Board 8 > Chris' Music Mafia Topic 13: It's a Bon Jovi song

(+) Yeah! (+)

turbopuns2 posted...

Sorry I am a little testy right now. I'm visiting my parents and I'm trying to be heads down focused on rereading the game and my mother is yammering on and on and on endlessly so I'm getting a little frustrated by the fact I'm having to nod along and stuff while I want to just play. So I probably reacted a little more harshly than I should have as a way to vent without being a jerk to my mom.

I feel you
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why are you on that list, and not Crescent?
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turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

So Tange is town then?

what?

If the last 2 scumroles left are a jack and a janitor, than godfather would normally not be one of them too.
---

puns, go talk to your mother.

there's plenty of time for you to play later

enjoy the time you have with your family
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htaeD posted...

turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

So Tange is town then?

what?

If the last 2 scumroles left are a jack and a janitor, than godfather would normally not be one of them too.

you know better than that, death

benjamin3740 posted...

htaeD posted...

turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

Also the fact that that would mean, scum had a janitor power that didnt belong to the scumjack...

what's strange about scum having a janitor that isn't on a jack?

janitor is a role, people.

So Tange is town then?

Godfather janitor.

I mean it's these role assumptions that perfectly explain and are the only explanation for Tony to be town that make me seriously doubt Tony

I wanted Puns to say that, but it was me acting dumb anyway.
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DoubleTangicide posted...

there's plenty of time for you to play later

unless there isn't...!

(because I could very well die tonight)

htaeD posted...

turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

So Tange is town then?

what?

If the last 2 scumroles left are a jack and a janitor, than godfather would normally not be one of them too.

I mean, I know this isn't in my favor, but with all the power town has/supposedly has, I wouldn't be surprised if there was some kind of godfather jack role

but I would be more inclined to believe that janitor is one of the powers a scum jack has....considering we haven't seen anyone else die at night without a role being revealed
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htaeD posted...

turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

So Tange is town then?

what?

If the last 2 scumroles left are a jack and a janitor, than godfather would normally not be one of them too.

We just had a game with a ninja vigilante and a godfather detective on top of a normal godfather, and this scumteam is super weak right now without something special. "Not normally" isn't good enough to say "no". I do think Puns' theory about a scumjack rb is stupid and it's still likely there's scum between the two, though.

I feel like this is the third person I've told this now. I was already discounting the innocent scans yesterday to begin with.

turbopuns2 posted...

DoubleTangicide posted...

there's plenty of time for you to play later

unless there isn't...!

(because I could very well die tonight)

I meant later today before day ended
---

DoubleTangicide posted...

htaeD posted...

turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

So Tange is town then?

what?

If the last 2 scumroles left are a jack and a janitor, than godfather would normally not be one of them too.

I mean, I know this isn't in my favor, but with all the power town has/supposedly has, I wouldn't be surprised if there was some kind of godfather jack role

but I would be more inclined to believe that janitor is one of the powers a scum jack has....considering we haven't seen anyone else die at night without a role being revealed

I've never heard of janitor being anything more than a 1 use role. I was a janitor once.. A roleblocker janitor.

benjamin3740 posted...

Here is the proposed plan, using FD's format

Lynching the bomb will be Puns + Tony + Ben + Zach + Han + Death

If 1 person disappears, and it is Tony (that disappeared), Kill Puns. Puns will flip scum and we will know what it meant.

If 1 person disappears, and it is Puns (that disappeared), Kill Tony. Tony will flip scum and we will know what it meant.

If 0 people disappear, kill Ben. If Ben dies we will know that Tony and Puns are BOTH confirmed town.

If 1 person disappears, and it is neither Tony nor Puns, kill Zach. We will know 1 of the 2 is scum, but it wasn't confirmed which.
Caveat to this one: if Zach is the one that happens to disappear, then shoot either of Tony/Puns.
Either this will result in a dead scum (which will appear like one of the first scenarios to us) or it will result in Tony/Puns dying as town, and confirm the other is scum.

If 2 people disappear, kill EITHER of Han or Death. If either of them is killed we will know that BOTH Puns and Tony are scum

Like if we are foregoing finding out who is one of the removed towns. Then I can accept that. But last time I checked, Crescent wasnt confirmed anything.
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htaeD posted...

why are you on that list, and not Crescent?

Well I offered to have myself killed if Puns and Tony are both town, mainly because it's fun to bet my life on something. But it would be useful toward winning the game I think since I know I would be a viable lynch target between Han, Death, Crescent and Tange. If Tony and Puns were to be confirmed town then we'd only have one mislynch left. I could be replaced with any one of them, though I do think Crescent is town so I'd rather she be X3 or X4 if she has to be in.
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Crescent-Moon posted...

I've never heard of janitor being anything more than a 1 use role. I was a janitor once.. A roleblocker janitor.

I've played with an infinite-use janitor in NFLB mafia (rip)
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I have no idea why Scare flipping town got me so many townreads in the first place so I agree with you on that.

DoubleTangicide posted...

htaeD posted...

turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

So Tange is town then?

what?

If the last 2 scumroles left are a jack and a janitor, than godfather would normally not be one of them too.

I mean, I know this isn't in my favor, but with all the power town has/supposedly has, I wouldn't be surprised if there was some kind of godfather jack role

but I would be more inclined to believe that janitor is one of the powers a scum jack has....considering we haven't seen anyone else die at night without a role being revealed

eh Janitor is usually 1shot regardless
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turbopuns2 posted...

DoubleTangicide posted...

there's plenty of time for you to play later

unless there isn't...!

(because I could very well die tonight)

Jeez I didnt know your mother was capable of THAT
---

benjamin3740 posted...

turbopuns2 posted...

DoubleTangicide posted...

there's plenty of time for you to play later

unless there isn't...!

(because I could very well die tonight)

Jeez I didnt know your mother was capable of THAT

*Drumroll, cymbals*

alright I don't want to dig up all the quotes to put them together nicely but here is my biggest beef with tange in a nutshell. it's a bullet point list but it's not individual points, it's the collective string of events as a whole so please don't pick out one specific point and try to harp on it

-when innocent scans came out on mzero/tange, tange went from mzero to panth. panth and red both had about 2-3 votes each at the time
-tange didn't really post any more at all until after scare faked hammering red. IGCD and panth both had 1-3 votes to red's like 10 or something
-tange did his "I trust the red voters more than the IGCD voters" switch, when everyone else in the game basically agreed that didn't sound right
-ben made his post about lynching IGCD because it was "fun" and tange quoted it and was like "this looks SO BAD if IGCD is town"
-next day starts, tange immediately votes ben (not red) and tange is overflowing with confidence all of a sudden
-tange was asked by Scare I think, to list some thoughts on the whole player list. in his quip about red, he basically said he was sure red was scum
-why didn't tange vote red the next day? or even consider lynching red? he sat his vote on Ben while other people were voting red...

benjamin3740 posted...

htaeD posted...

why are you on that list, and not Crescent?

Well I offered to have myself killed if Puns and Tony are both town, mainly because it's fun to bet my life on something. But it would be useful toward winning the game I think since I know I would be a viable lynch target between Han, Death, Crescent and Tange. If Tony and Puns were to be confirmed town then we'd only have one mislynch left. I could be replaced with any one of them, though I do think Crescent is town so I'd rather she be X3 or X4 if she has to be in.

No see the better plan is to give Mzero multiple targets for getting 2 confirmed town
Not for 2 confirmed scum.
He has a better chance of shooting scum in scenario 1 that way.
It sounds especially dumb to offer yourself alone when you should know you are town and you know your death will cost town.
I'd still rather blow up someone else who wasnt scanned innocent by Sheep.
Or did we all forget that?
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Has Mzero weighed in on any plan?
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Death feels like he's hinging too much on the innocent scans rather than on actual reads.

Tange never showed confidence in Red being scum, just in the voters, but it doesn't look like he said anything about the voters on the other lynch at all?

I wanted to get more sleep today, oh well

Actually it's worse than that, he's hinging too much on the innocent scans and he's dissuading the possibility of an innocent scanning scum remaining because it's "not normal".

Crescent-Moon posted...

Death feels like he's hinging too much on the innocent scans rather than on actual reads.

You will forgive me if I didnt get the chance to properly join the Tange discussion.
I like Ben more than Tange, thats for sure. But I cant say much else about him.

Crescent-Moon posted...

Actually it's worse than that, he's hinging too much on the innocent scans and he's dissuading the possibility of an innocent scanning scum remaining because it's "not normal".

Thats a lot of words you're putting in my mouth all at once, Crescent.
None of which apply.
I never said Tange or Ben couldnt be scum. I am saying, I dont find the odds high.
Dont even use the recent conversation as anything, that was me just trying to see Puns responses.

If this is about me wanting you in the bombsquad, say that.
---

Crescent-Moon posted...

Actually it's worse than that, he's hinging too much on the innocent scans and he's dissuading the possibility of an innocent scanning scum remaining because it's "not normal".

I did note in my full d1 read that death was the very first person to solidly express that Zam was scum. Immediately when Zam asked if my miller claim was countering pj, death was on him. Didn't actually pressure him but was clear about stating he thought zam was untrustworthy.

Regardless, it doesnt really matter who is on the bombsquad I suppose.
Though I would still rank Ben higher than Tange. And about on the same level as Crescent (discounting the scans here alltogether)
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htaeD posted...

Crescent-Moon posted...

Death feels like he's hinging too much on the innocent scans rather than on actual reads.

You will forgive me if I didnt get the chance to properly join the Tange discussion.
I like Ben more than Tange, thats for sure. But I cant say much else about him.

Crescent-Moon posted...

Actually it's worse than that, he's hinging too much on the innocent scans and he's dissuading the possibility of an innocent scanning scum remaining because it's "not normal".

Thats a lot of words you're putting in my mouth all at once, Crescent.
None of which apply.
I never said Tange or Ben couldnt be scum. I am saying, I dont find the odds high.
Dont even use the recent conversation as anything, that was me just trying to see Puns responses.

If this is about me wanting you in the bombsquad, say that.

It's actually unrelated. It's directly related to posts you just made, and it's not putting words in your mouth at all.

turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

turbopuns2 posted...

htaeD posted...

So Tange is town then?

what?

If the last 2 scumroles left are a jack and a janitor, than godfather would normally not be one of them too.

you know better than that, death

This is one part.

htaeD posted...

benjamin3740 posted...

htaeD posted...

why are you on that list, and not Crescent?

Well I offered to have myself killed if Puns and Tony are both town, mainly because it's fun to bet my life on something. But it would be useful toward winning the game I think since I know I would be a viable lynch target between Han, Death, Crescent and Tange. If Tony and Puns were to be confirmed town then we'd only have one mislynch left. I could be replaced with any one of them, though I do think Crescent is town so I'd rather she be X3 or X4 if she has to be in.

No see the better plan is to give Mzero multiple targets for getting 2 confirmed town
Not for 2 confirmed scum.
He has a better chance of shooting scum in scenario 1 that way.
It sounds especially dumb to offer yourself alone when you should know you are town and you know your death will cost town.
I'd still rather blow up someone else who wasnt scanned innocent by Sheep.
Or did we all forget that?

I put no words into your mouth at all. These were things you just said.

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

MZero11 posted...

Oh yeah Tony why didn't you watch Sheep last night? >_>

He had been unblocked/killed 2 nights in a row, and the day after I finally see scum shoot him a tracker is revealed.

Anyone who actually expected me to watch the cop after that either werent paying attention to yesterday, or youre bad at mafia, especially on the night after we spent the entire day questioning if Sheeps inno scans were even accurate.

I dont buy this one bit. I would have found any other reason more believable.
Tony cannot be playing this stupidly.
---

If you put a gun to my head right now I would lynch death and tange.

I'm taking a break

Crescent-Moon posted...

htaeD posted...

benjamin3740 posted...

htaeD posted...

why are you on that list, and not Crescent?

Well I offered to have myself killed if Puns and Tony are both town, mainly because it's fun to bet my life on something. But it would be useful toward winning the game I think since I know I would be a viable lynch target between Han, Death, Crescent and Tange. If Tony and Puns were to be confirmed town then we'd only have one mislynch left. I could be replaced with any one of them, though I do think Crescent is town so I'd rather she be X3 or X4 if she has to be in.

No see the better plan is to give Mzero multiple targets for getting 2 confirmed town
Not for 2 confirmed scum.
He has a better chance of shooting scum in scenario 1 that way.
It sounds especially dumb to offer yourself alone when you should know you are town and you know your death will cost town.
I'd still rather blow up someone else who wasnt scanned innocent by Sheep.
Or did we all forget that?

I put no words into your mouth at all. These were things you just said.

Yeah I did.
Where does it say that the innocent scanned players cant be scum?
Nowhere.
So...
putting words in my mouth.
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And I offered to be the *only* guinea pig for the bomb yesterday, why would I care so much about being a guinea pig for it today?

turbopuns2 posted...

If you put a gun to my head right now I would lynch death and tange.

I'm taking a break

This seems like a strong stance to take for someone you just gave some credit to (with the whole zam thing).

Puns, why are you so accepting of tony the watcher?
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Crescent-Moon posted...

And I offered to be the *only* guinea pig for the bomb yesterday, why would I care so much about being a guinea pig for it today?

See, I couldnt have known this. I havent been online for days now.
I only had enough internet time last evening to check who died, give some quick opinions, and tell everyone not to end the day in 24 hours.
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htaeD posted...

Crescent-Moon posted...

htaeD posted...

benjamin3740 posted...

htaeD posted...

why are you on that list, and not Crescent?

Well I offered to have myself killed if Puns and Tony are both town, mainly because it's fun to bet my life on something. But it would be useful toward winning the game I think since I know I would be a viable lynch target between Han, Death, Crescent and Tange. If Tony and Puns were to be confirmed town then we'd only have one mislynch left. I could be replaced with any one of them, though I do think Crescent is town so I'd rather she be X3 or X4 if she has to be in.

No see the better plan is to give Mzero multiple targets for getting 2 confirmed town
Not for 2 confirmed scum.
He has a better chance of shooting scum in scenario 1 that way.
It sounds especially dumb to offer yourself alone when you should know you are town and you know your death will cost town.
I'd still rather blow up someone else who wasnt scanned innocent by Sheep.
Or did we all forget that?

I put no words into your mouth at all. These were things you just said.

Yeah I did.
Where does it say that the innocent scanned players cant be scum?
Nowhere.
So...
putting words in my mouth.

When did I say you said that innocent scanned players can't be scum?

What I said is you're directly dissuading the possibility that they could be scum, and targeting the bomb primarily at people who aren't scanned innocent only compounds onto it.

And that's exactly what you're doing. You're defending a point that doesn't exist, why is that?

And Crescent
Like I said
That first bit you quoted was purely there to see what Puns would say. I am not actually that naive to think a godfather janitor or godfather jack cant exist.
(And you missed the entire context leading up to that bit on the last page).
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And I'm sorry, Death, but...

Post 17 is when I finished laying out that plan, and offered myself as the guinea pig.

Crescent-Moon posted...

And I don't really care if I played the role of X there. If I die to confirm two town I'm pretty ok with that.

For science~

You were back as early as post 24, and you were there for a while. There's no way you didn't read 14-16-17 in which I come up with a plan and say I'm ok risking myself to test it.

htaeD posted...

And Crescent
Like I said
That first bit you quoted was purely there to see what Puns would say. I am not actually that naive to think a godfather janitor or godfather jack cant exist.
(And you missed the entire context leading up to that bit on the last page).

Again, not what you said. You said those roles would "not normally" exist, as a way to try to draw us away from looking into Tange and Ben, then you also said we shouldn't put them in the bomb's path.

First of all, dont give me that sassy 'why is that?'

When did I say you said that innocent scanned players can't be scum?

What I said is you're directly dissuading the possibility that they could be scum, and targeting the bomb primarily at people who aren't scanned innocent only compounds onto it.

And that's exactly what you're doing. You're defending a point that doesn't exist

Second, fair enough. I took your wording as stronger than it was. But to me it felt like it made more sense to have Mzero include all unscanned players. If I am behind on the times, then I apologize for that.
Though I dont know why you said that I said 'thats not normal'. Thats not how I was thinking about it.

And what is this point that doesnt exist?

Really, I would be far less resistant if I could be more sure that it makes sense for scum to have 2 scanproofed roles.
---

What I see is, you're jumping to the absolute extreme at every point of this argument, when my argument never at any point suggested any of these extremes.

are we testing the bomb claim today or what?

If we are, let's get those who we decide are going to be on the bomb, on the bomb

if not, we should lynch Tony
---

Crescent-Moon posted...

htaeD posted...

And Crescent
Like I said
That first bit you quoted was purely there to see what Puns would say. I am not actually that naive to think a godfather janitor or godfather jack cant exist.
(And you missed the entire context leading up to that bit on the last page).

Again, not what you said. You said those roles would "not normally" exist, as a way to try to draw us away from looking into Tange and Ben, then you also said we shouldn't put them in the bomb's path.

I WAS TRYING
TO SEE
WHAT PUNS
WOULD SAY

Do I have to tell you this a fourth time?
---

htaeD posted...

First of all, dont give me that sassy 'why is that?'

When did I say you said that innocent scanned players can't be scum?

What I said is you're directly dissuading the possibility that they could be scum, and targeting the bomb primarily at people who aren't scanned innocent only compounds onto it.

And that's exactly what you're doing. You're defending a point that doesn't exist

Second, fair enough. I took your wording as stronger than it was. But to me it felt like it made more sense to have Mzero include all unscanned players. If I am behind on the times, then I apologize for that.
Though I dont know why you said that I said 'thats not normal'. Thats not how I was thinking about it.

And what is this point that doesnt exist?

Really, I would be far less resistant if I could be more sure that it makes sense for scum to have 2 scanproofed roles.

The point that doesn't exist is you keep saying I'm accusing you of extreme lines of thought when I've said nothing of the such.

htaeD posted...

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

MZero11 posted...

Oh yeah Tony why didn't you watch Sheep last night? >_>

He had been unblocked/killed 2 nights in a row, and the day after I finally see scum shoot him a tracker is revealed.

Anyone who actually expected me to watch the cop after that either werent paying attention to yesterday, or youre bad at mafia, especially on the night after we spent the entire day questioning if Sheeps inno scans were even accurate.

I dont buy this one bit. I would have found any other reason more believable.
Tony cannot be playing this stupidly.

Youre literally replying to Crescent saying she doesnt trust the innocent scans. Wtf are you talking about dude?
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I nominateCrescent-Moon posted...

And I'm sorry, Death, but...

Post 17 is when I finished laying out that plan, and offered myself as the guinea pig.

Crescent-Moon posted...

And I don't really care if I played the role of X there. If I die to confirm two town I'm pretty ok with that.

For science~

You were back as early as post 24, and you were there for a while. There's no way you didn't read 14-16-17 in which I come up with a plan and say I'm ok risking myself to test it.

Oh but you under-estimate the horror of checking in on a phone, (something I have never ever had to do before btw. Even that one time in 2016 I was using a notepad, and I was already dead so I didnt need to keep up except to talk with you as a mason)
I didnt have the time to see even the posts on that very page. I could only see if topic 13 existed and the day had not ended yet. I posted my reactions to the flip alone. Not to anything recent.

You think I would ignore a post of yours to make an argument that can easily be swatted away with said post?
---

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

htaeD posted...

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

MZero11 posted...

Oh yeah Tony why didn't you watch Sheep last night? >_>

He had been unblocked/killed 2 nights in a row, and the day after I finally see scum shoot him a tracker is revealed.

Anyone who actually expected me to watch the cop after that either werent paying attention to yesterday, or youre bad at mafia, especially on the night after we spent the entire day questioning if Sheeps inno scans were even accurate.

I dont buy this one bit. I would have found any other reason more believable.
Tony cannot be playing this stupidly.

Youre literally replying to Crescent saying she doesnt trust the innocent scans. Wtf are you talking about dude?

People had a reason to not trust the innocent scans.
Sheep being scum was not it.
---

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

htaeD posted...

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

MZero11 posted...

Oh yeah Tony why didn't you watch Sheep last night? >_>

He had been unblocked/killed 2 nights in a row, and the day after I finally see scum shoot him a tracker is revealed.

Anyone who actually expected me to watch the cop after that either werent paying attention to yesterday, or youre bad at mafia, especially on the night after we spent the entire day questioning if Sheeps inno scans were even accurate.

I dont buy this one bit. I would have found any other reason more believable.
Tony cannot be playing this stupidly.

Youre literally replying to Crescent saying she doesnt trust the innocent scans. Wtf are you talking about dude?

I didn't trust the innocent scans yesterday, either. I was very clear about this.

Crescent-Moon posted...

htaeD posted...

First of all, dont give me that sassy 'why is that?'

When did I say you said that innocent scanned players can't be scum?

What I said is you're directly dissuading the possibility that they could be scum, and targeting the bomb primarily at people who aren't scanned innocent only compounds onto it.

And that's exactly what you're doing. You're defending a point that doesn't exist

Second, fair enough. I took your wording as stronger than it was. But to me it felt like it made more sense to have Mzero include all unscanned players. If I am behind on the times, then I apologize for that.
Though I dont know why you said that I said 'thats not normal'. Thats not how I was thinking about it.

And what is this point that doesnt exist?

Really, I would be far less resistant if I could be more sure that it makes sense for scum to have 2 scanproofed roles.

The point that doesn't exist is you keep saying I'm accusing you of extreme lines of thought when I've said nothing of the such.

I took that back already. I can understand you missing it in the sea of responses we are making.
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htaeD posted...

I nominateCrescent-Moon posted...

And I'm sorry, Death, but...

Post 17 is when I finished laying out that plan, and offered myself as the guinea pig.

Crescent-Moon posted...

And I don't really care if I played the role of X there. If I die to confirm two town I'm pretty ok with that.

For science~

You were back as early as post 24, and you were there for a while. There's no way you didn't read 14-16-17 in which I come up with a plan and say I'm ok risking myself to test it.

Oh but you under-estimate the horror of checking in on a phone, (something I have never ever had to do before btw. Even that one time in 2016 I was using a notepad, and I was already dead so I didnt need to keep up except to talk with you as a mason)
I didnt have the time to see even the posts on that very page. I could only see if topic 13 existed and the day had not ended yet. I posted my reactions to the flip alone. Not to anything recent.

You think I would ignore a post of yours to make an argument that can easily be swatted away with said post?

Actually I think you'd just be too wrapped up in this argument to remember it existed.