Current Events > Why are vegans not just vegetarians

(+) Yeah! (+)

Probably could have worded title better but I'm tired. Anyway why forgo milk and eggs and shit?

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Vegans don't eat shit?

That's messed up.

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Why are admins not just mods?

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DeadBankerDream posted...

Vegans don't eat shit?

That's messed up.

Dude I love shit

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Why dont prostitutes just pay for stuff with their vaginas

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Why is turkey not just chicken

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R1masher posted...

Why dont prostitutes just pay for stuff with their vaginas

Like.. shoot bills and coins out of it?

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Smackems posted...

Like.. shoot bills and coins out of it?

C***apult!

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Trumble posted...

C***apult!

Fuckin HOT

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Different cows are used for Leather, Meat, Milk, etc, and theyre all treated horribly. Not sure if chickens are also separate for eggs and for meat, but either way, the industry is excessively cruel.

Also unsanitary food and cholesterol n shit

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Because you can't have eggs and milk without killing animals, and even they are still products of specist exploitation.

Herbette posted...

Because you can't have eggs and milk without killing animals, and even they are still products of specist exploitation.

?

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discodancer77 posted...

Different cows are used for Leather, Meat, Milk, etc, and theyre all treated horribly. Not sure if chickens are also separate for eggs and for meat, but either way, the industry is excessively cruel.

Also unsanitary food and cholesterol n shit

I see. So even dairy cows are treated horribly?

I've admittedly never looked into it and don't really want to know details

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Herbette posted...

Because you can't have eggs and milk without killing animals, and even they are still products of specist exploitation.

lol wut

I have chickens, they lay eggs, I gather the eggs, my chickens live on. I don't slaughter each chicken after it lays one egg.

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MabusIncarnate posted...

lol wut

I have chickens, they lay eggs, I gather the eggs, my chickens live on. I don't slaughter each chicken after it lays one egg.

Same with my brother. He gets like 10 eggs a day and doesn't kill them. They're fine

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MabusIncarnate posted...

lol wut

I have chickens, they lay eggs, I gather the eggs, my chickens live on. I don't slaughter each chicken after it lays one egg.

Right. Thats how all eggs are produced, right? Thatd be convenient. I bet you also think those happy dairy farmer videos are an accurate representation of reality.

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discodancer77 posted...

Right. Thats how all eggs are produced, right? Thatd be convenient. I bet you also think those happy dairy farmer videos are an accurate representation of reality.

How do you produce your eggs

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DeadBankerDream posted...

Vegans don't eat shit?

That's messed up.

They should. Coprophagia is the best way vegans can get essential vitamins such as B12 without resorting to buying supplements.

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MabusIncarnate posted...

I have chickens, they lay eggs, I gather the eggs, my chickens live on. I don't slaughter each chicken after it lays one egg.

You have female chickens.
Only females lay eggs. Half chickens born are males.
Where are they? (nuggets and dog's food)

To produce eggs, you need to kill the new born chicken males that are non productive.
Same logic applies to produce milk.

I am not pretending it is good or bad. It is just factual, and the reason why vegans refuse to eat those products.

Smackems posted...

How do you produce your eggs

I dont. You said it as if everyone gets their eggs from backyard hens and thats not the case at all. 99% of eggs are coming from factory farms with terrible conditions.

Paragon21XX posted...

They should. Coprophagia is the best way vegans can get essential vitamins such as B12 without resorting to buying supplements.

By that logic everyone would need to. The b12 found in meat and milk etc are given via supplementation to the animals, not naturally-occurring due to sterilization. Its given to them so they dont die from deficiency. The b12 in their flesh and by-products are basically sloppy seconds. B12 added to plant milks and other products are given as a supplementation for the person eating it, not the animal behind it. If anything, the most natural sources of b12-producing microorganisms would be fresh picked vegetables from the farmers market.


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Herbette posted...

You have female chickens.
Only females lay eggs. Half chickens born are males.
Where are they? (nuggets and dog's food)

To produce eggs, you need to kill the new born chicken males that are non productive.
Same logic applies to produce milk.

I am not pretending it is good or bad. It is just factual, and the reason why vegans refuse to eat those products.

Do chickens not just lay eggs without interaction with a rooster?

Also can't you just make a cow pregnant to produce milk artificially

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I was vegetarian for around 15 years and became vegan last year. I switched when I realized that most animals on non-meat farms still aren't treated well. Here are some of the main things that influenced my decision:

* Like humans, cows don't just always produce milk - they do it in relation to pregnancy. So in order to keep cows producing as much milk as possible, they're artificially inseminated and kept pregnant most of their lives.
* Cows can live something like 15 to 20 years, but their optimal milk production deteriorates by around 5 years. Rather than have to keep spending resources to care for them, farms will sell them off to the meat industry at that point.
* Regarding chickens, even if they weren't sold off for meat (which I think they end up that way like cows), unwanted male chicks and unhealthy female chicks are culled. Watching a video of chick culling was probably the instant where I knew I couldn't stay vegetarian.
* In terms of environmental impact and sustainability, it takes way more resources to raise livestock and all the feed for them. Using the same land and resources to produce plant-based food for humans, there would be much less environmental damage and more sustainable output.

Uh, I get the chicks from my neighbor who has been free range raising and breeding his for like 5 generations. The rooster that fertilized the eggs that are now my hens is still very much alive, and he's a loud asshole.

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discodancer77 posted...

I dont. You said it as if everyone gets their eggs from backyard hens and thats not the case at all. 99% of eggs are coming from factory farms with terrible conditions.

By that logic everyone would need to. The b12 found in meat and milk etc are given via supplementation to the animals, not naturally-occurring due to sterilization. Its given to them so they dont die from deficiency. The b12 in their flesh and by-products are basically sloppy seconds. B12 added to plant milks and other products are given as a supplementation for the person eating it, not the animal behind it. If anything, the most natural sources of b12-producing microorganisms would be fresh picked vegetables from the farmers market.

No I didn't, and Mabus didn't either. You just read what you wanted to out of it or just made it up

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discodancer77 posted...

99% of eggs are coming from factory farms with terrible conditions.

where in the world did you get that stat from?

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mtkennerly posted...

I was vegetarian for around 15 years and became vegan last year. I switched when I realized that most animals on non-meat farms still aren't treated well. Here are some of the main things that influenced my decision:

* Like humans, cows don't just always produce milk - they do it in relation to pregnancy. So in order to keep cows producing as much milk as possible, they're artificially inseminated and kept pregnant most of their lives.
* Cows can live something like 15 to 20 years, but their optimal milk production deteriorates by around 5 years. Rather than have to keep spending resources to care for them, farms will sell them off to the meat industry at that point.
* Regarding chickens, even if they weren't sold off for meat (which I think they end up that way like cows), unwanted male chicks and unhealthy female chicks are culled. Watching a video of chick culling was probably the instant where I knew I couldn't stay vegetarian.
* In terms of environmental impact and sustainability, it takes way more resources to raise livestock and all the feed for them. Using the same land and resources to produce plant-based food for humans, there would be much less environmental damage and more sustainable output.

Finally someone answered the damn question

Thanks for the answer. I didn't know all that

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Smackems posted...

Do chickens not just lay eggs without interaction with a rooster?

Also can't you just make a cow pregnant to produce milk artificially

Half chickens are born males. You brother did not buy five female chickens and five male chickens. He wanted only females (and maybe one male?), and that's legit.
The unwanted chicken males has been killed. That's factual, don't try to argue against reality.

You don't make a creature pregnant without having a baby. The point of milk is to feed the mammal's kids. If you want to drink milk, you need to take it from that baby. So, we kill it. That's factual, don't try to argue against reality.

dj1200 posted...

where in the world did you get that stat from?

https://www.organicconsumers. org/essays/howand-why-boycott-eggs-factory-farms

https://blog.usejournal.com/ eggs-without-hens-fc2486aea5e5

delete spaces

95-98%. Forgive me for using hyperbole.

Smackems posted...

Do chickens not just lay eggs without interaction with a rooster?

Also can't you just make a cow pregnant to produce milk artificially

how do you suppose the cows become pregnant. If forceful insemination happened to women what would we call that. Imagine being r***d, having the child be born, snatched away from you to become veal, or a dairy calf, or whatever, and then being r***d again with no downtime inbetween. What a life.

As for my reply to the post about backyard hens, in a conversation about the mass consumption and production about eggs, giving an anecdote about how ethically-sourced backyard eggs are a thing as is like saying yeah I knew this one Nazi, but he was a great guy otherwise!. Its a bit dismissive to just point out isolated examples vs the big picture.

A bit strong of an example lol but hopefully the point comes across


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Don't try to argue against reality Smackems

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MabusIncarnate posted...

Don't try to argue against reality Smackems

Guess not. Anyway someone already answered the question without being a weirdo about it and I'll keep in under consideration. Guess I need to get my own cow and some chickens or something

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Smackems posted...

I see. So even dairy cows are treated horribly?

I've admittedly never looked into it and don't really want to know details

Then youre part of the problem. Learn whats happening to these animals.

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Cause theyre BROKE @Shezarr

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I don't think I could be a vegan. Maybe I could be vegetarian. Surely there's milk sold out there from better treated animals

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Soybeans and almonds and peas and oats and coconuts

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Smackems posted...

I don't think I could be a vegan. Maybe I could be vegetarian. Surely there's milk sold out there from better treated animals

What do you think would be the most challenging/undesirable aspects? There are so many substitutes available now that I think it's becoming a lot easier to switch. I honestly like the taste of almondmilk and soymilk more than dairy milk, Daiya has some really nice vegan cheese, and there are tons of meat alternatives around now. The only thing I really feel like I miss from being vegetarian is that most bakeries around here use milk and eggs, but in terms of groceries and most restaurants, it's been pretty smooth.

discodancer77 posted...

Soybeans and almonds and peas and oats and coconuts

pea milk huh

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They think harvesting milk, eggs and wool and other stuff like that puts stress on animals. I know that domestic cows will die if they aren't milked. Their udders eventually explode

And sheep love getting sheared. Watch any video of a super hairy sheep finally getting sheered. They are in heaven afterwards

mtkennerly posted...

What do you think would be the most challenging/undesirable aspects? There are so many substitutes available now that I think it's becoming a lot easier to switch. I honestly like the taste of almondmilk and soymilk more than dairy milk, Daiya has some really nice vegan cheese, and there are tons of meat alternatives around now. The only thing I really feel like I miss from being vegetarian is that most bakeries around here use milk and eggs, but in terms of groceries and most restaurants, it's been pretty smooth.

The dairy. Just all of it lol. I've tried soy and almond milk and they just.. no

It would be a monumental feat to get me to stop eating meat. I wouldn't wanna go from omnivore to vegan right away. I know myself well enough to know that wouldn't work at all

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Smackems posted...

I don't think I could be a vegan. Maybe I could be vegetarian. Surely there's milk sold out there from better treated animals

In my opinion, you don't have to be vegan, nor even vegetarian. Those are individual choices.
But it is important, still in my opinion, that we are all informed on how the food we consume is produced.
I am personally not vegetarian, but try to take care to the meat and other animal product I consume.
Also, I respect vegans choices, but I know they are often way more informed about the production conditions of meat and other animal products than the vegetables they consume themselves.

And sorry if my last answer sounded morronic. I thought you were trying to have a bad faith argument to push whatever agenda.
My bad.

People who don't want to give up eggs could look into getting chickens if that's a viable option for them. I think you can feed them mostly scraps, so it'd be pretty cheap too

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When you speak to vegans you tend to find they view the dairy industry even more unfavourably than the meat industry.

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Zikten posted...

They think harvesting milk, eggs and wool and other stuff like that puts stress on animals. I know that domestic cows will die if they aren't milked. Their udders eventually explode

And sheep love getting sheared. Watch any video of a super hairy sheep finally getting sheered. They are in heaven afterwards

Kind of fucked up that we've engineered animals through selective breeding to a point where they need human intervention in order to just live, don't you think?

Thing is, your points here aren't supreme gotchas that vegans haven't ever considered. They are active and popular discussion points that actually solidified the position for a lot of vegans.

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A thing I want to point out about backyard chickens is they were selectively bred to lay hundreds of eggs a year while their wild equivalent, the Red Jungle Fowl, only lays 10-15 a year. Egg laying is incredibly taxing on them.

Smackems posted...

I don't think I could be a vegan. Maybe I could be vegetarian. Surely there's milk sold out there from better treated animals

There are companies like Perfect Day and Remilk that are working on making milk without any animals needed. You can already buy ice cream made this way from a company called Brave Robot.

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RedJackson posted...

Cause theyre BROKE @Shezarr

Are you high

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Shezarr posted...

Are you high

No, Im Stone Cold Steve Austinsober

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I eat a whole food plant based diet and to me dairy is way worse than meat, at least from a health perspective, eggs dont have any nutrients I cant find in plants and it doesnt have any fiber, also not as good for long term health as people think, at least not according to the research Ive done, there are worse foods for sure but I just pick better options

Thought this was a Sunhawk topic

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