Current Events > Sweden forced to reconsider its socialist policies due to the migrant influx

(+) Yeah! (+)

The Admiral posted...

I don't think anyone has argued against controlled immigration that allows in educated workers or students who want to assimilate.

The whole "controlled immigration, only let in doctors" thing is a myth. Immigrants are almost always low skilled and that's fine. They fill a need for such jobs and their children receive a better education than they otherwise would have. This is why Sweden's finances are in better shape today than they were decades ago.

Sweden is denying full benefits to a very small group of people, this is a non-story. The system remains the same.

bevan306 posted...

uh if you have this anti immigrant fixation like every other alt-righter I'm not sure you wanna be posting articles by the economist lol

Just to clarify, The Economist is a pro-globalism publication, but it actually uses the right definition of that word. In reality, globalism means the free flowing of goods, services, and resources across borders to create a competitive global market. In liberal pseudo-reality, the term means open borders and uncontrolled migration based on feelings towards the migrant groups.

I've always been a strong supporter of the actual definition, as are most free-market conservatives.
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Immigration is good for countries with low birth rates. This will benefit Sweden in the long run, even if its overwhelming in the short term.
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why do people on the right keep making it sound like swden is suffering in hand of black people and it needs to be saved or be cleansed of the BLACKS AND THE MUSLIMS who came to take it over and ruin it.
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EnragedSlith posted...

Immigration is good for countries with low birth rates. This will benefit Sweden in the long run, even if its overwhelming in the short term.

imo immigration is good for every nation. diversity of experience and ideas are an objectively positive value, i just think europe has gone way too far in allowing anyone and everyone in.
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Prediction: Sweden is either going to become an Islamist shithole or a neo-fascist regime.

Either way it's doomed.
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andel posted...

EnragedSlith posted...

Immigration is good for countries with low birth rates. This will benefit Sweden in the long run, even if its overwhelming in the short term.

imo immigration is good for every nation. diversity of experience and ideas are an objectively positive value, i just think europe has gone way too far in allowing anyone and everyone in.

Immigration is only positive if the immigrants actually want to assimilate into the country they're going to. If they're merely going there because their own country has become too big of a shithole to continue practicing their customs, it's a net-negative.
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The Admiral posted...

andel posted...

EnragedSlith posted...

Immigration is good for countries with low birth rates. This will benefit Sweden in the long run, even if its overwhelming in the short term.

imo immigration is good for every nation. diversity of experience and ideas are an objectively positive value, i just think europe has gone way too far in allowing anyone and everyone in.

Immigration is only positive if the immigrants actually want to assimilate into the country they're going to. If they're merely going there because their own country has become too big of a shithole to continue practicing their customs, it's a net-negative.

Thats a key distinction most people pushing for multiculturalism cant quite grasp
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xxBurnedManxx posted...

why do people on the right keep making it sound like swden is suffering in hand of black people and it needs to be saved or be cleansed of the BLACKS AND THE MUSLIMS who came to take it over and ruin it.

Skin colour is irrelevant, and #notallmuslims.

Islamists on the other hand. These guys are the problem, and once they gain power, the majority of Muslims have no choice but to obey, such is the house of submission that is Islam.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamism

Erdogan in Turkey is a good example of an Islamist that continues to gain power and is turning Turkey into yet another Islamic dictatorship. He is virtually unopposed as well, by Muslim and non Muslim alike.

Lord_Theruss posted...

xxBurnedManxx posted...

why do people on the right keep making it sound like swden is suffering in hand of black people and it needs to be saved or be cleansed of the BLACKS AND THE MUSLIMS who came to take it over and ruin it.

Skin colour is irrelevant, and #notallmuslims.

Islamists on the other hand. These guys are the problem, and once they gain power, the majority of Muslims have no choice but to obey, such is the house of submission that is Islam.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamism

Erdogan in Turkey is a good example of an Islamist that continues to gain power and is turning Turkey into yet another Islamic dictatorship. He is virtually unopposed as well, by Muslim and non Muslim alike.

erdongan?but he is just a power hunger dictator his action got nothing to do with him being muslim in fact he claims to be anit 'islamisis'
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There's a reason he keeps his post history a secret, guys
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The Admiral posted...

This is a great example of why the social democratic welfare policies that so many people on CE love could never work in a country like the U.S.

So disappointingly predictable is Admiral with the strawman. I take it you missed the entire context of the article. Sweden has a tough time maintaining its social economy (and has for a while) due to its geographical location. It's essentially settled in a DMZ with warring powers left and right and the middle east to the south. It' essentially a port of harbor for all these countries. It makes sense that if they don't take a hard stance on immigration, foreign policy, diplomacy, etc. that their economy will suddenly panic. So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.
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P4wn4g3 posted...

The Admiral posted...

This is a great example of why the social democratic welfare policies that so many people on CE love could never work in a country like the U.S.

So disappointingly predictable is Admiral with the strawman. I take it you missed the entire context of the article. Sweden has a tough time maintaining its social economy (and has for a while) due to its geographical location. It's essentially settled in a DMZ with warring powers left and right and the middle east to the south. It' essentially a port of harbor for all these countries. It makes sense that if they don't take a hard stance on immigration, foreign policy, diplomacy, etc. that their economy will suddenly panic. So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.

Of course this isnt a socialism problem, it just totally by chance happen to have happened in socialist lite state
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P4wn4g3 posted...

The Admiral posted...

This is a great example of why the social democratic welfare policies that so many people on CE love could never work in a country like the U.S.

So disappointingly predictable is Admiral with the strawman. I take it you missed the entire context of the article. Sweden has a tough time maintaining its social economy (and has for a while) due to its geographical location. It's essentially settled in a DMZ with warring powers left and right and the middle east to the south. It' essentially a port of harbor for all these countries. It makes sense that if they don't take a hard stance on immigration, foreign policy, diplomacy, etc. that their economy will suddenly panic. So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.

The socialist problem is that this system is incredibly fragile and becomes impossible to sustain once any stress is put on it. Like I said, these welfare programs are nationalized Ponzi schemes, and they fail for exactly the same reason any such scheme fails.
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I think your neighbor, Canada, is a good example of how such a model can be successful TC
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Kazi1212 posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

The Admiral posted...

This is a great example of why the social democratic welfare policies that so many people on CE love could never work in a country like the U.S.

So disappointingly predictable is Admiral with the strawman. I take it you missed the entire context of the article. Sweden has a tough time maintaining its social economy (and has for a while) due to its geographical location. It's essentially settled in a DMZ with warring powers left and right and the middle east to the south. It' essentially a port of harbor for all these countries. It makes sense that if they don't take a hard stance on immigration, foreign policy, diplomacy, etc. that their economy will suddenly panic. So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.

Of course this isnt a socialism problem, it just totally by chance happen to have happened in socialist lite state

Owned.
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/sarcasm
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Lol time to reap what you sow dumbasses
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P4wn4g3 posted...

So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.

how could it be? sweden isn't socialist.
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Remember guys, its only called a socialist state if it works.
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Th3HonestTruth posted...

@averagejoel posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.

how could it be? sweden isn't socialist.

What countries are socialist

lol he won't answer

FreedomEtrtment posted...

Th3HonestTruth posted...

averagejoel posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.

how could it be? sweden isn't socialist.

What countries are socialist

lol he won't answer

oh I hadn't checked this topic

but also, the question is a separate topic of conversation which I am not interested in discussing here.

the point is:
Sweden is not socialist
Finland is not socialist
Norway is not socialist
Canada is not socialist
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averagejoel posted...

FreedomEtrtment posted...

Th3HonestTruth posted...

averagejoel posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.

how could it be? sweden isn't socialist.

What countries are socialist

lol he won't answer

oh I hadn't checked this topic

but also, the question is a separate topic of conversation which I am not interested in discussing here.

the point is:
Sweden is not socialist
Finland is not socialist
Norway is not socialist
Canada is not socialist

Shocking.
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Esrac posted...

averagejoel posted...

FreedomEtrtment posted...

Th3HonestTruth posted...

averagejoel posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

So no this isn't a socialism problem. Semi decent try though.

how could it be? sweden isn't socialist.

What countries are socialist

lol he won't answer

oh I hadn't checked this topic

but also, the question is a separate topic of conversation which I am not interested in discussing here.

the point is:
Sweden is not socialist
Finland is not socialist
Norway is not socialist
Canada is not socialist

Shocking.

I don't particularly care what you think here - asking that question in the first place is just a form of deflection and will not lead anywhere productive
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Th3HonestTruth posted...

No, asking why they are or aren't socialist would be a separate topic. Just asking you which ones are is a very easy binary question and I'm not going to follow it up with any more details. So what countries are socialist or are no countries socialist?

there are current socialist states like Cuba and arguably China

there are former socialist states like the USSR

there are countries with socialist leaders that, for one reason or another (usually US interference) haven't been able to actually make positive change. the majority of south and central america, as well as the middle east, was part of this category during various parts of the 20th century

then there are leaders that aren't really socialist, but imo should be critically supported by socialists because of their resistance to US imperialism (Assad, Kim).

in virtually all of these cases, there's a shit ton of imperialist US propaganda surrounding them, so it's hard to tell what actually happened
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Hm. I only read the excerpt so feel free to correct me if I'm missing something. But it seems like what's blamed for immigrants' inability to get into the market isn't cultural differences so much as a language barrier? But naturally it will be difficult to get a job in a country where most jobs require a degree. That is indeed a problem, one of the main divisions between the left and right in Sweden.
Furthermore, this problem of an aging population isn't (to my knowledge) a problem exclusive to Sweden. AFAIK a lot of countries are facing this problem, the most famous example being Japan. But IIRC even the US has this problem, no? So it seems a bit weird to attribute it to an ineffective social democracy.

That said, it's certainly true that Sweden will struggle greatly to integrate the large amount of refugees that came here in the recent years, and it's true that they're placing a great burden on our welfare system.
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