarded wealth like a dragon and decided to give some of it away for tax and reputation laundering purposes.

It conflicts with individual freedom to have individuals with such disproportionate resources and economic power.

It doesn't conflict with individual freedom to tax people more so that they don't have such power or to organize our economy so that more wealth goes to more people rather than a few at the top soaking up everything.

What people often fail to realize is that there are individual freedoms that conflict with one another and that society's job is to determine which freedoms should take priority over others.

For example, if you're telling someone that they're free to own slaves, you are now restricting other people's ability to be free individuals.

This is why libertarian ideology is kind of a joke, because it operates off of the false premise that freedom in and of itself is an inherent moral good.

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g980 posted...

You know they get paychecks and can quit whenever they want right

That doesn't refute anything that I said. But by all means, continue having the conversation you think I'm having.

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RchHomieQuanChi posted...

This still has absolutely nothing to do with what I said.

The reason Amazon stock is worth so much is because of all the value the workers are generating, value that is mostly being extracted from them and being sent upwards to the shareholders, who amass wealth literally just for owning the stock.

Amazon Stock is worth what it's worth because that's what people are willing to pay for it. The reverse holds as well as the recent GME debacle proves where stock can be worth shit because no one is willing to buy it. Suddenly when the demand shows up, the price goes up.

The shareholders amass wealth but that's not the same thing as money. In order for Bezos to leverage his personal wealth to pay employees more, he would need to sell off his stock which will eventually run out and then what happens?

There's problems with Bezos operations for sure but his net worth is a symptom of the larger wall street problem. It is not the cause. Wealth inequality is not just a few hundred billionaires. It's an enormous worldwide banking and financial industry.

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RchHomieQuanChi posted...

That doesn't refute anything that I said. But by all means, continue having the conversation you think I'm having.

When you present the relationship as purely extracting value, and not a consensual exchange of wages for labor... i would say it is relevant.

It doesnt refute your statement at face value - its true that the value created from labor is passed to shareholders - it is critical context to descrive the actual nature of that relationship
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Tyranthraxus posted...

Amazon Stock is worth what it's worth because that's what people are willing to pay for it. The reverse holds as well as the recent GME debacle proves where stock can be worth shit because no one is willing to buy it. Suddenly when the demand shows up, the price goes up.

The shareholders amass wealth but that's not the same thing as money. In order for Bezos to leverage his personal wealth to pay employees more, he would need to sell off his stock which will eventually run out and then what happens?

There's problems with Bezos operations for sure but his net worth is a symptom of the larger wall street problem. It is not the cause. Wealth inequality is not just a few hundred billionaires. It's an enormous worldwide banking and financial industry.

I agree that Bezos isn't the problem. He's just one guy taking advantage of an economic system that allows him to do so because of his wealth and power. The reason Bezos is a target is not because of any personal beef with him, but because he's currently the largest beneficiary of a rigged system.

I'm well-aware that wealth isn't money, but it IS a way to generate money and, in the context of this discussion, functionally serves the same purpose.

And yes, the stock market can be utterly ridiculous and arbitrary, but the valuations often come from somewhere.

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Shablagoo posted...

I love when our magnificent benefactors tell us what we should do for half or more of our waking lives, dey truly are brilliant creators

He in fact created a future, the present economic world we live in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWRbTnE1PEM

And mind you, people with the above mindset are doing the same thing, creating the future, with the blockchain field (stop paying attention to the investing portion and look at the innovation side) and you have all the opportunities in the world to join in.

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g980 posted...

When you present the relationship as purely extracting value

It is. The consensuality of it is irrelevant. When someone works for you, they are making considerably less money than they are generating for you. That's how employment works.

And your boss certainly doesn't give a fuck if your wages are enough to cover living expenses.

g980 posted...

and not a consensual exchange of wages for labor

The only reason anybody works for an Amazon warehouse is because they need money to survive.

So yes, framing it as a "consensual" exchange is technically true, but also completely ignores the socioeconomic pressures (many of which are the direct or indirect result of wealth hoarding from the ruling elite) that cause people to agree to otherwise shitty terms of employment.

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g980 posted...

You know they get paychecks and can quit whenever they want right

This. I quit Walmart to do better for myself, now I make 6 figures a year because I was determined to do it and dedicated my life to getting a high salary. There are many jobs that pay you very good, but people in this topic that bitch about inequality and the rich are either ignorant or lazy, or both.

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RchHomieQuanChi posted...

It is. The consensuality of it is irrelevant. When someone works for you, they are making considerably less money than they are generating for you. That's how employment works.

a perceived asymmetry does not make it a one way street. it is not purely an extraction of value.
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g980 posted...

a perceived asymmetry does not make it a one way street. it is not purely an extraction of value.

It's not perceived, it's real. And it's not purely extraction of value, but it is overwhelmingly so. When someone who works at Walmart is making $7.85 an hour, can't afford basic necessities, but gives the company the majority of their waking hours and generates several times that in value for them, what would you call that?


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legendary_zell posted...

It's not perceived, it's real. And it's not purely extraction of value, but it is overwhelmingly so. When someone who works at Walmart is making $7.85 an hour, can't afford basic necessities, but gives the company the majority of their waking hours and generates several times that in value for them, what would you call that?

Id call it a good argument for stronger social safety nets to offset the declining value of low skill labor

But it is still an exchange of payment for labor
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Also think about this.

Jeff Bezo's ex-wife Mackenzie Bezos has given away more money than he has...

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g980 posted...

Id call it a good argument for stronger social safety nets to offset the declining value of low skill labor

But it is still an exchange of payment for labor

A forced exchange in which the other option is homelessness. Where one side of the "exchange" has chambers of commerce, right wing/libertarian think tanks, and an entire political party, plus half of the other one on their side. And when workers even dream about joining together to get better terms for that exchange, the company just packs up, fires everyone, and leaves.

It is not by any means an equal exchange and it's barely a free one.


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legendary_zell posted...

A forced exchange in which the other option is homelessness. Where one side of the "exchange" has chambers of commerce, right wing/libertarian think tanks, and an entire political party, plus half of the other one on their side. And when workers even dream about joining together to get better terms for that exchange, the company just packs up, fires everyone, and leaves.

It is not by any means an equal exchange and it's barely a free one.

People have had to work to survive since they werent hunter gathering in caves. Thats not a new thing and it isnt coercion

And yea the lack of protection for unions is awful, but irrelevant
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g980 posted...

People have had to work to survive since they werent hunter gathering in caves. Thats not a new thing and it isnt coercion

And yea the lack of protection for unions is awful, but irrelevant

Those were all bad as well. When people had to pay the king in crops or be jailed, that was bad. Just like having to enrich a capitalist to survive is bad. No one said it's new. Having to work to sustain yourself is one thing, having to work to enrich someone else and still not be fully sustained is another.

The lack of union protection is very relevant to everything we're discussing. That's the context in which Bezos accumulated this wealth. If his workers had unions, they would have made more, whether he still somehow had the same amount or less. And those workers didn't have them because of people like him and businesses like his stopped it from happening with those very same resources they got from underpaying disconnected workers.

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g980 posted...

People have had to work to survive since they werent hunter gathering in caves. Thats not a new thing and it isnt coercion

I mean...feudalism was the most popular economic system prior to capitalism and that was aggressively coercive....nobody is arguing that it's unique to capitalism.

g980 posted...

And yea the lack of protection for unions is awful, but irrelevant

It's completely relevant in this context. Union busting is what prevents workers from being able to organize together to negotiate for better pay and working conditions.

The idea of an equal exchange occurring in this case is complete farce since the employer has the ability to strip what little bargaining power the employee has.

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If he doesnt pay me $3,330.74 hes in for a rude awakening in space.

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uhhh

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People arent mad hes the richest. Theyre mad hes the richest by paying no taxes, shady business practice, terrible warehouse conditions, and getting billions from the government while the average American goes bankrupt after one hospital visit

Kingbuffet posted...

People arent mad hes the richest. Theyre mad hes the richest by paying no taxes, shady business practice, terrible warehouse conditions, and getting billions from the government while the average American goes bankrupt after one hospital visit

Then why do people say "billionaires shouldnt exist" ?

*some* people are mad hes rich
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good for him. amazon has made this country stronger, and without its jobs many would go hungry

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hsvhighlife posted...

good for him. amazon has made this country stronger, and without its jobs many would go hungry

yeah tbh this is true, amazon tech is pretty amazing

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