Current Events > Can a human brain live forever?

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In sci fi lots of stories have people implant brains in other bodies or in robots or in jars in an attempt to live forever

But I always wondered.....does the brain itself age and die, independently of the body?

No. Your brain ages and decays just like the rest of you.

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unknown. so far our issues are mostly because other organs fail first afaik

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Short answer: no the brain decays over time.

Longer answer:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2596698/

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mobilebloechel posted...

All cells eventually break down. Unless you're a lobster.

then we've got to gene splice ourselves with lobster cells

it only makes sense

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Brain atrophies over time, the neuron cells just die.

A head CT of a 20 year old versus a 120 year old is markedly different. That's why that's sci-fi and not sci.

Even if you had an immortal body after about 130-140 years there wouldn't be much up there, assuming you escaped alzheimer/brain cancer/etc

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One day, we'll likely find a way to make that happen.

With current technology, not a chance.

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NightingaleMD posted...

Brain atrophies over time, the neuron cells just die.

A head CT of a 20 year old versus a 120 year old is markedly different. That's why that's sci-fi and not sci.

Even if you had an immortal body after about 130-140 years there wouldn't be much up there, assuming you escaped alzheimer/brain cancer/etc

what about brain restoration or medicine? It helps right? Could we conceivably find new techniques that restore brain decay or that keep it going longer?

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More likely we will upload our minds onto computers that can last 100s of years and then make the jump to pure energy crystals.

imagine living in a time where you could shitpost on ce as an ascended being living off energy crystals

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pure_temper posted...

what about brain restoration or medicine? It helps right? Could we conceivably find new techniques that restore brain decay or that keep it going longer?

Nothing restores dead cells

nothing outside of sci-fi

Neurons are incredibly complex. There has been absolutely no advancement in this front in modern medicine and none on the horizon.

That's why people don't walk after a massive stroke*

*if large clot is not taken out quickly or broken up with tpa. There can be some gain of function through aggressive PT but if there is a massive MCA stroke and it's not treated that part of the body ain't ever moving again

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Not even Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos can buy their way out of death. How does that make you feel?

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Orlando_Jordan posted...

Not even Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos can buy their way out of death. How does that make you feel?

That death is the great equalizer

NightingaleMD posted...

Nothing restores dead cells

nothing outside of sci-fi

Neurons are incredibly complex. There has been absolutely no advancement in this front in modern medicine and none on the horizon.

That's why people don't walk after a massive stroke*

*if large clot is not taken out quickly or broken up with tpa. There can be some gain of function through aggressive PT but if there is a massive MCA stroke and it's not treated that part of the body ain't ever moving again

any chance the latest and greatest in research will uncover anything here, or is no one even bothering?

Orlando_Jordan posted...

Not even Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos can buy their way out of death. How does that make you feel?

who knows what's possible at that level of capital? for example if cryonics will ever work, you can be sure that they are paying attention to the latest and greatest and spending whatever money is needed on any moonshot behind the scenes.

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pure_temper posted...

any chance the latest and greatest in research will uncover anything here, or is no one even bothering?

It's probably going to be one of those things where no one takes it all that seriously for a while, then suddenly one day some nerd with nothing better to do has a Brilliant Idea except by pure luck it actually is good and suddenly propels the field forward.

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Trumble posted...

It's probably going to be one of those things where no one takes it all that seriously for a while, then suddenly one day some nerd with nothing better to do has a Brilliant Idea except by pure luck it actually is good and suddenly propels the field forward.

disagree

I'm not certain it's something that will ever be solved. One thing that really prevents that is an understanding of how human consciousness actually WORKS. It's still a complete mystery. shows have people "upload their minds" but the human mind is the most intricate thing in the universe. If something like this were possible we're still hundreds of years out from getting close, I would expect. 0% progress so far.

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The underlying problem with allowing the human brain to live forever is that eventually the brain will become racist, then get canceled.

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Relevant to discussion

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Command_neuron

If these actually existed mapping things would be easier

seems consciousness, what makes you YOU, is just a network of signals.

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NightingaleMD posted...

disagree

I'm not certain it's something that will ever be solved. One thing that really prevents that is an understanding of how human consciousness actually WORKS. It's still a complete mystery. shows have people "upload their minds" but the human mind is the most intricate thing in the universe. If something like this were possible we're still hundreds of years out from getting close, I would expect. 0% progress so far.

this is a serious question.

what do you think about cryonics? we may have already solved the first portion of the problem, which is the preservation of the body.

it's a moon shot but it's the only one any of us will ever have, and it could be implemented at global scale in the hope of someday reviving people out of cryo.

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tote_all posted...

People act like cryo is just fading into a resource-free stand-by mode. No, you'll need to be preserved by other people. You'll need the company or whatever to keep going as long as necessary, that your money doesn't run out, that if the company goes under another company capable of doing the same thing takes over, that there's no incidents whatsoever, no natural disasters, no third party foul play, that the employees preserving your body don't ever make a big mistake, that freaking society doesn't collapse and people start wondering why so many resources are being diverted into keeping ambitious human popsicles frozen, etc. It's a gigantic list of ifs waiting for something we are not even close to achieve, that we don't know is even possible. Also, considering that if you cryo you are likely to die anyway, if you do it too early you lose good years of your life, and if you do it too late your brain already isn't what it once was.

It's a bad idea.

It's the only shot we have. IMO it'd have to be funded as a foundational part of what we are and do as a species - even more sacred than roads or internet.

Resources won't be the problem, it'll be convincing enough people.

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pure_temper posted...

this is a serious question.

what do you think about cryonics? we may have already solved the first portion of the problem, which is the preservation of the body.

it's a moon shot but it's the only one any of us will ever have, and it could be implemented at global scale in the hope of someday reviving people out of cryo.

Maybe possible. They say "last in, first out" for a reason. Cryogenics is advancing and people more recently placed in it will be able to be freed first since they used later technology. The first attempts were basically just people putting heads in liquid nitrogen, completely destroying cellular structure.

The challenge is freezing the body but not destroying microscopic structure like DNA/RNA, etc. Suspending the proteins without completely annihilating them. Some animals do some similar stuff. If you look at "oldest bacteria" there is stuff millions of years taken out of permafrost and warmed and lived again. These serve as study models.

But still, far away. Much closer than your other idea though

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NightingaleMD posted...

Maybe possible. They say "last in, first out" for a reason. Cryogenics is advancing and people more recently placed in it will be able to be freed first since they used later technology. The first attempts were basically just people putting heads in liquid nitrogen, completely destroying cellular structure.

The challenge is freezing the body but not destroying microscopic structure like DNA/RNA, etc. Suspending the proteins without completely annihilating them. Some animals do some similar stuff. If you look at "oldest bacteria" there is stuff millions of years taken out of permafrost and warmed and lived again. These serve as study models.

But still, far away. Much closer than your other idea though

The freezing part, if not already solved will be solved before Bezos or Musk die. There's just no way they'll let that kind of capital go to waste when technology has made this so within reach.

So imo we should position for serious public conversations on the subject as a species, because it should be democratized and I'm pretty confident the ultra rich have already been making progress behind closed doors.

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pure_temper posted...

I'm pretty confident the ultra rich have already been making progress behind closed doors.

Probably not.

Money can certainly help but it doesn't will science into existence. But since you're purporting a secret conspiracy obviously I have no way to refute that just as you have no way to prove it. Though I will say if someone secretly solved this science they would make even more money by copyrighting the procedure and making billions selling it.

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